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akahn_gw

New foundation garden help - cornus alternifolia?

akahn
9 years ago

Hi everyone,

This is my first time posting on GardenWeb, I hope this is the appropriate forum.

I'm starting to plan for planting on this West-facing side of my house. My goals are for a low-maintenance wild/native bed, influenced by the ideas of Ricke Darke and Doug Tallamy. Basically a micro-meadow and woodland garden all mashed into this tiny space, hoping to attract birds and insects. I'm thinking wildflowers as well as viburnum/oakleaf hydrangea. I don't have it much more fleshed out than that yet. ;)

I'm looking for feedback on placing a small tree in the corner at left the attached image. I'm thinking of Alternate-leaf dogwood, for its flowers and berries, plus shade and privacy screening for the leftmost window in the photo. The two leftmost windows are my office, and I could use more privacy from people walking by on the street (hence the shade being drawn on the other window, that one actually needs screening even more). Anyways, does this seem like a suitable choice and a suitable placement? The bed is 10 feet deep from the foundation to the pavement. I've read that this species can grow 20 feet wide -- problem, or manageable with pruning? Note that under the snow pile at the left of the photo is a small peony.

I'm also a little concerned that this design would feel a little too "bookended" by having a small tree in that corner and then 25 feet away a similar sized tree (a crabapple), with some flowers/shrubs in between. I'm worried that it might seem a little too symmetrical. Does this seem like a reasonable concern or no?

Any feedback on how to design this space is welcome. Right now in the bed some yarrow, wild carrot and rudbeckia grows, I'd like to fill it with a lot more.

Comments (11)

  • PRO
    Yardvaark
    9 years ago

    Irrespective of the particular style of landscape design you're after, successful landscape design is not going to forget to correlate plantings with features of the building. The close-up, angled view is not a good one to provide viewers with sufficient sense of the existing overall space. It would be better if you step farther back and take a square-on picture of the whole side of the building ... or, at least the relevant portion and then some.

    I have to point out that the window details are unique and attractive. From the exterior, it's likely to look like a gross oversight if you place a big plant smack in front of it. Why can't the need for privacy be addressed with an interior window treatment that properly provides it? If you demand that window shading is performed by landscape materials, you unnecessarily complicate the landscape project while creating the above mentioned appearance of oversight.

    Love the dogwood, but I can tell you the width of it is going to vastly exceed the space, particularly if grown in the shrub form (not limbed up) which is how it is usually appreciated. I would go back to the drawing board on that plant choice. But let's see the wall first.

  • akahn
    Original Author
    9 years ago

    Hi Yaardvark,

    Thanks for the feedback. I guess what I was thinking is that the mottled shade that a tree or tall shrub would provide provides a nicer light than what a window dressing can provide. Plus I could admire the garden from my desk while enjoying the privacy that the plant provides. Maybe a suitable window dressing would provide this and I need to keep a more open mind. Although I don't particularly care about showing off the detail trim of my windows, you're right, I want my design to work with the house and not make it uglier.

    Here's a wider, more square-on view of the wall (didn't want to trample my neighbors' garden bed), plus two more, for further context.

    {{gwi:2117943}}

    {{gwi:2117944}}

    {{gwi:2117945}} (bonus wildlife features)

    Thanks again!

    This post was edited by akahn on Sun, Dec 7, 14 at 14:19

  • PRO
    Yardvaark
    9 years ago

    What is the existing multi-trunk tree? Don't know how much quality you're expecting to achieve in this space, but were it mine, I'd make an adjustment to this tree location. It's a major element that, so far, dominates the space and is too close to the house. Doesn't look like it's at it's mature size. Will likely need a maintenance strategy that keeps it in bounds.

    Can you better explain your notion of how "wild" would fit into this small space? What are you trying to achieve with that word? I don't think I'm yet 'feeling' it.

    "...I don't particularly care about showing off the detail trim of my windows..." It's one of the architectural details that measurably ratchets up the charm quotient. Just curious why you view it as insignificant. I'd be wishing the same detail was on front windows.

    If you had a SMALL tree next to, not in front of the window, it would still add a great deal of privacy, especially from the front street. If the window treatment had some combination of sheer, filigree and openness, it would allow privacy and view. There is some combination of window treatment and planting that will provide a good solution, but the ideal is probably not going to be all one or the other.

  • akahn
    Original Author
    9 years ago

    That's a crabapple (wish I knew the details of species, cultivar, etc.), planted by one of the previous owners. (We've been living here for about 1.5 years.) It's annoying to have to prune it to prevent it from touching the house. I guess we didn't realize that moving it was an option. I'd been thinking about planting a tree at the front of the house, maybe this is our candidate! But I assume moving a tree of this size requires professional services... what are we looking at? Hundreds? A thousand? I've never hired a tree person before so I'm curious what the ballpark would be.

    I'd like the garden to be modeled after the native woodlands and early successional meadows of our region. I'm inspired by the work of Doug Tallamy, whose research showed that by planting native species, you attract insect herbivores, some of whom are dietary specialists due to their co-evolution with these plants. The plants provide food for butterflies and other insects and the insects in turn are food for birds and other wildlife. As for garden design, though, I'm still figuring it out. But I like wildflowers like butterfly weed, milkweed, coreopsis, aster, yarrow, phlox, as well as shrubs like maple-leaf viburnum and oakleaf hydrangea. I'm also interested in tall grasses and ground covers, though I still have a lot to learn in terms of which native species I should choose from. Informal, dense, I guess like a cottage garden, but with a native plant palette.

    You're saying it should be possible to provide privacy without obscuring the window details, that sounds good to me! Any thoughts on Northeast-native SMALL trees that would fit the bill? Witch-hazel and serviceberry come to mind.

    Thanks again.

  • PRO
    Yardvaark
    9 years ago

    error...deleted

    {{gwi:2117941}}

    This post was edited by Yardvaark on Tue, Dec 9, 14 at 0:01

  • PRO
    Yardvaark
    9 years ago

    Let's forget that I mentioned the possibility of moving the crab. I suffer from over exuberance based on what I might personally do if I was the one dealing with these issues. In re-appraising it's size, it's going to be beyond your capabilities and not worth paying for. That said, now that we know it's a crab, it's not going to be useful to you along the side of the house because of its ultimate size, which will be quite large. Better to get rid of it now and forget about it. When I said place trees there, I'm not implying size, but form ... a woody plant that is limbed up with a clear trunk, or trunks, below. The available space determines what size the plant should ultimately be, and here I'd say a 10' to 12' height at mature size is about right. A plant I would consider to be about right for that is beauty bush (Kolkwitzia amabilis.) Another possibility would be dwarf burning bush. But many woody plants capable of achieving that size (and little or no more) are generally thought of as "shrubs," but here they are limbed up to expose the trunks. (Beauty bush craves to do that on its own.) Common lilac is another possibility.

    The primary objective of the drawing is to suggest a rough layout. Given that you have "cottage garden" and as an objective, I can't really help with how you might further subdivide the space into a multitude of plants, or what they might be. My offering ends at suggesting mass, size, arrangement and that sort of thing. Keep in mind that the "busier" you make it, the greater the likelihood that the overall artistic statement is weakened and the greater are the chances of increasing the upkeep maintenance. Simpler is easier on all counts. While some think it's more boring, I think it generally has greater visual strength. I'm sure you can find your proper balance. While some plants like butterfly bush are magnets for butterflies, I find that if there are blooming things at all, butterflies will be there. I wouldn't become too obsessed about having plants if they don't fit well. Things that do fit can do the job. Keep in mind that the space is quite small, so you'll probably not be able to fit all of the plants you dream of into the scheme.

    {{gwi:2117942}}

  • catkim
    9 years ago

    Forgive me if I've missed this earlier in your post -- is that your grass this side of the pavement fronting the bed in question? If so, locating a tree on the other side of the drive will be a much better option than trying to mash it up against your house. If we are looking at a side yard, with 10 feet of depth, why not delete 'tree' from your search and substitute 'shrub'. Many a shrub will suit your need far better than any small tree. If it is privacy you need, purchase an interior roller shade.

    The mockups above are somewhat idealized; I've never seen real trees in such tidy jellyfish shapes, but I've a lot to learn still. I do think you could come close to that look with mature Buddleia pruned for shaping, as long as you are content with the infestation of caterpillars that must precede the butterflies.

  • PRO
    Yardvaark
    9 years ago

    "I've never seen real trees in such tidy jellyfish shapes..." As I mention from time to time, to me, a tree is a form, not a size. It just means the plant is limbed up and the trunks are exposed. The continuum between "tree" and "shrub" -- in the way the words are used most most people -- is vast and without clear cut definition between the two. In my world, there's no confusing the two forms. That said, any number of plants that grow to 10 or 12 (or whatever one desires) feet height, make nice little trees when their lower foliage is removed. Some of the native azaleas would be another example. For sure, there is no room for a typical medium or large tree in the space between house and driveway.

  • emmarene9
    9 years ago

    You mention that you are annoyed by having to prune the crab apple.. I think a native Viburnum trained as a tree form would be a nice small tree,but will need to be trimmed from time to time.

    Perhaps you should only have perennials in that area It will look best with groups of the same type of plant together in three or five. An exception would be a striking plant that can beautify all on it's own.Is that a hydrangea on the corner?
    It will be easier if you make a scale view of your property.

  • Embothrium
    9 years ago

    The matching pair of identical trees does not go with either the design of the house or the companion plantings shown in the drawing - nothing else in the scene is geometrically symmetric.

    Nor is their placement effective, it would be much more comfortable and coordinated to have something tall where the roof-line juts up instead of where the row of windows is.

  • akahn
    Original Author
    9 years ago

    Thanks for the responses!

    catkim: No, that grass is my neighbors'. I'm standing in their yard to take the photo. If that was part of my yard I'd have a lot more options, it's true!

    Emmarene, that's what I'm thinking! Either Viburnum nudum or Viburnum prunifolium (which is tree-like further south?) Then a couple of Oakleaf hydrangeas. I don't think there's room for three or five of any of these, but these can provide the foundation and I can fill in the rest of the space with flowers.

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