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Pomegranates

Posted by bkay2000 8a TX (My Page) on
Sat, Aug 11, 12 at 17:38

I would like to have a bearing pomegranate bush. I'm in zone 8 and we have alkaline soil. My location has plenty of sun. I would like a suggestion for variety and vendor, as I will have to mail order.

Thanks,

bkay


Follow-Up Postings:

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RE: Pomegranates

  • Posted by Goyo626 USDA 8B/Sunset Zone (My Page) on
    Sat, Aug 11, 12 at 17:55

Do not know much about pomegranates but check the dave wilson nursery youtube page, they have a video on some pom varieties. Might give you an idea of what you might like. I have tried to include the vid as link.

Here is a link that might be useful: Pomegranate Vid


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RE: Pomegranates

  • Posted by Goyo626 USDA 8B/Sunset Zone (My Page) on
    Sat, Aug 11, 12 at 20:09

Also, here is a previous thread which I found helpful when researching pomegranates.

As for mail order vendors, I have used Bay laurel nursery and the trees were in great shape. I'm sure other more knowledgeable people can help you.

Here is a link that might be useful: Old Thread


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RE: Pomegranates

I can trade some dormant pom cuttings this fall, do you have any fig trees you can take cuttings from?


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RE: Pomegranates

  • Posted by mrclint z10SoCal Valley (My Page) on
    Mon, Aug 13, 12 at 0:01

Wonderful is the gold standard of pomegranates. If you live in an area that can grow poms, you should be able to pick one up for cheap during bare root season. If you don't live in pom country, it's hard to say how prolific or trouble free it (or any pom) will be.


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RE: Pomegranates

Mrclint,

Wonderful is marketed heavily and that is why it is so popular. The growers pick it more for it's pretty shape and color than it's taste. In blind taste tests Wonderful never is rated very well.


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RE: Pomegranates

Bamboo, every taste test I have seen rated Wonderful pretty good. In fact I have heard grudging comments, like people were hoping it was worse because it was the standard variety. Its like the Bartlett pear, its incredibly common but you can't complain too much about its flavor. All varieties are pretty good. Parfianka and Angel Red seem to be the hot ones today, I think they both have soft seeds which makes easier eating.

If you don't want to root one there are many nurseries selling pomegranates now. In Texas there is Womacks, in FL there is Just Fruits and Exotics, in GA there is Johnson Nursery, if you want exotic varieties try Rolling RIver, then there is Raintree, Bay Laurel, etc etc. I think most varieties are hardy in zone 8a.

Scott


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RE: Pomegranates

Scott,

https://docs.google.com/spreadsheet/ccc?key=0AqmdLhSYn40bdEhVWHVvRU9wYkFvZUxBYzN1a0tEMVE&hl=en#gid=0

http://forums2.gardenweb.com/forums/load/fruit/msg0121224326937.html


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RE: Pomegranates

  • Posted by mrclint z10SoCal Valley (My Page) on
    Mon, Aug 13, 12 at 14:10

You can believe it or not, but a dead ripe Wonderful pom is an exceptional piece of fruit. It is a well established, trouble free tree here in So Cal that actually precedes any of the marketing. Since Wonderful is the readily available gold standard, it is the rarer/newer varieties that need all the marketing.

Good luck talking someone out of Wonderful pom if they already have a good one. :)

Here is a link that might be useful: Pom Wonderful


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RE: Pomegranates

MrClint,

No need to get worked up over a piece of fruit.....all I said is in taste tests Wonderful does not do that well against other varieties, that is simply a FACT. It is the same as red delicious apples.....they are the picture of a perfect apple but taste bad. Wonderful does not taste bad they are quite a good variety, large and looks great but is far from the best.

Not quite sure what your link is supposed to prove......if you ask Ford they will say their cars are the best:)


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RE: Pomegranates

  • Posted by mrclint z10SoCal Valley (My Page) on
    Mon, Aug 13, 12 at 19:48

Bamboo, providing another perspective is not the same as getting worked up. Everyone is free to try and track down "Surh Anor" pom because it scored a 7.8 on a taste test.

The Pom link is there for anyone wanting to try a Wonderful Pom for themselves. There is a store locator in the link. The Wonderful poms can be bought at CostCo in boxes as well. They are not at all analogous to Red Delicious Apples.


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RE: Pomegranates

bought 2 tube sized, rooted cutting Angel Reds from forestfarms about 3 years ago. plenty of roots and grows very fast. the one i planted in ground is 6' tall. the one i kept in a 5 gal pot is about 3' tall and had 2 small fruits this year.

tip: you only need to buy 1 of which ever varieties you're interested in. b/c they sucker a lot, and are pretty easy to root them.


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RE: Pomegranates

also, i've read Poms arent picky about soil, we have clay, and it still grows great.


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RE: Pomegranates

Would like to see the Wolfskill 2008 taste test results. All that seems to be around is Joe Reals individual scoring sheet. That study bamboo referenced was done in Texas, which may be good for OP since that is his location. I'd like to see the CA/Wolfskill results if anyone has them....


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RE: Pomegranates

Would like to see the Wolfskill 2008 taste test results. All that seems to be around is Joe Reals individual scoring sheet. That study bamboo referenced was done in Texas, which may be good for OP since that is his location. I'd like to see the CA/Wolfskill results if anyone has them....


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RE: Pomegranates

"Everyone is free to try and track down "Surh Anor".

Greensea farms has Surh Anor as well as 50+ other varieties....


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Melike

This is Harvey Correia's scoring. He is a well known pom enthusiast who runs a group on poms.


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Ask and you shall...

Here is the taste test results you wanted.

The below is from Jeff Moersfelder, manager of the USDA pomegranate collection at Wolfskill. There were 43 tasters who submitted score sheets. Wolfskill November 2008.


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RE: Pomegranates

Thats more or less what I meant, it is generally liked. Its in the upper half of that last rating.

Scott


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RE: Pomegranates

Scott,

Oh it is good....no doubt about it. But if a person just has room for a bush or two and want the best Wonderful might not be the choice for them. It is the same with citrus...you mention citrus people think navel oranges though they are far from the best tasting citrus. It is though a very pretty orange and big and tastes ok/good.

I did not mean to start anything or imply Wonderful tasted bad. I was just trying to let people know there are better choices than Wonderful. I do grow wonderful as well as 14 or so other varieties of poms. I hope to get fruit next season. I have tasted 8 or so varieties of poms so far and to me Wonderful ranked about in the middle.


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RE: Pomegranates

  • Posted by mrclint z10SoCal Valley (My Page) on
    Tue, Aug 14, 12 at 12:05

Yes, Wonderful is still my recommendation because it is readily available, cheap, hardy, trouble free, is of excellent quality, and has been in North America since 1896. You can try it for yourself at a market near you, either fresh or as juice.

Bamboo, what is your specific pom recommendation and why?


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RE: Pomegranates

Mrclint,

Wonderful is less hardy than many varieties of pom.

Greensea has 50+ varieties of poms all are the same price....

Most all poms are trouble free....

Not sure what difference it is that Wonderful has been here since the 1800's....

Wonderful is good quality not excellent according to the experts.

I agree wonderful is very easy to get.

I prefer Parfianka which I think is due to it's cherry aftertaste and I love cherries. Like I said I have only ever tasted 8 varieties and some of those that are ranked near the top I have not tasted but some of them I do have growing.


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RE: Pomegranates

Thanks for posting that chart bamboo.


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RE: Pomegranates

Bamboo, not to step in it here :-) But why mrclint is probably alluding to with the Wonderful is it is the most commonly sold and grown pom here in S. California. It's funny, you can drive around anywhere, and if you keep your eyes peeled, you'll see one growing. Largely growing, just about everywhere. Kind of like everyone here has a Washington Navel orange tree in their yard. My neighbor whacked his back to a stump since it looked so terrible when he first moved in (previous owners were not watering it). It is 15' tall now, a year later and full of little fruits :-) Of course, dripping it helped a wee bit :-) They are very reliable here in our S. Calif. weather and grow well everywhere, from the coast to the desert. I don't have one (since my neighbor will have more than his share!), but do have Parfianka, Pink Silk, Red Silk, Red Angel, Eversweet, Sweet, Phil's Sweet and Utah, all of which are establishing very nicely, and looks like I might get fruit from Red Angel, it's blooming right now (rather odd, but I'll take it). They just love it here where I live, perfect climate for them. I prefer poms with soft seeds that I can eat. Hate spitting out the pits, so unlady-like :-) Parfianka is my favorite, too. Haven't tasted a lot either, but sure loved this one, so it has a special place in my garden. Plus, it stays more compact, so that's also a good thing for those with space limitations.


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RE: Pomegranates

Bamboo, forgot to ask, does Green Sea have a web site? Can't seem to find one.

Patty S.


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RE: Pomegranates

Patty,

No problems:) I understand it is widely grown in your neck of the woods. Most folks don't live in socal though and was just pointing out there are better tasting varieties. Some people get to be very loyal to the plants they grow instead of trying new plants with an open mind. I know I have you to blame for a few new citrus trees in my yard:)

If Greensea has a website I don't have it. I have no affiliation with them btw though do plan on giving them some of my $ this fall for some new varieties. Cindy Weinstein emailed me the excel list of the cultivars they carry with the prices if anyone wants it just email me but here is what they carry. They have liners ($5), 1 gal ($10) and 3 gal ($25). greenseafarms@yahoo.com is their email address.

�Hydranar x Kirmizy Kabuh
Afganski
Alk Pust Ghermez Saveh
Al-Sirin-Nar
Angel Red
Apseronski
Apseronski krasnyj
Ariana
Azadi
Bala Miursal
Big yellow
Chandyr
Christina
Cloud
Comb's Sweet
Crab
Cranberry
Desertnyi
Don Somner North
Don Somner South
Dotch Legrelley
Double Red #2
Double Red/White
Dwarf �
Dwarf(H)
Dwarf(J)
EG
Entek habi saveh
Eve(H)
Eversweet
Fleischman
Gainey Sweet
Garnet Sash
Girkanets
Gissarskii Rozovyi
Grenada
Haki-botan
Herbert
Kaim-anor
Kaj-acik-anor
Kara bala miursal
Kasmir Blend
Kazake
Ki Zakuro
King
Knuduzski
Larkin (Marianna)
Mack Glass
Mae
Mae II
Medovyi Vahsha
Mejhos
Mejhos 6269
Molla Nepes
Myagkosemyannyi Rosovyi
Nikitski ranni
Nikitski ranni
Nochi Shibori
Padgett
Parfianka
Parfyanka
Pink
Purple Heart
Red Silk
Rose
Russian #8
Saartuzski (Yalta)
Sakerdze
Salavatski
Shari's
Shirin Pust Ghermez Saveh
Shirin Zigar
Sin-Pepe
Sirenevyi
Southern Belle
Surh-Anor
Sweet
Sweet
Tabestani malas Biranden saveh
Thomson
Toryu-Shibori
Treehouse Vietnam
Vkusnyi
WEO 42
Wonderful
Zubejda (Denau)


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RE: Pomegranates

  • Posted by Goyo626 USDA 8B/Sunset Zone (My Page) on
    Tue, Aug 14, 12 at 17:36

Does any one know the differences between Parfianka and Parfyanka (besides the spelling)? Since they list both varieties there must be some difference between them, has anyone tried both of them and if so, what are the flavor profiles, seed hardness, etc of each?


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RE: Pomegranates

Excellent, Bamboo. And I accept full blame on your citrus, lol!! Just chatted with Treesource (Griffith Farms, the propagator of the Dekopon mandarin), and patents are still firmly in place, boo. But, there are rumors of the shiranuhi or shiranui mandarin, which apparently is the same thing being propagated and available in Florida. So, check around, you might find it. I have a few new citrus going in the yard here, shortly, the Lee x Nova mandarin (which isn't available, yet, but got it from Treesource), 2nd best mandarin I've had behind the Seedless Kishu, the Fukumoto Navel, which has a very strong propensity to variegate, two special Satsumas, a replacement Tahitian Pummelo and a Femminello Santa Teresa Lemon (the "limoncello" lemon).

Now, back to poms. Yes, it's easy to fall back on what's out there at all the retail outlets, and miss out on some other really exception varieties. Poms included. And for us out here in S. California, there isn't a pom we can't grow, and grow with essentially zero issues or pampering. If anything, we have to whack them back to keep them in check. They have virtually zero pests here. What would you say are your 3 top fav poms? I'm thinking of seeing if I can get a Sirenevyi and a Surh Anor. Maybe an Ink, too.

Patty S.


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RE: Pomegranates

Patty,

"But, there are rumors of the shiranuhi or shiranui mandarin, which apparently is the same thing being propagated and available in Florida. So, check around, you might find it".

Already did find it:) shiranui was added late this spring.

Here in Florida we have no pest problems on the poms either. Our problem is getting the fruit to ripen without splitting from our abundant rain during the ripening period.

Far as the top 3 poms I have tried.........I would have Parfianka, Desertnyi and Vietnam. Vietnam is very very sweet with to me a passion fruit type flavor. On the list it is called Big yellow. Unlike the rest of the poms on the list it is a evergreen type which according to Dr. Castle comes from India. It is called Vietnam as a Vietnamese gentleman gave it to the grower. I have never seen it on a taste test list. I like it so much I have 5 of them.


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RE: Pomegranates

  • Posted by mrclint z10SoCal Valley (My Page) on
    Tue, Aug 14, 12 at 19:46

Crikey! What do you folks do with so many poms ripening at the same time? :)

I know Angel Red is early, finishing up about the time that Wonderful starts, but otherwise most everything ripens at the same time as Wonderful. Hence the taste tests have all the varieties at once.

I planted an Angel Red but can't recommend it yet - it is young and I don't have the decades of history that I have with Wonderful.


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RE: Pomegranates

Well, Bamboo, you lucky dog, you. We are still waiting for UC Riverside to find some budwood. I was hoping to see it this fall with the CCPP budwood offering, but no go. I will try to email Green Sea and see if they can ship to California. Definitely will consider adding these to my pom line up.

Patty S.


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RE: Pomegranates

Patty,

I was very happy to find the Dekopon, also added a gold nugget and two Kishu....they are small after all:)

I'm not sure if Greensea ships or not.


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RE: Pomegranates

Wonderfull is still the variety Texas A&M recommends for McKinney. It grew well for me, always fruited, but always tasted bitter; ok for juicing if you add sugar, but not for fresh eating. My soil here is extremely alkaline, maybe that's why its so bitter, I hear other posters around the country say Wonderfull is great. But I took mine out after 6 years.

I've tried a dozen varieties and they all tasted bitter until this year my Eversweet is really good; dozens of fruit, sweet, soft seeds. I also had one Desertnyi pom last year that was great, I'm waiting for more this year. Parfianka was extremely bitter

Most of my poms are still ripening, they all seem to be doing better this year. Perhaps the trees have matured. Or perhaps it's the weather, we had very few chill hours this year, a very warm March, & no April freeze. It's a bad year for pears though, even my reliable keiffer just has a few pears on it.

Richard Ashton of Oak Creek Orchards in Brownwood Tx writes a lot about poms & is very high on the Sunbar & another varietie he's named himself, whose name escapes me. Both are recent Russian introductions from Dr Levin. I have both planted, in their 1st leaf, no fruit yet.

Good nurseries are Doan's in Irving; Womack's in Tx, though they have a minimum; Bay Laurel, & Raintree.


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RE: Pomegranates

Wonderful pomegranate is among the WORST I have tasted. The tree bears heavily, has good size, good looking fruit, fairly disease resitant. But it has ONE BIG problem. It has a lingering bad after-taste, rendering it among the worst.
I would also avoid the sweet and semi-sweet varieties, because they are bland with no sweet-tart balance. So far among the ones I have grown and tasted, Desertnyi is good.


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RE: Pomegranates

Bamboo, let us know if Greensea is shipping, it was not mentioned on their little web listing I found. They have an amazing variety selection.

Scott


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RE: Pomegranates

  • Posted by groem z6 utah (My Page) on
    Mon, Aug 20, 12 at 0:34

I figured I was to cold to have a pomegranate, but stumbled On to the willis orchards web site. They have a "Utah sweet" pomegranate, that is listed to hardy to zone 6. So I think hey im in zone 6 and in Utah how appropriate. Does any one have any experience with this variety? How long does it take for the fruit to ripen?


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RE: Pomegranates

Scott,

Will do. I plan on picking my plants up in person but I will ask. Greensea is part of the same University of Florida pom study I am except they took every single pom variety the University offered.....I just took 12 types.


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RE: Pomegranates

Hey all,
I got like 11 varieties from Green Sea this summer.
They post what varieties they have on a localharvest site with their email/phone listed:
Cindy can send a Word Doc of their stock. (I would call as their is a bit delay with email)
All my plants were great (I got $20 3gallons and some $8 starters):
http://www.localharvest.org/green-sea-farms-M36650

-Arian


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RE: Pomegranates

Found some more tasting results from University of Florida.

Surprisingly many varieties that get high praises from previous tests did not do so well. Interesting none the less.

http://www.crec.ifas.ufl.edu/extension/pomegranates/

http://www.crec.ifas.ufl.edu/extension/pomegranates/pdfs/taste_tables.pdf

I was thinking of getting Parfianka, Sin Pepe, Surh Anor, Salvatski, and Angel Red. Now I don't even know. hah


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RE: Pomegranates

i dont know what type of pomegranate this is


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RE: Pomegranates

I ordered a Christina Pomegranate from Florida. Anybody knows if it tastes good?


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