Thank you for bringing Hypertufa to my attention! I need some lightweight very large containers, and this seems to be the answer. I wonder if, instead of perlite, you could use pumice. It's cheaper because God made it, not man. Very lightweight as well. And with that new volcano over there, there just might be a glut of pumice!

I also wonder if these containers could become air pruning type containers with a sufficient amount of holes placed in their sides. Hmmmmmmmm

JD will be so mad at you for giving me these ideas!! :-)

I'm sure you will get some more educated answers, but I live in the southern California Desert, and Citrus grow like weeds here in pure alkaline soil. They line the streets with them, and they drop their fruit everywhere in the spring. To my knowledge, nobody puts vinegar on them.

I have some in containers, and I drop my coffee grounds in there, but I'm not sure why. I just read that they like it. The ones in the alkaline dirt get nothing, and they grow just as well as the ones getting coffee.

Additionally, make your soil acid and then you don't need to worry about the pot.

Thanks for the idea!
Suzi

GFG - After your hypertufa has cured for a few weeks, take you container and sink in in a large tub of water, ocassionally dump water and fill up again. This will help wash away some of the concrete residue. If you do a search on the hypertufa forum there is also another method ( I beleive a vinegar wash) to help make the planter more plant friendly. I have lots of containers - planters with conifers (they like acid soil) and they do just fine and I have never spent a lot of time doing washes.
Altough Hypertufa is lighter that concrete, large containers ( I am talking 36"x 36") are not very lightweight - DD, - You can use what ever ingriedent you like to make hyeprtufa, the perlite is very light weight ( I assume just like pumice) which helps keep the total weight down a bit. MIke

Mike, do you grow trees in your pots? Just curious, because this is new to me, and I drifted out to the world wide web, and most people make huge pots and put dinky, teeny weeny, plants in them. Can you put a fig tree, citrus tree, grape vine, pomegranate, olive, in these planters? As long as they are deep enough..... And if you fear the alkaline, why not line with plastic, punched with a gazillion holes, of course...

Suzi

I can not find any instance on the web where a tree was grown in these pots. I WANT to do it, but, there is nothing. No history. We fly blind here!

Here is a link that might be useful: photos of the pots on the web with dinky plants

Well, Suzi, we may be embarking on the 'tufa trip together...Where does one find pumice? Perlite isn't cheap, that's for sure! There is a helpful hypertufa forum on this site too.

Now that you mention it, I am curious about trees in general too, I havent seen or heard of trees in tufa but why not? It would be easier to move than concrete and more attractive (hopefully) than plastic.

It may be a marriage-ender if I were to get caught bringing something like that into our master bath jacuzzi tub ;-). I'm too cheap to buy a big outdoor tub just for that purpose so spritzing or hosing appeals to me.

If citrus don't mind alkali, then I wont worry about it. I had planed to pour coffee all over it to achieve the color I am after anyways, maybe that will help.

Thanks for the input!
Nik

Nik, you first! LOL!! Tell me how it goes!! Post pictures!!

The qualities of the pots are intriguing. No plastic (unless you opt for perlite), all organic. and they look really good! Well, if somebody else makes them.........

Show me a tree Nik! I'll follow! Promise!

Suzi

Hahaha, I see you beat me to posting the q on the tufa site!

I am about to do a test small pot just to see how it comes out looking. I am using pine dust leftover from making Al's gritty mix instead of peat-moss and I am really curious what color I'll end up with.
Maybe I'll put just one tree in tufa this year and make more next year if it works out. If it isn't a huge flop I'll post pics ;-)

I have a lot of plants in hypertufa. When I make the containers, I don't put a drain hole in them. That way, I can fill them with water after they're hard and let them age. If I want to use them that year, I fill with water & add white vinegar.

Remember to save your Turface fines and use them instead of sand - work great!

Al

Thanks Al,
Darn! I already threw them all out in the lawn and raised beds! (I am using the pine fines though).

So if you don't make a hole for drainage, what happens when you finally put the plant in??? Should I just plug the hole for the water and vinegar soak? Seems like it would be tough to drill a hole through this stuff once its cured.

The big question now: can you put big plants (regular dwarf fruit trees - not bonsai) in tufa pots?

Thanks!
Nik

Okay, I'm actually doing it! Got one layer on. Looking good so far. Lessons learned the hard way: If you are working outdoors, make sure you are freshly covered in off before you start! And you can spray too much WD-40 on the pot which makes the mix just slide - sheesh. I'll post my pics on the 'tufa site

How big is your pot? I just got back from pricing big pots at both Big Lots and Home Depot. They all range $30-$60.00, unless you look at the thin plastic ones and they are around $18.00. Good luck with your project!
Suzi

I bought a cheap plastic one at Home Depot that actually looks decent for $15.00, it is 20" diameter by 17" tall, it says "47 quart" on the sticker. I would have preferred a little larger but the price was right. The Dollar Store had some black plastic trash cans for $8.00 that might have worked well if they were cut down a bit, but I had already bought the HD pot and the DS cans were cheaply made and a bit wobbly. I am not working this hard to end up with a wobbly pot! I posted pics of my progress on the 'tufa site (I think I shanghaied your thread)
Nik

How hard can it be to post pictures here? I do need bigger pots, so I'm tuned in to this. Did you use those acrylic threads, or whatever they call them? for strength?

Suzi

Just check your other thread! Okay, twist my arm, here you go:

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{{gwi:34705}}

{{gwi:34706}}

No, I used nine pints of each: Pine dust, sand, perlite & White Portland cement, I added 2 extra pints of portland just for fun and I will tape it up with drywall tape before adding the next layer tomorrow. I really like the color, sort of natural granite like.

Its kind of heavy already though, I can't imagine going much bigger with 2 layers of this stuff and still being able to move it without a dolly.

What an adventure. I think we need to wait a week or a month to see the actual results. Please weigh it, and tell us what it cost vs the same size at HD.

Suzi

will do...

Suzi, I had a thought: if you just like the look of Hypertufa, why not buy some cheap plastic 30 gallon trash bins at dollar store or Walmart, punch drain holes in the bottom and cut to the height you want, then spread a thin layer of hypertufa over the outside and the rim? You could just leave the cheap plastic pot as the structure and the tufa would be like a decorative finish. Or better yet, just spray paint with faux stone paint and varnish with a water proof clear finish. Sounds crazy, but I discovered someone had done that to a crappy veneer counter top at one of my rental properties and it looked really amazing and held up really well!

Nik, it's not that I like the "look," of hypertufa so much as it's weight, and the porousity of it. Covering plastic would be anti-everything I believe in. Plastic is the cause of a plant getting root bound.

I like the "look" better than a grow bag or root pruning type container, but a grow bag is lighter, and more friendly to the tree.

I'm waiting to see how your experiment turns out, and I wish you the best of luck with it. If it works for you, I just might give it a try!

Suzi

PS Al never answered your question on "no drain holes in hypertufa." I wonder if he drills them later?

Suzi,
I would imagine Al does drill them later.

The impression I get from his post is he doesn't put them initially, so the container can soak..

No drain holes = death for pants.

JoJo

Just to put in my 2 cents...

I used to be heavily into Saltwater Reef tanks and we would make our own "live rock" using a mix just like the hypertufa. The important thing was the curing. We would put the hardened concrete into large trash cans and fill them with water. Change it daily for a few weeks, then once a week. The hot sun made the process go by faster. The rock was finished when the pH of the water stopped rising and remained more or less neutral. This could take months... but in a reef system, there is no margin for error.

What JJ said.

Al

Thanks for the clarification! Lucky for me (?), it turns out I didn't push the pvc down all the way, so I can fill my pot for now.

This pics for you Suzi, now you can say you have seen a big plant in hypertufa:

{{gwi:34707}}

Now what? Do I spritz it with water regularly and keep it in plastic for a month and then fill it with water & vinegar or is it one or the other?

Nik

Okay, I re-read everything and I see it cures 3 weeks, then soaks...This thing is not lightweight, I am here to tell you - it weighs about 85lbs!!! I hope it lightens up once dry!

Wow! It's beeutiful!! I would think it needs a long time to actually get dry enough to tell how much it really weighs. And then, of course, when you add the gritty mix and the plant, with water, it's going to weigh a lot too!

My grandma always told me, "to be beautiful, we must suffer!" So, I guess lifting that heavy pot will be tough, but it is certainly a masterpiece!

Suzi
What a nice shot of the bougainvillea in the top corner:-)

Thanks! I wonder if the $6.00 big lots dolly will support this weight? Good deal if they do, I may have to go check them out.

Do a web search for the price of casters! I thought I could make dollies myself, and cheap out, but OMG!! You will be in shock at what they cost. Obviously these things at Big Lots were made in Asia at a reduced cost, but 4 casters will definitely support 120+ lbs. Easy!

They had a couple styles. One looked like a spiral of stainless, and one had a wrought iron look. But you would not be able to see the thing with the plant on it, so cheap is good!!

My Big Lots is pretty new and they have furniture also. Their garden dept is pretty big. Look for a newer Big Lots.

I'm going to start a thread on this because a lot of folks have trouble moving their big pots. I love your hypertufa experiment! Rock on!!

Suz