Kevin, if I were still up there, I'd be paying you a visit! You have practical plant experience and good advice... and a lot of plants! I'll take exception to your comment on Beautybush. I'm from DeKalb and there were certainly some beautiful ones there--where people grew them correctly--so it can happen. And I echo the point by saying that if Brad Pitt and Angelina Jolie have a baby...it would be a seedling!

pm, that pool heater presents some tough problems because of its size & light requirements. Seems like it could turn the nearby planting into a barren area. If you didn't mind your yard looking like a government project, no sweat. What are your thoughts about elevation of the unit(s)?...at ground level? Or high up and used to make some shade on part of the deck?

I came across a "buried pipe" solar heater that uses paving (sidewalk, deck, etc.) as the solar collector. Link included. I recall seeing once a raised concrete deck where the concrete was poured over corrugated metal (like for roofing, but stronger) that was built on a wood frame structure. It was an inexpensive way to get concrete above ground. Not recommending or suggesting. Just brainstorming about the deck, itself, being the solar heater. How are you thinking you will steer this aspect of the project?

Kevin- I forgot to say that you are correct about the Japanese beetles in the area....they are brutal!!! Last year they seemed to not be quite as bad, but they still reaked havoc on our wheeping cherry and river birch.

Yardvaark- I actually like you idea of elevating the solar panels and creating some shade for the deck. We wouldn't want a roof over all of it....but maybe half.

Yardvaark--I have failed with a few beautyberries, so maybe I have put them in the wrong spots. It's good to know they can work here!

The solar is really a tough thing to hide. The funny thing is that the township wanted me to "landscape around the solar panels to hide them from the neighbors". An understanding board member laughed at that statement from the president and said, "It's solar. Powered by THE SUN. How much do you think the guy can hide them, FROM THE SUN."

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Kevin, is that YOUR solar panel? It's huge! But nice looking... like NASA mfg! Are you in nursery biz or just have your own botanical garden? How is it you're "into" all these plants? Looks like you got room for them.

pm, this is kind of what I was thinking about with the elevated version. Maybe shift panels more toward pool and cover half of deck. Best to check on what screening issues you face as it's so close to lot line. Wood is easiest to build with, but heavy. A possibility would be tubular framing along the lines of chain link post and rail material. It's pretty strong and light weight and easy to cut with tubing cutter. I would be thinking of using vines and screening on it to pretty it up. Again, just brainstorming.

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Yep--that's my solar array. It is placed at the only spot where sun shines--to the right is the septic field prairie(south is to the right).

I am a plant hoarder, a hobbyist gone wild. Years ago when I was in the same boat as Mr. Smith, I got this little pamphlet from the Morton Arboretum that said that 89% of trees planted in Illinois consisted of something like 7 species. I thought that was crazy. I thought back to the yellow painted X's on the elms on my street where I grew up. The canopy had covered the street for miles and they were all cut down. I never wanted to see that, so I went nuts in the other direction. Diversity. It has paid off as the loss of 9 Ash trees hasn't really been a problem at all.

Yardvaark - I really like the roof design you sent....thanks for taking the time to create it! Hoepfully we'll have enough room to fit it between the pool and the fence (there is about 14').

Kevin - Thanks for all your help! Your solar panels are huge!

Any ideas on where/how I can incorporate/substitute some of the following list of trees and shrubs into the backyard plan:

Viburnum plicatum tomentosum
V. lantana(variegated and regular)
V. dentatum
V. dilitatum
V. rufidulum
V. sieboldii
Bur Oak
Kentucky Coffeetree
River Birch
White Pine
Spruce
Various grasses
Redbud
Pagoda dogwood
Red oak
Bitternut hickory
Chionanthus virginicus
Bottlebrush buckeye
Pawpaw
Magnolia
Calycanthus
Japanese maples
Oakleaf hydrangeas

Thanks!

"Hopefully we'll have enough room to fit it between the pool and..." I can scheme it, but you have to figure out how to make it work! :)

That is a mighty ambitious list of some great plants. Let me remind you that of the pictures you included to illustrate the "northwoods" feel, two have only a single species of tree. One has a predominant species as the backdrop and a couple of individual trees added as landscape items. In other words, they are very species limited. Yet I sense you are willing to include much more. I would be, too, as much more beauty can be created than what just "woods" alone would allow. Let me offer the observation that it is easy--very easy--to add more kinds of plants in the future if one feels there is not enough variety. To the contrary, it is difficult to part with plants that one has either "paid good money for" or invested sweat over or grown emotionally attached to or can't bear to kill. I see many yards and I would say that they tend to fall into one of two camps: there are almost no plants and no variety. These belong to people who never spend time in their yard. In the other camp is far too many things either variety of plants or too many individual plants (that are not team players.) The overall picture tends to look busy... if it's severe, even junky. I know there have been contributors to this thread encouraging you toward more variety, but I suggest you should ask each for a picture--examples--of what more variety looks like. See if it's what interests you. You might need to be looking for pictures to update the photo examples of where you are trying to take the yard so it's easier to help you get there. First, get all those hardscape features (walk, deck, fire pit area, utility area) figured out and committed to a drawing. And then begin working out the plantings. You might want to scheme up a planting layout so we can see what's on your mind.

Yardvaark - I apologize on not being more clear on my earlier post.....in no way are we looking to use all these trees and shrubs. Rather, we were looking for ideas and suggestions on where we could substitute some of the items on the list for what your plan had showed. I did some research but am having a hard time determining which are substitutes.

I have been brainstorming about the solar panels. I was wondering if the panels could be situated on a deck roof similiar to your drawing, but rather than have them stationary, have them pivit (or swing) out of the way when wanted. I don't believe the panels are very heavy , but I'm not sure how the plumbing would work.

Given the myriad of decisions to be made in a landscaping installation, at some point it becomes unnecessarily cumbersome for the DIY designer/homeowner to consult as things get close to actually making decisions.

You will make trade-offs, and you may even change the initial vision that you suggested to us. What trade-offs you decide to make will become clear as you start doing things like drafting up your plant order, designing the actual deck, and of course determining the solar array placement. As you make them, you aren't accountable to anyone for what changes you make or how well you implement the vision or the advice you've been given.

Having the freedom not to discuss each of those changes with a consultant is one of the benefits of DIY. You can take whatever attribute you liked out of those inspiration photos to implement. The idea of a woods backdrop can be as diverse as you want to make it.

I hope you do go to see Kevin - there's obviously a wealth of local knowledge to tap into, and starting with some seedlings would be great way to kick off.

Karin L

PS Actually, I think you might be able to meet some of your privacy needs with the array, if you plan it that way.

There's an incredible amount of inspiration to be found on the Canadian Wildlife Federation website, "wild about gardening" page.

Here's a thought about a pivoting solar heater arrangement that would require a more stout main support pole and weight balance of the collector units. I'm sure a flexible hose connection near the pivot point could be devised. An advantage is that you could adjust to the seasonal angle of the sun.

I'll try to help you with some of the plants issues tomorrow.

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Thanks Yaardvaark. I know that there may not be substitutes for everything on your plan, just where it makes sense.

pm, you might work out and communicate the sight line line issues with a sketch such as what follows. That way, it'd be easy to see what height was needed where.

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Toying with your latest list, I've changed a few things around. But honestly, until the sight line issues are made clear and the hardscape issues worked out, the planting is just theoretical. I hope it helps you think of how it might look when worked out, but as it is, it's just a sample planting scheme.

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I conjured up a reason to return and take a picture of the group of trees that I spotted the other morning. When I first passed it (at highway speed) I wasn't able to see it for more than 3 seconds. In that time it struck me as a very strong element. It was early in the morning and there was a foggy haze about. The haze obscured the background and made the bosque of trees stand out. When I went back, it was afternoon with bright sun. In my picture, it was not possible to distinguish the foreground trees from the background trees. Therefore, I'm taking the liberty to "paint" fake fog into the picture in an attempt to halfway recreate the scene. (Overlook that the fog looks faked. The points can still be made.) Btw, I mentioned that it might be a place for picnic tables (as it was in back of a commercial building) however, there was not a table within it or nearby, nor were the trees even accessible from the building. They were separated by a chain link fence. (But that' an example of how quickly landscape spaces are perceived and "read.")

The trees were a group of live oaks--twenty-one of them--planted in a circle 30' across. (That would put the canopy at about 75'... half the length of Smitty's yard.) Would this circle of trees be improved by splitting it up with additional species? To me, the answer is that it would have been destroyed by incorporating additional species. Is is a single object. It is not 21 different objects. It would be analogous to changing the left arm of couch to a completely different style, color, material than the rest of it. It would look bizarre. I don't see this bosque of trees differently.

This bosque could have probably been created with as few as 7 trees. But it would have had a very different character at its bottom half... being much more open and less of a screen/ "view filter." Or it could have been created of 7 trees in the same tight spacing in a 10' circle... keeping the same "flavor" as it has now, but in a smaller size.

Note also that if these trees were being grown for horticultural purposes (such as in a nursery for eventual sale) they would never be grown at a tight spacing like this. But here, that's not at all the purpose. Here, they're being grown to be a living "shelter" and artistic/ architectural/ sculptural statement.

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Thank again Yardvaark! I took some time and tried to determine the sight lines we would like blocked:

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It looks like we really have nothing over 15' that needs to be blocked (although second story windows would still be able to see into our yard).

I did have a couple of new questions:

1. On your drawings you have a shrub/tree marked as "S.B." on the northwest corner of our backyard....what does this stand for?

2. The redbud grove is comprised of about nine trees. It looks like they can get to be about 25' wide. The area btween the fence and deck is only about 25' wide. Do they just grow into each other? I was trying to map them on the plan but obviously can't enter them at their full grown size.

3. The way the winter is going, I can probably start cutting the beds in a month or so. After I remove the sod, do I need a load of dirt or will the mulch just fill in the difference from the sod removal? I have access to a rotor-tiller.....should I use it to loosen up the soil? Add fertilizer?

S.B=Serviceberry?

I'm liking some of your selections.

Here is a Chimney Fire Oak. You have to have this tree.
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Here is my 'Girard's Purple' Witchazel. The fall color was so fluorescent my camera didn't know how to capture the color!
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My Oakleaf Hydrangea I believe its 'Alice'
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Be sure to work in Fothergilla. This is gardenii
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Its good to see you are getting great advice on sight lines. I spent several months determining which plants to place where.

Whoa,whass...now I have to find a chimney fire oak for myself! And room for it too...

Smitty, that's a good job on the sight lines. Easier for us to understand. Looks like you need tall,skinny screen at back side of pool. The rest is easier as you have plenty of space. Though I like the way my deck location relates to rest of yard, where you first put deck may work better for you with all the constraints that come into play.

Kevin is correct... S.B = serviceberry.

Per Redbuds, river birch, etc....they will grow together (like the live oaks I posted pic of, above, but not that drastic.) It is their group that gives the "woodsy" feel. Remember, you are creating spaces, not individual objects. They are shelter and ceiling. Also, don't think of them as foliage in your face. You will limb up to create the "room" below. You control their trunk and branching character...whether single or multi-trunk and trunk angle and how low/high branched. Where trees would contact buildings, their back side is cut off. It is unnoticed. Also, you could take the same space I've devoted to nine redbuds and cut it back to 3 or 4. It won't have as "woodsy" a feel. That comes from the quantity of trunks. But maybe you want more space with a wider, multi-trunk tree. There is lots of flexibility in what you're creating. But making some great and grand "statements" with your space will outweigh having a greater quantity of individual plants.

Mulch will make up the difference in elevation where you remove sod. Fertilizer at planting very good idea. No need to rototill for landscape plants. Just dig wide hole. Perennials and annuals would like amendments and you could use roto-tiller for them. But if those spaces end up being small you could do it pretty easily by hand, too.

Whaas, those are some great looking plants. It's so easy to see why people get crazy for great plants when they see how beautiful they can be. That Chimney Fire oak is awesome. Heck, they all are!

Its quite contagious isn't it!?!

Quercus xreilff var. warei x Q. alba 'Chimney Fire' was introduced by Guy Sternberg. That photo is courtesy of him. This plant is similar to Crimson Spire but this one is reported to have better fall color and will hang on to its leaves through winter. Some like this, others don't. I do as it gives more winter interest and screens practically year long.

Quercus xreilff var. warei x Q. alba 'Birthday Candle' is another intorduction of his but its a bit more narrow and more gold to rusty yellow in fall. Its the one to the back left in the pic.

I will be planting both of these this spring. They are grafted by a few individuals in the US but they finally went into commercial production in the US this year.
Sooner Plant Farm is the only "online" retail outlet I know of. Green Leaf Nursery is the wholesaler.

Yardvarrk,
What do you think about using Taxodium distichum 'Mickelson' in lieu of the Riverbirch? Still has an informal look and well suited for groves. Little less common, better fall color and better winter silhouette. Almost as fast growing as Riverbirch.

whaas, I like river birch, but only went there because Smitty already had the start... and multi-trunks examples in a grove is a pretty grove with all that beautiful peeling bark. So I can't disagree. But to me personally, it doesn't matter. I love Taxodium d. for it's great winter silhouette, too. Each tree has its feature. I just pray to God that Smitty doesn't go to an arboretum and start falling in love with all the great trees and shrubs and then insist on squeezing a pair of each in his yard... like Noah's Ark.

We're pretty happy with the trees we've picked out so far. Posting on here and in the tree forum has made us realize, however, that out front yard was planned very poorly. Should I post on here or start a new thread?

A new thread.

When it comes to plants & plantings... especially things woody, if there's something to be fixed, the sooner it's done the easier, cheaper and better.

Thanks Yardvaark! I created a new thread titled "Help my dull/poorly planned front yard!".

I wanted to check in quick and weigh in on a couple of things:

We have been busy lately and haven't had much time to work on the landscape design. I plan on spending some time over the next few days researching specific trees/shrubs (pictures, widths, heights, etc) and start plotting locations on our backyard plan).

We still like the idea of positioning the deck along the south (right side) of the pool. This does pose a couple of problems (we wanted to cover the filter with the deck; solar panel positioning). We have been using a deck design program at Menareds so it's a work in progress.

It seems that this thread has created some debate on another thread. First, I want to apolgize for creating any controversy. I started the post hoping for some basic advice and, thanks to some of the great people on here, we have far exceeded our expectations. I would especially like to thank Yardvaark, Kevin 5, and whaas for their extremely generous donations of time, ideas and plants! We have learned A LOT and I plan on creating a "Things Learned" thread once our project are completed.

Thanks again everyone!

I have not completed reading this thread, but have to make a comment about ordering bareroot trees - DON'T DO IT! I cannot tell you how many trees I ordered and how much money I spent and all of the trees died (and they were extremely small). Finally, I wizened up and bought 15' potted trees from a local nursery and had them planted. They have all thrived and flourished. So please, buy your trees locally in pots.

Need to add to the above, the trees not only thrived, but grew wonderfully well, and are still flourishing.

PM, you were in absolutely no way to blame for the controversy that erupted. What happened on this thread mirrored what had happened on several before it, and was only the final stimulus for me to say what I did on the thread that has since been removed. And what happened on that thread would possibly have been quite different if several uninvolved individuals from the Home Decorating Forum had not decided that this forum needed their help to discuss its dynamics.

You did get a lot of good advice here, but my observation was that you actually missed the best of it early on - it came from Adrienne, in part, and Plantman56 - because someone came along on a flashier horse and you got whisked past the stage Adrienne described of really seriously pondering your needs on the site YOURSELF as opposed to listening to others ponder them with more expertise but inadequate information.

What I think you've now gotten kind of tied to is a plan that does not really meet your needs, and that is what concerns me. It's a nice plan if there are no competing needs in the yard, and it has some ideas you will no doubt incorporate, and I think you learned a lot about planning, but as you now start to digest and sketch on your own I think you will amend it considerably - indeed, I hope you will.

My only interest is in seeing OPs get advice here that meets their needs. I think you needed the first half of this thread, and then to be left alone to do the planning steps that were suggested, perhaps coming back for further input once you had put some thought into the steps that were suggested. Of course, there's always a silver lining, in that the thread eventually got Kevin's attention, and he is obviously an excellent resource. It remains to be seen whether your interests in landscaping and gardening follow the style of Kevin and Whaas, or Yardvaark, but that is your journey, and I wish you all the best on it.

Karin L

Pmsmith, what a major undertaking! Good luck with all of it. My canvas wasn't blank when we bought this house 31 years ago, but it's definitely changed through the years and I've enjoyed being a big part of it.

Karin, last time I checked Garden Web was open to everyone. Don't know why you feel the need to demean other posters as you did once again in your last post.

Sorry I haven't check in in awhile but things have been hectic with family obligations etc. Tomorrow I am going to start planning further and plan on transplanting the serviceberry. How far should I plant it from the house? I see that it can grow up to 20' wide so should I plant it 10' from the house (further than I'd like). Thanks as always!

Good to "see" you again! Tell where near the house you are planting it. Many times, trees that grow near houses are really just 1/2 trees. Where the canopy meets the wall, it's chopped off on the back side (hich goes unnoticed from the front.) Also, the lack of light where it meets the wall usually discourages new growth in that direction (but that varies from plant to plant depending on how shade tolerant they are.) Depending on how you intend to shape it, it might be as little as 4' to 6'.

I'd be laying out bedlines before you do much planting and visualizing their shape and placement so you can be sure that you get what you want. I think I told you about marking wand. Great tool for that.

Thanks Yardvaark. The seviceberry I am referring to would be planted at the north west corner of the house (per the plan you had posted above). I like the idea of providing some privacy from the deck with it but don't want to plant it too close to the house.

As I am working on our plan, a few new questions have come up:

1. I am skeptical planting a tree between the stairs and deck due to space. There is probably only a 2-3' space there and the railing on the deck is about 5' above ground level. Is this enogh space?

2. We like redbuds but not sure if we want that many planted together in one area. Is it possible to substitute another shrub/tree for half of them? Maybe create a white/pink checkboard affect during spring blossom?

3. We've decided to place the deck at the southwest corner of the deck. That will leave the areas to the south and the east of the deck open to landscaping ideas.

Thanks as always!

Serviceberry ...4 - 5' from wall seems decent. You can always chop off back side of it as much as you desire (the trunk(s) being your limit. The other constraint is the bed/lawn relationship. I wouldn't want the S.B too close to the edge of bed or for the adjacent grass path to get too skinny. But you can always work with massaging the bed on the other side of that path, too. Much of the fine tuning of landscaping happens directly on the site, not on a piece of paper. Don't hesitate to post photos of problems as they come up and you can probably get help that way, too.

Tree between stairs and deck... There's enough room for small type tree if you grow a standard or control a multi-trunk the way you want and need it. (Don't let it grow a trunk too close to railing.) You'd do this if you want shade at deck, but if you don't, then it wouldn't be necessary.

I drew the plan to give you an idea of what it is you were shooting for in trying to draw a plan. There are lots and lots of ways you could reconfigure what the plan shows in order to fit it to your needs. In regard to the redbud, as I look at it now, I see no less than 6 easy ways is could be reconfigured to use less trees. I see three different groups of 3, 2 different groups of 4 and and a group of 5 that would make ready sense. You could also space them somewhat wider, but doing so lessens the "woodsy" feel. Then, there's no reason you can't change your mind about that either. However, I would avoid mixing colors or mixing in similar sized trees of another species. I think it's better to have distinct arrangements to keep things from looking busy or messy (which saps strength of design.) I have a horror story I could later share about mixing shrub bloom colors but it'd be material for another thread... maybe titled, "OMG I can't believe they (I) did this".

Because your project is sizable and there's a lot to consider and install, an idea you might toy with is that of installing the largest, most important elements (including establishing the beds) that you feel very confident about, and letting some of the lesser elements go under review for later installation. You could do this over time and be continuously appraising what's there against what's needed. That way, you wouldn't have the feeling you are putting in more than you really want. Installation could take place over 2 or three years or even more.

De nada as always!

Thanks Yardvaark. A couple more quick questions:

1. To clarify....in the area in the southeast corner of the backyard, we could do a group of 3 or 4 redbuds and then a group of 3 or 4 of a different tree? Do you have any suggestions on what else might look good there?

2. For the river birch grove, would each tree consist of 3 trunks? For example 7 trees (per your plan above) would actually be 21 trunks or shoots, correct?

3. Would red oaks work in the northeast corner (behind the swingset)?

4. Any more suggestions on what we can plant behind the pool? Like I said, the deck is going to be at the southwest corner of the deck (10'x15') and we'll leave the area to the south of the pool open for now (future site for solar panels).

We are planning on just planting major trees and shrubs this year and then filling in groundcover etc next year. I think I'd break my back trying to do everything at once! Thanks as always!

In your question #1 are you talking about the south-west corner of back yard... where there are redbuds? How many feet away would trees in one group be from those of the other group... the separation between the groups?

Sometimes River birch have 3 trunks. Sometimes more. I would try to find trees that are matched in form as much as possible. Given that the bark is what's providing a great deal of the interest and beauty, more trunks is good. You could cut the group to 5 trees instead of 7, if you like.

Sure, red oaks would work behind swingset.

Behind pool... that's where you need tall, skinny 15' ht? If Kevin is still visiting, this might be a good question for him. Possibilities that come to mind for me are 'Skyrocket' Juniper (evergreen, but slower growing), Tallhedge buckthorn (Rhamnus cathartica 'Columnaris'...deciduous) and even Lilac (would be the widest spreading, but manageable.) Learn to trim hedges narrower at top and wider at bottom to keep from losing lower foliage (and turning these plants into trees.)

If you create beds, mulch them and keep them weed free, it will be much easier to keep weeds controlled next year after the little plants are in.

Yardvaark....yes, in question number 1 I am refering to the south-west corner. Not sure if I should use more than one species there or keep it just one. Maybe I'm just skeptical because the redbud in our front yard looks so sad (Home Depot special).

By the way, what are your opinion on the magnolia? Any place in this plan (or in our front yard if you remember the post) where we could incorporate it?

"Maybe I'm just skeptical because the redbud in our front yard looks so sad..." When plants are planted by themselves as just one, they usually ARE sad! They almost always look better in groups. In Illinois I have seen many excellent specimens of Redbud so I know it CAN grow there and prosper. If one example looks under the weather, it probably has more to do with conditions of establishment. New plants especially tend to lag if they suffer through any dry periods. If a person goes without water for only one week, how will that person look one year later? Not that good! If a plant suffers (for any reason) it takes time to get past it. Extra water in the first two years makes a huge difference. As I don't know the history I'm just guessing, but I'm certain Redbuds can do well.

Another possibility behind the pool is Hick's Yew (Columnar yew)... evergreen, but slower growing

As always, I prefer keeping just the one species in the group. I don't look at it too much differently than if a person was selecting chairs for a dining room table. It's not likely that two (or more) different styles of chairs will look better that a matched set of 6. I'm attaching some pictures of tree groupings. Which picture would be improved, by replacing part of the trees with another species? In the center row far left, do the two bloom colors add greater impact... or reduce it? In the bottom row far right there are mixed species of trees and shrubs...is it stronger visual impact, or less? Note the b & w photo bottom left there are different species in different groups. I think this works because each is distinct. So that's a general rule of thumb I'd offer, If the groups won't be touching, they could be a different species.

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I think we are leaning towards junipers for behind the pool but aren't real excited about the bluish-green color of the Skyrocket. Any other variations of junipers that are darker green that would fit in this area?

"In the center row far left, do the two bloom colors add greater impact... or reduce it?"

I misspoke but I guess everyone could figure I meant center row far RIGHT, not left.

Maybe someone else can come up with another juniper, but I only know other ones that are too big and fat. 'Sky pencil' Holly sounds good on paper, but I don't how it does there in real life. Maybe someone else knows. It's a tall, narrow broad-leaved evergreen rated for zone 5.

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Well I made my first attempt at transplanting one of the trees tonight. I moved the serviceberry that was loacted in the middle of the backyard to the northwest corner of the backyard. Here are my observations concerns:

1. I dug around the serviceberry with a drainage shovel (24' circle) like you instructed Yardvaark in another thread. The tree came loose easily, but the majority of the soil around the root ball fell off (I was careful not to disturb it when I dug). The soil is fairly wet so I'm not sure why this happened.

2. When I planted the tree, I remove a 6' circle of sod. I then removed the soil creating a saucer shape (gradual tapering, not a steep hole). I places what was left of the root ball in the middle of the hole so that the top of the highest roots are about even with the top of the soil. The entire circle of soil is about an inch below the sod around it now. I'm assuming I just fill the area level with mulch?

3. I watered the tree with about 2 gallons of water. Going forward, how often and much should I want transplaned trees?

4. There are lots of shoots coming up 6" to a foot from the main trunk (which I have trimmed down in the past). Now that I realize this is a shrub, I should just let any shoots grow as they want, correct?

5. What mistakes, improvements can I make in the transplanting process?

6. The weeping cherry in the front that I want to transplant is already showing signs of blossoming. I can see the pink of the flowers (still in roundish buds). I was going to transplant this tree tomorrow evening, but it very well may blossom before then (it's suppose to be 75 here again tomorrow). Can I still transplant it (this weather is crazy!)?

Thank as always for your help!

When transplanting, sometimes it happens, in spite of the precautions one takes, that the soil wants to fall off because the root system is not fibrous enough within the rootball area. This depends somewhat on the plant's history. Your chances are still probably pretty good based on karma alone! Add to that that it's still early in the season. If it had little or no foliage that's a big plus. Give the plant some water every day (or every other day... well, just don't let the soil become too dry) until you see sustained growth. Once newly transplanted material shows good growth, you can back off on the water. The main thing is don't let the soil become drier than damp-dry. Then treat it like any new planting. As you pry/lift the plant out of the hole it's good to have help in order to place two or three shovels equidistant around the perimeter to even out the pressure that's applied in lifting. Also, treat the rootball carefully and once it's out of the hole, lift and transport it with a sling of fabric. Dragging it across bumpy ground can shake soil loose. Just be as careful as you can. This is not likely, but if the soil fell off because it was too wet and couldn't sustain it's own integrity, then dig when a little drier.

Just place mulch atop the new planting to fill in the 1" depression. It's not necessary to remove 6' dia. sod, but no harm either. Dig a hole that's approx. double the width of the rootball. The sides can be straight or somewhat tapered. Same depth as rootball or just a little deeper and backfill depth to correct level before putting in the plant.

@ question #4. The answer is probably mostly "yes." please post a photo of the lower half of trunk system showing the sprouts, if you can.

I would transplant cherry asap. You especially would want to do it before foliage sprouts. If you take as much care as you can, it will probably come through unscathed. It's possible the flowering could stall a little, but I doubt it. Especially if you give extra water for a while after moving.

I was able to make some significant progress over the weekend on our backyard plan (thank you Kevin!). Here are a few pictures of what I was able to accomplish:

Along north side of backyard:
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Northeast corner of backyard facing east:
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Northeast corner of backyard facing north:
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Viburnim plicatum tomentosum planted along back of yard (east side):
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Redbud planted on southwest corner of backyard (more redbuds being ordered tomorrow):
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A couple of questions have come up as I have planted:

1. How close can I plant next to the fenceline. How close can I plant the river birch, oaks, pagoda dogwood, japanese maples, oakleaf hydrangea, and viburnum from the fence?

2. How close can I plant the redbuds next to each other?

3. When I finish the beds and lay down mulch, how deep shoulde I make it? What about in the areas where we plan on planting groundcover next year?

4. How big should the beds be (width)? Should they come out to the future mature width of the trees?

Thanks as always for everyone's help!

1. Closeness to fence depends on the plant and the form you'll grow it in. On the average 3'- 4' is about the closest for smaller trees and shrubs. 4'- 5' for trees. Again, depending on what and how, expect that the plant will cross the line. (As discussed in your front yard thread.) What you show in the pictures look fine.

2. How close can I plant the redbuds next to each other? Depends on woodsy-ness desired, as close as 6'. But I think you'd probably want to go more like 8' to 12'. Much of what you're asking about has to do with the effect that you're trying to produce. I'm not certain of your intent there. To a certain extent, it's arbitrary. You might Google images of the specific plant names, looking for photo of a similar effect that you're after. Then, try to ascertain from the photo the distance (or at least a guess of the range) that the plants are spaced at.

3. When I finish the beds and lay down mulch, how deep should I make it? What about in the areas where we plan on planting groundcover next year? 2" everywhere. (I'm sure you know you'll need to kill grass first and prepare the bed edge.)

4. The bed depth/width will vary. You don't want a large plant to be right at, or too close, to a bed's edge. Bigger plants need more bed around them. If you imagined that large plants were in a display flower pot (as opposed to a grower's) instead of the ground, and that they had room to grow in the pot before needing to be moved to a larger one, how big would the pot need to be? That size flower pot would be the absolute minimum that I would consider making the bed. Since the plants will continue to grow, plan ahead and widen the bed to accommodate that future growth. But there's lots of massaging and tweaking that can happen to a bed's edge. It's common to widen and re-shape a bed after several years of plant growth to accommodate what the plants have become. I would work out what the shape and size of the bed is to be before doing too much more planting. Otherwise you stand the risk of putting things in the wrong place.

Thanks Yardvaark! Any idea where I could incorporate a hibiscus tree into either the front or back yard (my wife loves them and I just ordered one). Also, I am seeing a lot of shrubs with bright yellow flowers on them. Any idea what they are and where I could incorporate one? Maybe just west of the river birches if I keep it trimmed (it would provide a little more screening from neighbors on corner. Thanks as always!

If shrubs with bright yellow flowers are big, they're probably Forsythia. Where to "incorporate one"...? Hmmm... I'm sensing an ominous wind blowing. You should be thinking of where to incorporate a group of something, not just one. Too much of "just one" and your yard will be looking disorganized and haphazard. Also, I don't feel in control of what you're doing. The plan I offered was as an example to show you what it would look like when you start to work things out, but it certainly needs refinement given that you have needs and desires that I know nothing of. (And more cropping up with every blooming day!) I would work out some of the details of that plan (especially the bed lines) before acquiring much more plant material. For that "Hibiscus tree" do you have a botanical name as there are several plants that would qualify for that title?

Thanks Yardvaark! The hibiscus is named 'Hibiscus Fireball - Perennial Hibiscus'. As for the planning aspect of the project, as I've planted I've kept in mind the size of each tree/shrub (referring to the internet for mature size). I've also been checking site lines from various points in the yard as I plant. I did buy marking paint recently and plan on marking all bed edges tomorrow before I plant further.

I don't remember if I told you, but make a skimpy dashed line with the paint with the first walk through. Appraise the results and make corrections with a heavier dashed line. Appraise again and when you think it's right, go over it with a solid line. Depending how good you are about it, it can be fairly straightforward... or it can get messy. So take your time appraising it from many angles before making the corrections. If it gets really messy, a second, different paint color is useful. Once you get the line as you want it, mark it in some permanent way (cut with shovel?) as the paint will not last long. After a couple of weeks of weathering and mowings it may be so faded you can barely make it out. If you want the line reviewed, post a picture taken from a high elevation.

I know you're making changes to the concept plan I showed you so I just want you to be thinking through the planting arrangements as you make the changes. Since you're doing this work yourself, I have the feeling you're going to become good at evaluating what you've done and the way things are fitting together... especially after you see a year's growth. Now that you're a transplant expert, you'll be able to make adjustments when you see some are needed.

The hibiscus is more a shrub than "tree." It looks like something that should be within easy view of deck or pool area.

Since you're new to so many plants and trying to save some $ by doing the work and putting this together over time, you might consider creating a temporary place where you plant various perennials that are under consideration...a regular perennial garden. You could collect plants with zero worry about what goes where, just stick them in. See how they do. Get to know them. You could place such a garden in any place that's not ready yet to be landscaped (so it's not in the way for a while.) As you evaluate plants, you can increase the stock of those you like. Some perennials multiply so rapidly that if you buy one, from it you can make all the others of that kind you need. If you do it, add 1/3 volume of peat moss to the planting soil so it is better to work in and better to grow things.

Another thing I meant to mention, where you have like groups of plants (say River Birch) when it's all said and done you'll want these plants to match as though they came from the same family. It will not be pretty if one is a 5-trunk multi and another is a single trunker... and one branches as 8' above the ground, and another at 12 feet. They need to look like they're all from the same planet and got their hair cut at the same salon. What to do about it? This year, nothing. Just see what they do and try to make them as healthy and fast growing as possible. At the end of next winter, you'll want to do whatever pruning (before spring growth occurs) that's required to make them be matched. But never fear, even if it has to be severe, as long as they're healthy they'll bounce back and keep going.

I received the hibiscu yesterday and it's just a bulb (no growth above the roots). Not sure if this is correct or I should contact the nursery.

I believe these come up quite late. Plant somewhere you'll remember where is and have faith that it will become something. Maybe not for several more weeks.

I have a questions concerning mulching the beds....I'm assuming I need to remove the sod from the beds and then lay mulch, correct? How do we handle the transition between the redbuds and beauty bushes and the firepit area (mulch to stone/crushed brick)? Any other tips when it comes to mulching?