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milehighgirl_gw

Help with planning espilier or high tunnel

milehighgirl
10 years ago

I finally have my prayers answered regarding getting sturdy, affordable metal posts. I found these posts on CraigsList for $7.70 each. They originally were used for fencing back in the 80's when there was a NASCAR or some sort of race in downtown Denver.

The posts measure 13', have an OD of 2.25" and are .150" thick. I put a 7' T-post on top of the pile for perspective.

I was thinking that I should put one post on either side of my rows of trees, which are 30' long, and consist of 5 trees with a spacing of 5' between. My rows are 7' apart. I have 10 rows on the east side of my house and 2 rows each on the north and south side.

I have looked up zoning codes and we are allowed 150 days of use for a tent. Now 2 of my 3 neighbors have fences that are higher than 6', but I am still leary of someone complaining. According to Dave Wilson ( I think) I should have my trees no taller than 6', or 90% of row distance. This will leave me with room at the top, for Christmas lights or overhead misting for my paw paws, etc. I will have to put the posts a total of 3' in the ground.

My thought was to dig a hole and fill with cement leaving a post or even cardboard tube that has an ID of 2.75 in the center. This way I could install the posts but could also remove them without cutting them down or digging up the concrete.

These are quite sturdy but I want to avoid rust so I was thinking to put sand below the concrete and make sure the post-holding hole can drain so water does not collect in the hole.

I am not sure if I should orient them so the curve goes inward toward the center, or curving over the rows. My deepest desire is to make a high tunnel with either hail cloth or plastic. My goal is to protect against frost, hail , birds, squirrels, and codling moth.

I know I will not be able to afford the complete covering all at once (unless someone puts something on Craigslist for me), so my goal is to protect my stone fruits first. I have not pruned or trained any of my trees because I wasn't sure what training system I could afford. I thought I might have to buy a 10' T-post for every tree, and that was too much.

Any thoughts are welcome! Here are some pictures of my little orchard when it first went in. Right now you can't see the forest for the trees so a recent picture would not be helpful.

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This post was edited by milehighgirl on Wed, Oct 30, 13 at 14:50

Comments (15)

  • mes111
    10 years ago

    Milehigh..

    As endposts for espalier these can easily handle a 100 foot row. 35' feet is no challenge to these.

    As endposts I would place them with the bend facing inward towards row facing each other. I bought a 2000 foot 12.5 gauge monofilament line for about $100.00 and I ran it between posts and it is strong enough to support bird netting. With heavier shade-cloth or plastic row covers you might need to put an addition post or two in between to support the wire in the middle to avoid sag.

    You could easily install posts along the edge as well facing inward and that way you could actually build an enclosed "greenhouse"

    The attached photo (without net) might show it better. My rows are 100 feet long so I installed two smaller diameter poles in between the end posts for "sag prevention".

    Your idea with the concrete mold allowing the large poles to be slipped in sounds good and adds flexibility. Your poles look like they are galvanized so rust should not be a major problem.

    Hope this helps
    Mike

  • milehighgirl
    Original Author
    10 years ago

    Mike,

    Oh my your trees look wonderful. I sure hope that I can get mine to look this good. What heights are your laterals at?

    Thanks for your input. At least I have some confidence that I am on the right track.

    I always do things backwards. I hope one day I will learn better; get the supports and watering system in before the trees go in!!!

  • mes111
    10 years ago

    Ideally the lowest should be 18-20 inches off the ground with each next higher line 18 inches higher. This will make the highest line at 6 feet which allows for easy pruning, spraying, harvesting and monitoring for problems.

    Most of the trees you see in the photo went into the ground in the spring of 2012 as bare root trees from Miller, Stark, Raintree, Burnt Ridge etc. So I figure they were one year old when I planted them.

    My problem was that 2012 was a very warm spring and the guys who were going to help me drive the poles got tied up and didn't show up until Mid-June instead of Mid-April. I was forced to plant the trees before I had the trellis up and I was forced to plant 45 trees all by myself and I had to get them in the ground pronto as the temps got to 80 degrees in early May. As much as I tried (or as I tired, I guess) I didn't level the raised planting area as carefully as I should have and by the time the wire was up the trees has started to branch out fantastically.

    So some of the laterals are not as well spaced as I would like but they are doing fine.

    Mike

  • mes111
    10 years ago

    Here are some photos that were taken in late September

  • mes111
    10 years ago

    more

  • mes111
    10 years ago

    how do you upload photos so they are all in the same message

  • milehighgirl
    Original Author
    10 years ago

    Mike,

    Thank you so much for sharing photos of your lovely orchard. Tell us more about your orchard. What cultivars did you decide on?

    The way to post more than one picture is to link it from another site. Mine come from Photobucket but there are others. The remote site will give you an HTML code and then you just paste this link in your post. When you set up your account make sure you set the privacy setting the way you want as it is possible for everyone to see all your photos, which you might not want.

    I had planned to space my laterals at 12" intervals, Can I could get away with this since I am a mile high and the sun is very intense here. I've found that I have to grow paw paw in complete shade here.

  • mes111
    10 years ago

    I don't see how 12 inch separation will make much of a difference shade-wise but will have an effect on air circulation which is what we do want.

    MY VARIETIES
    ___APPLES__
    CANDYCRISP
    GIBSON GOLDEN DEL
    DAYTON
    ZESTAR
    SANSA
    MACOUN
    CALVILLE BLANC D'HIVER
    COX ORANGE PIPPIN
    SUNCRISP
    KARMIJN D'SONNANVILLE
    HUDSON'S GOLDEN GEM
    ORLEANS REINETTE
    JONAGOLD RED
    PRISTINE
    GRAVENSTEIN
    REBELLA
    HORSE
    ROXBURY RUSSET
    MELROSE
    CHENANGO STRAWBERRY
    KING DAVID
    SPARTAN
    ASHMEAD'S KERNEL
    WINESAP
    BLUSH ROSETTE
    GREANADINE
    THORNBERRY
    GOLDRUSH

    __PEARS__
    SUNRISE
    SECKEL
    DOYENNE D'JULIETTE
    COMICE
    HIGHLAND
    MORENTINNI
    KEIFFER
    D'ANJOU
    UBILEEN
    ORCAS
    RESCUE
    CONFERENCE
    SUIJE
    COLLETTE

    ___CHERRIES___
    EMPEROR FRANCIS
    RAINIER
    GOLDEN SWEET
    MONTMORENCY
    NORTHSTAR
    BING
    EVANS BUSH

    ___PLUMS___
    SANTA ROSA
    BUBBLEGUM (TOKA)
    BURBANK
    OZARK PREMIER
    SWEET AUGUST SURPRISE

    ___APRICOT___
    MOONPARK
    PUGET GOLD
    MONTROSE
    CHINESE (MORMON)
    SUNGOLD

    __PEACHES - NECTARINES___
    4TH OF JULY
    SATURN
    POLY WHITE
    HARKEN
    Q-18
    HARDIRED
    NECTA ZEE

    ALSO 20 BLUBERRY BUSHES WITH RIPENING FROM JUNE TO NOVEMBER

    I have one of each.

    This selection is with different blooming and ripening times will keep me busy but hopefully in fruit from June to late November

    Wish me luck

    Mike

  • mes111
    10 years ago

    bubblegum plum

    I am trying some of the stone fruit in "fan" style and others as traditional espalier with the branches forced more horizontal.

    Looking forward to results. I have seen both styles tried

    Mike

  • mrsg47
    10 years ago

    Mes111, What a fabulous undertaking. Your orchard is large, filled with many trees and espaliered. That is quite impressive. I have my hands full just pruning and spraying. At one point I thought of espalier, but now, I might purchase two that have already been pruned and shaped. Your orchard is growing quickly and within four years you will not recognize the pictures you have posted. My orchard at one point looked like yours (a bit smaller) but now I have a forest. Looks great! Mrs. G

  • mes111
    10 years ago

    Mrs. G

    Thanx. I chose espalier for two reasons.

    First because it looks so cool and most people have not seen fruit trees that look like this.

    Second because I think that spraying will be much less time consuming and with the open architecture fungal and bacterial diseases might find it harder to spread and insect attacks easier to find and treat.

    This is important because the orchard is at my retirement place 135 miles from home and I only get there on weekends so time is at a premium.

    Hope my plan/vision works.

    Mike

  • Fascist_Nation
    10 years ago

    Holy c**p! Are those your two boys on that Bobcat?

    Best
    MOTHER
    EVER!!!

  • milehighgirl
    Original Author
    10 years ago

    Fascist_Nation,

    Not only that but they were allowed to ditch school as well because the rental needed to be returned!

  • milehighgirl
    Original Author
    10 years ago

    I have more prayers answered! A local tomato-growing greenhouse advertised on Craigslist that they had plastic available for FREE as they were replacing all of their plastic. I went just hours after it was posted and there was none there but she said to come back. Long story short, I hadn't been able to get there b/c it's quite a drive from my house. On a lark I went yesterday and I was able to get two pieces about 25x45'. It is very heavy gauge but I don't know how heavy yet. It took two of my Astro vans to bring it home .I am on my way to having frost protection for my trees!

    Fruitnut, I'm gonna be asking a lot of questions soon!

  • mes111
    10 years ago

    You are about to embark on a wonderfully fulfilling and challenging journey but have no fear... you have many willing and able navigators and co-pilots.

    Mike
    many happy smiles :-)

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