Young Lycidas or Princ. Alex. of Kent

canadian_rose(zone 3a)April 15, 2014

I'm thinking of getting one (or maybe both) of these 2 roses:

Young Lycidas
Princess Alexander of Kent.

Which do you think is a more lovely rose and has the better perfume. I guess I want the whole package - good repeat and strong neck too.


Thank you for reporting this comment. Undo
ingrid_vc so. CA zone 9

I've only grown Young Lycidas (for about a year) but just now looked up PAK on helpmefind, and the roses actually look remarkable similar to me except for the color which is more in the reddish-purple range in YL. They both seem to have thin canes on which the flowers nod a little. Young Lycidas has a lovely fragrance and I've seen no disease on mine whereas other roses here have mildew and some blackspot. Still, I would wait for someone to respond who has grown this rose longer and has PAK also. Needless to say, our zones are also wildly different. If I had to choose I'd take YL because of its more dramatic color, but I'm told the bush can be rangy and floppy.

    Bookmark   April 15, 2014 at 7:32PM
Thank you for reporting this comment. Undo

I have YL but I've only had him planted, in a 24 gallon pot, for about 6 or 8 months. He does have kind of wrinkly (though interesting and green) leaves, but the bush is very full and most of the canes are strong enough to hold up the blooms. I expect he will get even stronger when he's a little older.

I am VERY fond of this guy. The most incredible fragrance I can imagine.

Fantastic Fragrance
Nice full and bushy shape
Gorgeous Blooms

He's a keeper!

    Bookmark   April 15, 2014 at 7:42PM
Thank you for reporting this comment. Undo
jo_pyeweed(z9 SF Bay Area)

I have both.

My Young Lycidas is in its 4th year. The canes are pencil-thin and don't hold up the blooms well. I have him in a raised bed and the flowers appear to better advantage arching over. The leaves are wrinkly, as Andreark has noted. They appear diseased, but are not. He is constantly in bloom and fragrance is very strong - old rose. Don't skimp on his water. He's about 4 feet round.

Princess Alexandra of Kent just completed one year in my garden. She's 5 feet tall and 7 wide, and has bloomed non-stop since arriving. She's also been covered in mildew which I hope she outgrows. Her blooms have balled for me in cooler and damper weather but have been gorgeous this spring. And, yes, she's fragrant too.

I really like both.

Edited to say: YL would be my preference, Carol, if I were forced to choose between them. In my climate, YL has a stronger fragrance, better disease resistance and more compact growth. His color, as Ingrid notes, is unique. The magenta color with a silvery sheen isn't quite captured by camera, and even the David Austin catalogue picture doesn't do YL justice.


Young Lycidas

This post was edited by jo_pyeweed on Tue, Apr 15, 14 at 23:10

    Bookmark   April 15, 2014 at 10:47PM
Thank you for reporting this comment. Undo
jo_pyeweed(z9 SF Bay Area)

And, here's Princess Alexandra of Kent. Her canes are much thicker than YL's but her blooms are heavier so they flop down too but I think she'll get better as she's older in this regard. You get an idea of how wide she is.

The pic is from last week. I thought I had more recent pictures with PAOK flowering more heavily.

    Bookmark   April 15, 2014 at 10:56PM
Thank you for reporting this comment. Undo
Kippy(SoCal zone 10. Sunset Zone 24)

I have both. Both were 5g plants, but YL has an extra season on PAOK in our yard.
The blooms look totally different.

PAOK has had maybe 6 blooms in a year+
YL is absolutely loaded with giant deep pink blooms.

Because of all the blooms I smell YL in the yard, PAOK have not noticed.

YL I can pick a bouquet just off the blooms that want to open too low to view them

PAOK holds her blooms up
YL flops them on his neighbors.

I would get both, YL is a favorite of mine for cutting and taking in just do to the sheer volume of blooms

    Bookmark   April 15, 2014 at 11:06PM
Thank you for reporting this comment. Undo
jo_pyeweed(z9 SF Bay Area)

Kippy - that's a gorgeous picture. I have to get me some Santa Barbara daisies...

"YL flops them on his neighbors."

I have to move Lady Emma Hamilton because YL has flopped all over her. She clearly isn't happy with her sunshine being cut off.


    Bookmark   April 15, 2014 at 11:21PM
Thank you for reporting this comment. Undo
canadian_rose(zone 3a)

Okay....the description of YL has convinced me NOT to get it. :)
The reason is that I HATE that magenta color. LOL I have given away perfectly good roses because I can't stand the color. So that saves me some more money. Thanks! :)

I hear what you're saying about how great a rose it is and how fantastic the fragrance is - but nothing can get me past that color. Pictures really helped define the color too.

Hmmmm - and PAOK is a lovely color - and that picture is great - but it MIGHT be too wide. I'll have to think on that.

Thanks for your help!!

    Bookmark   April 16, 2014 at 1:48AM
Thank you for reporting this comment. Undo

I love PAOK and would recommend it for its beauty. I do think I lost mine over the winter though. It had great snow cover for protection, but took a beating from the winds from the west. Hardiness may be an issue. That said, if she's dead, I will be replacing her immediately (I'll just make sure to better winter protect next year.)

    Bookmark   April 16, 2014 at 9:50AM
Thank you for reporting this comment. Undo
canadian_rose(zone 3a)

Mine go into the garage - so hardiness is not an issue for me. So PAOK sounds like a winner.
Hopefully I'll get more blooms than you did, Kippy the Hippy.

Can anyone else comment on PAOK's bloom quantity??
Oh, I just scrolled back up and reread about PAOK's width. Hmmm....maybe I should just pass on both. After all, I'm already getting 12 new roses this year. :)


    Bookmark   April 16, 2014 at 12:07PM
Thank you for reporting this comment. Undo

Just planted PAOK this morning! I am so excited to see these pictures. Better get back out to plant Brother of Cafadal,Munstead Wood, Tranquillity and another Evelyn. I love spring!!!!! lesley

    Bookmark   April 16, 2014 at 1:27PM
Thank you for reporting this comment. Undo
jo_pyeweed(z9 SF Bay Area)

Carol - PAOK may be a lot smaller for you. The long growing season and mild winter where I am in California means that roses are typically much larger than the sizes stated in catalogues.

Hopefully, others in colder zones chip in on her size.

And, which 12 roses did you get? :-) I got only one new this year (held off because of the drought) - Lady of Shalott. The first bloom just opened and it's shell pink; possibly Heritage. It will be returned today...


This post was edited by jo_pyeweed on Wed, Apr 16, 14 at 14:48

    Bookmark   April 16, 2014 at 2:42PM
Thank you for reporting this comment. Undo
canadian_rose(zone 3a)

Okay....this is fun...I'm getting:

1. Acapella
2. Dame de Coeur
3. James Biddle
4. Yves Piaget
5. Love's Promise
6. Dee-Lish
7. Dolly Parton
8. Fragrant Cloud
9. Martina Mondadori (Carole Bouquet)

  1. Lady Like
  2. Buxom Beauty
  3. Baronne Edmond de Rothschild
  4. Grand Dame

I'm going for big smelly flowers. :)
No shy roses for me in this batch. LOL

Too bad you didn't get Lady of Shalott. Yeah, I would send Heritage back too. And it's not want you want. We want what we want. :)

    Bookmark   April 16, 2014 at 6:24PM
Thank you for reporting this comment. Undo
jo_pyeweed(z9 SF Bay Area)

You have some great roses there, Carol.

I have Yves Piaget as a tiny band acquired last spring. I really should have got it grafted, as bands are slow to take off in my garden. But I did get my first flower a few weeks ago - I couldn't bear to pinch the bud off. The bloom was gorgeous ! I will be pinching any more buds so the palmy can grow....


    Bookmark   April 16, 2014 at 7:51PM
Thank you for reporting this comment. Undo
ingrid_vc so. CA zone 9

I'm another huge fan of Yves Piaget; even a few blooms on the bush make such an impact in the garden.

jo and Kippy, great pictures, thank you. jo, the blue companion plants are so pretty with the roses.

Interesting how many of us have strong color likes and dislikes. I love the color that Carol can't abide, and I on the other hand have a deep dislike of red roses, which so many people are very fond of. It would be pretty boring if we all liked the same things, so it's all good.


    Bookmark   April 16, 2014 at 11:39PM
Thank you for reporting this comment. Undo
canadian_rose(zone 3a)

Yeah, Ingrid, it's all good!

I've had Yves Piaget before - but it was my first attempt at overwintering roses in the garage. And this rose (in pot) was left on the grass where the pot FROZE to the grass/dirt. We just couldn't move it. So it died outside. OF COURSE, it was my favorite rose. Sigh. So I'm looking forward to getting it again.

Jo - I never pinch off first blooms, 2nd, 3rd, etc. I just let them be themselves. I don't think it's done any harm - but who can tell. :)

    Bookmark   April 17, 2014 at 2:31AM
Thank you for reporting this comment. Undo
the_morden_man((Z4-Z5) Ontario, Canada)


I see you have Buxom Beauty on your list. I tested BB against another Kordes HT called Beverly a few years back. Buxom Beauty didn't make the grade (not disease resistant or productive enough), but Beverly certainly did and it outperformed BB in almost every sense. Both of these roses have very large blooms as well and outstanding fragrance.

You may end up loving BB, but I highly recommend you give Beverly a try at some point as well.

    Bookmark   April 17, 2014 at 9:22AM
Thank you for reporting this comment. Undo
canadian_rose(zone 3a)

the morden man
I DO have Bevery!! YAY!! I am (my apostrophe is not working, so I will not use contractions. LOL) very happy to hear it is so good!. I got it as a bare root last summer, so have not seen its full potential.

Buxom Beauty should not be a problem disease wise as that is not usually a problem here. Low productivity is a bummer though. Although you never know. I will keep what you said in mind. :)


    Bookmark   April 17, 2014 at 12:27PM
Thank you for reporting this comment. Undo
Kippy(SoCal zone 10. Sunset Zone 24)

This is what I like about YL, so many blooms I can make a bouquet just cleaning up the canes on the ground

    Bookmark   April 17, 2014 at 10:15PM
Thank you for reporting this comment. Undo
prickles(Los Angeles, CA)

I, too, dislike red colored roses.

Kippy, your Yves Piaget bouquet is beautiful. Is your plant healthy? I was warned before hand that Yves would mildew and mine mildews terribly. Right now I am trying a new way of watering. I mist the whole plant in the morning and hope this method will help. Any tips you have on growing him will be greatly appreciated.

    Bookmark   April 17, 2014 at 11:09PM
Thank you for reporting this comment. Undo
Kippy(SoCal zone 10. Sunset Zone 24)

I saw a bit of mildew on a few buds, but nothing worse so far (the fog just rolled in this week though) Ours gets extra water from gray water and drip system, has about 2" of horse manure under 2+" of mulch it is a VERY happy rose

Crocus Rose is right next to it and has a very very different habit but is also very big and happy.

    Bookmark   April 17, 2014 at 11:13PM
Thank you for reporting this comment. Undo
canadian_rose(zone 3a)

Prickles - Kippy says that the plonk is Young Lycidas. So it's an Austin, and not Yves Piaget. Gorgeous though, isn't it!!!

    Bookmark   April 18, 2014 at 12:15AM
Thank you for reporting this comment. Undo
prickles(Los Angeles, CA)

Sorry... My bad.. A little confusion here.

Thanks Kippy. I guess horse manure does wonder!

    Bookmark   April 18, 2014 at 12:47AM
Sign Up to comment
More Discussions
Growing roses indoors in winter with very little light
I've read many sources here where people stated that...
braverichard zone 6
Iceberg vs. Pope John Paul II
I am considering placing white roses near the entry...
Desertgarden- Las Vegas, Z8b @ 2800 ft.
Belmont Yellow and Schmidt's Smooth Yellow
Somewhere there was a thread on these two roses, but...
Your opinion about Bonide Rose RX 3-in-1 Spray
I want to stay organic with the first few roses that...
How to Take Cuttings...
We are officially moving Monday, and as I walked the...
Desertgarden- Las Vegas, Z8b @ 2800 ft.
People viewed this after searching for:
© 2015 Houzz Inc. Houzz® The new way to design your home™