My American Meader persimmon starting to turn color. The Kakis are getting close to rippened: Giant Hana Fuyu, Ichi Ki Kei Jiro. Nikita's Gift are still green.

American Meader

Ichi Ki Kei Jiro

Giant Hana Fuyu

Olympic Asian pear starting to ripe also.

My Galia honey dew and cantaloupe cross are ready also.




Tony

My American crop harvest started off about 2 weeks ago with Osage followed shortly by NC-10. Quality for both American and Asian not as good as usual so far.

I have alot of Asian persimmons on trial here in Omaha, Nebraska. Lucky P.got me started. I tried to grow the most cold hardy Kakis(-10F). Astringents: 1)Greatwall $25 from Burntridge, 2) Kuyng Sun Ban Si(Korean), 3)Saijo (Japanese), Sheng (Chinese), Honan Red (Chinese). Non-astringents: Ichi Ki Kei Jiro (Japanese), Giant Hana Fuyu (Japanese). Hybrids: 1)Rossyanka (Ukraine), 2) Nikita's Gift (Ukraine). I protected the Kakis in winter from late November to February by wrapping them up with a big tarp from Home depot and stuffed them with dry leafs and unwrapped them in February because of the milder temperature. I don't want them to budded out too early and get hit with late frost. I also grow them on the south side of the house and about 5-8 feet from the house to benefit the micro climate (heat given off from the house) and no North winds. I also keep the trees to max high of 8 feet for easy wrapping. I hope this will help you. My Nikita's Gift did survived the -26F for 2 days in 2007 deep freeze. My average low in Winter around -8F.

Tony

Your fuyu drops fruits probably due to too much fertilize or too young. Kakis tend to abort fruits the first 1-2 years and after fruit set will be better. Fuyu does not need to be pollinate.

Tony

I usually waited until the Fuyu persimmon turn dark orange color and picked them firm. They will be alot sweeter then light orange. For drying, I can either dried them hard by cutting in half and placed them in a dehydrator or let them get a little soft then dried them. They are a little bit more sweeter and juicier when soft.

Tony

I did an experiment by picking the NC-10 American persimmons while still green and let it sit on the windowsill to ripen a week ago. So far so good, the persimmons starting to turn color. If this experiment work out then you can harvest your NC-10 before the grey squirrel does.

Tony

NC-10 American Persimmon

After a week and a half on the windowsill, the green NC-10 turned orange and soft. I tasted one of them and it was soft, sweet, and aromatic flavor. In Conclusion, I think this experiment show that NC-10 could ripen off the tree in late green stage to avoid critters. Next year, I will do some more experiment on other Virginianas.

Tony

Creekweb, I hope your experiment with Yates and Geneva Long have good result.

I dried my persimmons and eat it all year around and it tastes like candy. You can also freeze it whole or pulp it for later you. I also like it fresh. Below is Jerry Lehman himself described the benefits and usage of persimmons.

Tony

Passion for Persimmons: Grower Strives to Commercialize the Seasonal Fruit
August 10, 2012 By Susan Hayhurst

When leaves start to turn brilliant colors in the fall, thoughts of favorite autumn foods come to mind. For many in Indiana, persimmon pudding and persimmon cookies are at the top of the list.
Terre Haute grower Jerry Lehman�s freezer is brimming with persimmon pulp always ready for his family�s beloved desserts. To say he�s passionate about persimmons wouldn�t be an exaggeration. In fact, Lehman is so enthusiastic about the globular, bright orange fruit that he has dedicated his retirement, nearly 15 years, to developing a persimmon tree that can be commercially produced in the United States.
From Farm to Orchard
Raised on a farm in Berne, Lehman�s family instilled in him persistence and patience, traits key to starting his orchard in southwestern Vigo County and growing it to nearly 1,000 trees. Lehman and his wife, Barbara, use golf carts to traverse the orchards. He can cite the type of tree, planting date and fruit characteristics as if giving information about his grown children.

"Though there are about 20 farms producing persimmons in Indiana, there are no commercial persimmon growers like there are commercial apple orchards," Lehman explains. "In my experimental orchard, I�m trying to develop a viable American persimmon tree with hardiness and quality. My goal is not to mass produce the fruit but work toward commercializing the American persimmon to benefit consumers and provide another avenue of income for Hoosier farmers."
Much of Lehman�s 85-acre orchard is planted in American persimmon trees, but Asian persimmon trees have also been grown from seeds and cultivated in open pollination. They, too, dot his landscape and have been backcrossed to American trees.
"The Asian fruit is really good and sweet and red in color," says Lehman, the first fruit producer to import the Asian-American hybrid to the United States in 1992. Two years later, he became the second to grow and test the viability of the hybrid.
"My zest for growing persimmons comes from my mentor, the late Jim Claypool of St. Elmo, Ill.," Lehman says. "He was considered the most prolific persimmon grower in the world."
Claypool had some 2,400 hand-selected, pollinated trees and was looking for someone to carry on his work. When he died, his family allowed Lehman to move about 100 of Claypool�s trees to his Hoosier farm.

Growing and Storing Persimmons
Persimmon trees should grow in full sun and be spaced 25 feet apart, Lehman says. They are somewhat self-pruning and ideally should top out at 20 to 25 feet high. "You don�t want persimmon trees to grow too high because the fruit falls to the ground when it�s ripe and goes �splat,� " he says.
The trees, which can be purchased through catalogs for about $25, typically include varieties for early ripening, large and nearly seedless. Planting to fruit production takes about five to six years.
According to Lehman, the best fruit harvest happens in mid-September to the end of October. Fully ripened fruit drops to the ground and should be picked up frequently. He warns persimmon lovers that the American fruit is not instantly edible.
"It is known to be �astringent� � needs to ripen fully before it is fit to eat or be used in cooking," Lehman says. "Not often can you pick persimmons and eat them right off the tree." However, he notes that many Asian varieties are �non-astringent� and can be eaten from the tree.
Remember, he adds, that persimmons must be pureed to create the pulp for end use in recipes such as pudding, bread and cookies. The pulp should be stored frozen unless it�s being used immediately. Persimmon pulp must be processed in federally inspected kitchens to be available at farmers markets, specialty groceries and gourmet food vendors. The fruit is rich in dietary fiber, low in calories and is known for its antioxidant compounds, such as vitamins A and C, beta-carotene and lycopene.
"I know persimmons are healthy for you," Lehman says. "But I know what I enjoy, and persimmon pudding is my favorite dessert. And I�m just as happy eating persimmon cookies and bread."
Try your hand at Lehman�s recipe for persimmon pudding. For more information or to request a tour of his orchard, contact him at (812) 298-8733 or jwlehman@aol.com.

I want to think it through (I am going to get two persimmons trees, a neighbor is going to get another two, I want to make sure we use them all). I have been to Japan and can attest that, dried, they are exquisite. But their method of drying, with daily massaging, is very time consuming. Do you just set racks outside, and plop peeled fruits on them? Asian or american? Ripe or astringent? Sun or shade? Raccoon protection?

Tony

Ichi ki kei jiro is a natural dwarf non-astringent Asian persimmon tree. Hardy to zone 6. Heigh about 10 feet. One of the most hardy Kaki.

Tony

Could You tell me if European kaki cultivars (italian and spanish ones) /for example Tipo, Triumph, Vainiglia, Rojo brillante, etc./ are known and common in America or they are rarities or miss absolutely?

You can control the size by pruining the top. Persimmon will be loaded with fruits and that will bend alot of branches down and that will keep it closer to the ground. Most of mine are grown in the field and the grass underneath will help Cushing it so I don't have that kind of issue even for the bigger varieties. If you grow it near a cement pathway and that will be an isue.

Tony

What happens if...

Good demonstration. Is that Giant Hana Fuyu? What is the max height of your persimmon tree that you would like to keep? What is the lowest temperature (F) of your region in Hungary?

Tony

Tony

ASIAN PERSIMMON VARIETIES 'KAKIS'

Ichi Ki Kei Jiro

Tanenashi

Giant Hana Fuyu

Jiro Fuyu

Imoto Fuyu

Giant Fuyu

Hachiya

Suruga

Gosho

Honan Red

Fire Crystal

Greatwall

Hao River

Tapapsco

Sheng

Nikita's Gift

Rossyanka

Chocolate

Triumph

Rojo Brillante

Sharon

Tamopan

Wase Fuyu

Tamkam

Costata

Ormond

Hyakume

Kyung San Ban Si

Saijo

Coffeecake

Izu

Shin Na DA

AMERICAN PERSIMMON VARIETIES

Prok

Yates

Garretson

Meader

Geneva Long

Szukis

C-100

U-20A

Early Golden

John rick

Lena

100-46

100-47

Morris Burton

Ruby

J-59

Killen

A-118

B-59

Miller

Hao River is more conical shape from China and Costata is from Japan. By the way, how old is your TIPO?

Tony

First phase

It's good without pruning or with some "aesthetic" cut

American Meader (Virginiana) persimmon picked at late green stage and let it sat on the windowsill for 2 weeks and ripen as well as NC-10. So, there you go. Early harvest if too much pressure from critters.

Tony

England's catolog says that, "They select over many others for the taste, size and cold hardiness." He has Shin Na Da, Tae Chu, and Seo Chon.

I have found Ichi at Starks, Edible Landscaping, and Just Fruits and Exotics.

Any suggestions? Tony, which is your best producer? I think Denver is similar to your environment.

Tony

Tony

All trees were completely defoliated with the exception of Rosseyanka and Tamopan. Rosseyanka was not a surprise faring the best, but Tamopan was. Again limited data(1 tree) is of limited value.

Fuyu - In general my Fuyu took more damage then most, 2 trees took minimal wood lose, 3 trees totally lost above graft, and others took significant wood loss. The reason I have so many Fuyu trees, as it is the most widely available tree and among my oldest trees aging from 2009 2010
Matsumoto Wase Fuyu - 2010 trees 1 tree dead to graft, 1 tree major wood loss, 1 tree limited wood loss
Izu - 1st year tree limited wood loss, 2010 Fuyu grafted over to Izu limited wood loss
Eureka - 2010 tree moderate wood loss
Great Wall - 2010 tree minimal wood loss
Saijo - 2010 tree minimal to no wood loss
Tamopan - 2009 tree retained around 50% foliage minimal wood loss. Abnominally? Never heard this tree reported as hardy, but it is an older larger tree, but so were the Fuyu beside it.
Jiro - 2010 tree lost to below graft

1st year tree limited wood loss
Rosseyanka Retained significant foliage, maybe no wood loss
Nikita's Gift
Izu
Ichikikeijiro

1st year tree significant wood loss
Giombo
Sheng
Maekawa Jiro

1st year tree Major wood loss
Hachiya
Hao River
Unknown Huge PCNA
Tanennashi

Young grafts still in pots protected
Giomba (same as Giombo? Listed separate on UC Davis source site)
Okugosho
Tam Kam
Suruga
Cheintang

That is some very valuable datas that we can use to assess hardiness of Asian persimmons after the trees leafted out. Are you planning to relocate those trees to your new home.That will be a major task since you have so many trees.
SD and all, I am going to try a new method to protect the Kakis if late frost set in after the tree leafed out. I will hang a 120v light bulb in the center of the tree and turn it on for the duration of that cold spell and wrap up the whole tree with a giant tarp from Home Depot or Menards to keep the heat in. I think that will raise the temperature inside the tree significantly. I think this method and the micro-climate of the house will prevent the tree from freezing. Creek, Scott, SD, Lucky, what are your thoughts about this method?

Tony

So do not waste your time with bulbs, the dirt (which you should water a couple of times during the winter, to increase the thermal ballast) will store heat during sunny days, and release it at night. The coldest nights are usually after sunny days, and the system is self-correcting. I eat a number of greens in January and February, from the garden.

For trees would you suggest plastic sheeting or tarp material, and would you suggest leaving it on all winter or putting it up when a cold spell hits? It's hard to make myself run out in a blizzard to cover my trees for some reason:)

If you suggest something that lets light in will this not make the heat/cool cycle more variable?

The heat/cool cycle depends on the thermal ballast and thermal coupling to the ballast. Yes, it will be more variable, but you are trying to protect trees. Your post forced me to think in a little more detail about how I would do it for a tree, since so far the tallest plant I have grown under cover are collards.

Probably, for a tree I would also put a 55 gallon drum under the cover, or a number of 5 gallon buckets, and make sure that the soil is moist at all times. The cycle is moderated by thermal contact, but also by high humidity, that is on a sunny day water evaporates from the soil, condenses on the plastic, freezes at night (in the morning, the hoop houses are completely frosted), providing extra insulation, and drips down again in mid-morning. Rodents like hoop houses, so a tree guard is essential.

If you are afraid of the thermal cycle, without a doubt you should use a dark tarp. A good seal and bare, moist soil are the two big improvements.

I suppose it's trial and error, hopefully not too much error.

Tony

On pruning, I do something similar, but my point is to keep from using a ladder, they are not safe on my hilly ground. I have a Nakita's Gift, it is about 6' high, and maybe 9'wide. Much easier to pick this way.

Good to here from you. If you have the chance to take a picture of your Nikita' Gift , I just want to see how to prune and shape it.

Tony

I glad there are two options to protect newly leafed out persimmon trees from a late frost by either misting them in early am or wrapping them up with additional heat source like a 120v light bulb. I guess this call a labor of love.

Tony

I just went out and harvested half of the NC-10 persimmon tree. I will let the fruits sit for 1 week to turn orange but firm not mushy. I will do a drying trial on half of them by carving away their skins and hanging them like the Japanese traditional way to see if they can be drying this way since they are an American persimmon (Virginiana). The other half I will also carving away their skin and cut them in half and place them in the dehydrator. I will take note to see if the heat in a drying process will remove the astringency.