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Stark Bro's Dwarf Intrepid Peach

Posted by NJgrower 6 (My Page) on
Wed, Jul 23, 14 at 23:42

Hello,
I bought a dwarf intrepid peach tree from stark bros. I found an old post saying that stark bros rootstock is Lovell for standard and Stark's redleaf for dwarfs.
Below is a link which indicates the dwarfing effect isn't substantial:
http://extension.umass.edu/fruitadvisor/sites/fruitadvisor/files/newsletters/fruit-notes/pdf/FruitNotes-vol62-no2-5_0.pdf
I was planning on planting the tree in a 10'X10' area in my front yard 5'5'' from the curb. I was wondering if my redleaf rootstock won't be appropriate since it's dwarfing effect isn't that strong.
Additionally, any reviews on the quality of fruit of the intrepid peach would be handy!
Thank you!!


Follow-Up Postings:

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RE: Stark Bro's Dwarf Intrepid Peach

You can keep any peach within that spacing with appropriate pruning. You live in peach country and can probably grow any peach that does well in the east coast. I don't know Intrepid but it may not be the best peach for your location as it's probably a selection whose key merit is bud hardiness. I'm sure someone else can do a better job of illuminating you on this.


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RE: Stark Bro's Dwarf Intrepid Peach

Thanks for the response! I picked intrepid mostly because it has excellent bacterial spot resistance and its winter hardiness doesn't hurt. If anyone could recommend a potentially better peach for zone 6 NJ that would be excellent! My only concern was that hardy peaches sometimes aren't as tasty, but from what I read elsewhere intrepid does apparently taste good.


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RE: Stark Bro's Dwarf Intrepid Peach

Harvestman has you on the right track. Pruners are great for drawfing a tree. Don't prune willy nilly though. read up on it alot before the time comes. In my area the tree that is pushed for winter hardiness is Relaince. But isn't a very good peach and only half a hair better on hardiness. Rutgers has a great peach program so get one they rate high for flavor.

Don't buy it in a pot now, get bare root in the spring. you'll be ahead come fruiting time


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RE: Stark Bro's Dwarf Intrepid Peach

I ordered a bare root dwarf intrepid from stark bros already to be deliver early November. I've been happy with their products so far so if I change my mind I will likely pick another variety they offer. I'll take a look at Rutgers and see what they suggest.


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RE: Stark Bro's Dwarf Intrepid Peach

A standard July Elberta I got from them is on some type redleaf. I'm not sure if it is because July Elberta is more vigorous than other varieties or they don't consider redleaf to be that much different than other peach seedling rootstocks.


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RE: Stark Bro's Dwarf Intrepid Peach

nyRockFarmer,
How disease resistant is your July Elberta? Is the fruit of high quality?


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RE: Stark Bro's Dwarf Intrepid Peach

I don't know, I just got it this spring. It was the first time I ordered a bare root tree and first order at Stark's. In the past I have only bought locally grown trees, but they have never offered an early peach. Stark Bro's acquired Miller Nursery, which is why I tried them with a small order.

I have a Hale Haven on Lovell and its hardiness has surprised me. It is doing well in compact clay and it survived 3 nights of -18F without winter injury (except fruit buds). The only problem I had with the tree was leaf curl about 4 years ago. I sprayed it with copper in the fall. Aside from that one time, I've never sprayed the tree for anything. I usually get peaches that look like they came from the market. My only disappointment is that the typical yield is less than expected (1-2 bushel). It has mild flavor, which I personally like. It's an old variety. I haven't seen it offered much. I guess that means it is obsolete.


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RE: Stark Bro's Dwarf Intrepid Peach

A good variety to start with for your area is Jonboy, unless you are in a low, very frosty spot. Big, very juicy, rich, deep orange flesh and a fairly long picking season all favor it.


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RE: Stark Bro's Dwarf Intrepid Peach

  • Posted by Drew51 5b/6a SE MI (My Page) on
    Thu, Jul 24, 14 at 21:54

Michigan is the 6th largest producer of peaches and our warmest zone is 6a. Peaches are hardy enough for zone 6. I would check out Scott's report on peach cultivars.
No rootstock will dwarf a peach much. Stark brothers used to say semi-dwarf. I guess if only 10 feet it is somewhat dwarfed. As stated though you can prune to keep small. And my guess is with no pruning this so called dwarf would get big. Not to be confused with genetic dwarfs. Those do stay fairly small.

Here is a link that might be useful: Peach report


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RE: Stark Bro's Dwarf Intrepid Peach

Although I'm in a different zone, and in the heart of peach country, I would think that your planned spacing is much too conservative, even on dwarfing rootstock. Here, peach trees are grown on 18' centers, and that's after pruning.


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RE: Stark Bro's Dwarf Intrepid Peach

  • Posted by Drew51 5b/6a SE MI (My Page) on
    Fri, Jul 25, 14 at 9:14

Mine are on 8 foot centers, half on dwarfing half on standard, I will never let them get taller than 8 feet. Rootstock doesn't matter at all. Scott whom I linked his review has them on 5 foot centers.
I agree that 5 feet is a little close, I expect mine to be near 8 foot wide too, although 5 feet can be done. Just prune it away. Scott has managed that for years and years.

This post was edited by Drew51 on Fri, Jul 25, 14 at 9:19


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RE: Stark Bro's Dwarf Intrepid Peach

My biggest concern with confined spaces would be sun light. Small spaces are often confined by structures that could shade the area too much. In NJgrowers's case, the space is near a street curb so it is probably okay.


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RE: Stark Bro's Dwarf Intrepid Peach

Hey all,
The location is near a street curb and gets baked by sun. My flower bed is in the same area and I grow cosmos, zinnias, an assortment of asclepias, and sunflowers there. My russian mammoth sunflowers are 12' tall and are developing flowers that will be 1'-2' in diameter. I plan on prunning the peach tree with a pyramidal shape with branches cut out of the middle to allow for air circulation and sunlight.
I don't want the peach tree to get too big because it will be near the road -- I also could never eat that many peaches off a large tree! I would like the peach trees to be 8'-10' in height.
Since I haven't gotten much love from the intrepid peach I am looking at Starkbros website and seeing if any other peaches are good.
While I wouldn't consider myself a great gardener, the other edibles I have on my property are elderberries, blueberries, and wild raspberries. This begs the question on how I manage deer, raccoons, and squirrels concerning peach trees. I don't mind putting up a 5' tall fence around a sapling, but it would be an eye-sore to have it up year-round. I also saw some trees with sheet metal around the trunks, I suppose that would need to be refitted yearly. Any suggestions on keeping pests away?


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RE: Stark Bro's Dwarf Intrepid Peach

I looked at starkbros and they have listed the Catherina peach which sounded good. Anyone know about this peach. It would be cool to plant because it was bred in my home state! I'm going to have to check its disease resistance.


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RE: Stark Bro's Dwarf Intrepid Peach

"A good variety to start with for your area is Jonboy" - harvestman

Thanks for the recommendation. I will consider if I expand on the peaches in the future.


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RE: Stark Bro's Dwarf Intrepid Peach

"I don't want the peach tree to get too big because it will be near the road -- I also could never eat that many peaches off a large tree! I would like the peach trees to be 8'-10' in height. " - NJgrower

Sounds like you will have to manage the size through pruning regardless of the rootstock.

"I also saw some trees with sheet metal around the trunks, I suppose that would need to be refitted yearly." -NJgrower

Squirrel management could be trickier since it is near a public right of way. The metal tree guards might be the only practical solution. However, they won't work if there is something nearby that they can climb and jump to peach tree. Squirrels are good problem solvers, so you need to think through what you would do when faced with the same situation.

"Since I haven't gotten much love from the intrepid peach I am looking at Starkbros website and seeing if any other peaches are good." - NJgrower

I'm not sure anyone was specifically discouraging your choice.


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RE: Stark Bro's Dwarf Intrepid Peach

  • Posted by Drew51 5b/6a SE MI (My Page) on
    Fri, Jul 25, 14 at 14:19

Looking at Stark Brothers I don't see anything I would want, but that's me. I'm interested in Winblo, O'Henry, Old Mixon Free, Indian Free, Indian Cling, and many others. The above for sure I have PF Lucky 13 and Indian Free. Also have nectarines Arctic Glo, and Spice Zee Nectaplum. I would like to get Arctic Jay. Some want super sweet ones, but I'm not really that interested. Jay and Mixon are pretty sweet, and fill that niche.
As far as your choices, I have no way to judge. So many cultivars exist, it's unreal.


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RE: Stark Bro's Dwarf Intrepid Peach

Drew, but are you speaking from the experience of growing them? Many peaches that are grown commercially in Jersey are excellent, with the advantage of being resistant to bacterial leaf spot and adequately winter hardy to bear consistently. Many were bred in the state by Rutgers.

I've been helping people enjoy fruit from their own orchards in the northeast for 25 years, every working day, and having reliable croppers for your specific region has many advantages. I believe it is best to have a few delicious and reliable varieties before starting to experiment with trying to get the most amazing fruit possible.

When you first experience fruit from your own trees it will probably completely astonish you by how good it is even if you will one day top it with some other more unusual and difficult to grow variety.

I've been growing fruit here from before the time I started helping others, and I just planted my first O'Henry peach this year. Planted Winblo last (not that it is a CA peach, but I don't know about its reliability and other liabilities).

If I was ordering trees for NJ, I'd wait for Adams to start taking orders instead of getting my peach trees from Starks. They really don't have the best varieties for east coast growers, although some of them will work well.


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RE: Stark Bro's Dwarf Intrepid Peach

Update: I canceled my Intrepid peach order and will look at Adams when they start offering. I like the idea of buying Rutgers peaches since I go to graduate school there.

Concerning Starkbros: I was about to order the fingerlakes super hardy peach but couldn't find enough on its disease resistance profile to pull the trigger. Venture peach had a good disease profile, but from what I read online it is a canning peach which seems to indicate more commercial application than fresh eating.

Thanks for the input!


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RE: Stark Bro's Dwarf Intrepid Peach

NJ,

I attached Scott Smith's 2013 Peach Report for you to check it out.

Scott is in MD, also an East Coast grower. He is a great contributor here. You may like a lot what's in his report.

Here is a link that might be useful: Scott's 2013 peach report


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RE: Stark Bro's Dwarf Intrepid Peach

I think Scott's list is most useful after you already have your first 3 or 4 varieties and want to branch out.


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RE: Stark Bro's Dwarf Intrepid Peach

H-man,

I have to disagree with you on this. Scott's statement " I have lots of unusual heirloom and modern peaches growing, with the goal of finding the very best taste with good growability." makes his report very helpful and user-friendly.

His area is more humid and more difficult to grow peaches than mine. A variety that grows well (less trouble) in his area, is likely to grow well in mine, even if I was a new peach grower.


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RE: Stark Bro's Dwarf Intrepid Peach

Scott is a huge asset to this forum and so is his list, but he has little interest in growing varieties that have a more common taste although they are not at all common to most people in the sense of tasting them at peak quality ripened on the tree.

He doesn't review varieties like Jersey Queen or Loring which are luscious and wonderful varieties but are grown by commercial growers in Jersey and elsewhere. In fact he doesn't review a single variety that has been grown widely in Jersey as a commercial variety in recent years, although TangO's is getting there.

I just believe, and Scott and I may disagree on this, that commercial success of a variety often means that it reliably produces crops of high quality peaches, although the two I mentioned can be a problem in frosty areas.

I also think his testing methods are somewhat limited because it is about how they perform at a single site and in the context of growing using Surround and organically approved materials, using synthetic chemicals only as a last resort. Also, any variety on a part of his property likely to be hit by squirrels may not even get the chance to be evaluated.

All that said, I have benefited greatly from Scott's input and actual grafting wood. A couple of his varieties are now a part of my collection, but the beginner might arguably be better off starting with varieties known to be resistant to bacterial spot and peach leaf curl and known to be adaptable to a range of sites. These trees can later be used to graft on varieties of Scott's suggestion- that is the only way you can get many of them anyway.

Even most experienced growers aren't interested in growing 300 varieties of fruit, (I'm not). If you have 100 varieties of peaches it doesn't matter if a variety has a very short picking window (others are following or overlapping) or if it only crops 2 out of 3 years- or if it is available from a convenient source. The most important thing could become, how different it tastes from the other 99.


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RE: Stark Bro's Dwarf Intrepid Peach

I agree with Hman. Scott provides a wealth of information,but it is very site specific. The biggest mistake that most people make is trying to grow varieties, based solely on someone's recommendation, without first checking to see, if that variety is recommended for his/her area, and if he/she has the same taste as the recommender. They spend many years and money and a lot wasted effort in growing varieties that were doomed from the start. Believe me, I've been there and done that.


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RE: Stark Bro's Dwarf Intrepid Peach

  • Posted by Drew51 5b/6a SE MI (My Page) on
    Wed, Jul 30, 14 at 10:21

Well one should first grow cultivars known to perform well in your area. After that one should look at one's that should work in your area, but are unproven. After you have mastered those categories, you can go for experimental types. I never grew peaches, but have 40 years of growing experience. So I did all three at once.
It's working great for me. I have some trees that were developed in Michigan, so are my staple production trees. I have some developed elsewhere that should grow well here, and one or two that need to be tested.
Nothing dead yet.
Since I'm moving in a few years, I will have to start over. But now I know what I want. Maybe 6 trees, all I need.


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RE: Stark Bro's Dwarf Intrepid Peach

H-man and Rayrose,

I hear you esp. the site specific and taste subjectiveness. I do have those points (and others) in mind.

Your comments definitely will be helpful to new peach growers.


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RE: Stark Bro's Dwarf Intrepid Peach

I have an intrepid peach and a reliance peach (both dwarf from Starks) planted 50 feet apart in good dirt -both six years old. The intrepid is a big tree. I prune it each fall to keep it down to 11 feet tall. If I told you how much I have to remove each year, you would say I'm lying.
The reliance is truly a dwarf tree and just produced over a bushel of peaches. The Intrepid had 4 peaches -due to frost.
Charlie


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