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Educational laag...

Posted by woodyoak 5 (My Page) on
Sat, Apr 9, 11 at 19:44

My comment on the 'specimen tree' thread that laag's photoshopping (that's a word that has come to mean any photo manipulating I think...) was educational, reminded me of a 'small world' incident that happened in the CAD course I took over the winter...

When we were learning about how to label the drawings neatly, one of the students in the class (who was from Ink's neck of the woods...) did an Internet search, looking for examples of drawings done by professionals. She posted links to a couple of sites with drawings she thought were particularly good and intended to use as a model for what she wanted her drawings to look like. I'm 99% sure that one of the sites she posted was laag's! It is indeed a small world... :-)


Follow-Up Postings:

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RE: Educational laag...

  • Posted by laag z6CapeCod (My Page) on
    Sat, Apr 9, 11 at 20:08

My web page has not been updated in a really long time, I'm embarrassed to say (it is currently a part time thing). The plans on it are negatives - white on black. I do have lots of plans that I've posted in places that could pop up, including older places of employment ... and current. What was in the plan?


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RE: Educational laag...

I'm not sure which plan she focussed on - the link she posted took me to the home page, where the plans do indeed show as negatives. So, you need to update your site - you never know when it'll pop up and influence someone :-)


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RE: Educational laag...

Andrew: you have said before that one reason for posting here is to improve your communication skills (or words to that effect). It seems to me that you get through to people in a very effective way lately so there is a result. What do you do with this ability now? It is a talent that should not be wasted ...teach...write a book...big up your online presence?


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RE: Educational laag...

  • Posted by laag z6CapeCod (My Page) on
    Sun, Apr 10, 11 at 14:38

Sell more landscape design ... maybe in a bigger way.


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RE: Educational laag...

  • Posted by bahia SF Bay Area (My Page) on
    Sun, Apr 10, 11 at 18:15

Yeah, we would all like it to lead to a chance to make a bit more money and more interesting projects, wouldn't we? Hopefully that is what it is doing for you. You do have an admirable way with words and expressing opinions in a non-intimidating way...


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RE: Educational laag...

We seem to have a crop of landscape designers who are trying to use the forum to do that just now - a bunch linking to their websites. What a shame this is against the forum rules of use!! And what a shame that it is likely the most deserving designers who freely participate here without pimping their business who are too classy to use this method! At the same time, I think there is nothing wrong with knowing peoples' real names...

KarinL


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RE: Educational laag...

  • Posted by KraB none (My Page) on
    Sun, Apr 10, 11 at 20:23

I like the explanations with drawings, sometimes arrows pointing at things, it helps me understand why to do something. If there were a book or website with a bunch of drawings and explanations of 'empty space', 'meet and greet areas' and whatnot it would help newbies like me alot.

Make a website or write a book. :)


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RE: Educational laag...

  • Posted by laag z6CapeCod (My Page) on
    Sun, Apr 10, 11 at 20:30

I wish everyone thought so, but I have gotten much better at it.... just tooo darn wordy. I hope to become more concise.

The most interesting thing is learning what makes sense to other people and what does not. That is what I have really gotten out of participating on this and other websites. Leaning that things that I thought people intuitively understand are not always so easy to explain. Learning tact is a slow process as well. I used to get quite a bit of hate mail because people took things the wrong way. I have not had any in years .... from this site. I'm not well appreciated by some landscape architecture students and recent graduates for some reason (I like to think that they don't yet accept reality).

There are a lot of different ways to do things, so presenting one example on a thread and studying the reactions is a huge education in how some people perceive things differently than I do. I'm a little warped, so it is important for me as a designer to be able to be aware of how other people perceive their landscapes either so I can get schooled, get on board, or get them to follow my logic.

You can't survive in this business if you are the greatest designer in the world if you can not give someone the confidence to hire you after only an hour of audition time over all of the other people they talk to. That has become really easy for me and I definitely think participating here has helped that in a huge way.

Thanks for the kind words.


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real name

  • Posted by laag z6CapeCod (My Page) on
    Sun, Apr 10, 11 at 20:57

Karin, I don't use my whole name on discussion forums because I like to be able to have candid discussions on controvercial threads sometimes. I don't care if those i the discussion know my name, but I don't want someone to search my name and have one of those be the first thing that pops up.
I'm pretty sure you can get my name pretty easily, anyway. I used to have a web page link, but I either did not like some changes in terms on this forum or I changed providers. I do have an email link that is my primary email and do get emails from people on garden web from time to time.

Karin, you mentioned shameless self promotion. I did a search because of this thread to see what cad plan might have come up in Woody's class. I searched google images "landscape CAD plans" and sure enough one of my plans came up twice right near the top - one black on white and one as a negative. I clicked on the black on white and SOMEONE ELSE'S web page opened with my plan on it! Worse yet, the page states that all photos are copyright protected "all rights reserved". Nice. I sent an email and the company owner agreed to take it off. He said that the webpage designer put it on there and he had no idea. I believe him. He said that he would contact his web host and it would be removed.

My webpage is very limited and has not been updated in quite some time.

www. yportdesign. com Not for promotion, but not to hide who I am. (remove the spaces).


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RE: Educational laag...

Fascinating, Andrew, and much appreciated. Interesting to see your analysis applied. And I understand wanting not to be judged by what you say on this forum - you're always very circumspect, but that kind of captures a bit of how I feel, and it's not even my professional image at stake.

I also like what you say about the whole communication process, not even just wanting to finesse what you say but observe responses to it. I love watching the conversations here for those kinds of things, quite aside from content. By way of contribution to that, I think a key element is always checking assumptions. For example, in the Sunbum thread I think the OP, while really nicely receptive to input, is a bit baffled by it because he hasn't previously (and maybe still doesn't) perceive the design or siting of the house as a problem. On a consultation, you'd have to gain alignment on that to begin with for the client to even evaluate the proposed design. With the Eyebrows thread, who'd ever think to view "looking established" as an objection to removing horrendously sited and overgrown plants?

I have a post-grad degree that took two very intense years to complete, and I have sometimes said that the whole thing can be distilled down to three words that were one professor's motto and are now mine: check your assumptions.

Now, the veil over Ink and a few others remains intact. I do respect that...

KarinL


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RE: Educational laag...

Years ago, when I found this forum, I used to imagine Laag with a long, gray beard (cause that's what he sounded like) - was quite surprised when I saw the photo portrait!


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RE: Educational laag...

  • Posted by laag z6CapeCod (My Page) on
    Mon, Apr 11, 11 at 7:17

... my beard is now gray, but just trimmed it this very morning, so not very long.
Photobucket

I'm the one on the right, although some may think that I'm out of the photo off to the left by 5 or so feet.

Can't wait for the photoshop renditions.


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RE: Educational laag...

I'm not one to render a bonsai on your head, I leave that to others...
That be me:


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RE: Educational laag...

I wonder how many hits your website got -
its a great site and beautiful work. Thanks for sharing.

I use a facebook account for my business, but I worry about the amount of information that out there on the web about all of us. My personal facebook account is well protected and I try not to friend clients, but the overlap is starting to be an issue. (because some of my clients become friends). Not that I am posting bad stuff on facebook; but I just like to keep a separation.

Perhaps the separation is detrimental because I did get one huge job this year from a "friend" on facebook who followed a link to my business and liked the pictures. So the free marketing that facebook offers did pay off. I was reading an article in Entrepreneur Magazine that led me to believe I should be doing a lot more self promotion on the internet such as twitter and invest in a website. Since 90% of my business comes from word of mouth one could argue both sides of that issue. Would the internet increase the word of mouth, or would it be a wasted effort?


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RE: Educational laag...

timbu - aren't you cute?! :-) Great picture - nice to 'see/meet' you!

laag - are you a horse person too?! I was in my younger and healthier days...
Image Hosting by PictureTrail.com

I don't think you have to worry about being 'wordy'. You are the soul of brevity compared to me! I think it's better to offer a more detailed explanation than nececessary than it is to not offer enough explanation because you assumed something was understood that wasn't. Which sort of relates to Karin's 'check your assumptions' comment. It's easier to cut short a detailed explanation when it becomes obvious that you're covering familiar ground, than it is to back up and explain further when it becomes obvious that the other party is not following you. The important thing - especially with the client base I assume you target - is to never appear to be 'talking down'. You need to explain things without appearing to be doing so....

drtygrl - the Facebook issue is a tricky one for sure. I've never felt comfortable with that format. I prefer the type of interaction on forums like this, where the discussion feels more like a conversation. I'd be interested in a link to pictures of your work though...

Karin - I'm intrigued... what is your background/degree? 'Check your assumptions' sounds scientific...?


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RE: Educational laag...

Woody - I completely agree about laag not needing to worry about "wordy". :)
And you make a good point about it being difficult to explain further when someone doesnt understand - that is what I certainly struggle with myself.

@ woody I would be happy to email you the link to my page and to anyone else who is interested - but since facebook is interactive I am reluctant to post it here for all eternity (as bahia pointed out in another thread - you cant edit after you post things here).
@ everyone else I will put my email on my profile for a bit - so please email me if you would like the link - happy to share.


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gardenweb!?!?!?

its not letting me add my email to my member page so here it is
twilcoxgardens@comcast.net


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RE: Educational laag...

Woody, my background is more confusing than intriguing! Prior to 20 years of housewifery/mothering and �bevolunteering, I did an MBA, which is not scientific but analytical, and is where the motto comes from. My undergrad is in dietetics, which is more scientific. I worked in that field for a few years, but other than that almost the only paid work I've done is some freelance writing.

Interesting point about talking down. I think the thing that can trick you into doing that is to get stuck on the word "explain," and on the assumption that it is the expert who will do the explaining. I think it is really important actually for the client to be drawn out to explain thoroughly what their needs, expectations, and assumptions are. Then the professional can explain how their plan functions to meet those needs, not to mention make a plan that meets the needs. But I think maybe the operative word in the communication process is "share" rather than explain.

Drtygrl, at least you can pull images by taking them off your Pbucket, but yes, the words stick until they scroll off. And Murphy's law, the ones you wish would disappear will keep getting bumped up, the ones we go looking for likely disappeared long ago :-)

KarinL


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photos

that is exactly why I only post using flickr so I can control what is on here:)

I have a masters in social work - who would have thought I would be doing this!

One day my crew was installing a garden and we looked around and between the four of us we had 3 masters degrees and a MD. When i started my business one of my goals was to provide flexible employment for moms of young children. It has worked out incredibly well as you can tell from the education of my staff!


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RE: Educational laag...

  • Posted by laag z6CapeCod (My Page) on
    Mon, Apr 11, 11 at 13:05

My wife and daughter ride. I just stand nervously near the horses and feed them carrots.

"I think it is really important actually for the client to be drawn out to explain thoroughly what their needs, expectations, and assumptions are. Then the professional can explain how their plan functions to meet those needs, not to mention make a plan that meets the needs. But I think maybe the operative word in the communication process is "share" rather than explain."

Karin, that is absolutely correct!


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RE: Educational laag...

laag - Randy's relationship with horses is/was much the same as yours. That's his hand on the end of the lead shank... :-)

Karin - your background can't be any more confusing than mine - I started out as an agricultural economist working for a farm lobby group and ended up as that reviled thing - a bank (junior - VP) executive in the investment end of the business. And then I got sick....

I'm in the MBA ranks too (also a CA - Cdn version of CPA) so I fit with with this well-educated group with their hands in the dirt :-)


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RE: Educational laag...

Wow, no WONDER we're all so anal...ytical! :-)
My economics angle is sorely lacking, Woody, I envy you!

So now I think I've figured out where the name "Laag" comes from.

KarinL


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RE: Educational laag...

  • Posted by laag z6CapeCod (My Page) on
    Tue, Apr 12, 11 at 13:03

AG, LA ...backwards.


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