From the tree-hugging, bleeding heart, animal loving, gun banning, commie liberal here in California, I can only say: Shoot away! LOL Garden trumps politics.

Besides, I don't think crows will be on the endangered species list anytime soon.

On a more serious note, have you tried row covers to get the plants past the infancy stage? I've got to put bird netting over EVERYTHING, as like you're experiencing, they're getting worse and worse every year. I can pull it off once the plants are a couple feet high--the birds seem to leave them alone then.

And Being the treehugger I am.........I say find a different way to protect your corn. Crows are incredibly cool creatures.

I agree with catherinet. I don't like the term "treehugger" because it categorizes people into two restrictive categories. I'm all for controlling animal populations when there is an ecological need for it, but this doesn't fit the bill. Ravens (I know you said crows but just sayin') are important hunters of varmints like mice and rats.

As an anti-tree hugger, I say blast away. I have solved many a pest problem with a 12ga, from chicken stealing foxes to seedling chomping squirrels to homesteading rat's. They are called "varmints" for a reason.

Rabbits, birds, mice, anything that I can't squish between my thumb and forefinger is kept in line with whatever goose shot left over from hunting season (although those steel shells are getting expensive I might have to buy some good old fashioned lead).

It just takes a little more imagination to protect the things we want to keep. I have 35 acres of woods and live in the middle of it. My garden is secure, as are my chickens.

Before we get into a shooting war, lets look at the evidence. Crows are marauders and in numbers can be quite a pest. They do like corn but spend much more time raiding the nests of lesser birds. But they are not going dig up corn seed. They will walk down the rows of newly emerged corn and pull it up for the kernal attached to the root. If you have crow damage, the little corn plants will be pulled up and left neatly in the row. If the plants are not there rule out the crow.
This had been an unusual spring. many varieties of corn do not have good cold emergence. Add to that untreated seed and I suspect the seed rotted in the soil. I have a lot of blank space in my second planting this year. It appears to be in the areas of colder wetter and heavier soils. On the positive note, you still have plenty of time to grow corn, especially sweet corn.

It just takes a little more imagination to protect the things we want to keep
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Are claymores imaginative enough? Perhaps a triple strand of concertina wire thrown around the perimeter for good measure. I met some Iraqi's that could probably teach me how to rig up an RC car remote and a soda bottle full of nails to detonate on a heat signature... Well actually I can't ask them anymore (I don't think insurgents locked up in IP prisons are afforded the luxury of Skype), but they were definitely some imaginative SOB's.

My garden is secure, as are my chickens.
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Same here. Just different ways of going about it.

This post was edited by ZachS on Thu, May 29, 14 at 23:46

I appreciate my crows and reward them with good food and clean water. Whenever that damn hawk sails by, the crows rush in and chase it away. I hate hawks. They're after my cottontail rabbits. I feed the rabbits under shrubbery for their protection. No "varmints" ever eat anything I grow.

I like that Zack.

ultimately ecology has to serve us.If something invades our backyard, that is a war.

We're just wired very differently. Peace versus war, love versus hate, compromise versus obliteration.
Zach.....I hope you can find a way to get that huge angry, heavy chip off your shoulder and find a little relief.

Now......back to the vegetables.

Our resident crows only come into the garden to get the leftover scratch feed from the chickens, but some nearby gardeners are using scare-eye balloons in their corn plot. They seem to be working.

I wonder if hanging old CDs might work too. I guess when they turn in the wind, the reflected light frightens some birds off.

Bad-quality seed is another likely factor. Seed quality from conventional vendors is very poor.

There is no anger here, that comment was in jest. Though, I will admit my experiences probably have given me a much different perspective then you. Not that it's right (or wrong) just different.

To be clear, I don't shoot until they give me a reason to shoot. Yes, I hunt, but, as a way to put good meat on the table not because of any harbored animosity towards those animals.

We are probably wired very differently, and I was probably raised a little differently. I come from a family who homesteaded in Colorado since the gold rush times and in my grandparents and great grandparents time, the garden and the farm were not just some "back to the earth" hobby movement. Animals who killed livestock or ripped up plants were not simply an annoyance, they were quite literally stealing food off the table that was depended on. Spending a lot of time on that homestead growing up, that's how I was brought up. Don't get me wrong, there was plenty of defensive measures in place, just as I have now, but sometimes you do have to take the offense.

Course, then I grew up, and after I got out of Active Duty I got myself one of those fancy educations in, of all things, biology. I do realize there is SOME compromise to be made. So, I take as much of a "live and let live" approach as my psyche will allow. But, when I wake up and find rabbits munching on my freshly sprouted beans or blood soaked feathers, for me, it's time to take action.

This post was edited by ZachS on Fri, May 30, 14 at 10:14

Here in wine country, birds are a big problem for the vineyards. Growers net over entire hillsides of grape vines. They hang shiny silver strips on the trellises that blow around in the breeze. They also have some sort of device that makes the sound of gunshot ring out every few minutes. I presume between those three efforts, they keep the birds at bay.

Zach, I understand what you are saying and appreciate your saying it.
I realize that for many of us, growing gardens is not a have-food-or-starve situation. Living in such a rich country can sometimes allow us to be too "soft" about how we treat wild animals/pests. Most of us, if our gardens fail, just have to go to the grocery stores, that are packed to the gills with fairly inexpensive food.
If all my family had to eat was what I grew.......my feelings would probably be pretty different towards wild things.

I do appreciate your reply.

This post was edited by catherinet on Fri, May 30, 14 at 11:23

"There is no anger here, that comment was in jest." Some of us got that.

My comment was also in jest. I would have thought adding an "LOL" followed by "On a more serious note," followed by an actual suggestion that didn't involve shooting birds would have been enough to make that clear. Sigh...Probably best to leave the humor for the folks over on the compost forum.

Farmer Dill, I have great respect for you and I have followed much of your good advice.

But I disagree with "If the plants are not there rule out the crow."

I have been farming a long time too and I have witnessed them digging up untreated seed many times. We used to grow 40 acres of feed corn every year.

My Dad saved his seeds so they weren't treated.

They didn't rot in the ground, the air and soil temps were very high and I didn't have any rain, I had to water my garden.

Okra, crowder peas, and everything else came up fine. So rotting is out of the picture.

I got lucky, a car hit a crow right down the road. I don't have to shoot one now, I hate killing something that I'm not going to eat. I have it hanging on a pole in the garden now. I haven't saw a crow since yesterday afternoon, except up the road! That was Dads old trick.

Yes, I know that I can still plant sweet corn now, even though it isn't recommended by Clemson EXT. They recommend Apr. 15-30. And they have a valid reason for this, Pests!

I have tried planting this late before and the worms destroyed the whole crop.

Slimy_Okra, they are not Ravens, I know the difference.

Catherine,

I agree, and I realize my methods are not for everyone and that everyone has their own way or doing things. As I said, no way is right or wrong, just different.

Loribee,

Don't feel bad, I don't have ANY hard feelings, and I'm not upset. If I in any ways gave the impression that I was I apologize! I didn't take anyone's comments as an attack or offensive. We better not leave the humor to the guys in the compost forum, I don't visit there and this place would be pretty dang boring without it ;).

Now back to Wertach and the poor corn!

Oh no, Zach, I was agreeing with you and adding that you aren't the only victim of people not recognizing tongue-in-cheek humor when they see it. I have often wished there were a sarcasm font. Would make life on the forums so much easier.

"I have it hanging on a pole in the garden now."

Now that is a good idea. Solves the problem with minimal killing.

One might wonder how the First peoples raised crops with so many critters around. Then we realize that best research indicates that game (which includes most animals that eat crops) was extirpated from settled areas nearly as thoroughly as during the Colonial era. Sans firearms or synthetic poisons, which is impressive.

Since both the common rat and house mouse are european imports, predation on stored produce was easier to control.

One method native Americans used was to build a platform in the middle of a corn field and put young boys on crow patrol. Their job was to be on that platform at dawn and dusk to scare away or kill varmints. The reason they planted squash in the corn plots was because raccoons do not like to walk through the squash vines. It also helped to get the most out of an area of ground.

I had a serious problem with raccoons digging up and eating corn from a late planting. It took 2 weeks of setting a live trap nightly to catch the two doing the damage. So far this year, I've trapped 2 groundhogs, 1 opossum, 2 raccoons, and 3 feral cats. The cats were relocated to barns in the countryside where they can do some good. The rest won't be causing problems again.

I believe in live and let live, but also recognize that opportunistic feeders like raccoons and crows and groundhogs must be stopped if I am to get any benefit from the hard work I put into my garden.

I wish I would have seen this earlier in the year. I was searching for corn seed.

Anyway, I planted a pound of Silver Queen. Best crop I've ever had. I had so much this summer that I quit picking and mowed them down. I think I had 30 dozen or more all total. Sold 20 dozen or so at work. I tried blanching and freezing on the cob, but now that I'm eating it after being frozen a couple months, it's not very good. Tastes soured, looks sad, etc... I did make some corn relish with some of the fresh corn, so not all is lost. Next year, I'll be cutting it off the cob and freezing it if I have so much again. Maybe cream some.

I also had good field corn from a pound. Trucker's Favorite. I didn't count them. Crows got to a lot of the ears on the stalks. Some were 15 feet tall. Most yielded 2 ears per stalk. I mowed those down at the end of August, I guess. Had volunteers and I picked baby corn ears from them last weekend. Delicious! I think I'll be planting at least a pound of it next year just for baby corn to pickle or otherwise preserve or sell.

While I was picking the baby corn, the stalks were breaking and juice was splashing from them. So I tried eating a little of the tender stalk itself. Very tasty, not very fibrous in spots, really sweet. Not the whole stalk, but every few inches. It was soft, then hard, then soft, then hard... Kind of like asparagus is good to a point and then it's fibrous and not good. It was interesting.

I wish you had relocated the racs and possums near a source of water. I hate you.

Lost half of my early corn planting this year, due to heavy June rains just after planting. The garden slopes slightly, and the seed in the low side rotted in the mud. The plants which came up, though, produced some of the best sweet corn I've ever grown... large ears, and hardly a "worm" to be found, even though I didn't use Bt on the silks this year.

But I usually put up a lot of corn, and what remained of the first planting wasn't enough. The heavy rains stuck around until July, so it was too late to put in more of my main-season sweet corn ("Miracle"). It didn't look like I would get much corn this year.

But I went to the local garden store, and they still had seed for an early variety, which I planted over the July 4th weekend. It was a gamble, but a spell of warm weather in late September allowed it to ripen. Smaller ears than the main-season varieties, but smaller plants too, so I was able to plant them more densely. Ended up with about 400 ears... even after giving away about 100, that still left about 300 ears to cook, cut, and freeze. The phrase "be careful what you wish for" comes to mind.

The late planting had a lot of worms, though, nearly every ear, and sometimes more than one per ear. Not sure if that was due to the lateness, the variety, or a combination of the two... early varieties tend to have looser husk cover on the tip, which certainly doesn't help. Fortunately most of the damage was confined to the area around the tip, we just husked the corn over buckets of soapy water to drop the worms into (we flush that water when done) and cut off the damaged portion. I ended up freezing more cut corn than I've ever done, so much in fact that I am not in a hurry to do that much work again any time soon.

So in reference to the original post, I would say don't be afraid to try a late planting, especially for an early variety. You might lose it if the frost comes early, but you might also get a really good crop of corn just before frost. I've had better than 50% success with plantings as late as July 10th, and in the cooler weather, the corn doesn't get past its prime as quickly.

A lot of focus on critters in this thread. My garden feeds me all year, so I need to keep damage to a minimum. A hybrid fence has served me well; chicken wire low to keep out rabbits, electric fencing above it to keep out larger animals, and baling twine high to discourage the deer from jumping over. The fence isn't charged all year, just for a few weeks after planting to teach the deer to stay out, and when the corn is almost ripe to keep out the raccoons. Other than blackbirds pecking through the husks once in awhile, haven't had anything damage my corn for about 10 years.

That last time, though, I didn't charge the fence until the raccoons had already found the corn. They really love sweet corn, and once they have had a taste, they will put up with the shocks to get back in. It was a learning experience, they spoiled most of my corn that year.

Oh, and about crows pulling up corn... they aren't the only ones. A pair of sandhill cranes did that to my corn last year, I arrived at the garden just as they were finishing. Harder to chase out than crows; I'm used to scaring animals away by running at them & yelling, but the sandhills are big enough that they do not scare easily, and will stand their ground. They just strutted away slowly, giving me the eye, like they owned the place.

I don't usually do corn cause there are only the 2 of us and I haven't had much luck with freezing it. Also, it's .10 per during the season and maybe .50 each around now.
I HATE crows! Did you know a flock of them is called a "murder of crows"? And I have seen them murder! A whole bunch (murder) descended on my neighbor's small chicken enclosure and attacked the poor chickens! It was horrible! I ran over there with a towel and scared them away! The towel was partially for my own safety! Nancy

No, no. I think somehow the crows help you to kill the idea of growing corns. Corn is one of the least efficient crop to grow.

I'll buy the sweet corns from the local market, like $1 for 4 or 6 ears. And use the land to grow something that is more productive. Even the stinky onions yield better than the corns.

I like to grow my own corn. Simply because I like it better at an earlier stage than most people pick it. I also like it as fresh as it can be, it starts turning to starch as soon as it's picked.

I start my water to boiling before I go to pick it.

Sweet corn is indeed a space hog, and it is generally cheap to buy in season. Couldn't agree more, and for those reasons, growing sweet corn as a garden crop is not for everyone.

That being said... as Wertach has said, nothing beats the flavor of sweet corn picked at the perfect stage, then rushed to the kettle. Furthermore, nothing I can buy compares to the cut corn I freeze each year, from those fresh-picked ears.

Oh, and about those cheap supermarket ears of bi-colored kernels...

Most of that corn - if not all - is now GM. Depending upon how you feel about that, it can be a good reason to grow your own that is not GM. As an organic gardener who has strong feelings about both GM corn & the tactics of the companies who sell it, that is a deal breaker for me... I wouldn't eat GM corn if they gave it away for free.

Understand your concerns on the GMs. But you can't avoid them completely. Everyday, you consume:

Corn oil
Soybean oil
And all the food item you eat at restaurant, you buy at stores, the crackers, soup, more and more.
The meat you eat. Even the tofu is not from the heirloom soybean.....

Everything is a compromise.

I myself don't really care about GM food. Much to do about nothing. As far as the crows, just shoot a couple put them on poles around your corn and I'm pretty sure the rest will stay away.
I have seen squirrels take one bit out of a peach and toss it to the ground. Then do the same to about 50 peaches. I have no sympathy for pests. I saw two raccoons fighting. One was a mother. She lost, the other bit her baby on the back of the neck. I tried to help, but it's neck was broken, it died. Seems we may have ethics, but animals do not. Often lions kill other types of cats in their territory like Cheetahs as they compete for the same food, so the lions just murder the cougars and cheetahs and leave the carcass to rot. The cruelty, violence, and viciousness of the animal kingdom makes us look tame.
Deer often kill young trees like crazy, very sad, no concern at all for the tree. Most animals are extremely selfish creatures, and I have no love for such things. Hard for me to feel sorry for them in anyway. They have no concern about anything but themselves. Now if we could share the food, no such luck.

"Understand your concerns on the GMs. But you can't avoid them completely."

No, it is impossible to avoid them completely, because GM ingredients - due to heavy lobbying - are not labeled. I can, and do, avoid them when given a choice. If others choose not to, that is their prerogative... but we all should have the right to make an informed choice.

"...Corn oil... Soybean oil..."

I use canola... which is also nearly all processed from GM plants. Personally, I am not as concerned with refined products, as when the whole plant or whole seed is consumed... a chemically pure substance is the same, regardless of the source. Others are not as accepting of GM, even in refined products, and I respect their right to choose based upon their own convictions.

"And all the food item you eat at restaurant, you buy at stores, the crackers, soup, more and more.
The meat you eat." (emphasis mine)

That statement really is an over-generalization, and gives a false overview of our food supply. There is (presently) no GM wheat, so most crackers and breads have no GM ingredients. The same can be said for most soup, I am more concerned about the container (and what it is lined with) than I am about the ingredients. GM meat is not common in our food supply - yet. So to say that "all of our food" is GM, is to exaggerate the prevalence of GM in our food supply.

"Everything is a compromise.

With respect to life in general, that is true... but it really does not apply in this case. There is a difference between compromise (where all parties agree to give a little) and submission, where one party is forced against their will to accept the decision of another. Consumers were not represented at the table when GM was approved for consumption, or when informative labeling was struck down. If there was a bin labeled "GM corn", and one next to it labeled "non-GM", which one do you think would be empty first? We should have a right, as a society, to answer that question.