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Patio Pavers and sloped yard

Posted by sshaw66 5 (My Page) on
Wed, Aug 10, 11 at 23:19

I'm posting images below. Here's the situation I'm looking for help/assistance about. I've got this kids pool, about 8 ft. in diameter, currently on our deck. It consumes a bit too much of the deck space. What I'd like to do is to put in a patio/pavers off the deck where the soccer ball is at in the photos. It would serve the dual purpose of having a place to put the pool in the summer, and after it is put away for the year (around labor day), we could put a portable fire pit in the center of the pavers.

I'm open to any ideas as to what to do with the space, if anything. I envision having a couple columns, either segmental block or tumbled-type, around the side of the deck. To avoid a retaining wall on the far side of the paver patio, I was thinking of putting some segmental blocks along the deck, and then go outward toward the back of the yard, to make things even. Very much in the planning/idea stage at this point.

My concern: The slope of the yard, which is back toward the raised deck/house. Thanks in advance for any input.

Link to images: Here


Follow-Up Postings:

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RE: Patio Pavers and sloped yard

I add bamboo,J-maple...
Photobucket


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RE: Patio Pavers and sloped yard

Thanks for the ideas, but a few things:

1. I live in Zone 5, and can't grow bamboo;
2. The Jap. Maple is right where I already have a small tree (weeping mulberry);
3. The little water pond you put into the photo is facing a fence, and wouldn't be visible; and
3. The gist of my question is I want to install a paver patio, and was asking about the slope issues that exist in the area.

Does anyone have any ideas/help with the slope issues that exist, and comments about installing a circular paver patio in the area mentioned, off the deck?


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RE: 7Patio Pavers and sloped yard

Juniper,conifer work.
Photobucket


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RE: Patio Pavers and sloped yard

Hi, sshaw66. Sorry you were disconcerted by designshare. You're not the only one....

So I will now proceed to disconcert you with too many questions!

As I understand it (which may not be very well), the yard slopes down toward the house.

Could you post a photo of the location where you want to put the new paving? Take it from the grass looking toward the base of the deck. If that area needs to be raised, I think the hardscape experts (sorry, but I'm not one) will need to see the lay of the land in that area, and how the deck is supported.

How high off the ground is the deck in that location?

Do you have a good estimate of how much height difference there currently is between the soil at that side of the deck and soil at the location of the outer edge of the new paving?

I assume you'll also be adding paving at the bottom of the steps which would connect to the pool/firepit area. In any case, you've got those existing steps. How does the level of the grass at the bottom of the steps relate to the proposed level of the new paving? (It looks to me as if that area may be slightly below the lawn at what would be the outer edge of the new paving.)

Do you expect to have a bed for plants between the deck and the new paving? If so, how wide would that be?

You mention possibly adding columns next to the deck. How many and how tall would they be, and what would be the purpose?


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RE: Patio Pavers and sloped yard

OK. Let me try and answer.

As I understand it (which may not be very well), the yard slopes down toward the house.

YES.

Could you post a photo of the location where you want to put the new paving? Take it from the grass looking toward the base of the deck. If that area needs to be raised, I think the hardscape experts (sorry, but I'm not one) will need to see the lay of the land in that area, and how the deck is supported.

Here is a Photo

How high off the ground is the deck in that location?

About 2.5 ft.

Do you have a good estimate of how much height difference there currently is between the soil at that side of the deck and soil at the location of the outer edge of the new paving?

I have not looked at this yet to an exact amount, but I'd say about 2 ft, max.

I assume you'll also be adding paving at the bottom of the steps which would connect to the pool/firepit area. In any case, you've got those existing steps. How does the level of the grass at the bottom of the steps relate to the proposed level of the new paving? (It looks to me as if that area may be slightly below the lawn at what would be the outer edge of the new paving.)

Correct, it is slightly below the lawn.

Do you expect to have a bed for plants between the deck and the new paving? If so, how wide would that be?

No, don't necessarily need that.

You mention possibly adding columns next to the deck. How many and how tall would they be, and what would be the purpose?

I'm thinking of coming up 5-6 feet, and using them to hold a fire-bowl, or incorporate some glass blocks into the columns, for lighting around the deck/patio.


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RE: Patio Pavers and sloped yard

All OPs should be warned to ignore Designshare; your response is commendably constrained. The bizarre thought process behind these pictorial manipulations is incomprehensible to us all, but we appear powerless to stop them.

As for providing useful input to your problem, I don't see a lot of concern with it except that in your zone you may require pretty extensive base preparation to avoid frost heave. Alternatively, the patio would just have a fairly short lifespan before requiring some re-setting of the stones.
Plus, I would ensure that any surface water flow is being directed away from the house. Finally, I think I'd want that patio a bit shaded so would probably plant some trees that would eventually do so.

But I cannot understand what you mean by the columns, and hopefully this doesn't make me a complete idiot. Perhaps you could clarify.

KarinL


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RE: Patio Pavers and sloped yard 2

Whoops, I drafted this up earlier and delayed posting, sorry - forgot to check for new action in the meantime.


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RE: Patio Pavers and sloped yard

Have you considered using decking instead of pavers? It could be a different level than your current deck but with the same railings and columns to make it work together.

I was just thinking it would be the easiest way to deal with the uneven slope. You wouldn't have to level the ground, just the supports. The uphill side could be ground level or just a few inches above and then add some supports to the down slope side.


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RE: Patio Pavers and sloped yard

Dear KarinL: there aren't any great designer without any bizarre thought.your photoshop pics are so poor,maybe I help you some.please don't use that word "ignore" again.you isn't a dictatorship police. I am sure you have not any jealousy.
don't comment these pics "incomprehensible to us all"
missing:OP"Thanks in advance for any input.".my suggests--create a fir fit,a pool on the lawn---disconcert you than OP.
I have a dozen other pics,if OP don't like them,I don't post again.
Now, I enjoy this forum' rule.


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RE: Patio Pavers and sloped yard

tanowicki's suggestion is often called a "floating deck." There is plenty of do-it-yourself info on the web.


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RE: Patio Pavers and sloped yard

Ssahw, sorry for this hijack, and back to your deck in a moment.

***

Designshare, I have been saying nothing in response to several of your posts, but this time you posted twice and you did not listen to what the OP said. The OP clearly rejected your input, yet you made yet another bizarre and irrelevant picture.

I would suggest you try to improve your work to encompass both reality and the question that the OP is asking, so it doesn't require anyone to be advised to ignore it. And by the way, if you see anyone giving advice that you think is a waste of time or otherwise bad, you are free to say so here. Just be sure to give reasons why you think it is bad.

Given that freedom that you have, I would suggest that you try learning what "dictatorship" means before you use that word again. It continues to beggar my understanding that you are from China, which is a dictatorship where corruption and oppression abound, and yet you cannot tell the difference between a dictatorship and simple peer response.

Far from seeking to oppress your contribution, I have frequently offered you suggestions on how to improve it. Your contributions in words are sometimes very good, and if you could simply stop with the pictures, you would be much more welcome by me. In particular, I have suggested that you not be the first to post to any thread, because it is very off-putting to a new OP when a "cartoon" (as your drawings were referred to by someone else) is the first response.

That, of course, is only my opinion. I don't seek to speak on anyone else's behalf, and everyone else is free to tell you, and the rest of the world by posting it in a thread, if they feel differently about your pictures.

***

So, back to the deck. I agree a deck would be easier to build, but maybe not so good for a firepit. I wonder though whether the firepit and pool seasons do not somewhat overlap. Perhaps it would be better to consider the two functions separately.

Alternatively, based on the measurements you've given, that's some slope. Could you move the patio further from the deck to flatter ground? And/or extend the deck at its present level until you reach flat ground? Fill below the deck to bring the ground level up??

The concurrent thread I've linked below may give you, in monetary terms, some idea of the magnitude of putting the patio right where you want it.

KarinL

Here is a link that might be useful: concurrent thread


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RE: Patio Pavers and sloped yard

Thanks for the input. Yep, I've thought about adding on to the deck, and that is an option, but it does take any fire out of the play. The only other place to put the deck addition/patio would be off the side, which also slopes quite a bit in the opposite direction, and only gives me about 7 feet from the deck to a fence. My thought was to bring the grade around the deck up to about the point where the decking is, then out in a circular fashion, so that where the circle ends on the opposite side, it transitions directly to lawn. I'd have to install retaining walls on both sides, however. The deck option would also deal with any frost/maintenance issues with pavers---in zone 5 how much of an issue is this?

I think those monetary terms are pretty over the top. I'd do it myself at (probably a fraction), but that doesn't negate my desire to do it right.

Deisgnshare: It's no so much that your pics aren't appreciated, they are. However, it would be nice for you to come up with something that actually incorporated my thoughts/needs. I want to explore the option of a circular patio off the deck, something to deal with the slope issues, and perhaps a couple of columns with lighting on the top (e.g. glass block or a fire bowl, something like that). I already have 10 trees in this yard, so I don't need any more; nor do I need or want any conifers. Finally, I don't want to put pavers across the entire lawn.

THanks.


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RE: Patio Pavers and sloped yard

A fire pit/ring will be much smaller than a pool and require a much smaller flat area. People seated around it don't need to be on the same level either. As karinl mentioned, the fire pit and swimming pool seasons do overlap - think in July when you'd like to have the pool out and roast some marshmallows while catching fireflies. I think a quicker and cheaper option to solve the pool space problem would be to extend the deck and have the fire pit elsewhere in the yard - either a flatter area or a smaller flattened area.

Extending the deck level out using retaining walls and pavers is going to be expensive and doing it yourself is going to be a strain. How are you going to get all the retaining wall blocks around back and then the backfill material?


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RE: Patio Pavers and sloped yard

  • Posted by bahia SF Bay Area (My Page) on
    Fri, Aug 12, 11 at 21:21

Extending a lower level of deck may be a more pragmatic/cost effective solution. A fire pit could just as easily incorporate a portable metal fire bowl. Columns with lighting could easily be framed as wood columns or as part of a deck railing. Grading to accommodate drainage/settling/frost heave in your climate make an at grade pavers patio more complex when on a slope with cut/fill design._


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RE: Patio Pavers and sloped yard

I love a deck as much as the next person. But I think the OP wants someplace to put that pool to get it off the deck near the house. I think that pool is heavy enough that I'd want it on a patio as well. That's a lot of dead weight for a deck to hold.

It would be expensive, but it would be pretty awesome if you had the patio laid so it was set into the slope of the yard. If you had a low retaining wall to hold back the slope on the back of the patio it would also double as a seating wall. Why did you want to avoid a retaining wall on the far side of the patio? I know they can seem like an expensive repair waiting to happen if they are installed poorly, but it looks like you'd be holding back a pretty small amount of soil (2' at most) so even the dry-stacked wall systems should work. Unless your soil is something particularly evil.

As for the lighting concerns, I would go for simple & look at some nice outdoor battery operated lights. I think you could achieve the ambiance lighting you'd probably want with some battery operated lights & it would save you from pulling an electrical permit & all the associated costs with running power outside.


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RE: Patio Pavers and sloped yard

I think pavers on a cut and fill base would look great. I'm just thinking about the amount of DIY that would take when it comes to design, especially taking into account the weather in zone 5. The pool is already on the deck so a deck can take that amount of weight - it is only a kiddie pool. I think that's why I'm saying to consider adding to the deck.

As I'm typing this though, how many more years will that kiddie pool get used? Will you want to move up to a bigger pool or will it just be reclaimed space?


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RE: Patio Pavers and sloped yard

I agree with tanowicki we have done the 8 foot inflatable pool thing for our grand child for the last few years and at almost 5yrs she still enjoyed it this year but reminded me frequently that Cassidy has a 'big' pool where she swims and her feet don't touch the bottom. That will never happen in our yard. :c) They grow up quickly so plan for the future, it will be here before you are ready.


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RE: Patio Pavers and sloped yard

Hi,
Whatever you do, make sure it's with the long term in mind since you plan on putting money into it.
1. Big enough for a patio set?
2. Level and retained properly with a solid base (A-gravel for pavers)?
3. Design design design!! :) Draw it out, play with the curves and for goodness' sake please do an exact radius if you're doing a curve! (sorry, landscape designer coming out in me :P)
4. You won't EVER regret putting in a patio if you do it properly and sit down with a pencil to plan it out. It will become an outdoor space that you can enjoy for a long time.
5. BEST WISHES!! You've got a lot of work ahead of you!


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RE: Patio Pavers and sloped yard

Tanowicki raises a good point about the DIY difficulties of a cut-in paver patio on that hill.

I don't know if any patio contractors would be willing to do this, but if they would do the parts of the job with less margin for error - grading the site & digging out for the base layer of gravel - then you could consider making it a hybrid project (some professional work, some DIY). I think laying the pavers & sweeping in the sand/stone dust is something that would be DIY-able.

If you did try this yourself, I'd check with your local tool rental yard for a Dingo or Bobcat to rent for a day or 2. They might even "know a guy" who's really good with it and would operate it for a day for cash (depending on your comfort level with this sort of arrangement).


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