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New to fruit, what steps did I miss?
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Posted by last1earth z6NJ (My Page) on Sat, May 9, 09 at 15:13
| Last year, spring, I planted different fruit trees. This year my nectarine produced little balls (fruit?), --do I have to cut them off? --Can I at least keep 4 of them to try?? My apple also has 3 balls of fuit, --can I keep those 3 to try to grow out?
I did not spray anything on these trees since I got them, what should I do, copper? --Can I do that now? --Are there any natural homemade ways to keep the trees healthy and a little pest/disease free?
I have also never pruned them, but their growth is slow as compared to pictures other gardenwebbers put up. I am really really really scared to do it. They grow so slow anyway and then I am supposed to cut them furthur, (I am like the opposite of a green thumb).
Okay so any info would be appreciated, thank you. |
Follow-Up Postings:
RE: New to fruit, what steps did I miss?
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| I'm getting great results by planting Elaeagnus under trees, it fixes Nitrogen in the ground. the trees with Elaeagnus under always look in optimal condition. You can get dwarf Elaeagnus or plants you'll need to prune. They'll cross polinate and produce their own fruit as an undercrop while keeping your trees happy, worth getting the better fruiting varieties. As for your trees, they sound fine as they are to me and I'd also keep the fruit, it's hardly a tree killing amount you've got this year. |
RE: New to fruit, what steps did I miss?
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Hi Last1earth-
Were these small bare root trees last year? Or were they more established trees (such as in a 5 gallon pot from your local nursery)? That answer depends on whether you can keep an apple or two. (can't comment on nectarines) If the apple tree is really young, it may drop those small fruits during June drop anyway. Put some pics up on your pages (I looked by didn’t see any apples), and that would help too. As for copper, what type of copper are you spraying, and for what? For me, I spray Kocide3000 copper during the early and late dormant season to help prevent scab and fire blight. I do not believe I can spray my copper once the leaves get going. Really, it's best to do what the label says here. The question is, what type of diseases are you trying to prevent? If your answer is "I'm not sure, I'm just trying to prevent any diseases", then the answer is difficult. Really, you don’t want to spray for things that aren’t going to affect you anyway. Since your trees are young and really won’t be bearing much fruit yet, it’s often useful to not spray anything the first year, and instead carefully observe. You want to figure out exactly what diseases and insects are attacking your trees so you can come up with a comprehensive plan for the following year. Another route would be to talk to others in your area that are growing fruit, or perhaps you can talk to your local extension office. If I were to guess at what diseases you’d be facing, the first question is… What variety of apple do you have? Certain varieties are more susceptible to certain diseases like Apple Scab, Cedar Apple Rust, Fire blight, etc. Some trees like Liberty, Freedom, and William’s Pride are very resistant to the major diseases and may need almost no spraying. If you were really attempting to be organic, then you may want to start anew with a disease resistant tree. For me, my non-disease-resistant trees get devastated by Cedar Apple Rust, and I suspect that would be a big problem for you in NJ as well. I don’t believe there is an organic solution here. Start searching and learning about Immunox. For scab, Kocide copper is considered to be organic in most circles. But, from reading other postings here on this forum, there are other copper products that are bordering on completely useless. Again, let us know exactly what you are using. While we’re talking about it, stay away from the common all-in-one fruit tree sprays like Bonide Fruit Tree spray. They often say they target diseases that they couldn’t possibly target (based on their ingredients), they add other ingredients that you don’t want/need, and the ingredients that you would want are often not in sufficient quantities. A spray of dormant oil during the dormant season will help against some (scale, etc) insects. But, a nice solution for most insects is bagging your apples. Basically, take a cheap Walmart ziplock bag, cut above the ziplock off, cut the bottom two corners off for drainage, and seal this around your very young apples. Search this forum for "Bagging apples", and you’ll get a lot of info. Jellyman is a great source of info here. There are some great videos on YouTube these days for pruning fruit trees. Because the trees are so young, it may not be completely necessary yet, but you will need to do it at some point. Best to start learning now! This is only my 4th season with my apples, so take my advice with a grain of salt. Get back to us on the all the questions I’ve listed above, and I’m sure others will be able to help you out more. Good luck,
-Glenn |
RE: New to fruit, what steps did I miss?
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| Hi, thanks for the response. --They were bare root last spring when I got them.
--I just keep reading on forums where people spray copper so I thought I should too?
--answer is "I'm not sure, I'm just trying to prevent any diseases".
--I have Williams Pride, and Honeycrisp apples. Harko nectarine and Charlotte peach.
NEW DEVELOPMENT: Dad asked me to keep the nectarines (about 20 little fruits), since he is getting older and would like to try some from his own yard while he has the chance. So thinking about keeping them for him.
--I'll post some pics tommorow, besides Elaeagnus, what else is good to plant near fruit? Herbs?
--I'll also check into youtube (good idea!)
Thanks guys |
RE: New to fruit, what steps did I miss?
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Last1Earth-
I’m going to let the experts chime in on whether or not you can keep an apple or two on that little tree (if it doesn’t drop them). I believe the wise experts here will say that you need to remove the apples during their 2nd growing season so that the tree puts its energy into getting stronger. That said, I may try leaving 1 or two apples on my 2nd year bare root tree. (If anything, I’ll simply learn from it). Good. Now we know about your varieties. Since I’m growing both, below are my notes on the disease issues with both. The good news is that the Williams Pride is resistant to just about everything. Where as my other trees are hit by CAR really hard (even the Liberty gets a little), the Williams Pride shows no signs of CAR (zero, zilch, nada), with no spraying. Amazing. The bad news is that the HoneyCrisp is susceptible to just about everything, and this is the one you’re going to need a spraying plan for. I would suspect (though I don’t know for sure), that CAR, scab, Fire Blight, & Powdery Mildew would all be issues for you in NJ. Harvestman is closer, so perhaps he can chime in if I’m wrong. For Scab, I would be investigate spraying Kocide 3000 after the trees go dormant (in November or so?), and then again just as the trees wake up at the bud break (green tip) stage at a rate of 1-2 tbsp/gallon. You can search for more info here by ScottFSmith and Jellyman. When you spray the Kocide, you also want to mix in a "sticker". Dormant oil works for this purpose and also smothers scaling insects. (The Williams Pride wouldn’t mind getting some dormant oil as well). Hopefully this will ward off the fire blight too. For CAR, you want to want to look at spraying Immunox. Search for posts by Harvestman and Michael357. Harvestman needs to spray Immunox (also goes by Nova, Eagle, Rally, etc) just twice (once petal fall and 10-14 day later application) to get full control. Because I’m new to it, I’m spraying it 3 times this year. Unfortunately, unlike the scab spray above, has no chance of being considered organic. But, without it, many of my trees suffer badly. You really need to do you own research here to back up everything I’m saying. I have not been doing this very long and would want you to make any mistakes. Make sure you read, understand, and obey the label! Again do your own research and read the label! Hopefully someone will speak up if I’ve said anything incorrect here.
I think you are best to keep all plants away from your fruit trees. Anything growing near the tree will force the tree to compete for nutrients, etc.
Good luck!
-Glenn
Williams Pride - Highly rated for flavor. It ripens in early August and is the best of the early apples. The large red fruit has a sweet rich spicy flavor. The tree is very productive with strong well angled branches. Immune to apple scab and resistant to mildew, cedar rust and fireblight. It is an early season bloomer with unusually long lasting blossoms.
Bloom: - Midseason
USDA Zone: 4,5,6,7,8,9
Pollination: Self-fertile (still need to confirm)
Fruit Storage: Doesn’t store well
Mature Size: Moderate to large
Ripens: -9 weeks before RD (end of July or so?) another site says 7-8 weeks before RD
Uses: - Best used for dessert
CAR : Resistant, Very Resistant
Scab : Very Resistant
Powdery Mildew: Resistant
Fire Blight : Resistant Honeycrisp - Rated superior to McIntosh and Delicious for fresh eating in taste tests. Skin is mottled red over yellow with very crisp flesh. Good keeper up to 5 months.
Bloom: Midseason
USDA Zone: 3,4,5,6,7,8,9,10
Fruit Storage: Excellent
Mature Size: Medium
Ripens: -2.5 weeks before RD (beginning of Sept or so?)
Uses: Fresh eating/ dessert
CAR : Suseptible
Scab : Suseptible, Moderately Resistant
Powdery Mildew: Suseptible
Fire Blight : Suseptible, Resistant
Flavor Type: Sweet Note: The above info is compiled from multiple sources, which is why you see "Suseptible, Resistant". Also, approximate ripening times are for RI. |
RE: New to fruit, what steps did I miss?
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besides Elaeagnus, what else is good to plant near fruit? Herbs?
I remembered this clip where crimson clover is being used under old fruit trees to fix nitrogen. Skip to the 23:00 mark. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZOaPFt_ajvU
Searching Youtube for "Nitrogen fixation" gives plenty of hits that look relevant and Wikipedia has a list of nitrogen fixing plants. As I'm growing Elaeagnus for fruit anyway, I tried to place them well but clover might be your best bet, you could also try growing Legumes up taller trees, forest garden style. Seeing the effect on my trees, these companion plants will also make your young trees flower and fruit a lot next year so you may want to prune most of those too or not bother at all with this. It certainly never hurt mine though. |
Here is a link that might be useful: Wikipedia list
RE: New to fruit, what steps did I miss?
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| Just wanted to thank you for all the information and help, it taught me some new stuff. Thanks for taking the time! :) |
RE: New to fruit, what steps did I miss?
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| Immunox would probably eliminate the need for Kocide. It is just as affective for scab as CAR. The 2 spray schedule generally works if done at petal fall and 10 to 14 days later- just when you most need to be spraying for insects. Fireblight probably won't be one of your common problems where you live. There's almost no point in worrying about it and when it strikes you will just cut out affected areas. If your trees aren't showing vigorous growth the second season, something is very wrong with your soil. Even the first year trees should double in size. The soil should be soft and moist, not hard or soppy wet. That's for starters. Also, there is no point trying to get fruit from runted trees. |
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