24,795 Garden Web Discussions | Vegetable Gardening

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nancyjane_gardener(Zone 8ish North of San Francisco in the "real" wine country)

Well, Rob....It's very yummy! And I will allow you to put that into your article! ;) Nancy

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ilovecucumbers Zone 6b, NE PA

I'm betting Rob is looking for quotes/anecdotes. Rob, do some research, then come back and ask for stories based on what you find. I'm growing asparagus for the first time this year and it's a nail-biter, I'm tellin' ya.

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Humsi(USDA 9b/10a Sunset 23 SoCal)

I have a 4x12 bed with 3 zukes and 2 yellow squash and it's full. I can't imagine squashing (haha) 16 plants in there.

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nancyjane_gardener(Zone 8ish North of San Francisco in the "real" wine country)

I can't imagine having more than 1 zuk and 1 crookneck unless there is a VERY large family! One of each was fine for our family of 4, but now that we are only 2 we give away quite a lot! Nancy

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floral_uk z.8/9 SW UK

Yes. If they are put into a growing medium. There are no seeds which don't become plants. That's what seeds are for.

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digdirt2(6b-7a No.Cent. AR HZ8 Sun-35)

<I only asked this because a soil expert and phd agronomist expert in irrigation just advised that this idea of building up a bed of organic matter was a bad Idea and would cause more problems than help especially with even water and the water available to plants after the large volume that this composed OM basically pure compost will be able to hold relative to a more even mix of mineral content and OM and to just till in the supplemental OM rather than build up layers. >

That is correct. Planting in a bed of pure compost can be problematic about water. You can always compensate for it with more water. How much of a problem it is often depends on how decomposed all that organic matter is. The more decomposed, the more humus in nature it is, the less the problem.

The difference with lasagna beds vs. straight organic matter is the inclusion of several layers of soil. That is required for an effective and productive lasagna bed to function well.

Dave

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ninjaninku

Thank you for the information I will work with incorporating probably a pre mix soil into the layers from a local soil company as well as possibly some of the local soil depending on how deep the homeowners want me to go and how I think that will affect the overall consistency looking a few years down the road when it is all composted in.

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nancyjane_gardener(Zone 8ish North of San Francisco in the "real" wine country)

I topped my asparagus bed the last couple of years with leaves and got asparagus beetles. Most were still edible, but just didn't look right.

I was told to spread food grade salt on the bed to control weeds. I haven't tried it yet. But no leaves for me next year! Nancy

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teowok

Thanks for the help. The vine weed is not morning glory. I too get bugs that lay eggs but I can control that with Sevin. Last year I used Round Up before the gus came up and I don't think it had any effect on the gus yield. I'll just get more crowns.

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digdirt2(6b-7a No.Cent. AR HZ8 Sun-35)

It isn't so much breaking the rules as it saves us from having to ask about all the other things that could be causing the problems and then waiting for the answers. All info up front is a big help. :)

It does sound from reading your other post, that you went over-board with the additives. Not sure why all that is needed, especially since you added all of them last year too. Minerals are retained in soil for a long time and you can easily create a toxic buildup of them by over-applying mineral based supplements. Unless you have had a professional soil test done that recommended all those additives. Is that case?

Based on the pics I would agree that you have some sun and wind damage from insufficient hardening off, especially in the last pick. But the issue in the first pic and the top leaf in the middle pic shows interveinal chlorosis and that is a nutrient issue. It can be caused by exposure to weather extremes and by excess water (yours or Mother Nature's) AND by a severe nutrient imbalance or a skewed pH in the soil.

Greensand can be lethal if over applied - did you use only per label directions? Did you till it in well before planting? Then you doubled up on all the Mg, Zinc, Copper, Moly and especially the Manganese with the Azomite and some of your leaves appear to me to be showing symptoms of manganese toxicity and the accompanying iron binding. Google images of 'manganese toxicity in plants' to see many pics to compare to your plants. And the link below gives you great info on toxicity symptoms in plants.

https://www.hydroponics.net/learn/deficiency_by_element.asp

This is further compounded by clay soil if you have that (and it looks like clay in the pics).

So if I'm right, what to do? First, get a professional soil test done. Contact your local county ag extension office for that. Ask for an organic matter % and especially a pH and follow their recommendations. Then assuming the local source of compost is providing quality product I'd side dress all the plants with several inches of it in the hopes of binding up as much of the elemental toxicity as possible and hope the plants make it. They may adapt and compensate to some degree. Then lay off all the additives. :) Assuming your soil has an active soil food web they aren't needed anyway and repeated applications are definitely not needed.

Hope this helps. Good luck.

Dave

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floral_uk z.8/9 SW UK

Dirt said it all but I would just add that there was no question of rule breaking, just that without all the details the answers you get will not be as informative as they could be. Good luck in the garden.

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jenandwya

Oh Dave. I am in the bowels of the south. 5 miles from the coast. I am near mobile al and I hail from the great N'awlins. Our weather is sweaty and unforgiving even at christmas. Lol

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jenandwya

Well! Turns out I was severely over-watering. I removed the roofing felt and cut down to watering about 30 minutes every 2 or three days and the new growth is explosive!

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jnjfarm_gw(5a)

the cordless cultivator. no spend money on something else. best used after it is worked up for weed control. 30' x 5' garden a good hoe would be better investment. may want to consider spading that size garden with a spading fork. it doesn't have to be done all at 1 time. or consider a mantis type tiller. check e-bay for mantis tillers. $300 new.

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Peter (6b SE NY)

That's what qualifies for overgrown in vegetation? You should have seen some of my property last year....

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nancyjane_gardener(Zone 8ish North of San Francisco in the "real" wine country)

My raised bed is 4x8 and I have found that 5 untrimmed indeterminates that are tied to a zig zagged line of pig wire are all I can handle. I put my sungold cherry in a 3x3' bed by it's self cause it gets so big. Nancy

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Suzi AKA DesertDance So CA Zone 9b

I was told we can't grow tomatoes here because it gets too hot in summer. I have one Big Boy purchased at HD now growing in partial shade. I know jalapeno peppers do fine in partial shade, so giving tomatoes a whirl too. Nice to know sort of what to expect. There are only two of us, so we figured one plant would suffice. The jalepeno went in a month earlier than the tomato and is already producing. No flowers yet on the 1' tall tomato, but it's growing. Soon!

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Tracy West

I a lot of people in the far north plant runner beans. I've also heard that they start their regular beans indoors. In a greenhouse is another option, although that wouldn't work for you.

Can you put the seeds in a very large pot of soil in the house and take them in and out for sunny weather for a month or so? Then just move them outdoors when it's warm enough? Beans hate colder weather. They also don't do well in extreme heat like AZ. I always had to really on yardlongs and cowpeas when I was in AZ.

Also, bush beans have shorter days to maturity. But, hard to get much from a couple of pots of bush beans.

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glib(5.5)

in my case I, too, don't get much from runners, so I stick to regular pole. Warm the soil with black plastic, and consider putting up a small hoop house to protect the beans until it is warm enough. The yield of pole beans is largely determined by how long they can produce, and you are in Zone 2.

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nancyjane_gardener(Zone 8ish North of San Francisco in the "real" wine country)

Zzackey, I'll give it a try if I can find some. Nancy

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Tracy West

S the New Zealand spinach compared to regular?

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jean001a(Portland OR 7b)

Obtain some packaged fertilizer for veggies, then follow label directions.

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mystmaiden(texas zone 8)

I ordered sakatas and midget so far. I'd still love to hear from anyone else with recommendations

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little_minnie(zone 4a)

There is nothing tastier than Charentais.

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digdirt2(6b-7a No.Cent. AR HZ8 Sun-35)

Any organic matter helps - leaf mold, chopped straw or hay, cotton or coffee hulls, etc. Not as effective at compost but helps. Peat skews your soil pH so use depends on your pH. Sand, per all the discussions over on the Soil forum, doesn't help much and it takes a lot of it. Even unfinished compost works and it finishes composting in place. Did you fill the whole bed with only compost? Nothing else?

Your compost contains enough diverse components or just turf. Perhaps it needs more carbons added to decompose. Do you run an active hot compost pile or a stacked cold pile? What is available to you locally?

Dave

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wayne_5 zone 6a Central Indiana

If you have soil that is heavily clay and tends to be slow to dry out, warm up, and tends to be cloddy, I think 3 inches of medium/ coarse sand can do wonders to loosen that soil up. For my silty clay loam I also add a good bit of peat moss. I love what this does for my soil. Just today I went out and tilled in the planting rows for a row of gladious and a half row of super sugar snap peas. How did the ground work up here in wetish Indiana?...like a sand box.

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tishtoshnm Zone 6/NM

I have not grown celeriac from seeds myself but I can tell you that a 4 inch pot is larger than the space available in the 6 packs I buy from a local nursery so I think that your pot is likely fine.

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shermthewerm(8 PNW)

That's the size I use.

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