which do you guys recommend? my primary interest by far is fragrance. what are the differences between these? all good fragrant reds?
thank you! I'm trying to expand my fragrant row and replace my least favs.
All three have wonderful fragrance. The two oldies have dizzying damask perfume, while Firefighter is more fruity. Chrysler has a bushier and tougher plant than gangly Mr. Lincoln and probably blooms more. Firefighter has a more consistent true red color than the others and more classical form. The oldies show a range of crimson, scarlet, and purplish tones depending on the weather.
In my garden Chrysler Imperial had WAY more fragrance than Mr. Lincoln. Not familiar with Firefighter. I am in No Cal, and our climate is classic Mediterranean, if that helps.
thank you guys so much for the reports!!!
I don't have any of them, but someone who has a lot of roses talked me into getting Chrysler Imperial yesterday. He likes it more than Mr. Lincoln.
He said that the fragrance from one cut flower fills his whole house. Small house, but that's pretty potent!
This post was edited by eahamel on Fri, May 17, 13 at 9:19
The Chryslers I've had (have 2 now) have very large, intoxicatingly fragrant blooms. Can't speak for the others. At the risk of pushing a rose I don't know will do well for you or that YOU will like, it's one of my must-have roses.
The roses blue, which some hate--I don't. The bushes are upright, get some blackspot. I love this rose, and old Crimson Glory, but if I had to chose, I'd pick Chrysler for its overwhelming heavy fragrance though Crimson Glory smells mighty fine, too. Both plants I have now are plain old body-bags, been in the ground about 3 years. No-spray yard.
I have Firefighter and Mr. Lincoln. They are both VERY fragrant. Both are tall, but Mr Lincoln is much more narrow. ML has larger, less formal blooms, but he doesn't bloom as much as Firefighter...Firefighter is almost always full of blooms. Both will blackspot some, but Firefighter is more resistant to it. I haven't grown Chrysler Imperial for some time, but I always have to stop and smell it at the local nursery...one of my favorite smelling roses of all time. CI blues much worse than Firefighter or ML, though, and is also more prone to blackspot in my high humidity area even with spraying, so I don't grow it anymore.
I have ML and CI in my garden and if I had to choose one over the other, I would go with Chrysler Imperial. The main reason is the CI blooms a little more then ML. They both are beautiful roses and I'm glad I don't have to choose.
i LOVE my Chrysler Imperials. Firefighter is new for me, but so far I'm impressed. Mr Lincoln - except for a few really exceptional blooms, he hardly blooms at all, as a 2 year old, and is excessively tall and thin (over 6').
Since Mr Lincoln and Chrysler Imperial are both prone to powdery mildew, I opted for Firefighter. Similar fragrance to Mr Lincoln in our climate but has been relatively free of disease (we don't have blackspot).
I have grown all 3 in a previous garden. Since you say your primary interest is fragrance, I will echo others in recommending Chrysler Imperial. I find that fragrance more of a fruity damask to my nose. The most prolific bloomer & best cut flower of three for me was Firefighter. The most disease prone (esp. black spot & really bad rust) was Mr Lincoln.
FWIW-I've watched beds of Mr L & FF at the Washington park rose garden & found them almost indistinguishable at times....growth habit of both is tall upright & both of them "blue" (get shades of pinkish/purplish) Mr L worse than FF. I think the fragrance is similar too, Mr L stronger fragrance to me, but you get more blooms with FF.
.... I think Oklahoma should get an invite to this party before Mr. Lincoln. Oklahoma stays short too and I think smells the best of all.
I've read reports that the color on Firefighter is more of a subdued red similar to Alec's Red. Is this true? I've grown Mister Lincoln before and it had sinfully fragrant deep velvety red blooms. Same for Chrysler Imperial but it blues more and the petal texture is slightly less "velvety". Much better bush though.
Have never grown Chrysler Imperial, don't know why, but after this post, I am getting it. I have Crimson Glory, which is wonderful. Also love Alec's Red - and it doesn't "blue" in my garden and always smells good. I just got Fragrant Cloud last weekend at a rose closeout. Have never grown it but was in love with the fragrance. For those of you who do, is it as fragrant as Chrysler Imperial? I rather like the color too....tho others don't.
awwwww just get all three. Then get a Papa M and an Oklahoma to have all the greats.
Firefighter has been a great rose to add to all the oldies. He is mildew resistant which really helps and his fragrance stays in the heat. Chrysler Imperial is the prettiest fragrance and in my opinion has not been surpassed yet. Papa M is an amazing perfume rose and is just a little different than CI. Both are memorable and when visitors smell a rose from either one they say "That's what a rose should smell like" or "That's the best rose I ever smelled".
Never tried Papa Meilland but now tempted. Do any of these roses do better grafted or own root, or is there a difference? My Crimson Glory is an own root, in a large pot, hope to get it in the ground soon but cant tell if there might be any difference. Not sure if Crimson Glory can be found grafted anymore, unless at big box stores and who knows if that would even be the correct rose? If you all had a choice on these roses - would you pick grafted or own root?
I just smelled a Papa Meilland for the first time last week and I almost don't care if the plant would become a rusty, mildewy eyesore here. It was easily one of the three best scents I've ever experienced from a flower. I have a sorry looking Mr. Lincoln for the wonderful scent as a cut flower, but Papa Meilland is in another echelon as far as I'm concerned.
Etoile de Hollande also has a better fragrance than Mr. Lincoln to my nose amongst reds, but I can't speak for Firefighter.
If your climate will permit it, grow Papa with as little pruning as you can. He will build in size and all you will have to worry about is a little mildew now and then. Worth it for that rare perfume and velvety red blossom.
Yes FF is a bit more subdued of a red. Take pure crimson paint and add a touch of black to it and that is FF. However it is still red, not magenta or purple or blackish red a la Black Baccarra.
One thing that hasn't been mentioned is that Chrysler and its' three offspring are all weak. In Connecticut only Mister Lincoln thrived for me but t is a sparse bloomer and just gets too big.. Chrysler is the most fragrant but also the weakest. Here in SoCal that is not a problem but in CT it always went into decline and after three years or so it wasn't worth keeping. Oklahoma is a prolific bloomer but the blooms are cupped and smallish and the plant is short as well. Papa Meilland is the most like Chrysler but if you are going to use it you might as well take Chrysler which is really the best of them all. My Chrysler here is prolific and the blooms are gorgeous and wonderfully fragrant. But it s weak and I would be curious to know if anyone here in Z6 or below has had success with it.
My Chrysler Imperial, in Zone 6 Kansas, is definitely on the weak side as I have noted in several recent posts on this forum. I'm always surprised to see it launch another bloom cycle cuz to me it usually looks like it is declining during the post-bloom stage.
When it blooms, the flowers are velvet red and fragrant, but you have me worried now as I've had my plant 3-4 years. Maybe this time it will go into decline and stay there! : (
I have Firefighter,Mr Lincoln and Papa Melland, I love them all. But Papa Melland's scent is much stronger than the other two, and the dark red color is really amazing.
Here is a picture of papa in vase.
This post was edited by Smoky88 on Sun, Dec 1, 13 at 4:49
Firefight (Sorry the picture was taken by Ipad not very clear)
This post was edited by Smoky88 on Sun, Dec 1, 13 at 4:43