Shop Products
Houzz Logo Print
echoyjeff222

Kale?

echoyjeff222
10 years ago

I'm wondering what to do with my Kale ... I've been growing it all summer, but it's recently slowed in its growth. It's probably because I live in WA and our sunlight is rapidly diminishing. It's pretty tall now, but the leaves are all growing pretty slowly. It almost looks like it's etiolated - it seems paler than before and the leaves are much harder than before. I'm wondering what to do -- should I cut the entire thing and let it grow again, or should I keep harvesting the small leaves that are being produced only near the tip? The places I've already harvested are not growing anymore (not sure if that's normal).

I also heard that Kale was alright to grow in winter, so I'm not sure if I'm supposed to pull the whole plant (does pulling the whole plant mean roots as well?)

Comments (28)

  • woohooman San Diego CA zone 10a
    10 years ago

    LOL... you're not supposed to harvest the INNER leaves. Harvest it just like you would any green leafy veggy... OUTER, larger leaves and leave the inner, younger leaves on the plant. Harvesting the inner leaves will stop the growth of the plant from producing more leaves.

    Kevin

  • Donna
    10 years ago

    Assuming that you have been harvesting from the bottom up on the plant, but now are only getting smaller leaves....I have cut them back before and they come back strong, but it takes a fair amount of time to do so. They are heavy feeders, so perhaps they need a boost of nitrogen? I grow them throughout the winter here in my zone 8 garden in the south. They are tough and will withstand temps in the teens if the cold doesn't last too long.I harvest the larger lower leaves and they put on more which grow just as large....You can also consider starting over with fresh plants. You ought to be able to find or start kale from seed this time of year.

  • echoyjeff222
    Original Author
    10 years ago

    @ Kevin -- I thought that harvesting the inner leaves near the apical meristem would promote the lateral buds to start growing leaves? At least, that's what I learned in biology last quarter!

    @ Donna - I've been harvesting the largest leaves for a few months now, so that's why the bottom is basically leafless now ... It's just growing near the top - the bottom 3/4 is just the stem with marks where I pulled out the leaves. The leaves are definitely not as large as before.

  • tommyr_gw Zone 6
    10 years ago

    I tried blanching and freezing Kale this year and it tastes rubbery after cooking. It's fine if I saute it fresh. I must be doing something wrong......

  • woohooman San Diego CA zone 10a
    10 years ago

    Jeff: maybe for some plants like cannabis, but kale doesn't branch. You have one main stalk. You can harvest all the tender, young leaves you want, but you want to leave at least a few of the MOST INNER leaves. The general practice is to harvest the lowest leaves upward, discarding any crappy ones, and leaving the younger leaves to photosynthesize.

    They say that the younger leaves are sweeter. I don't buy it. There's a reason why KALE is called a BITTER green --- it's bitter!

    Kevin

  • tommyr_gw Zone 6
    10 years ago

    I find Red Russian and Dino Kale MILDER than curly Kale. Your mileage may vary! Next year I will only grow those 2.

  • susanzone5 (NY)
    10 years ago

    I pick the inner leaves all the time and the plant keeps producing more. I like the inner leaves. They're softer, sweeter and more tender. I grow Red Russian kale.

    Where I live, (and it's frozen cold), I leave the plants over winter. Some of them will resprout many, many side branches from the stem which is laying horizontally on the ground, in spring. Other plants just turn to mush and I pull them in spring.

    The good plants that have wintered over will flower in the summer from all those side shoots, after you've eaten leaves from them. The flowers are beautifully yellow and, full of bees when you want them in the garden.

  • Mark
    10 years ago

    Woohooman, Kale is not considered a bitter green, at least i've never heard it called that in the 18 years i've been growing and selling it. Generally that refers to the endive/escarols.

    -Mark

  • woohooman San Diego CA zone 10a
    10 years ago

    Madroneb: I always assumed it was along with collards, mustard greens dandelion greens, and the like.

    You probably should call it a bitter green. I think most chefs would. JMO

    Try googling "bitter greens list" or "examples bitter greens"

    Also click on the link.

    Kevin

    Here is a link that might be useful: Oxford's definition

  • tommyr_gw Zone 6
    10 years ago

    IMHO it's definitely a "bitter" green. Especially curly Kale. Red Russian and Dino is not as bitter to *me*. I still have to saute them with onions and garlic etc. to reduce the bitterness.

  • Mark
    10 years ago

    I put various varieties of kale in salad mix and it's never bitter. I also grow 4 kinds of it for bunching.
    I think you folks are eating kale when it's hot out. Then it can become bitter, not to mention covered in aphids.

    I only grow it in the fall, winter and early spring when it's sweet, tender, delicious and not a drop bitter.

  • theforgottenone1013 (SE MI zone 5b/6a)
    10 years ago

    I agree with madroneb. Is it possible that you are eating kale in summer or at other times when the plant is stressed?

    In my experience kale isn't bitter. Some mustards certainly can be. Lettuce and spinach grown in summer heat can be. Arugula, endive, radicchio, dandelion, and chicory are definitely bitter. But not kale. And I should mention that I cannot stand any bitterness whatsoever.

    Rodney

  • susanzone5 (NY)
    10 years ago

    That's why I eat only the small, newer leaves. They are sweet. I let the bottom leaves get old and pull them off and compost them (or just leave them to compost under the plant.) I can eat the small ones raw right there in the garden.

    You don't break the top of the plant off, you just pluck the leaves by their stems.

  • woohooman San Diego CA zone 10a
    10 years ago

    I eat it year long. I don't know what you guys/gals consider "bitter." Kale is bitter, winter or summer. Though, I do admit, less in the cooler months.

    JMO.

    Kevin

  • Mark
    10 years ago

    It's become obvious that we all use the word "bitter" differently, probably depending on our taste preferences.

    I find it interesting. I sell veggies at the farmers market and usually choose to avoid the word "bitter" because it carries with it such a strong, negative association. Most americans weren't raised eating bitter things, mainly sweet and salty, and the term bitter to many just means 'bad'.
    While I personally love the amazing flavor that bitter greens add when harvested in the cold months, many people are just turned off.
    What would we do without braised escarole in butter, dandelion greens, Whitlof (belgian endive) or radicchio? Not to mention coffee, olives, chocolate, gin and tonic and beer....
    YUM! I'm getting hungry!

    -Mark

  • woohooman San Diego CA zone 10a
    10 years ago

    Mark: Totally agree. It's all about balance in a dish for me. I wasn't implying negative when I called kale "bitter." You're right -- when selling it, the word "bitter" just may turn off the everyday Joe.

    I, myself, haven't graduated to eat RAW Kale salads....a tad too bitter and grassy for me. But some garlic and bacon sauteed--- pretty good stuff. Maybe with some cream, mushrooms, and jalapenos added to the above ...yum! great in my stir fries also.

    Kevin

  • florauk
    10 years ago

    The words 'bitter greens' aren't even an expression we use over here. Kale is a winter vegetable for us and although it might be termed 'strong flavoured' I'd never call it bitter. In fact Red Russian is so delicious it tastes as if it has been cooked in butter even when it's only been steamed. The only bitter greens I can think of are unblanched dandelion, bolted lettuce and unblanched chicory. Maybe its to do with having a damp mild climate.

  • chickencoupe
    10 years ago

    Hey! Bitter or no, that was good info because I have not eaten my Red Russian kale. Now that it is fall cool weather, I'll give it a try.

    I have a question, though. My Red Russian Kale has been growing since the spring of 2012. Bugs ate all the leaves leaving the 2" stalk and strong limbs. Those looked fine so I let them be. It's an heirloom variety, too.

    I noticed small interior leaves popping so I fertilized them with worm tea. Wow... full leaves came back in a week.

    Will this die at all? Surely, it must go to seed. I'd like to collect seeds since it is a very hard variety to my area.

    Can anyone tell me what to expect when it goes to seed so I can be on the look out? Is it hard to collect?

    Thanks bunches.

  • chickencoupe
    10 years ago

    I just realized another forum exists for seed-saving. I will also post there. Thanks!

  • florauk
    10 years ago

    ChickenCoupe - mine flowers and seeds in the spring. I don't even bother to collect the seed. It self sows. One way of keeping it in order is to wait till the seed pods are almost ripe but not yet brown and open. Then I cut the branches and lay flat on the soil in a row where I want next winter's kale row. Then I leave them alone. The seed will drop along the row and germinate without any help from me. You might need to water if you have a dry climate. I never need to here. I discovered this technique when I used old kale stems to protect peas from pigeons. (Big problem here). The peas grew well and after they were finished I had a row of baby kale ready to take their place. Nitrogen from the pea roots already in place.

  • SkagitBroomWorks
    10 years ago

    We are from Washington, and we have great luck with kale. There is so much to eat in the summer, so we only harvest it in the cool months. We just whack on it and it keeps leafing out. Then we plant more young plants every fall. We also have eaten the leaves from our broccoli plants & they don't taste too bad at all.

  • chickencoupe
    10 years ago

    @florauk
    @Skagit

    Thank you for that. I finally found a video that showed me what the flowering and pods look like. That helped, too.

    Why is it still growing? I planted it in spring of 2012. I checked my file. Is it unusual for something to grow into a 3rd season? I guess next spring will be 4 seasons.

    We're experiencing a reprieve, right now, but this bad boy lasted through the drought.

  • woohooman San Diego CA zone 10a
    10 years ago

    Chicken: I live in Socal and I've yet to have kale bolt to seed for me. Collards yes, kale no. It usually last 18 months to 2 years and then just tuckers out for me. I imagine if I just let it go it would get going for me again, but I just start a couple more plants.

    On a side note--- Wow! After reading how many people like the Red Russian and Dino varieties, I'm going to have to get some seeds. I've just been growing some curly stuff from Johnnyseeds -- Starbor. After hearing how you guys/gals talk about how sweet they are, I'd love to grow some that isn't bitter(to me :P ), and possibly eat some sweet Kale(maybe, even raw) that doesn't need for me to do too much with it in the kitchen.

    Kevin

  • lucyfretwell
    10 years ago

    As an aside , is bitterness any indication of a lack of nutritional benefit in the plant?
    I mean my body is telling me not to eat anything it judges to be bitter and from "experience" lettuce for example has "obviously" deteriorated when it has bolted and I always compost it out or give it to the animals at that point. (I wonder would it actually make good/better soup ?)

    This post was edited by lucyfretwell on Sun, Sep 29, 13 at 11:34

  • theforgottenone1013 (SE MI zone 5b/6a)
    10 years ago

    lucyfretwell- On the contrary. Most bitter greens are high in vitamins. The bitterness does make them not as palatable though. As far as lettuce deteriorating when it bolts, the only thing that deteriorates is the taste. The plant itself is healthy (usually).

    Rodney

  • chickencoupe
    10 years ago

    Kevin -

    You know what I like best about the Russian? It's a beautiful plant. It's in my front yard planter. A nice addition. We're coming upon our first frost, soon, and it will be mild and sweet.

    Woohooman -

    I've had this thing so long, I forgot I started a thread on this very issue before!! Gentleman is wondering if there is something keeping it warm so it does not trigger the cycle. It's atop a hugelkulture. I'm guessing the hugelkulture plot beneath is keeping the roots warm: not unlike warmer conditions in So. California.

    I am definitely SOLD on hugelkulture and will make all my beds in this fashion.

    lucyfretwell -

    I agree with Rodney. For me, most bitter indicates nutrition - especially in the form of antioxidants. Tart cherries versus sweet cherries is a great example.

    I am a big advocate of "listening to my cravings", but sometimes it's just my genetics and I need to eat what I don't like, occasionally. If you feel repulsed by something, your body may have too much of one mineral or vitamn in store, too. I read that Vitamn D doesn't release well in our bodies and can become toxic, for example.

    Sometimes my craving signals are mixed up. I can begin to crave meat, meat and more meat thinking I need iron or protein. Really, sometimes, I'm needing a grain-based protein or omega-3, instead. I eat omega-3 rich nuts or whole grain cereal and the cravings ease. Takes time to figure out!

    Thank you all very much! I think I'll enjoy my Red Russian Kale until it becomes unsightly. Then, I'll pull it and feed it to the rabbits or try sauteing some of the stems in a stir-fry.

  • CarloMartin947
    10 years ago

    One thing to keep in mind is that all vegetable plants must not suffer any stoppage in their growth, or they will turn bitter. Usually it's too little or too much water, lack of nutrients, or wild temperature fluctuations. Using the methods pioneered by Alan Chadwick, the so called, French Intensive method, helps a lot. See the descriptions here:
    Alan Chadwick
    Click on "Techniques", then on "Kale" for more on that plant also.

    Here is a link that might be useful: Alan Chadwick

  • stuffradio
    10 years ago

    I grow Red Russian Kale and Dino Kale and leave them all winter. The only fear is the overwintering baby slugs. You definitely want to check under the leaves to get rid of them, because it will give them a nice supply of food once we get near Spring!