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Got my tree order in...think some were shipped dead!

Posted by konrad___far_north 3..just outside of E (My Page) on
Wed, May 21, 14 at 0:12

Came in from Green Barn today, have a look and see what you think.
Nectarine
Main trunk is shriveled up, cambium brown.


Follow-Up Postings:

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RE: Got my tree order in...think some were shipped dead!

Picture..


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RE: Got my tree order in...think some were shipped dead!

The trees I lost looked like that first. I agree, they look dead even though small ilimbs are still green. I highly doubt it will make it. Let us know!


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Peach..might not be dead but awful dry on the main trunk, top broken.


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This a plum,..and awful looking graft!..I'd be ashamed selling something like this for $49.00 ! Trunk further up by the label is shriveled up, got them in water now, will see.


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RE: Got my tree order in...think some were shipped dead!

Well, Konrad, you should give them a lesson on grafting! I sure hope you can bring them back to life.


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That's one ugly graft! Looks like they did a cleft graft but split both and slid them together. I hope they do better for you than they appear.


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I do believe they were dug last fall and stored,..thus, some got dehydrated.

Roots looked kind of weird,..on the black side, how do you check for root damage?


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Another awful ...


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  • Posted by murky z8f pnw Portlan (My Page) on
    Wed, May 21, 14 at 4:05

That is ugly, sometimes you wish they'd just sell you the scion wood.


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  • Posted by bencjedi 6 - Central Kentucky (My Page) on
    Wed, May 21, 14 at 8:29

Looks like the apricots I bought from directgardening.com
The first set came like that last spring. Then I used the guarantee to order replacements in the fall and they came just the same. Guess what... also dead! I am invoking the warranty yet again. They need to stop sending me dried-out plants. Never will order anything new from them again.


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I complained..
Telling me B.S.!
KI....plant them and cut back any damaged wood .....plants look like they went thru an oven chamber on the way...they certainly did not leave here like that...ken

Let me know how they come through the Post Canada torture.


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RE: Got my tree order in...think some were shipped dead!

Wow. Those roots look as if they were sitting in a bucket of slime. You can't blame that on the Post Canada. I am surprised that the graft on the Taylor's Gold even took. And their trees are about $36.00USD. The diameter of those trees is so small I would expect to pay no more than $15.00USD.

One think caught my eye, "Apples are one of the most difficult fruit to grow organically." I would think that could be said about peaches more than apples.

I hope you double posted this to the Canadian forum.


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  • Posted by olpea zone 6 KS (My Page) on
    Wed, May 21, 14 at 13:12

Konrad,

I've received hundreds of trees through the mail from a dozen nurseries over the years. I've never received trees as sorry looking as the ones they sent you.

They don't get like that through shipping. Those trees were sent out that way. The people you are dealing with are crooks.

Once I had a nursery ship me some blackberry plants w/ no packing whatever and the plants still didn't look as bad as the photos you posted.

The nectarine is dead. I can't tell from the photo if the peach is dead or not, but it looks bad. Even the scion portion of the plum with the sorry graft looks a little shriveled.

It's as you say, they either let the trees dry out in storage over winter, or dug them in the spring after they were winter killed.


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I would not waste the time and effort to plant them, speaking from too many experiences. I've actually received worse looking stuff from places like Burgess or Autumn Ridge. At least they were cheap attempts, not $49 garbage. Demand a refund.


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Konrad, what a mess. Get your money back. The trees were half dead or dead before they shipped. The black roots, are horrible and I bet they are really slimey!!! Wish I could help. Mrs. G


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RE: Got my tree order in...think some were shipped dead!

Well, at least they agree with you that those trees are no good!

I'm sorry, Konrad. You're going to lose a year of growth and production thanks to them. I hope you at least get a refund. Good luck.


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  • Posted by glenn10 5a New Brunswick (My Page) on
    Wed, May 21, 14 at 21:50

konrad I wish you would have said you were getting stuff from the green barn because I too had problems with them last year and I would have told you to stay away from them!!!!
This is my story.....August 2012 they were having a sale on grape plants for fall shipping, ok so I bought $200.00 worth(paid in full) of different varieties which I made it very clear that I wanted them shipped in September. The end of September came around so I called them and they said oops we misplaced your order....it is on its way! good I said! I waited 3 weeks still nothing! I called them back and they said that there was some sort of mix up and it was too late to ship now as they were out of the plants now! could you wait till spring? I said sure everybody makes mistakes no problem, can I get them shipped in may? they said no problem.
May came and June rolled in so I called them, oops they misplaced my order! at this point I was a little fed up and said look am I getting these plants this year or what? they replied with "we are waiting for more plants from the propagator and we will ship them to you as soon as they come in"
Long story short I finally got the plants in JULY! and they were basically cuttings shoved in dirt with about one months white hair primordial roots and some with NO ROOTS AT ALL!!!
I tried calling them and left them emails with no response. I will never deal with them again!
I thought I was the only one but now I see there are others!
Its too late for me but if I were you I would call them up and demand a full refund.


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  • Posted by glenn10 5a New Brunswick (My Page) on
    Wed, May 21, 14 at 22:17

here is a pick of one of my grape plants with no roots:)(I have several)
I am so mad right now Konrad! I had forgotten about my experience somewhat until today!! They really are crooks sending out products like that and then selling product for which they have no stock and making up excuses! I hope the word gets out on these guys(hopefully makes it to the better business bureau).
On a side not I also purchased a "montreal black" mulberry from them in spring 2012...I wanted an Illinois everbearing but they said this variety was much hardier and pushed it on me so I bought it......I got the plant in timely fashion and the graft looked very poor as well. I planted it and it di leaf out and it grew maybe 4 inches which I thought was ok for a new plant. we had a mild winter that year only getting down to minus 22 on our coldest day. spring rolled around and it had died down to the graft. I called them up and asked if they ever seen this happen and was told it was my fault as I was supposed to protect the graft for winter. I the words of Steve Leroux " If you had watched the videos on youtube you would have known". oh well my bad!
Steve left green barn and started his own company, not really sure what the final title of the company is but I was getting some emails from a company called "Tree Hustler" for a while but I think he may have changed it. I will check my work email tomorrow and confirm.


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RE: Got my tree order in...think some were shipped dead!

glenn10, Make sure you repost this in the Gardening in Canada forum. Also, there is a "Watchdog" that could warn others too.


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RE: Got my tree order in...think some were shipped dead!

Thank you all!
I'm sure, allot of others have been taken! I looked into Garden watchdog before ordering but nothing there!
I know a local guy who bought there before and was very disappointed, too bad that he told me after my order. Apparently, the son worked with Ken but left and started he's own business, called http://www.whiffletreefarmandnursery.ca/ website pretty well identical. Since then, everything went downhill!
The guy who works with Ken is hes step son.
I sure got scr.. ewd!
All in all it was 10 trees, total bill was around $575.00 some pears also, ..got them all in the ground, mostly for nothing,..if any will grow I don't know.

OH...did I mentioned,..the Montreal black Mulberry I ordered, see picture, has no graft! Just crocked, looks like I got a seedling,... I asked, no reply!
Ken probably didn't think I know anything about grafts etc.

I'll mention to Ken that all are planted but I have much doubt
that any will grow and I will contact him in about 3 weeks.

This Mulberry,..the ONLY tree which I have no doubt is going to grow and was freshly dug,....they quickly ran out to the field to FIX my order, ..since storage run out.


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This has to take the prize as worst order ever. I recenlty hired a cement contracter to do some tuck work, it cost a fortune, he didn't do everything he said he would do, but the work he did do is good, but I should have paid 20% of what I did. A special hell awaits these people.


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  • Posted by glenn10 5a New Brunswick (My Page) on
    Thu, May 22, 14 at 6:07

the mulberry I got from them was grafted but only grew that one summer. below the graft was still green but never resprouted and is totally dead this year and for a price of $87.00 including shipping , it was disappointing thinking it was my fault the tree died.
Att the same time I had ordered a pair of seedling mulberry from Henryfields $12.00 for 2 came to total of a little over $20.00 including shipping.....Both trees are still alive and growing well!


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I've heard horror stories about Tyty here in the U.S. It sounds like Green Barn in Canada is giving Tyty some competition for worst nursery. Oh my goodness. Do whatever it takes to put a stop to this thievery! I am just sickened by your losses.


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RE: Got my tree order in...think some were shipped dead!

Since Ken didn't reply on my question on the Mulberry, ...if it
wouldn't be a grafted tree, I then mailed he's former partner, [son] at Whiffletree nursery, just asking if theirs are grafted,..it didn't take a half day and got mail, saying yes, grafted.

I then mailed back and said that I bought one from Green Barn, [with picture] showing without a graft, asked if he thinks that I got a seedling, he hasn't responded, I mailed again,..nothing! I'm thinking now that he decided to better be quiet before he's getting into trouble.

In the mean time I got mail from Ken and he explains...

K.......No grafts..... we do most of our mulberries from summer soft wood cuttings under mist...no graft to weaken hardiness of tree that way....Ken

That would be awesome! Do I have to believe it,...I don't know.

Since the mulberry looks in normal condition,..[not fried as the other trees in the mail as Green Barn says] tells me, that there is prove that it had nothing to do with shipping,...he's just making a bunch of good stories!


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RE: Got my tree order in...think some were shipped dead!

I have mailed Greenbarn and asked for full refund,..except for the Mulberry.
All others are either dried up, have black roots and black trunks!

In the meantime I got mail from Whiffletree about my Mulberry question,..

By looking at the picture you sent it looks like your tree is a seedling.
You will still get good fruit but it may be black, white or even lavender.
I'm going to ask someone with a little more experience their opinion on your
other trees. We'll let you know what we can do.
Thanks!
Robyn

Looks like they still work together. I would think the son would know if dad is doing any summer root cuttings.


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RE: Got my tree order in...think some were shipped dead!

Those are some abused trees. Nothing is more important than to have a healthy young tree at least to start with. I have received a few trees from mail orders, nothing ever looked that bad.

This day and age of the internet word gets around quickly about the places that do not care about quality or customers. Maybe they should try for honesty and rename themselves The black root barn.

Hopefully they give you a quick refund.

This post was edited by Grafty on Fri, May 23, 14 at 14:53


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And black and damaged stem,..how awful!


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RE: Got my tree order in...think some were shipped dead!

Black and dead...


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RE: Got my tree order in...think some were shipped dead!

The 10 trees are about 3 1/2 weeks in the ground and 50% have no sign of live,...have mailed pictures and said,...

Hello Ken,
these pictures from yesterday,..
It's now over 3 weeks and I'm showing you the trees what have no sign of life, the rest, for the most part are pushing,
some have a few leaves, overall, very disappointing. [Only Mulberry looks healthy]

Please, I would like full refund on these 5 trees.

Best Regards,

Konrad

He's still blaming Post Canada..

Konrad...yes the photos do not look good but the cambium tissue still looks alive on most.....suggest you cut back to a few inches above graft to see if you can get the roots to push some new secondary buds. The trees seemed to have been mishandled beyond normal shipping stresses as they all left our farm well packed and alive. You can check with Post Canada to see why they took so long to deliver your order and make a claim against them. We do not give refunds but will replace any dead trees this fall or next spring.

Ken

My reply,..

So, you're still trying to blame post again, first they oven fried it and now it took too long. NO, it didn't, it came at normal time frame, (regular shipping).
They should have been shipped allot sooner! (Some were dry and dead at shipping, only Mulberry looked good)

If oven fried or blaming post Canada, why Mulberry looked in
perfect shape?

I will cut them, but fact is, these
trees are way beyond normal
and even if something will shoot
out, these new "late growth" will
most likely kill the tree in winter
since no proper hardening off!


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RE: Got my tree order in...think some were shipped dead!

Wow... this is horrible! I've never seen such sorry excuses for plants.... I agree, they should change their name from Green Barn to Black Root Barn, because I surely don't see any green there...


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I'll post all 5 trees,..seeing is believing.

1


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RE: Got my tree order in...think some were shipped dead!

Tree 2


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Tree 3, that large stalk is just a branch for marker and also should fool deer to eat new tree.


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Tree 4


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Tree 5


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Konrad, I won't be ordering from that nursery, ever! Mrs. G


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RE: Got my tree order in...think some were shipped dead!

I'm sorry to hear about your troubles Konrad. I'll keep this in mind when ordering in the future.


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RE: Got my tree order in...think some were shipped dead!

  • Posted by glenn10 5a New Brunswick (My Page) on
    Tue, Jun 17, 14 at 17:30

I think garden web should start a page with a list of nurseries so everyone can post our various experiences good or bad . In time there would be some good reference material for everyone to scrutinize so stuff like this doesn't happen.
Konrad,I think this whole thread should get retitled as "I got ripped off by the Green Barn Nursery". That way anyone internet searching them may happen upon this thread and will be made aware of the potential disappointment.


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RE: Got my tree order in...think some were shipped dead!

Thank you all!
Glenn, good point!
How about the garden watchdog,..is it effective?
I'll have to wait until I got my trees replaced,..if ever?

Didn't you Glenn, thought about to report in the watchdog?


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RE: Got my tree order in...think some were shipped dead!

Glenn,

Gardenweb does have a forum for ratings but it doesn't seem to get much use. I have found Garden Watchdog to be more useful in this one instance.

Here is a link that might be useful: Rate & Review Vendors


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RE: Got my tree order in...think some were shipped dead!

Konrad I use Dave Wilson's Garden Watch Dog. I post on it with good and bad reviews. It has helped me a great deal. Mrs. G


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  • Posted by glenn10 5a New Brunswick (My Page) on
    Wed, Jun 18, 14 at 11:40

I think I will post on daves garden watchdog and the garden web link milehigh girl provided. just did a web search for green barn review and this horror story came up at the top of the search LOL!
I cant seem to paste the link just do a search on beware green barn nursery and there is a really good thread on the wine making talk forum. It is a story very similar to mine and Konrads.


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RE: Got my tree order in...think some were shipped dead!

Looks to me some hobbyists on a lot of those are selling junk on eBay and Amazon. $50 is what I'm paying a real nursery near Mammoth Cave for a 6' pecan tree.

I never tried to buy any seeds or plants on eBay and have since started saying no to Amazon. There are all types selling old seed and un-rooted cuttings on Amazon. I use a google search and use a real established 24/7 nursery that guarantees.


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RE: Got my tree order in...think some were shipped dead!

Nobody bought those on EBay. Plus Amazon has some excellent nurseries, like Proven Winners. Nice Ornamental plants. I just got a zone 6 hardy "Blue Satin" Hibiscus (rose of Sharon), but really off the proven winners web site, nice! What a cool color and hardy in my zone! I recently discovered a lot of small but excellent nurseries. It's so cool. I want hundreds of plants, but I owe thousands already on my CC, oh well!

And some excellent sellers on EBay too, sure some bad ones, but you know they have feedback there that is very useful. I bought seeds from a French organic farm off EBay, excellent product. Also from a nursery in the UK. I love EBay! Some excellent Kentucky tomato heirlooms were bought on EBay, from Blue Ribbon Tomatoes, such cool, well documented history, like Aunt Lou's Underground Railroad It is rare to find such an historically significant vegetable treasure
with this kind of provenence. A black man from Kentucky, traveling through
the Underground Railroad, arrived in Ripley, Ohio, with the seeds of this
tomato variety. Ripley, Ohio, where many slaves crossed the river to
freedom, is home to Rankin House, a well known stop on the Underground
Railroad and now a museum. The black man later shared seeds with a woman named Lou, who later shared seeds with her great nephew Francis Parker, who lives in Sardinia, Ohio. Sixty years later Francis shared seeds with Wilfred Ellis, owner of Ellis' Feed Mill. Wilfred shared them with Susan Barber, who shared them with Kentucky tomato guru Gary Millwood and me.
This tomato is a 4- 12 ounce, round, dark pink, canner or cooking tomato, juicy and seedy with thin skin and an acidic flavor, some having green shoulders. Sparse regular leaf foliage. The seeds are irregular in size and shape. This is not a "New and Improved" variety but it has performed better each year over the last several growing seasons I've had it. In 2011 it grew well and produced well even in standing water through the spring.

Some excellent pepper seeds too, some super rare. Seed For Africa has some excellent pepper seeds. Hell Hot Peppers offers seeds nobody else has, awesome stuff on EBay! EBay rocks! My tzimbalo plant from an EBay seller is awesome! Grew from seeds.


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I've ordered seeds from a few sellers on Ebay and have been very satisfied. They were mostly pepper seeds.

Does Windmill Point Farm have anything to do with Green Barn? I found a link on their website for Green Barn Nursery (aka Green Barn Farm?)

http://www.windmillpointfarm.ca/page.home/language_id.1

Here is a link that might be useful: Beware Greenbarnnursery.ca

This post was edited by milehighgirl on Wed, Jun 18, 14 at 14:11


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  • Posted by glenn10 5a New Brunswick (My Page) on
    Wed, Jun 18, 14 at 17:59

Yup ,I would say they are one in the same milehigh. That is a picture of ken holding the cantaloupes who is the owner of green barn....I guess windmillpointfarm is now on my black list.


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  • Posted by olpea zone 6 KS (My Page) on
    Thu, Jun 19, 14 at 17:06

Don't have anything more to add to this thread other than thanks Milehigh for posting the link of Windmillpointfarm (aka Green Barn Nursery). Always good to know what a crook looks like. I've met crooks before, but always good to be reminded.


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  • Posted by glenn10 5a New Brunswick (My Page) on
    Thu, Jun 19, 14 at 18:46

I posted a negative rating for windmill point farm on daves garden watchdog as there was no listing for green barn nursery on there.


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RE: Got my tree order in...think some were shipped dead!

Thank you all!
Good boy!..Glenn


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RE: Got my tree order in...think some were shipped dead!

Glenn,

If you scroll to the very bottom of the WD page it has a link for "Add a new company to the list".

Also, their maze of ownership, "Who owns what?" should be updated to show the two companies are related.

It seems that the WD links are not working right now. I hope the problem is rectified soon.

This post was edited by milehighgirl on Fri, Jun 20, 14 at 13:05


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RE: Got my tree order in...think some were shipped dead!

To start I have no affiliation with either company below other than having bought from both. I know some of this information simply because I had been ordering from both over the past 2 years so I got bits and pieces of the story.

Greenbarn nursery was in bankruptcy protection in 2013, it seems that they have exited this year.

Prior to the bankruptcy a Mennonite family in Elora Ontario started an affiliation/franchise (Greenbarn Elora). Following the bankruptcy my understanding is that they are no longer formally affiliated and thus changed their name to Whiffletree farm and nursery. This explains why their website and stock closely resembles Greenbarn. My understanding is that they are completely different entities at this point with their own rootstock and plantings. To further complicate matters Steve Leroux is the stepson of Ken of Greenbarn and he left Greenbarn to start his own orchard consulting business as well as to assist in the running of Whiffletree which is why you can see him in the photos and videos of Greenbarn but you talk to him on the phone when you call Whiffletree.

I have bought plants from Greenbarn in the past. I no longer order from them.

I currently order all my plants from either Whiffletree or Pepiniere Ancestrale. With these 2 companies I have had no issues with tree quality (currently 100% survival), communication or payments. For people looking for cold hardy fruit trees and bushes I can strongly recommend both. They have different varieties and availability so both complement each other. Pepiniere Ancestrale is probably 0.5 to 1 zone colder than Whiffletree but so far I have not had deaths down to -35 but we had a good snow cover last winter. Follow my post below for updates as the years go by.

You can see a more detailed listing of what I have planted at:
http://forums2.gardenweb.com/forums/load/fruit/msg092211376486.html?5

Again, this is not to promote any particular business, just to state my personal experience.


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RE: Got my tree order in...think some were shipped dead!

Hey Konrad,

BTW, did any of those trees survive?

I bought a bare root tree this spring and forgot it in my garage and when I finally found it it looked like kindling wood. It was a Mirabelle.

I soaked in in room temp water for 24 hours and put it in the ground. Man, did it look like a sorry sight.

SIX weeks later at the end of May I saw the tiniest green growth about 3 inches above the graft union. Then another and a third.

Today these shoots are 40 inches tall and next spring I will have to decide which will become the new main trunk.

Mike

This post was edited by mes111 on Thu, Sep 11, 14 at 16:22


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RE: Got my tree order in...think some were shipped dead!

Out of the 10 trees, 3 or 4 showed no sign of live until now, only the mulberry grew well, the rest,..grew some but below normal rate. Overall, a horrible experience with my first and last order from Greenbarn. Ken said, he will replace the one's dead, not sure if I should believe this, come spring, will find out!

Steve from Whiffletree has a new website, [looked the same as Greenbarn before] owned by Mennonites, he contacted me the other day,..knows what happened and he said that I should let him know which trees didn't make it and that he will see what he can do, I find this very nice from him, since he had nothing to with my order.
Steve has his own website...below

Just looked into Green barn nursery, also has new website, it's called Green Barn Farm. Guess, that's what you got to do, declare bankruptcy when scamming customers for too long.

Here is a link that might be useful: Tree Hustler


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  • Posted by glenn10 5a New Brunswick (My Page) on
    Thu, Sep 11, 14 at 22:15

It's funny how tree hustlers website look almost identical to the former green barn website. Both sites share many of the same photos and plant listings although you don't see many of the "Taylor" specific varieties on Steve's site and Steves pricing is a bit cheaper.
It is nice to see some here have had good experiences with them.
If anyone one wishes to give them a chance and order from them go ahead but take everyone's feedback into consideration before hitting the check out button. They very well could have changed and be great to deal with now and in the future. I will not be testing my theory anytime soon.
Konrad can you post some pics of the survivors or are they under too much snow? My good friend from Calgary sent me some pictures of his place today which makes me glad I moved back to the east coast HAHAHA!

Glenn


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RE: Got my tree order in...think some were shipped dead!

LOL Glenn!

Remember,...Edmonton is not Calgary!

Just took some pictures and have sent the list which are dead or look bad.

So far,..out of the 10 trees, 4 never had a sign of live, even the root stock never showed anything at this time.

The two worst alive,... this one I had to cut down, only one branch grew a little.


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RE: Got my tree order in...think some were shipped dead!

This one had little growth.


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RE: Got my tree order in...think some were shipped dead!

Only Mulberry has good growth branches,.. [the yellow leaves], we had frost.


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  • Posted by glenn10 5a New Brunswick (My Page) on
    Fri, Oct 3, 14 at 19:04

The leaves on the mulberry have some very interesting deep lobes almost looks like a maple leaf. Hopefully it pulls through your ultra cold winters and we get to see some fruit. Do you plan on winter protection of some sort?
Glenn


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RE: Got my tree order in...think some were shipped dead!

You see the other mulberry beside, [green]....about 10 years old and freezes back every year,..if the new one is any hardier then I could graft to it and see,..yes, I'll put some burlap and or row cover around. I really don't expect fruit,..if it does, you'll hear about.
A very good sign in this new mulberry, it got the message after the first frost,...go into dormancy!


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RE: Got my tree order in...think some were shipped dead!

Oct. 27 I've sent Ken the 4 dead tree pictures and ask for replacement and when I could expect them next spring.
No answer.
Looks like I'm getting the cold shoulder treatment.


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RE: Got my tree order in...think some were shipped dead!

I have inquired about a cherry plum last year, ...just a little later after I did the order, he was sold out, then I said to hold one for next spring, he said will do, [me not knowing what crap I'll get].

Got an answer the other day, said that he will ship trees with my new order. LOL ... what a thief!

I said, wish I could but common sense tells me to grow the dead replacements trees first.


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  • Posted by glenn10 5a New Brunswick (My Page) on
    Tue, Nov 18, 14 at 19:32

Konrad , how is ken handling the shipping costs for your replacement trees? Or are you paying shipping for the whole order considering you are getting some new plants?

Glenn


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RE: Got my tree order in...think some were shipped dead!

I really don't know, I'm NOT getting new plants.


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