Another Mystery striped rose - need ID

nippstress - zone 5 NebraskaJuly 10, 2014

Hi folks

Wouldn't you know that after you all helped me ID Papageno from the Rogue Valley mystery roses, I'd have another mystery pop up right near that rose that is also striped. This one has been there a few years and I have absolutely no idea where it came from. I don't recall planting any rose in that spot, so when I saw some rose leaves coming up I tentatively thought it was Dr. Huey from a long-forgotten rose. Basically, I only try to plan thornless roses in this area, and my only guess before it bloomed was a spare Pinky or Caldwell Pink that I had no other spot for.

Well obviously, this isn't either of those roses. It's a low growing red/white stripe, and I can't tell if it wants to climb yet or not. It has been there at least 2 years, but this is the first bloom and it's still a short plant. It might be something that was mislabeled as Caldwell Pink (or whatever), but I can't even ID the source of the plant. If it climbs, it might be Hurdy Gurdy or Berries and Cream. If not, it could be any number of striped roses like Rockin' Robin or Stars 'n' Stripes or even the good Papageno. I don't see any signs of clustering yet, but it's still young. It doesn't strike me as one of the striped HTs, since the form is pretty loose, or any of the OGR striped ones, but as I say I have no clue.

Any ideas, oh striped rose fans?

Cynthia

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vasue(7A Charlottesville)

First reminded me of Fourth of July, which I've seen in person but not grown. But that's supposed to be thorny so you wouldn't have planted that there. Perhaps your roses dropped a fertile hip that's a cross of ones you grow? Pretty!

Here is a link that might be useful: Fourth of July

    Bookmark   July 11, 2014 at 11:03AM
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campv

Raspberry swirl maybe, if its a climber (I have one)

    Bookmark   July 11, 2014 at 5:16PM
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nippstress - zone 5 Nebraska

Thanks for the guesses so far - I'd be thrilled with either one of them. I'd always thought Fourth of July had more yellow mixed in there, but you're right it does look like that picture. Raspberry Cream Swirl would be most welcome, as a grafted plant of that didn't survive my last winter. It would be great if this were a climber, since it's right next to a support.

I don't want to bias the guesses away from lower floris or shrubs, though. I've posted a photo of the whole 2-3 year old (maybe) plant, and while it doesn't really look much like a climber yet, climbers don't necessarily grow much when young. You can see it's taller than the coral bells, but not quite up to the cross bar of the swing at around 3 feet. There are also a reasonable number of thorns on this one, so whatever I'd thought I was planting that was thornless isn't. It doesn't look like a monster, thank goodness, though for stripes I might overlook even that!

Any more guesses?

Cynthia

    Bookmark   July 14, 2014 at 10:34PM
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nippstress - zone 5 Nebraska

If it helps, here's a slightly out of focus shot of the leaves and canes (sorry about the blur - it's in part shade). You can see there are thorns and the leaves look, well, modern is all I can tell.

Cynthia

    Bookmark   July 14, 2014 at 10:36PM
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bouquet_kansas(z6Ks)

It sure looks like my Fourth of July climber.

Carol

    Bookmark   July 15, 2014 at 11:37PM
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jerijen(Zone 10)

Fourth of July does have a good deal of yellow. And it is fearsomely thorny. It is stiffly upright, and "made" to climb.

I don't think this is FoJ -- but I am sorry I cannot suggest a different identity.

    Bookmark   July 16, 2014 at 6:33PM
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bouquet_kansas(z6Ks)

After looking at my Fourth of July rose......I agree with you
jerijen that it cant be it .

    Bookmark   July 17, 2014 at 12:17AM
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iris_gal(z9 CA)

Rosa Mundi ?
Berries and Cream ?
Sheer Stripes ?

Love its colors.

Here is a link that might be useful: Rosa Mundi at HMF

    Bookmark   July 18, 2014 at 2:53AM
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jerijen(Zone 10)

No, I don't THINK it is Berries and Cream. Here is B&C looking good (which it really rarely did, here). Climbers that mildew are not my cup of tea. It's gone.

    Bookmark   July 18, 2014 at 12:34PM
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nippstress - zone 5 Nebraska

Thanks for the continued guesses, folks. All of these have something to offer the process, but I still think we may not yet have the right ID. Raspberry Cream Swirl has about the right configuration, but it seems to have a lot more petals when happy. Berries and Cream grows elsewhere in my yard, but when I look at them side by side, B&C is notably pinker. The loose structure is good, though. BTW, sympathies on the mildew Jeri, but B&C does great for me. I'd love it if it were Rosa Mundi or Sheer Stripes, but I get a distinct impression of texture in those rose's leaves, and this one has much more of that smooth texture.

Just to add in some discussion of non-climbers, let me give you my impression of the contrast of this mystery rose against other red-white striped roses in my yard:

Stars 'n' Stripes, Broceliande, Papageno, Fiesta: fuller blooms, more petals
The Nightwatch - same open pattern but darker red on petals

Rock 'n' Roll is a possibility among what's in my yard, though my impression is still of more petals. I've posted a picture of my bush from last year - what do you think?

Keep the guesses coming if you can - I'm still stumped!

Cynthia

    Bookmark   July 18, 2014 at 4:11PM
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nippstress - zone 5 Nebraska

Another possibility is Rockin' Robin, and I've posted a more closeup picture of that one. Both this one and Rock 'n' Roll seem to have more petals, but maybe that comes with maturity of the plant.

Other red/white stripes I have that it probably isn't:
Neil Diamond, Philatelie - too recent in my yard to have a random cane sprouting, also more double I think

No clues yet, but it's a good mystery to have!

Cynthia

    Bookmark   July 18, 2014 at 4:15PM
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jerijen(Zone 10)

Oh, I could really fall for 'The Nightwatch,' both for the flower, and for the name.

There's no listed source for it. Disappointing!

    Bookmark   July 18, 2014 at 4:20PM
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nippstress - zone 5 Nebraska

Jeri - yep, The Nightwatch is a great rose with really intriguing high contrast. I don't know if the Williams shrubs do well for you, but mine is a trooper coming back each year on the windy edge of my zone 4 pocket in the front yard.

But all is not lost - I got mine from Roses Unlimited in 2009, and while they're not on their current listings for this year, they're still listed in HMF for the Nightwatch. Might be worth dropping Pat a line to see if she still has the mother plant and will be propagating it.

Just adding to the enabling with the photo - I love the variability between each and every bloom! You never know what you'll get, but it's lovely.

Cynthia

    Bookmark   July 21, 2014 at 3:59PM
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jerijen(Zone 10)

AH! I can dream of roses I cannot "afford" to own -- not because of $$$, but because of water . . .

    Bookmark   July 21, 2014 at 5:53PM
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rosaholicme(9)

Looks like Scentimental

    Bookmark   July 21, 2014 at 7:03PM
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jerijen(Zone 10)

No. Not enough petals for Scentimental.

Here's a particularly dark bloom of Scentimental, so you get an idea of the form and the petallage.

    Bookmark   July 22, 2014 at 9:17PM
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