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| I'm looking for a sweet-tart apple that is earlier than Macintosh. It needs to be tart. Everyone I know complains if the cider is sweet without the tart. Fresh eating and baking quality isn't important. |
Follow-Up Postings:
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- Posted by Appleseed70 6 MD (My Page) on Sun, Aug 3, 14 at 17:22
| Goldrush is often hailed for it's good cider making attributes. In fact, Albemarle Cider Works makes a commercial single varietal cider with Goldrush. In fact, it's called Goldrush. Macs are pretty early. I'm certainly no expert, but I think most of the good cider varieties are later apples. I just recently read about Liberty being a good cider variety also, but not having ever tasted one I cannot attest to that. At least these two varieties disease resistant and reliable heavy croppers. That should be a nice bonus. I've seen Winesap renowned for it's cider qualities too and has the sweet/tart balance leaning towards tart. But again, not an early variety. |
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- Posted by nyRockFarmer 5A (My Page) on Sun, Aug 3, 14 at 18:16
| Appleseed70, Goldrush is late season apple. I'm not looking for an ideal cider apple. I'm looking for an acceptable apple for cider during the summer months. As it is now, I press about 5-10 gallons per week for family/friends from early September to mid November. I would like to extend that into early August if I can. Greendumb, that is a nice chart. For convenience, it would have been better if they included ripening times relative to a common apple. |
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- Posted by Appleseed70 6 MD (My Page) on Sun, Aug 3, 14 at 21:21
| Yeah...I think I mentioned it was late season. I see now what your shooting for...sorry. |
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- Posted by nyRockFarmer 5A (My Page) on Sun, Aug 3, 14 at 21:27
| I wonder if Yellow Transparent or Lodi would make decent cider. I'm not familiar with either. Based on all the descriptions, it seems like Lodi might be more tart than the Yellow Transparent. |
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| I agree nyRockFarmer. Just out of curiosity I'm going to start looking at ripening times. |
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- Posted by Appleseed70 6 MD (My Page) on Sun, Aug 3, 14 at 21:32
| Ginger Gold? GINGERGOLD Ginger Gold® exhibits all the qualities of a fall variety and ripens three weeks before McIntosh. The highest quality early season yellow eating apple available. It is sweet and crisp. Maturity: August 15, Fruit Color: Golden If you search "ginger gold apple cider" you'll see there are numerous cideries using it, in fact one calls it it's flagship cider. 3 weeks ahead of Mac...is that early enough? I guess it may not have enough of the acid you are looking for though. I've ate Ginger Gold many times fresh and I think it's a fabulous apple. It has a flavor I'd guess would bode well for cider, although having never made it, I really dunno. |
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- Posted by Appleseed70 6 MD (My Page) on Sun, Aug 3, 14 at 22:07
| William's Pride? 4 weeks before Mac Williams Pride Apple Summer. Co-op 23 [PRI 2845-1=(PRI 1018-101 x NJ50)] PRI Co-op, 1988. Probably the most popular summer apple among the newly developed disease-resistant introductions. It’s actually crisp, which is rare for a summer apple. Deep purple roundish-conic irregularly shaped fruit, highlighted with areas of glowing rosy red and covered with a thin bloom. Light cream-colored flesh, with red staining just under the skin, is firm, crisp and very juicy. Has a nice acidic blend of tart and sweet, reminiscent of Fameuse. Long ripening period means you don’t have to eat them all at once. Vigorous annually bearing tree with some biennial tendency. Well-shaped with strong right-angled branches that do not require careful training. Highly resistant to fireblight, cedar apple rust and sooty blotch; resistant to powdery mildew. Scab immune. Blooms early-midseason. Z4-7. Both are ME Grown. |
This post was edited by Appleseed70 on Sun, Aug 3, 14 at 22:09
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- Posted by Appleseed70 6 MD (My Page) on Sun, Aug 3, 14 at 22:13
| ZESTAR: Sweet/Tart 3 weeks ahead of Mac This is the only sweet/tart early summer apple I see that has a sweet/tart flavor profile. Still it sounds like William's pride would maybe be a better choice because of it's juciness. Beyond this I guess you would be delving into old heirlooms or apples that come with baggage. |
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- Posted by nyRockFarmer 5A (My Page) on Mon, Aug 4, 14 at 8:04
| Appleseed70, those August varieties sound good. I just found the website of a nearby orchard that grows Zestar and Ginger Gold, so I should be able to get some of those to try. I'm not sure I will be able to do the same for Williams' Pride. There is another August variety, Redfree, that sounds interesting. I could ask around at the orchard. Maybe someone working there can give me more information, like why they don't grow those varieties. |
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- Posted by jwalker5666 (My Page) on Mon, Aug 4, 14 at 8:40
| Found this link on homebrew forum. I know Centennial is August here in Virginia. Not sure about Dolgo but this may be a good option. http://www.homebrewtalk.com/f32/cider-apple-juice-dolgo-crabapples-269143/ |
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- Posted by Appleseed70 6 MD (My Page) on Mon, Aug 4, 14 at 10:26
| Can't speak for the others, but here Williams Pride is a July apple. Curtis Orchard also shows it as beginning in July going into August. It has a lot going for it for being so early. Heavy reliable cropper with flavor balance and juicy. I have no idea about it's cider attributes though. Most of what I read about cider is always using very late apples. I've always wanted to know more about the subject though because I like cider and I have no issues with alcohol consumption...lol |
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| MonArk - just picked the last two yesterday; 70 mi NW of Nashville TN. Can't attest to its potential for cider, but it's a terrific early season apple - big, firm, crisp, good for fresh eating & cooking. Holds well under refrigeration, 6+ weeks, without going mealy. Requires repeated picking - I've been gathering ripe fruits for 3 weeks or so, maybe longer. Centennial is just past its peak here right now, starting to get a little mealy. |
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- Posted by Appleseed70 6 MD (My Page) on Mon, Aug 4, 14 at 11:27
| MONARK, from the University of Arkansas, is a great quality, early season dessert and culinary variety. Fruit is large, round-flat, near ful-red, with a superb texture and tart flavor. Ripens in July. One of the finest early pie apples. It requires multiple pickings or a stop-drop application. Tree is vigorous, very spreading and very hardy. Very precocious and productive. Lucky...could you make a good cider using only a crab as feedstock? |
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- Posted by nyRockFarmer 5A (My Page) on Mon, Aug 4, 14 at 12:54
| Well, that was nice of them to name an apple Monark when there is already an antique apple from UK named Monarch. Anyhow, it does look like an interesting apple, but it doesn't seem to have a following in the north. I don't see any place to get it from. While looking up info on Centennial I found another interesting apple. Beacon is listed as early August in Vermont and is described as having a good balance with tart. |
Here is a link that might be useful: Beacon Apple Description
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- Posted by nyRockFarmer 5A (My Page) on Mon, Aug 4, 14 at 13:06
| It appears that Maple Valley Orchards sells scionwood for many of the varieties listed above (not MonArk and Centennial) . That is an attractive option for me because I have a lot of junk apple trees growing in random places that I could hack up for grafting. |
Here is a link that might be useful: Maple Valley Orchards Scionwood
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| See if this chart helps you. Mostly heirloom apples though. According to it, Summer Sweeting Apple can be picked by August 10 and then there is Winekist Apple. |
Here is a link that might be useful: Apple chart
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- Posted by Appleseed70 6 MD (My Page) on Mon, Aug 4, 14 at 17:53
| Trees of Antiquity shows Monark in their catalog Rockfarmer $36.95. Everything I see on that apple lists it's flavor profile as just tart. I thought you were looking for sweet-tart? Rockfarmer: if you have a bunch of junk trees why not do something like William's Pride on 1 (tart-spicey), and Early Crisp (sweet) on another. That combo ripens at the same time and is a full month ahead of Mac. Scionwood for WP is available everywhere (Fedco and others $3-$4), probably EC too. OR, if you wanted to get a little later you could go Prima (tart) and Ginger Gold (sweet). Again, obtaining scionwood for these (particularly GG) should present no issues. Just an idea. |
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- Posted by scottfsmith 6B-7A-MD (My Page) on Mon, Aug 4, 14 at 20:30
| I am harvesting some early apples now. Ginger Gold is something like golden delicious but more mild/soft. Williams Pride is a nice flavorful apple worth considering; it is water coring for me. Jefferis is more tart than Williams Pride, it seems most like the classic American late cider apples, Winesap etc. Cherryville Black is a great early apple that should also be good for cider; its only problem is smallness which actually makes for better cider as the skin has more flavor in it. I have never made any early cider, I only make cider out of late varieties. Scott |
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- Posted by Appleseed70 6 MD (My Page) on Mon, Aug 4, 14 at 21:26
| Man Scott, you really know your apples. I'd never even heard of a Cherryville Black until you mentioned it. I had to look it up. A Lee Calhoun find. Couldn't find a photo of it though. I've ate a number of Ginger Golds, but I must be remembering them incorrectly. I thought they were harder and crispier than Golden Del. I've considered getting a William's Pride and have read a lot of reviews on it. How would you rate it overall, and how would you rate it as a early apple? |
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| Appleseed, I don't know beans about cider-making. Some of the crabs have tremendous brix and great flavor, and, I presume would make a stout hard cider. If I had a grinder & press, a mix of Centennial, Kerr, and Almata(red-fleshed) crabs might be worth a try... The irregular ripening of Monark could be a problem - but they hold well under refrigeration, so you could potentially stockpile 'em til you had enough to press. |
Here is a link that might be useful: MonArk @ VVA/Albemarle Ciderworks
This post was edited by lucky_p on Mon, Aug 4, 14 at 22:46
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- Posted by Appleseed70 6 MD (My Page) on Tue, Aug 5, 14 at 0:07
| Scott, when you say you got your's from Vintage Va. apples are you referring to the Monark or William's Pride? Surprised you mention the WP water coring. Is it prone to that? You and I being fairly close and knowing our weather I'm surprised a bit that you would have it this year. I thought that happened a lot in droughts or following one? Is WP the only apple with the problem? |
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- Posted by nyRockFarmer 5A (My Page) on Tue, Aug 5, 14 at 10:01
| Scott, thanks for the recommendations. I never thought about watercore. It seems like it could be a potential issue for any summer apple in places that are prone to long periods without ran during the summer. This is especial true in soils that drain well and don't retain moisture. I suppose it is smart to plant trees were they can be watered if you live in a place known to be prone to drought and watercore. Although, it shouldn't be much on an issue if the apples are used for cider only. |
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- Posted by scottfsmith 6B-7A-MD (My Page) on Wed, Aug 6, 14 at 8:01
| Appleseed, I think you mixed me up with Lucky, he is the one that mentioned VVA. I also had Monark but the deer kept munching it so I never got any fruit. Williams pride is a very good apple, it has lots of flavor and a good sweet/sour balance. The only problem is water coring. One other early apple that is ripening now is Worcester Pearmain. I think this is a greatly under appreciated apple, its something like a Mac but with a more rounded flavor. Most edible crabs are excellent early cider apples. Scott |
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- Posted by Appleseed70 6 MD (My Page) on Wed, Aug 6, 14 at 13:14
| you're right Scott, I did get you mixed up. Does it water core often? You and I being in the same zone with probably similar weather I'm thinking maybe I should look at something else if it's a annual problem. |
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| I squeezed some Geneva crab last month and was pleased with the flavor. Geneva is a very big, say two inches, crab that is dark red and has red tinged flesh. It is mentioned as a good cider apple by the Vintage Virginia folks, and while it might not be a good single variety cider for some folks taste, it would be a good addition to a blend. I have two gallons in the freezer and plan to add it to the Gala cider I'll be squeezing this week. Gala is rather bland to my taste, so I am hoping the Geneva and perhaps some Whitney crab cider added to the blend will kick it up. BTW, where would it be good to post questions about press designs? I just put together a rack-and-cloth press using a Harbor Freight hydraulic press, and even before using it I have been thinking about making a stailess steel cylinder to use with it, and if perforated stainless steel could be used without press cloth. Chuck |
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