disappointed in row covers/will netting work for cabbage moths?

Why not just use Bt (Bacillus thuringiensis)and free your brassicas from the plastic?

I have always used tulle netting (the stuff wedding veils are made of) to cover my cabbages. it works great! Its light weight, cheap, and has tiny holes. the rain gets in just fine with no problems, as does the sun. It comes in many colors, and I don't see that it matters what color you use. I've had blue, green, and pink. You can get it at fabric stores or craft stores like Joann's. Usually around now, (pre-wedding season) is a good time to buy it on sale, only about 50 cents a yard. it comes in 72 inch widths too, which is generally better than the 52 inch wide.

I had a bad problem with cabbage moths last year too. Tulle sounds like a fun idea - it will be like prom night in my garden. haha

I used fanfortony's idea of using tulle netting to cover my squash seedings in March. It works great! To use in a raised bed like we did, we made two hoops using flexible black irrigation tubing anchored over short pieces of rebar placed in the corners of the 4'x4' bed. Two pieces of nylon netting were cut into 3' lengths. Overlap the long sides of the netting over the hoops and use short 2.5" pieces of the tubing that have been split as clamps over the hoops. Sandbag the netting around the base of the wood box frame using freezer bags filled with playbox sand. This held up very well in the rain and could be used through the entire growing season of short plants.

Thanks, everyone - the tulle sounds like exactly what I'm looking for. I found some 108" wide tulle sold by the yard on amazon, which should be ample room to let my brussels sprouts get as tall as they want to.

Dicot: I decided on a physical barrier for a number of reasons, some of which are: I want to stop the problem before it starts, not after; although I think Bt is great for many people, I want to avoid any pesticdes if I can; and the idea of dead caterpillars in my broccoli squicks me only slightly less than the idea of live ones. :)

Thanks everyone for sharing your experiences - I'm sure the tulle will work much better!

~Emily

Bt is more like biological warfare, but I understand completely. I used Safers soap on the aphids infesting my cabbage, apparently killed a looper too, which didn't come off when I washed the head. I discovered this by biting into his decomposed little squirmy body.

That was unpleasant.

I used row cover last year and it didn't hold up for the growing season. The tulle sounds really interesting. How long will it last? Can you get more than one season out of it?

dicot how GROSS!

So glad everyone likes the tulle idea. I've used it for years. To answer "never give up", it can last for many seasons. Although, last year I had an issue with Grasshoppers eating through it on my brussels. I wont let that happen again....I didnt know that they liked the brassicas too and just ignored them. Lesson learned! I also find the tulle much easier to handle than row cover. I just fold it up when done and put away until needed again. Because its airy, it doesnt seem to get as dirty and grungy looking as the row cover. Good luck with all your gardens.

Does anyone have any bridal/prom garden pictures?

Thank you fanfortony! Off to look for tulle.

I'll see if this works. I can never remember how to post pics

well, it showed up in the preview! I'll try one more time.

Wow - beautiful! And you can actually SEE your veggies! Which are lovely, and not chewed!

That's it, the order's going in right now.

Thanks so much, fanfortony. I would probably have tried it anyway, but now I'm sure it's going to work.

It'll be s nice to be able to see my poor little transplants again!

~Emily

LOL. Emmers, glad you like it. Took a while to show it to you! Hope you enjoy your PROM Garden. :)

Great idea! I'm wondering if this would work for carrot flies, too, or if they are small enough to get through those holes. Hmmmm...

I am interested in using tulle for a cover for my broccoli and brussel sprouts. Do I need a frame to hold up the tulle or can I just make a bag (the tulle can be sewn quite easily) and put it over the plant? If the plant is holding up the tulle, will the moth be able to lay eggs on the top of the plant?

awwwwww, how pretty ! I like that it is blue or green. It blends in better than white would have.

Thanks for the tulle idea. I have yards and yards in my fabric stash -- never thought of using it for the veggies!!

DL

I was thinking about this, and am glad I found this thread. I have been battling Squash vine borers this year, and have thought about using row covers and hand-pollinating next year instead, so I don't have to spend many hours a week hand-picking eggs and injecting BT, which is getting OLD! Last weekend while at a wedding reception,they had hung up some white netting,and I told my wife that I thought that would make good stuff to use to cover my plants. I liked it cause here in Texas it gets super hot, and I didn't want to cook my plants with something designed to keep in the heat. Also I want to let as much light in as possible. I really doubt the SVB moth can squeeze in through the holes of the netting I saw. So I will definitely try it next year. Just need to ask my wife to sew together long strips so I can make a very wide net to accommodate the large, sprawling squash plants.

This-is-where-I-got-the-idea,too.Here-on-PLease-excuse-my-typing-etc...as-large-print-keyb0ard-does-s-not-work-properly
Gardenweb.I-ordered-2-bolt,summer-before-last..I-even-sewedlenthstogether-to-cover-small-and-med-fruit-treees....I-got-plums-that-year....I-made-frames-for-the-smaller,newer-trees,too....I-used-4ft-steel-rods,the-
Iused-flexible-irrigation,hoses,cut-to-lentghs,etc.
I-went-extra-and-made-(sewed)-casings-with-drawstring-s-for-my-blueberries>
K-LIkre-big-pillowslips,actually.
-also-sewed-the-draw-strings-I-just-sewe-lots-of-bias-tape.together.they-are-like-a-big-pillowcase....AS-blueberry-bushes-got-bigger-Ih-ad-wished-I-made-the-covers-open-and-gather-top-and-bottom...
bushes,too.I-used-them-couple-years
Just-chiming-in-with-my-two-cents-and-previous-experiences...
Thanks-all
Jean

I have been using cheap green mosquito netting. Instead of hoops I use thin sticks or canes, particularly in pots, and attach the netting with bulldog clips. For us gardeners with very limited space, the vertical sides give the crops a little more room! Mike

I just bought a 54" wide by 40 yards long bolt for less than $10.00 here: http://www.giftsintl-us.com/tullefabric.php

This sounds like a good idea.

I think that's a great idea and I'm going to suggest this to my gardening buddy, the Amish man who's my neighbor!
But what about bird netting instead? I would think that the bird netting would give you more yardage. Trouble is, it might not be available at this time of yr when they start putting a lot of the gardening stuff away in the stores.

Another vote for tulle. You can drape it without a frame, but be sure you don't leave any gaps where the moths can fly in.

Here is a link that might be useful: Net on brassica

Lizbeth, unfortunately cabbage white butterflies and cabbage moths go straight through birdnetting!

I bought some remay low tunnels and am determined to get some fall broccoli. I transplanted my broccoli starts 10 days ago and have been watching there progress carefully. A couple of days ago I watched one of those white cabbage moths spend maybe 5 minutes trying to access the hoop from one end - thankfully it was unsucessfu; its persistance was scary. A few days later I noted some damage to some of the plants. I pulled back the hoops and found a good old fashioned caterpillar and a giant slug under there. Crushed the catepillar, tossed the slug, put down some slug pellets and replanted some broccoli starts.

Lesson learned: The hoop is only good if there isn't anything in or on the soil when you cover the plants. Yes you can see I actually do use newspaper Pots to start my plants cost $0!!

I just came from Joanns and tulle is now between $1.49 and $4.99 a yard and only 54" wide, so I would have to sew 2 lengths together to get the width, making it not cheap if you need a lot. I bought net instead because it was same price but 72" wide. I am praying that the holes aren't big enough to let critters in.

Check this out:
http://www.fabric.com/crafts-craft-fabrics-108-39-39-wide-tulle-fabric-108-wide-tulle-silk-white.aspx

108' wide tulle. I just bought 18 yards of it, because of the free shipping on orders over $35, that put me just over $35. So that will give me a 54 feet by 9ft piece.. that's a stinkin' big net! I'll need to figure out how to cut in in segments that I will need, especially for my squash, since eventually I will need a big piece, but at first I will just need a little. Since I am not too sure of the durability of the tulle netting under the sun, I might cut a small piece and a big piece, so I can use the small piece while the plants are small, then when the plants get bigger, replace it with the bigger piece, and hopefully I will be able to put away the smaller piece and reuse it later.

Here is a link that might be useful: link to the fabric website

Price update: Joann fabric's has this for 29.00 that's half price right now. You need to buy a whole bolt which is 72inches by 40 yards. Shipping was 6.95. It arrived in 3 days. IF memory serves, this is an on-line special.

No one has yet to mention, that although it's nylon, it is washable!!!!

Dang, I wish I had read this thread before I ordered row cover! I thought it was rather expensive at $10 for 25 feet, but didn't know what other options would be good :(.

There was a recent post elsewhere about tulle in keeping bugs off plants. I understand you can get tulle in two forms -- nylon and polystyrene. The polystyrene stuff is called "glossy" tulle. It's about 25% more expensive than the nylon tulle (both of which are really cheap). Polystyrene is a bit more UV resistant than nylon, so you might try to pick up some of the "glossy" stuff.

DO NOT put netting over a patch where you had bad bugs before. They're probably still in the soil, and the netting will just hold them in when they hatch.

Big craft stores have tulle for about $1 per yard. A big more expensive at JoAnn.

As to making a net wider than a yard, I'm sure some fabric ribbon (there's a name for that ...) can easily be used to glue (Liquid Nails) two lengths together. One long strip. Don't do it by sewing.

At least in my neck of the woods, as of today, Hobby Lobby has tulle on special for $0.70/yard. (Just the plain nylon stuff.) Time to stock up.

I tried the tulle last year and it worked really well until the rabbits found it. Now I've got tulle with much larger holes that would only keep out giant bugs--like those larger than a rabbit!! Dang wabbits!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Coyotes moved in this winter. Sure hope they like rabbits.

I am reminded that a "yard" of tulle, is about a yard and a half wide, and can stretch farther. So keep that in mind when you're laying out your protection. (Unlike, for wood, a 2x4 is really 1 1/2 x 3 1/2!)

I don't have rabbits, but I have loads of squirrels who like to dig holes and steal produce. (I also have barred owls, and I think they like squirrels.)

Thanks, Wolverine, I just ordered 80 yards from the link you posted last summer. Glad it was still good. Cost was $10 for each of the two 40yard bolts plus $10 s/h.

Last year, I discovered that both mamma and baby wrabbits could fit through the 2 inch holes in my fence. Still,, at this price and ease of use, I think I'll try doubleing the fabric around the base of the fence to see if it helps. With the drought last summer, there was not much for the little critters to eat or drink except in the garden. Hopefully it will be different this year.

I had high hopes for tulle netting. I had a terrible time with squash vine borers last year. I got my squash and zukes all tulled up and ready to go this year! Everything has been great for 2 weeks until today. I found SVB eggs on the leaves. The tulle keeps the SVB moth out, but doesn't stop her from laying eggs through the tulle. :(. The little holes are just big enough for the eggs to fit through. Anyone try drapery shears before?

Im13- could you use wire to make half hoops to keep the tulle above the plant so the squash vine borers cannot lay their eggs through the holes?

And thank you very much for the website Wolverine. It was still good as of Jan 2015, and, the tulle was on sale for 8.95 for a 54" by 40 yard bolt. Shipping and handling were $10. A most excellent deal, imho.

Another buffalo,
Did you use Illusion tulle? It is very fine. I have used for a few years on squash and didn't have issues the last two years. And my squash leaves were huge and grew right up against the tulle.
Keski

I also use tulle. 108" width over hoops over my raised bed. Plant broccoli under it in the spring and fall and squash in the summer. I do have to hand pollinate the squash. Any summer squash, zucchini or pumpkins not covered will eventually get hit with the SVB in my location.

This post was edited by yolos on Fri, Jan 16, 15 at 22:10

Yolos, that looks good. How tall are your hoops and how wide is the bed? Are the hoops constructed of pvc? Thanks, Jen.

The hoops are 1/2 inch PVC. I buy the 10 foot lengths and cut them down to 9 feet to make sure I have enough room for the 108 inch tulle to hang over the side of the bed. They are insert into 1 inch PVC pipes attached to the inside of the bed with EMT one hole strap. The bed is 3 feet wide. Sorry, I don't know how tall they are and I can't measure the height of them now because I do not have any set up yet.

I place a panel on each end of the bed and then a big piece from one side of the bed to the other side. So I just have to undo a couple of clips to raise up the side of the tulle to hand pollinate. I use jumbo binder clips purchased at the office supply store to secure the tulle to the PVC.

I also use pieces of 1 x 2 or 1 x 1 wood laying on top of the tulle to hold the side panel down. That makes it easy to get into the bed.

Thanks for the thorough reply yolos. I've been trying to decide how long to cut my pvc to fit broccoli inside. I have terrible caterpillar problems with broccoli and I'm hoping this works.

You are welcome jenhp. It does not need to be this tall for broccoli. But I use it for Broccoli in the spring and fall and squash/zucchinni in the summer. The squash and zucchini try to bust out of the sides and the top. But without this covering, I can't grow these crops without a lot of losses or time wasted picking off insects or spraying heavily with pesticides.

I used tulle last summer to keep potato beetles off my potato plants. Worked well, so I expect I will do the same this year. By the end of the season I had some holes in the fabric, however - it seemed to be breaking down from UV exposure. I used 108" that I got at Joann's, which covered two adjacent beds, each of which had black plumbing tubing for a frame. I used water-filled milk jugs as weights on the edges and corners. I don't have raised beds. With a 40% off coupon it was about $1.65 per yard, so thanks for the links to various sources. I see that if I buy it by the bolt it can be ~$1 per yard.