Cheaper way to kill fleas on your dogs

msmitoagainJuly 30, 2008

The below is what I use on my dogs. We have 20 dogs, due to having deer hunting dogs, rabbit hunting dogs and rescued dogs because we live in the country. This information came from the MS Dept. of Wildlife, Parks and Fisheries Hunting Dog Forum. I used it last year and this year when some of our beagles came home with fleas and it works. After killing the infestation and then re-applying for a couple of months, I didn't continue using it because they are all penned and the fleas were gone.

I am not a vet. So I don't want anybody reaming me out for posting this. Use only at your own risk, but I have told several of friends about this and they are now using it too with no dire effects. It worked for us and it's an affordable solution to fleas. I have not found any ticks on the dogs either. I used it as a spot-on and also sprayed their houses/pens with it. But mainly what I'm trying to point out, use less if you are not sure to be sure you don't over dose your dog.

FROM THE MDWPF FORUM, remarks cut from several posters:

If you have flea problems i recomend using BAYER - TREE AND SHRUB spray it works wonders , i apply 12 cc's once a month down the back on my grown hounds , you can buy it at wal-mart , Home Depot and i think i saw it at Lowes

We had a bad tick and flea infestation at the camp where the dogs are housed. Dogs were covered in ticks and fleas. I used the Bayer TREE AND SHRUB.. Let me tell ya that stuff rid the dogs of all the ticks and the fleas were minimal.. That stuff works great.. I diluted with water and sprayed all the dogs.

I need to go back this weekend and do another treatment. I will try the 12cc's that has got to be easier than spraying. :)

Just put it on your dogs neck full strength out of the bottle and rub it in.You can dilute and spray the kennels if you want or you can put Borax laundry detergent on your kennel floors.Just sprinkle it like a lite snow and dampen it so that it will not blow away.Both works great on fleas.

This is what I told my friends:

It talks about using Bayre Tree and Shrub to spray yards or to use it as a spot on. I bought a bottle at walmart this weekend it was $19 . I think I got the large bottle, there may be a smaller one available.

The Bayre might be a little more now than when I bought it. We use a syringe that I got from the vet supply to pull it out of the bottle. But we do not use a needle on the syringe when applying the liquid to the dog. Just squirt it on between the shoulder blades and rub it in with the end of the syringe.

We talked about it and we said that we would use 6 cc's on our big beagles. And, 3 to 4 cc's on the smaller beagles, and 1-2 cc's on the small yard dogs.

We think when they are referring to 12 cc's per hound, that they are talking about Walkers or Coon Hounds 50-60 Lb dogs.

The adult male Bluetick coonhound will normally weigh between 55 to 80 pounds and be between 22 and 27 inches tall.

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HerringboneD28(z7 Central AR)

Makes sense. The active ingredient in Bayer Tree & Shrub is 1.47% imidacloprid - the same ingredient which they market in Advantage flea control for dogs in a 9.1% solution.

    Bookmark   July 31, 2008 at 2:16PM
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I wonder, for cats??


    Bookmark   August 3, 2008 at 7:24PM
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I have dominion 21 which is 21% imidacl.....since you said advantage is 9.1 % what do I use on a dog 150 lb,140lb,120lb,100lb and 160lb I have others 35lb 60lb 85lb I rescue and cannot afford the label products thanks I was told to dilute w/water is that right all info is helpful I don't want to od them

    Bookmark   May 18, 2010 at 5:35PM
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athenalegare - I would have responded to your email that you sent me, but I cannot locate an email address for you. However you sent your message shows up as "Do Not Respond to this Message".

We've used the Bayre Tree and Shrub on our hunting and outside dogs. We used it in 2008 and 2009 as a spot on for a couple of months and as a spray.

We used it as a spot on based on what I posted above. We sprayed as mixed per the instructions on the bottle and sprayed in the dog houses and kennels.

We've not had any strays this year (nor escapes) which will usually generate a flea infestation.
The dogs have not had any fleas so far this year and we've not had to treat any of them.

I don't know what product you have. So therefore, I cannot give you any advice on that one. I would get the Bayre Tree and Shrub and it is affordable.

In our opinion of using the Bayre on our dogs we used the phylosophy that "less is best". We didn't want to overdose any of our dogs either.

All of them are very fat, healthy and doing just great.

    Bookmark   May 19, 2010 at 9:43AM
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Diatomaceous Earth is perfectly harmless (except to fleas and all other insects) as long as you use the food grade only. Good for both cats and dogs and can be put into food to take care of internal parasites. (good also for ants and anything invading your home --- you can even put it on top of your counters without harming anyone.)

Amazing to me that this isn't more widely known, but vets don't make much money selling it. We have used it for decades and never buy anything else for fleas, ticks, ear mites, etc.

    Bookmark   May 19, 2010 at 3:27PM
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Is diatomaceous earth available at most box stores? I remember some pool filters use it but pool supply stores are usually expensive.

    Bookmark   June 25, 2010 at 6:33PM
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My neighbor who moved away this spring used DE for Jap beetles last year. Got it at Lowe's. I don't know much about the stuff but he's into organics and said to be sure to get the food grade but didn't know they could eat the stuff. He put on a mask and surgical gloves, dampened his hibiscus, then sprinkled the DE all over it, got rid of most of the beetles, should repeat every week. Should be safe for bees.

As to the Bayer stuff, the imidacloprid I know kills bees so gardeners using it indiscriminately are causing great harm (shouldn't spray it on anything that is blooming), but I guess if you spray your dogs with the right concentration, it might be ok and cheaper than Advantage which works great and also has residual action for some time that kills any that they pick up later, got rid of mine in the house one year using it on my cat so didn't have to get pest control but not a major infestation like I've had in the past.

I'd be careful using it on a cat though. I'd call a vet, and they sell Advantage based on the weight of the cat, so I'd tell them how much your cat weighs and ask what the concentration of imidacloprid on the squeeze tube is for that weight. If just one cat, I'd just use Advantage and not the Bayer personally.

I'm a little leery though but can see the bind you're in as Advantage for every dog would be expensive.

I used to have to dip mine and didn't know any better, but used the dog strength on a cat and nearly killed the poor thing, it languished for a few days then got better. Never make that mistake again.

    Bookmark   June 25, 2010 at 9:59PM
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softmentor(z9/sunset13 CA desert)

I agree with carmen_grower_2007. We use diatomaceous earth too, and it works well. If you have never used it, it may take 3 to 5 days for it to get all the little crawlies but it works. Be sure to use FOOD GRADE and NOT the stuff they sell for pools. Here are a couple of sites:

    Bookmark   June 25, 2010 at 10:21PM
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I use advantage on my cats- vet tech who has lots of cats let me in on the secret. I use .4 CCs on cats under 9 lbs and .8 CCs on cats over 9 lbs. I have been buying the blue tube of advantage which is 9.1% imidacloprid. It works very well. I use a 3CC syringe because it's easier to read. I want to use the Bayer product (1.47%), but am unsure how to because of the difference in percentages. Anybody know a chemist?

    Bookmark   August 7, 2010 at 4:21PM
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Pooh Bear

I found a great way to keep fleas off our dog.
Add to his drinking water four teaspoons of
apple cider vinegar per gallon of water.
At first I did this to all his drinking water
but after the fleas were gone I slacked off and now
I only have to do this a couple of times per week.
It raises the acidity level in the blood
and the fleas just don't like that at all.

Pooh Bear

Here is a link that might be useful:

    Bookmark   August 17, 2010 at 11:29PM
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    Bookmark   April 19, 2011 at 11:29AM
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First of all I don't like diatomaceous earth applied on my dogs because it make their hair dusty and grimey which is not suitable for me sense they are inside and I like to scratch them without getting a film on my hands. It's good for other things though and safe. I've been using permethrin 10%. It's also used a lot with horses, kennels, breeders, hunters, and stables. It should not be used on cats, and I have heard that a mixture with Bayer is even better which is what I'm researching now. With Permethrin, the fleas die instantly, but usually come back after a week or two. Still it's cheap and effective. With Bayer it sounds like it may be much better.

    Bookmark   June 28, 2011 at 9:54AM
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12 ccs of the Bayer as a spot-on treatment for fleas? That would be 12 syringes full (small insulin syringe) for a say 70 lb dog? This seems like a LOT. Are you sure it's not 1.2 ccs?


    Bookmark   July 10, 2011 at 8:39AM
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I found the same thing as the Bayer and Dominion at a store here...Wondering if it is the same thing the amt of 1.47% imidacloprid ...Orschelins carry's it..and it also is for trees and shrubs...I would like to hear more from those who have used it...The fleas are horrible this year...

    Bookmark   July 15, 2011 at 4:26PM
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Are you aware that Bonide Tree and Shrub has the SAME 1.47 % concentration of Imidocloprid ; however it is 33% cheaper then the Bayer Tree and Shrub per gallon... GLTA a former owner of a German Shepherd..

    Bookmark   March 1, 2012 at 2:02AM
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We use Permetrhin down the spine. We have used garlic given orally. Never used vinegar but many tout it is good for many things.

I would hesitate to use a tree & shrub chemical on any animal without doing my research. We use no chemicals on our trees or lawns, either. One has to wonder what those chemicals, sprayed all over the place, are doing to the beneficial bugs, like maybe butterflies & the bees that are dying off so quickly.

I suppose it is better to spot it on a dog than to spray it all over the lawn & shrubs.....but still, has any research been done on the effects of humans/animals?

Has anyone researched the active ingredients, or is everyone just using it because he fleas & ticks are gone?

Just curious...

    Bookmark   March 1, 2012 at 8:00PM
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There is no evidence that diatomaceous earth has ever killed a worm inside an animal. Ever. Anywhere.
Detrimental to external arthropod parasites, yes, but nematode parasites inside the animal, NO.

    Bookmark   March 8, 2012 at 10:48AM
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bruglover(Gulf States)

Don't feed garlic to dogs. It can cause gastrointestinal upset and a type of anemia.

Here is a link that might be useful: ASPCA - pets and garlic

    Bookmark   March 12, 2012 at 10:43PM
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Dont know if its cheaper but I like it,instead of putting the greasy stuff on back of neck you spray bedding ,the dog,frontline.

    Bookmark   March 27, 2012 at 8:10AM
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The packaged Advantage for pets is about 7 times more potent than the tree and shrub is at 1 1/2% so that is why you have to use more, but that being said, we did not use anywhere near 12 cc's on our 80# dogs and it worked fine. I do not remember for sure what we used last year...we started with about 6 and waited for a week to see if it worked and if it did not, we added another 1 or 2 and so on, the first time around. A month later, we knew what had worked. And yes, it did work! We were breeding doxies and had always used Frontline spray until they became resistant to it! Our whole area of pet owners were going crazy! We were so happy to find this! For the 10-12# dogs, we used 2cc's spread down their spines and for the cats we used about the same or a little less depending on weight. Time to start in again this year!

    Bookmark   June 15, 2012 at 11:55PM
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Please be aware that if you are using "Bayer Tree & Shrub Insect Killer" that Bayer Co. added a fertlizer to it in 2010--the label now says "Protect & Feed"--the "feed" part is nitrogen fertlizer which can burn your pet.

Best to use Ortho Tree & Shrub Insect Killer or Martin's brand of Tree & shrub Insect Killer, or Old Dominion brand--they contain only imidacloprid and no added fertilizer.

    Bookmark   July 10, 2012 at 12:02PM
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I'm going to give the Bayer tree and shrub a try on the dog but really hesitate to use it as a surrounding spray because of our collapsing bee colonies. In places where fleas are in grass and soil, I swear by beneficial nematodes. You water spray them on the lawn and especially under houses if the dogs/cats can get there. But you must keep the ground moist for awhile after applying. (for those of you in drought conditions--my sympathies) You can buy different varieties for different insects at

Here is a link that might be useful: The Flea control type

    Bookmark   July 29, 2012 at 10:19PM
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I was looking for some information and came across this post, which caused me to do something I have never done and that is join a forum.

What you are recommending is ILLEGAL and is breaking federal law.

It is illegal to use a pesticide on any site not listed on the label, even if it contains the same active ingredient as another product that does have that use on its label.

It is not just the active ingredient, but the formulation as well. Example: Rodeo (an aquatic formulation of glyphosate) is safe to use to control emerged aquatic vegetation and will not harm aquatic invertebrates.. Round Up on the other hand has the same active ingredient, but will harm aquatic invertebrates.

One BIG reason that the EPA pulls registrations of pesticides is because of misuse. We used to have an excellent fire ant control product that was available for homeowners to buy, but because of consumer misuse (not following label directions), the product is now restricted and has to be applied by a certified applicator.

Somebody is going to harm their dog or cat following your recommendations.

    Bookmark   November 19, 2013 at 1:17PM
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now that you've put your 2 cents in, go unsignup from the forum.....

p.s., could you not read that this post started in july of 08.........

    Bookmark   February 24, 2014 at 3:59PM
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I believe that Bayer is the manufacturer of Advantix for dogs. Yet I understand why many pet owners have resulted to using their insecticide product made with Imidacloprid for their pets. Many people who own pets simply cannot afford to spend over $50 per 3 item/box of Advantix etc. for their pets. I am unemployed and have 5 dogs to care for. One was my dog, the other 4 were dumped here ( I live in a rural area where pet dumping is common). I cannot buy over $1000 worth of Advantix a year. I tried the Bayer Tree and Shrub imidacloprid on these dogs and it worked great. I live in a wooded area where fleas are horrendous in the summer. The fleas come in from the woods and fields into the yard; you can walk outside in white socks and have hundreds on your socks. They end up in the house and are difficult to remove. I would rather use this product than see animals tortured to death by fleas. Fleas can kill your pets!!!! I've volunteered in animal rescue and have seen dogs killed by fleas.
As far as naysayers stating that it is not recommended to use this product on pets; it is no more of an off-label use than what doctors do every day with prescription drugs. Also, any product that you spray in your yard, ends up on your pets, in your house on your carpet, you breathe it in, etc. There is no completely safe product, but if you use it sparingly, you may lessen the long term effects.

    Bookmark   March 23, 2014 at 10:17PM
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The Bayer product I purchased is the 3-in-1 for trees and shrubs. The only other kind I found is the one with feed (nitrogen) in it also so I went with the 3-in-1. It has two other ingredients besides the Imidacloprid, Tau-fluvalinate and Tebuconazole. Before I put this on my dogs I want to be sure it is safe to use. I'm not worried about the Imidacloprid but the other two I'm not sure about. Has anyone else used this product on their animals?

    Bookmark   May 4, 2014 at 11:15PM
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I had to buy the Ortho Tree & shrub Concentrated spray that goes on your hose, As you know finding Bayer w/o fertilizer is almost impossible. My concerns are the correct dosage to put on our pets. Since it is concentrate, do I use it full strength out of the bottle, or dilute it first? This is for med/ large dogs & cats. Thanks for your help

    Bookmark   May 30, 2014 at 2:08PM
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It is labeled as a Tree & Shrub Insect Killer. I used to buy the Bayer product but they added fertilizer a few years ago. I have switched to the brand made by Bonide. It is about $20 for a quart.

The active Ingredient is Imidacloprid 1.47%, which is the same active ingredient that is in Advantage. (Advantage is 9.1%.) The tree and shrub version is not as concentrated as Advantage, that is why you have to use more and the consistency is different but it works! I have used it and a personal friend of mine in dog rescue with a dog and cat sanctuary has used it for years, with no problems.

You can buy it at Wal-Mart, Tractor Supply, etc. Just look for the active ingredient of Imidacloprid. Do not buy any that say âÂÂplusâ because it will have fertilizer in it.

Imidacloprid Doses for Tree and Shrub product.

1 cc or ml per 5 pounds.

Between Shoulder Blades and down the spine. I put on rubber gloves and rub it in. I actually have much better luck with this than Frontline which was only good for 3 weeks on my dogs. With this I am getting over 6 weeks effectiveness. Depends on how much your dogs go in the water too as it is water soluble. My friend who uses it only gets about 4 weeks out of it but her dogs are in the water several times a week.

    Bookmark   June 2, 2014 at 4:19AM
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To Hortagent.... I hope you were on your government job lunch break when you put your two cents of ILLEGAL PC crap on the subject and that we the tax payer were not paying for you to join this site, cos that's more ILLEGAL in my book?

For people still looking for a generic "Tree and Shrub" with the single 1.47% Imidacloprid ingredient can now buy ANDRO Tree & Shrub at Walmart.

Bayers Imidacloprid came off patent a while ago, and now other brands are making and selling it. I found the ANDRO over at Walmart the other day, but it's only in select stores so check their website to see which local stores are carrying it. It's only $11 a 32 oz bottle. SAME chemical as ADVANTAGE only Advantage uses 9% concentration in each spot-on vial.

PLEASE use this produce responsibly folks.... Europe has banned it's use as a systemic application on crops/plants/trees/shrubs due to it being highly toxic to Honey Bees. Studies have reported that just one application in you back yard can have devastating effects on pollinators causing a total colony wipe-out within days. (See Imidacloprid and bees on wikipedia) There is currently a move here in the USA to have this chemical banned by the EPA. So far, the movement to ban has only resulted in a diluted or weaker solution being sold. But, it won't be long before it is taken off the market completely.

    Bookmark   June 25, 2014 at 9:31AM
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Signed up just to post this here.
Recommended Usage at 9.1% concentration should be around
.23ml for kitten under 5lbs/
.4m for cats 5-9lbs/
.8ml for cats 9lbs++/
.4ml for dogs under 10lbs/
1.0ml for dogs 11-20lbs/
2.5ml for dogs 21-55lbs/
4.0ml for dogs 55lbs++/
ML are = to CC 4ml = 4cc .27ml = .27cc
Apply at base of cats skull and or between dogs shoulder blades.
If you use a product like advantage, foaming of the mouth can occur, which is a reaction to the alcohol within the solution. It shouldn't harm anything with a vertebra.

Also, for cats look into "Program" oral and injectable, key ingredient lufenuron. For dogs look into Sentinel.

    Bookmark   September 11, 2014 at 7:22PM
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Did some research and came up with this. I think before you put this chemical on your beloved pets you might want to, at a minimum, contact them and check it out. I did some research and found some information by a veterinary professional that works for Bayer. This is what I found out:
The Bayer Advanced Garden product is not made by the same division that produces the animal topical products. The garden product is not formulated for use on animal skin and there are ingredients in it that are not approved for use in animals. Basically, it has one ingredient that is the same, but the other different ones should not be used on animals. Some products in the garden product line are very toxic to animals.

    Bookmark   September 29, 2014 at 3:22PM
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After reading your post, I decided to research the inert ingredients for the Bayer product. The inert ingredient in the Bayer formula is Propylene Glycol.
This compound appears to be rather benign to man and dogs. Taken directly from the MSDS for this chemical:
"No adverse systemic changes were reported in rats or dogs following repeated dietary exposure to high concentrations of propylene glycol."

    Bookmark   October 18, 2014 at 12:14PM
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Ok, if you have a pack of dogs there's no way you're going to want to do this, but my mother taught us to diligently pick off & kill fleas every day until they no longer reproduce. It works on my one dog.Haven't had fleas for years. If he would get reinfected, I'd just start over.
And my 2nd helpful hint: use ivermectin sheep drench instead of Heartgard chewables.Huge amount of money saved. You can buy it & disposable syringes (for measuring-not injecting) at Amazon.It costs between 2-3 cents a month.Dosages for dogs by lb available on the internet.
Heartworms are becoming resistant to medications & there are other options besides ivermectin. But if you're using ivermectin, no sense paying all that money for expensive, meat flavored dog treats with the same ingredient.

    Bookmark   October 24, 2014 at 3:33PM
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If you can "pick off and kill fleas", then you must be able to catch flies with chopsticks too.

Those suckers jump around, and you are more likely to just end up infested yourself if you try to "pick off & kill fleas". Even with a flea comb you are highly likely to miss many of the little buggers. Not to mention the whole self-infestation thing.

Thanks for reminding me about ivermectin sheep dip. Last time I checked prices on that, it was only available by the liter (about a quart) and was stupid expensive, so I didn't recommend it.

Checking on Amazon I found it in an 8 oz bottle for under $30. I have updated my ivermecting for doggies thread accordingly.

RE using DE to kill fleas: I've never seen that DE has ever affected any insect in any visible way. But if you must use the stuff, make sure you wear a breathing filter. The stuff is he!! on your lungs - and the lungs of your pets, I would imagine - if breathed in.

    Bookmark   December 17, 2014 at 5:18PM
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Nitenpyram, the active ingredient in Capstar- any ideas on where to find it?
Preferably pure as possible.
Need a doable way to get this for my indoor cats, not affordable otherwise.
We are infested, after the rescue of 2 abandoned ferals (who are now happily fostered elsewhere, on their way to a good home ;)
Thanks for any help (yes, I am heavily researching as regards safety, this is my starting point.).

    Bookmark   January 30, 2015 at 3:37PM
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I would try to use a more natural way to kill fleas/ticks on dogs, I know Gardens Alive sells products that aren't quite so toxic to animals. We had a bad experience with my parent's dog. She was older (8 years old) but otherwise no apparent health problems. They had always applied frontline on her, but apparently something happened which did not agree with her. After my mom applied it, she said that the dog "shivered all over" after the application. A few hours later she started having her first seizures ever. It went down hill from there, more and more medications heaped on her (barbiturates, etc) and they finally had to put her to sleep as she was deteriorating fast. I'm not sure what the active ingredient is, but I've heard other people saying that their dogs died from it as well.

    Bookmark   March 12, 2015 at 3:39PM
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