I have so far steered clear of roses -- too big, too finicky, they'll die in the summer heat -- but now my 5 yr. old daughter wants roses on the balcony, so I'm looking into roses.

Anyone growing them? I'm particularly interested in mini varieties, scented of course, and I need someone to talk me out of thinking I can cram a mini rose and a clematis viticella hybrid into the same 18" container. Would love to hear of other people's experience, both positive and negative.

Jim, Gazing onto a balcony buried under 4 foot snow drifts.

Check out the Roses Forum – the people on there are very helpful. Good luck!

I think what can get them in pots is the same as what can get them in the ground - poor drainage. If the rose is grafted, often the bottom will sprout and take over if you're not careful.

If you can put them in very free-draining soil, mulch them, and protect the canes, they should do just fine.

Unfortunately the web-page I normally use for converting measurements is down today, but follow the link, and it should be quite easy to convert my Continental European meters to those smelly feet the English speaking world is so fond of.

Blush Boursault: (synonymous, "calypso" or "rose de l'isle") bright pink, blooms once every season, 3 - 4.5m high, USDA zone 6, tolerant of poor soil

Dupontii: single white, well scented, blooms late spring/ early summer on old wood, USDA zone 4

Goldfinch: semi-doubbel, bright pastel yellow with darker centre, blooms July, 3x2m high, quite prone to deceases and cold, tolerant of poor soil

Kathleen Harrop: bright pink, scented, blooms from spring to autumn, remontant, USDA zone 5-6

Madame Plantier: before they open flowers are bright pink, after they open they are white and scented, blooms in spring, 1.8m, USDA zone 4, tolerant against disease and poor soil, should be very good in pots

Madame de Sancy de Parabere: pink, blooms once in June/July, USDA zone 5, tolerant in poor soil

Mrs. John Laing: pink, blooms summer and spring, remontant, 1.2 - 1.8m, USDA zone 5, tolerant against diseases, is also said to be very good in pots

Reine des Violettes: violet of course, remontant, 0.9m - 1.5m, USDA zone 5, tolerant in poor soil, good in pots

Rose Marie Viaud: violet, no scent, 3m - 4.5m

Zephyrine Drouhin: pink to cerise, remontant blooming summer and fall, (I've seen very different opinions on how tall this baby gets, some say 1.8m others say 2 - 4m, some even say it gets bigger than that), USDA zone 5-10, tolerates poor soil, some say it's good in pots, some say it's not... This is my personal favourite!!

I'd thought about Zephyrin Drouhin too, it seems to have so much going for it. I think it's just too big for the size of container I can fit on my small balcony, so I'm probably going to go with either a "mini-climber" or a small rugosa hybrid, probably one of the "Pavement" series -- terrible name, but it looks like a good rose!

Jim

Grew one very successfully last year, only to lose it in the heat of the summer, when I put it outside.

Any reommendations?

Looking for a fragrant but heat tolerant miniature. Don't have space for more than one, so want the best.

1) All roses need full sun to bloom well (maybe some afternoon shade in high summer).

2) They prefer rich soil or frequent fertilizing (again to bloom well), and a lot of water, but the water has to be able to drain away, so no sitting in wet saucers.

3) They have a reputation for being hard to grow because many varieties tend to suffer (especially in periods of damp or humidity) from a problem called blackspot -- it's a fungus -- which causes them to drop their leaves. New rose owners will panic and think they have killed their plant. Not at all! There is another set of leaves waiting which will come out soon, they're just getting rid of the fungus. (When I'm gone for the summer I often get a desperate email from my plant-waterer, but by the time I get home they've leafed out again.) This does make them look ugly though, so you may want do so some research to find ones that are good in your zone. Many states have rose societies with lists of roses suited for your zone, search for "Yourstate rose society" and they will probably have a website. You can spray for blackspot but I never have.

4) Don't start with the plastic bag roses in the big Mart. They can be saved, but you need to have some experience. For your first rose get a bush already planted in a pot; they tend to come available when full spring has hit your zone. I have gotten them from nurseries but have also gotten some great ones from KMart and Target (not WalMart though, I don't know what they do to them.) You can leave it in that pot for up to a couple months but it will be much easier to take care of (esp. watering) if you put it into a 15 to 18 inch pot.

5) I have only had roses in containers survive winter in zone 5 when I've moved them into a garage; it's harder than for roses in the ground because the roots suffer from the extremes of temperature (not just the cold but the swings from cold to thaw when they're on a south-facing balcony). But you can find lots of information in books that give you tips, and maybe you'll have more luck than I did. If winterizing doesn't work for you, you can buy a new KMart rose in the spring for $10 that will bloom perfectly fine for you all that spring and summer too. Here in zone 7 they stay right where they are all year, I don't do anything except mulch with some fir bark which also keeps the dirt from splattering around when it rains. It does get me some really funny looks when I haul the big bag up in the apartment elevator.

Kinds of roses for containers:

A miniature rose (a true miniature) willl do very well in an 18" container its entire life, along with other plants, though you have to be careful not to plant something really fast-growing that will overwhelm it. I got tired of miniatures because they rarely have fragrance; that gene got bred out when miniaturization got selected for. I did have some whose foliage had kind of a spicy scent. You often see miniatures in supermarkets, where it is misleadingly implied they are houseplants. Actually they prefer being outside. They're kind of cute because they're just like full-size roses in shape, but doll-sized. They rarely have thorns, so they're pretty safe if you have kids. (Roses are also non-toxic, as far as I know.) Miniatures, in my experience, tend to be less sensitive to blackspot than full sized roses.

Full size roses -- That's what I have now. Mine are in containers 20" high and 18" wide which is fine although they are not as big as they would get in a garden. I also prune them so they stay about 3 feet by 3 feet. If you have room for a whiskey barrel that would be ideal and get them to grow really big. The pots are plastic because that keeps the weight down and I don't have to water as much as with clay. I spent a lot of time with rose books from the library (especially in the winter!), because I like looking at the pictures, and a lot of time on the rose forums here. I prefer "old roses" or "antique roses" because they tend to be more fragrant, but they are not always around in your basic garden center. But you never know, I just scored a La Reine Victoria from the Home Depot today. If you browse at garden centers in the spring you can also see how thorny they are and smell them.

These books give you a lot of help with sizes; unless you have a big space and a big pot you might want to stay away from Zepherine Drouhin. I had to give mine away to someone who had a garden, along with a couple others that got too sprawly or only bloomed once a year. On a balcony you want roses that you can get maximum display out of. You can also search for roses on everyrose.com or helpmefind.com.

I now have settled on the following which do well for me, mostly found serendipitously at nurseries with a list of potentials in mind:

Gruss an Aachen -- my favorite. If I could have only one this would be it. Pretty compact (3 x 3 feet or smaller), good scent. Bonus -- the blooms vary in color from pink to white depending on how hot it is.
Iceberg -- I'm loyal to this one too although you find it everywhere, because it was my "beginner" rose. It's very forgiving and always seems to have a bloom somewhere on it. In Europe it is called Schneewittchen (Snow White).
Abraham Darby -- this is a sprawly one and it's really too big for me but I like it because of its old fashioned blooms (although it's a modern designer rose). I have to tie it to the balcony railing because it has long canes (want to be 5 feet) which are very floppy.
Scentimental -- an upright rose with neat-o red and white striped blossoms.
A no-name bright pink "plastic bag" rose I bought one February at Lowe's when I had cabin fever. Against all odds it survived, although it's not what was on the label.
Souvenir de la Malmaison -- this rose has a reputation for being very nice but has been sulky for me. It hasn't grown too much in two years and only gives me a bloom once in a while. If it doesn't shape up this year (some roses take 3 years they say) I'm giving it away.

In magazine articles about "small space roses" I have seen New Dawn recommended highly, and in European magazines Raubritter, although it looks pretty big, and if I had room for more I would try those. VGtar's list has a lot of old roses on it which will probably have to be special-ordered in most places in the U.S.

Hope this helps.

I also planted a pink carpet rose in a hanging basket, and it too has a lot of buds on the canes. I plan to transplant it to a bigger pot for the summer. It doesn't get quiet as much sun, but maybe enough for blooms. My goal was to overwinter them successfully, and I guess I've done that. I'll just have to wait and see whether they do anything.

Any suggestions for pruning these two kinds of roses?

I think the trick for us city-container-wannabe-rose growers is to get own-root roses, and to purchase roses hardier to at least 2 zones lower than where you are. I purchased 2 zone 4 roses from Heirloom, and kinda wish I had searched harder for zone 3.

Oh, another thing you mentioned, Jim ... I had read about lots of people (with "real" gardens) who grew roses and clematis together and how beautiful it was, and I wanted to try that. But I was strongly advised by folks with experience that I should NOT put a rose and a clematis together in one container. So I bought an obelisk whose feet will go in separate pots and will try to mix them together that way. No sign of life from my clematis yet, so I've no idea if this will work, but I've got my fingers crossed.

I hope everybody keeps posting all summer so we can see the progress.

Judith

But last year I brought four roses from a well loved grower of old roses in Texas to Missouri. I have Belinda's Dream, Iceberg, Souvenier De La Malmaison and Cecile Bruner which was supposed to be the shrub kind but might be a climber..

They are all in large resin pots, the ones that look like concrete or stone with raised grapes and vines on them. They took off and except for my not knowing what to with a couple of kinds of insects for a while, they did very well last Summer.

They all bloomed well. And the Souvenier has "sported" into a new rose. I sent pictures to the grower who was so pleased he telephoned me to talk about it and if it repeats I can register and name it. The new rose looks like a tea rose, but has the same color and fragrance of the original.

The first change was a split in the large cabbage rose shape so it looked like a figure eight..two lobes. Then by Election Day the most beautiful "tea rose" looking one opened. I am watching the new buds on the branch that sported to see if we have a keeper.

Anyway, they all did very well. I do not have a green house and the garage was too dark to try wintering them. So we set them against the side of the house in the opposite direction from where our winter storms comes. And they have all made it beautifully. We are in zone 6, maybe 6b.
I forget.

This year I intend to plant some protrate rosemary around the base of the roses, and also a couple of lavenders in each pot, hoping they might deter some of the insects. And the prostrate rosemary should be attractive.

Does anyone have any experience with planting these shallow rooted herbs beneath roses?

Any other suggestions for things that might provide some sort of "ground cover" for the soil in the large pot, that will be compatible to the roses?

Well, I really came here to talk about balcony gardening. But the rose subject was close to home so I thought I'd comment.

Am also wanting to grow morning glories, which I'll have to plant right away, and have them trail along the balcony rail which is wood. Any suggestions how big the pots need to be and if they will take to the pots?

Marge

With respect to morning glories, they'll sprout and grow on my astroturf and volunteer anywhere, so whatever size container you have should be fine. I expect that the bigger the pot, the longer the vines will grow but I've had them sprout in all sorts of containers and they did just fine and went wild. Just be aware that in your new zone, they will probably bloom later than where you came from and depending on where you are now, they may bite the dust fairly early in fall.

Marge - I've not tried it, but I've read all sorts of good things about companion planting herbs and roses. Neither of the ones you mentioned are heavy feeders or drinkers... I'd give it a shot. Just make sure they have good drainage. Chives are supposed to work well too.

My pleasant surprise was how much we are able to smell the fragrance off the Lavender plants..not blooming..just from the plants themselves. I should have done this long ago.

Still don't have any prostrate rosemary, but can add that later. I did mix a pot of Moss Roses with chives and they are wonderful. Lots of other herbs mixed with flowers in pots..but so far not with my roses.

Oh, I hope I'm not a bad person for laughing when I read that (It's been in the 90s here for weeks now, and summer has just barely started--I have serious bouts of zone envy this time of year).

You will be just fine with roses, just keep them mulched and watered, and buy from a nursery that you trust to have plants that do well in your area. But yes, I know from experience that you certainly can grow roses in containers, even in the dog days of summer (expect their best blooming to be in the spring and fall, but they'll still try for you in the summer). : ) Best of luck!