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Can you turn a balcony into a 'yard'?
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Posted by jflo 10 (My Page) on Tue, Oct 26, 04 at 18:43
Hi All,
A friend of mine and I were discussing whether its possible to fill a balcony with dirt and plant in it as if it were the ground. Of course, depending on the design of the balcony, this would require at least some sort of boarding up or sealing off so you could open the door to get in and out.
Has anyone tried such a thing or know of anyone who has? I'd be a bit concerned about drainage and wonder how deep you'd need to fill. Would some sort of a liner be necesarry? Also, seems a bit messy, but who knows, maybe someone's already tried it.
I tried looking around the other forums, but no luck.
Any suggestions?
Jen |
Follow-Up Postings:
RE: Can you turn a balcony into a 'yard'?
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| Using a kiddie pool makes a nice container for a garden on your balcony. It provides a good deal of surface area. Extend black trash bags beyond the sides to hide the bright blue color that these pools are generally painted and surround with decorative bricks, etc. Don't forget to drill holes in the bottom of the pool. A co-worker planted tulips in hers five years ago and they have faithfully resurfaced each year since! |
RE: Can you turn a balcony into a 'yard'?
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- Posted by jflo 10 (My Page) on
Wed, Oct 27, 04 at 23:30
| A kiddie pool is what I've suggested, but he wants the much more drastic just fill in the balcony. I must admit, I'm intrigued. Not sure that it would get by the management though. |
RE: Can you turn a balcony into a 'yard'?
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| Wow, this sounds like a big project and there are a lot of engineering considerations to take into account. How high is it off the ground? Do you have neighbors undernieth? Will the balcony support the weight of the wet dirt? Is the footing rated for that much weight? etc. You don't want it to collapse on you, and in fact, unless it's made of steel and reinforced concrete and the footing is rated for at least 5 tons, I wouldn't even consider it just for safety's sake. Yes you would have to fur up the "floor" and line it making certain that the drainage slope is no less than one quarter inch per linear foot. For this I would reccomend 3/4 inch CDX/CDX grade particle board (some folks call it "Chip" board) and a rubber roofing membrane specificly made for flat roofs (since that is basicly what you will be building to hold the soil). Once you have the decking installed and waterproofed (and all the glue has cured), run a garden hose over it to see where it drains. You may have to provide some sort of drainage collection and diversion system to prevent the drainage from undermineing the footings or the foundation over time. Before you even begin though, check your local building codes, a project this big might even require a permit be issued because of the long term safety and footing considerations. Best Wishes
Amino-X |
RE: Can you turn a balcony into a 'yard'?
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| this sounds like a huge, huge undertaking...Amino-x pretty much hit on all the issues- especially safety, weight, permits. The weight of all the soil, water then the plantings. What would you do when you moved? You'd have to dismantle the whole thing. |
RE: Can you turn a balcony into a 'yard'?
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- Posted by jflo 10 (My Page) on
Sat, Oct 30, 04 at 17:08
| I agree, it sounds huge. I was a bit concerned about drainage and weight, and sounds like I was right on target. I'll forward send this info to my friend. Does sound cool though - too bad balconies don't all come as mini yards. |
RE: Can you turn a balcony into a 'yard'?
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| I dunno, I kinda like having chairs and a little table and being able to sit among my flowers. Don't think I'd be too happy if all I could do was look at them out the window. |
RE: Can you turn a balcony into a 'yard'?
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| I have astroturf on my poured concrete balcony and it tends to look like a "yard" when everything is growing because so many ground cover plants like mint (and of course weeds) end up rooting in the astroturf. It's unbelievable! LOL There was a previous regular poster from California who had a ground floor step-up balcony with an inner area that she "filled in" with soil and planted a number of things. The entire area wasn't filled in but just a section (perhaps 2 - 3 ft out) up against the solid wall that served as the equivalent of a "rail". The problem aside from what was brought up above, is that if the balcony is covered, it can be a challenge getting sun to such an area unless it is south-facing. |
RE: Can you turn a balcony into a 'yard'?
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| Here's a pic of a rooftop garden in New York with a Kentucky Bluegrass lawn. If you've got enough money you can do anything! 
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RE: Can you turn a balcony into a 'yard'?
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Well Jen.. you have gotten alot of considerations there.. to be deep enough to plant below the ground level it has to be pretty deep.. at least as deep as a planter would be for a particular plant item.. I find a combbonation of the ground planting and planters works for the same feeling.. I grow a bunch of Kentucky bluegrass/ scotts sun mixture on my roof top.. but I have full sun there.. it grows less thick if it is in the back of a shaded balcony... then the ajescent planters when overplanted and spilling over the edges to the grass giives the appearence of it being all in the ground with a hill perhaps with plantings on it..
try this link to see some pictures of the lawn.. it is a layer of sand maybe 1" thick and sod rolled over it.. the grass is about 6 years old there.. and drainage is through the grass and to the sand and out the edges back onto the roof the thickness is about 1 1/2 " total and isn't enough to plant much in.. but the plantes provide more depth.. |
Here is a link that might be useful: Gordon's before and after photos
RE: Can you turn a balcony into a 'yard'?
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| So do you have to have a lawn mower? :-D |
RE: Can you turn a balcony into a 'yard'?
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- Posted by JimShy z7 Brooklyn, NY (My Page) on
Mon, Nov 15, 04 at 11:14
No, that's what the goats are for -- organic, closed-loop gardening!
;>) Jim |
RE: Can you turn a balcony into a 'yard'?
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meg...
I use a string trimmer.. I save them from thongs.. goats will eat to the roots and destroy the lawn.. Jim...
I did have a red tailed hawk visit though... he dinned on a pigeon he caught elsewhere I think I rarely see pigeons up there.. doves yes.. Gordon |
RE: Can you turn a balcony into a 'yard'?
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- Posted by jflo 10 (My Page) on
Tue, Nov 16, 04 at 23:54
I knew there would be some far more ambitious people on this forum - i'm quite impressed with the rooftop gardens. I don't know that my friend is that ambitious - and he has one of those stucco balconies w/o a rail, so getting enough light might be tricky too. Not sure if this thread will dissuade or encourage him.
I, on the other hand, just have a simple balcony w/ a rail and won't go turning it into a yard - i've got too many pots already and am just waiting for things to grow. In the meantime, i've started a compost bin - that's about as close to a yard as i need. |
RE: Can you turn a balcony into a 'yard'?
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| OH..MY Brooklyn Red Tailed Hawk.. |
Here is a link that might be useful: Gordon Hawk's Brooklyn Red Tailed Hawk
RE: Can you turn a balcony into a 'yard'?
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| A rooftop garden is entirely different from a balcony garden. Balconies in general are just kind of hanging out in space. Rooftops are supported on all side, and underneath. The main concern is the weight of the soil and water. Plants are relatively light. But wet soil can weigh (literally) a ton, so as Amino-X said, you shouldn't even consider it unless you have a concrete balcony, and even then you'd need to check with the building engineers, get permits, etc. Could be quite a safety hazard. Not to discourage anyone, but you do need to face facts. Perhaps he could look into a rooftop garden for the whole apartment unit? |
RE: Can you turn a balcony into a 'yard'?
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| I have not seen this attempted in "real life" but at a garden show. The balcony floor was almost covered with a large aluminium tray planted with pearl heathwort (Sagina) in not more than an inch of soil. It had a water rill running the length of it. All other plants were in containers. It looked very expensive as it will have to be made to order. I think a sedum carpet would work better than grass but it won't stand much walking on. |
RE: Can you turn a balcony into a 'yard'?
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I agree to..weight is an issue. And whether it is allowed by management or not. Sometimes I see some of the balcony photos posted by others and I almost cringe and hold my breath wondering whether there is going to be a BIG CRASH as the balcony plummets to earth. lol You can make a beautiful 'yard' though on a balcony or small patio by using containers and choosing them, and the plants, with careful thought and planning to get that 'yard' feeling. I still have my tiny porch in my condo...about 7 1/2 x 7 1/2 ft. and still fill it with plants in the Spring/Summer/Fall and enjoy my 'yard' most of the year. Of course my porch is right on the ground so weight isn't an issue for me, thank goodness. ;)
Good luck..plan very well and your 'yard' will be great. |
RE: Can you turn a balcony into a 'yard'?
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| You can grow sod on concrete for a few months. There was a demonstration somewhere - maybe a world's fair. Sod just requires a tiny bit of soil, but it has to be kept alive with water and fertilizer. The following site shows sod installed on perlite. |
Here is a link that might be useful: sod growing on parking garage
RE: Can you turn a balcony into a 'yard'?
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There are a lot of resources for "green roofs" that would apply to what you're thinking of. In Chicago the city is pushing green roofs pretty hard to help deal with rainwater and the heat sink effect caused by mile upon mile of black roofs and parking lots.
Structural support is definitely a huge consideration - wet dirt is very heavy, and you'd be surprised how much dirt it takes to cover even a small balcony. Definitely get a professional to determine how much weight your balcony can safely hold.
There are special panel systems that work like a drop ceiling in reverse, they take panels of a growing medium that are like starter cell packs and weigh much less than dirt. Greenroofs.org is a good starting place for researching some of the options. |
Here is a link that might be useful: Greenroofs
RE: Can you turn a balcony into a 'yard'?
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| Hi all Im sort of new to this fourm but I have some home and garden stuff on my web page you might want to check out. Thanks www.aaaemporium.net |
Here is a link that might be useful: aaa emporium
RE: Can you turn a balcony into a 'yard'?
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To make a 4" or 5" deep "container garden"
Turn the pallet, flat side down. Nail boards all around, and cover the "box" with thick plastic.Drill a few holes for drainage. If desired use 2 sawhorses or an old table to elevate.Fill with soil. You have now a "container garden"
I did not try this myself yet, just wanted to share the idea, and hear your comments. |
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