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dandelion

Posted by gringojay (My Page) on
Fri, Feb 6, 09 at 12:10

? What are your preferences for the use of the different parts of the dandelion plant at any particularly unique stages of it's growth?


Follow-Up Postings:

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RE: dandelion

I Like to eat the young leaves,stems,and flower buds in spring.
Delicious with scrambled eggs.

I purchase an imitation coffee made of the roots and a few other things. It's a good substitute for iced coffee in summertime.

I think the roots are mainly a diuretic.


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RE: dandelion

Pickled dandelion buds in the spring.
Young leaves sauteed with garlic.
Root added to soups for its stimulating effect on the liver.

The leaves are a potassium sparing diuretic, the basis of the French nickname "pis en lit" or "Wet the bed".


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Can you give us a better general idea what liver stimulation is? Perhaps what kinds of symptoms it might fix?


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It gently encourages the liver to produce a little more bile, therefore making defecation easier.


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So why say "liver stimulator" rather than "stool loosener"? I'm not sure that more bile means easier deification (there are lots of things I don't know) but that is a testable claim, so that's a step towards proving the value of this herb for that purpose.


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Sorry, I was being specific in the way that the herb acted. A stool loosener can be drinking more water. It can be ingesting something that "disagrees" with the colon. It could be food poisoning. If you would like vagueness Brendan, sure.


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RE: dandelion

Hi Brendan,
? Do you consider dandelion useful for any purpose(s)?


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Deliciousness, yes.


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To add to what's been said already, the flowers make a wonderful wine. The plant is also nutritious: list of dandelion's nutritional benefits.

FataMorgana


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Now Brendan, you of all people, realize that to use an unscientific term one has to parse it's meaning.
Elucidate this "deliciousness" you are claiming to find in the dandelion.
? Are you ascribing this property to all parts of the plant - at all times, or just some stages of it's growth ?
Inquiring minds want to know; that & if you don't mind this ribbing.


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The open flowers can be used for wine or tempura battered and quick fried for a quick treat. The young leaves make a good addition to salads, The roots can be cooked like any of the root vegetables that you might be familiar with. It is a suitable cure for acute hunger.

This isn't a medical claim however (like liver stimulation, etc) and as a result doesn't require the same high standard of evidence. If professionals were making claims about pharmaceutical drugs the way that claims about herbal drugs are made then there would be charges pressed and those people would be rotting in jail.


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Oooo, brendan wants herbalists to rot in jail!

I'm gonna call my Congersman.


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Careful Eric, you know the moderators blocked the last person to do that with out me actually asking them too.

:)


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Saying burdock root is a gentle liver stimulatant is on par with saying carrots are good for your eyesight. Good grief! ANY bitter tasting food stimulates bile production. That could be arugula, kale, broccoli raab.


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Am I correct in deducing that for predisposed individuals a thin skin is the only side effect of consuming cooked dandelion ? (If I get banned here look for me on HBO.)


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Back to the original question. Think of harvest times when using various parts of the herb. Spring/summer: new shoots, flowers; fall: roots, harvested when tops have died back. Prep roots-- wash & cut-- immediately. They are hard as a rock after they've dried. I keep the roots stored all year long; however, I prefer them for winter formulation-- they seem to have a deeper affect. If you want to know what that "means", compare using the leaves vs the roots in your personal formulation and draw your own conclusions.

One note: In forumlation, roots are decocted; leaves are infused. If you are mixing a formula containing both roots & leaves, you must prepare each portion accordingly before blending-- otherwise, you will overcook one or undercook the other.

If you are tincturing, you can throw both dandelion roots & leaves together (but why not just make wine?)If you are tincturing formulas, however, tincture each herb separately then blend the formula.

BTW, dandelion "fluff" makes a great addition to soaps, sort of like silk fibers, while the attached seeds provide a good scrubbiness.


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RE: dandelion

I have a recipe someone gave me the other day for Dandelion jelly. Smells and tastes like honey. If anyone wants the recipe let me know.


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RE: dandelion

Hi indy,
? Can you please post your dandy jelly recipe when get a chance ?
I need ways to preserve dandelion & my electricity grid shuts down every day for hours.


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RE: dandelion

Hi simplemary,

I find your herbal uses and recipe very useful, as a matter of fact I copy and paste them to my word pad..your're one smart lady.
Thanks for all the information you give.

Hettie


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Thank you lady 6. I'm glad to pass on the benefits of my experiences.


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Indy...
"I have a recipe someone gave me the other day for Dandelion jelly. Smells and tastes like honey. If anyone wants the recipe let me know."

YES PLEASE!!! :)


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RE: dandelion

I wanted to thank eibren for recommending Flexitol an herbal cream for psorisis. but did'nt want to ressurect the psorisis thread.
I've been using it for a couple of weeks now and it works good. I got it in another town but my pharmacy is going to order it for me. Forgive me going off topic.
Looks like you have a good forum going here.
Thanks again


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RE: dandelion

Ok here it is

Dandelion Blossom Jelly - The flavor of this jelly is similar to buckwheat honey.

Pick 1 quart packed dandelion blossoms (the earliest ones are the best). Remove stems and all green parts of the flowers and wash well. Place in 5 cups water and bring to boil. Boil 1 minute, strain and reserve liquid. Add 1 pkg pectin to liquid stir and heat. When liquid boils add 4 cups sugar. Simmer until jelly sheets off a spoon (about 1 hr). Skim and pour into sterilized jars. Boil bath 5 min to seal.

I hope everyone enjoys this recipe.


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Hi indy,
Dandy jelly recipe easy & I can find ingredient list , thank you.


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Thanks for the recipe! It reminds me of corn cob jelly-- which someone who'd never had it said "You must be desperate if you're down to using the cobs..." Tastes like honey:

After kernals have been removed, simmer cobs for 20 minutes, strain. Add sugar & pectin according to liquid volume, bring to boil 1 min., process hot water bath as usual.


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Hi simplemary,
? Any reason maize, or feed, corn cobs would not work for making cob jelly ?


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I suppose that as long as it has a sugar content, it'll work. You probably want to hull them while they're fresh, tho' & use before they dry out. Good luck.


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What kind of pectin in the jellies? Liquid or dried? I'm looking forward to trying these!


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Thanks, Indy, for the dandelion blossom jelly recipe. That will mean a few less seeds floating around too! :-)


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>> This isn't a medical claim however (like liver stimulation, etc) and as a result doesn't require the same high standard of evidence.

If you knew anything about scientific herbalism, you would not need to ask questions about whether or not there was any evidence that dandelion increases the flow of bile. That question was settled long ago. Nor would you badger people who made such claims. I can only surmise that you you are ignorant of the research but want to play "science police."

A quote from the article linked to below:

This contribution provides a comprehensive review of the pharmacologically relevant compounds of Taraxacum characterized so far and of the studies supporting its use as a medicinal plant. Particular attention has been given to diuretic, choleretic, anti-inflammatory, anti-oxidative, anti-carcinogenic, analgesic, anti-hyperglycemic, anti-coagulatory and prebiotic effects.

Here is a link that might be useful: Taraxacum--a review on its phytochemical and pharmacological profile.


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RE: Pectin in jellies. I have always used powdered pectin because it is the easiest for me to get. I have never had issues with it in any type of jelly. The Ball Canning Company offers info on their website, however, about the two pectins. Good luck.


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RE: dandelion

apollog: "If you knew anything about scientific herbalism, you would not need to ask questions about whether or not there was any evidence that dandelion increases the flow of bile. That question was settled long ago. Nor would you badger people who made such claims. I can only surmise that you you are ignorant of the research but want to play "science police.""

I regret seeing you direct a personal attack on brendan. I had hoped since your return to posting here that you had gotten past that tactic, but it sadly appears not.

To return to the subject of the thread, you cite a quote from an abstract of a scientific article that you claim supports dandelion's use as a "liver stimulator":

"This (paper) provides a comprehensive review of the pharmacologically relevant compounds of Taraxacum characterized so far and of the studies supporting its use as a medicinal plant. Particular attention has been given to diuretic, choleretic, anti-inflammatory, anti-oxidative, anti-carcinogenic, analgesic, anti-hyperglycemic, anti-coagulatory and prebiotic effects."

That doesn't tell us that dandelion or its extracts have an effective pharmacologic action in any of these areas in humans, only that the article is examining what evidence exists in these areas. In fact, the authors go on to say:

"Finally, research needs such as quantification of individual Taraxacum constituents and assessment of their pharmacological activities in humans have briefly been outlined (in this paper)."

That doesn't sound to me as it's any kind of settled matter that dandelion is an effective drug for the liver, for use against cancer or any of the other claims mentioned. The authors are calling attention to the importance of doing definitive work on the subject.

Now those people who believe (without evidence) that a normal healthy liver needs outside help from an herbal medicine or other kind of drug to do its job, will likely seize on whatever limited data comes their way, even if the drug has only been tested in rodents or shows no sign of truly effective action in humans. Others will look for that confirmatory evidence before adding dandelion products to their day's ration of medicines.

I'm certainly up for some springtime dandelion wine. God knows there's enough to harvest in my lawn (organic, too). :)


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I heard that the bloom can be battered and fried and tastes simliar to morels...
Would you remove all the green part first?
Please don't make fun of me for not knowing! ;-)
Any other suggestions are welcome!
Thank you to awesome folks!
in peace,
Elle Jaye


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>> "That doesn't sound to me as it's any kind of settled matter that dandelion is an effective drug for the liver..."

Why not just admit that you don't know what you are talking about, and that you and brendan are using your limited knowledge of science to try to define the terms of discussion and push others around??

As I said, this is a settled scientific question. Perhaps if you have new research that calls into question the consensus of several European scientific and regulatory agencies, then you would like to re-open the discussion?

The Commission E approved the internal use of dandelion root with herb for disturbances in bile flow, stimulation of diuresis, loss of appetite, and dyspepsia. The British Herbal Compendium indicates its use for hepato-biliary disorders, dyspepsia, lack of appetite, and rheumatic conditions (Bradley, 1992). ESCOP indicates its use for restoration of hepatic and biliary function, dyspepsia, and loss of appetite (ESCOP, 1997). The German Standard License for dandelion decoction indicates its use for biliary disorders, gastrointestinal complaints such as a feeling of distension and flatulence, digestive complaints, and to stimulate diuresis (Wichtl and Bisset, 1996). (Citation in link below.)

Bile flow, biliary and hepato-biliary conditions? Yeah, that sounds like the liver and gall bladder to me.

Here is a link that might be useful: Dandelion root with herb (monograph)


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Your link takes me to a log-in page for the American Botanical Council.

None of the sources you cite (including the British Herbal Compendium) indicate that any controlled studies have been done in humans showing that dandelion products effectively cure or ameliorate any defined disease (what are "disturbances in bile flow" and "digestive complaints", exactly?

If any dandelion-derived medications have been proven effective by real-world evidence, surely those studies will be easy to find. The fact that you're resorting to ad hominems again looks like a concession that you don't have that evidence.


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The link is to a monograph that cites reviews by regulatory agencies and approves claims and use. I don't know why you can't see the monograph; I entered that information from home yesterday, and was able to follow the link from another computer today.

>> The fact that you're resorting to ad hominems again looks like a concession that you don't have that evidence.

No, when you and brandon are unwilling to do a review of the scientific literature, you lack a prerequisite to participate in a high level scientific discussion. You have no context to evaluate statements, unless they are quite obvious.

You both have a pattern of resorting to sniping at reasonable statements, and believe that you are qualified to be the arbiter of what is true, even when you haven't bothered to study the matter at hand. You are like high school debaters trying to cast aspersions on things you disagree with, regardless of whether they are true or not.


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RE: dandelion

I'm interested in Dandelion.

I'm especially interested in this question...

"I heard that the bloom can be battered and fried and tastes simliar to morels...Would you remove all the green part first?"

Does anyone know?


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RE: dandelion

apollog: "...when you and brandon are unwilling to do a review of the scientific literature, you lack a prerequisite to participate in a high level scientific discussion."

Um, it is not incumbent on anyone here to "do a review of the scientific literature" to prove or disprove a poster's claims (though we often look for such evidence). One of the basics of science is that the people making the claims are the ones obliged to provide the evidence. It's not up to anyone else to do the work for you.

I accept that your continued use of personal attacks means you haven't got the evidence to back your claims and are hoping to create a distraction instead.

By the way, this business about "stimulating bile flow" and "choleretic" effects and such, brings home an essential point about liver health. The very best thing we can do for our livers is to leave them alone to do the job they are highly suited for. There's a continual emphasis in some alt med circles on the supposed need to "flush" or "cleanse" the liver, and a variety of herbs claimed to do the job. In reality, the liver in a generally healthy person has a large amount of reserve capacity to detoxify, synthesize and do all its usual tasks without outside "help". We can do our part for the liver by limiting its exposure to hepatotoxins. These most commonly include alcohol, a variety of OTC and prescription drugs and certain herbal medicines. Live a healthy lifestyle and you'll find that your liver gets along just fine without the need to ingest artificial aids.

Anyone wants to post a recipe for dandelion wine, I'm up for it.


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Hi eric,
I first came across people using liver "flushes" over 35 years ago.
Those who used a "cleanse" recipe for prolonged periods of time did not do well with their strategy. It seemed they became more susceptible to what they ingested.
The practice was/is an outgrowth of European Naturopathic approach. This strove for a spring tonic to dispel winter torpor, related to the cold season dietary limitations.
With purification mania the benefit was surpassed & over use did too much interference with biological rate of liver activity. Kind of as if the liver was rushed to purge before had completed it's processes.
Flushing also means the liver xeno-biotic glucuronidates are not given a chance to diffuse through the liver tissue & can't pass the bulk toward urinary excretion. This then results in high level of discharge into the bile, which puts these by products of metabolism into the small intestine.
Purification advocates see their discomfort as indicating they need more thorough cleansing, or proof it is doing something they require. In some cases they are just auto-intoxicating; their gut bacteria enzymes cleave the bountiful supply of glucuronides to feed on & their intestinal mucosa reabsorb some of the xeno-biotics to go be a burden again.
The intelligent use, in moderation, of dandelion root is compatible with normal liver/bile metabolism.


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>> Um, it is not incumbent on anyone here to "do a review of the scientific literature" to prove or disprove a poster's claims (though we often look for such evidence)

Yes, if you wish to claim authority, you need to be familiar with the research. Its that simple, and when you claim authority on a topic that you are not familiar with, you are a fraud. You are in no position to validate or reject statements when you are ignorant of the subject being discussed.

>> By the way, this business about "stimulating bile flow" and "choleretic" effects and such, brings home an essential point about liver health. The very best thing we can do for our livers is to leave them alone to do the job they are highly suited for.

And where is the evidence for this statement? Why should we believe such claims?

Humans evolved to periodically experience shortages of food; fasting can be therapeutic. Humans evolved to move, and the heart and various muscles need to be exercised. Humans evolved to eat various foods in various seasons, and some of these have tonic effects.

If the kidneys are so perfect, why do doctors write millions of prescriptions for diuretics each year? If the liver and gall bladder are best left alone, why are so many gall bladders surgically removed each year after they clog with deposits?? If the gonads are best left alone, why do so many women have menstrual difficulties like PMS and PMDD? Dandelion has long been used as a food/medicine for treating such conditions, and research supports these uses.


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Before telling others that they "lack a prerequisite to participate in a high level scientific discussion" (ooh, that smarts ;), I think you need to learn what the scientific method is, and most particularly what the burden of proof is (and who carries it when a particular claim is made).

"Outside a legal context, "burden of proof" means that someone suggesting a new theory or stating a claim must provide evidence to support it: it is not sufficient to say "you can't disprove this." Specifically, when anyone is making a bold claim, either positive or negative, it is not someone else's responsibility to disprove the claim, but is rather the responsibility of the person who is making the bold claim to prove it."

Failing to provide evidence to support a claim and resorting instead to calling others stupid if they don't agree with you, has nothing to do with science or civil discussion.


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>> Before telling others that they "lack a prerequisite to participate in a high level scientific discussion" (ooh, that smarts ;), I think you need to learn what the scientific method is, and most particularly what the burden of proof is (and who carries it when a particular claim is made).

That fine and dandy for a particular experiment - when proving something, proof is needed. But when there is a body of research, you can't walk into a serious discussion without first being familiar with what research has already been done. In fact, you and brendan are "suggesting a new theory" - that dandelion has no proven effects on the liver or flow of bile. That is an issue that medical regulators have looked into, and decide. Unless you presenting new evidence to refute the accepted science, you have nothing to contribute to the discussion except for dilatory diversions.

>> Specifically, when anyone is making a bold claim, either positive or negative, it is not someone else's responsibility to disprove the claim, but is rather the responsibility of the person who is making the bold claim to prove it." Specifically, when anyone is making a bold claim, either positive or negative, it is not someone else's responsibility to disprove the claim, but is rather the responsibility of the person who is making the bold claim to prove it."

Nice sentiment, but do you live by it? Where is the proof for your statement that "The very best thing we can do for our livers is to leave them alone to do the job they are highly suited for" ?? It is not clear how we can 'leave the liver alone' in any case - we are always consuming various plant and animal substances. The only question is which ones have no effect, which are beneficial, and which should be limited or avoided.


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Barbara Hall once said that "dandelion is used medicinally as a liver tonic and as a mild diuretic. The roots may be dug in fall or early spring and tinctured (soaked in a jar of brandy or vodka for four weeks or more to extract the medicinal components). A dropperful of this alcohol extract twice a day is a time-honored remedy for liver complaints. The leaves are also good for the liver but have more of the diuretic properties and also contain potassium, which replaces the potassium that tends to be depleted by diuresis...

What were those elderly relatives doing with them? They were gathering the tender spring leaves before the flowers appear. Perhaps none of them could have recited the exact chemical constituents or could have spoken with any authority on the splendid effect this plant has on your liver. They most likely would have said with raised eyebrows and a shrug of shoulders "It's a spring tonic. My mother/father always gathered them and their parents before that." That used to be a good enough answer.

This is what I find so comical about our 'advanced' society here. We doubt, we analyze, we study. We tear things apart and have to PROVE that they do something or other. And you know where we wind up? Right back where we started, with Grandma and her bag of greens and that old paring knife, shaking her head and heading back to the kitchen. She knew.......we'll catch up."


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apollog: "you and brendan are "suggesting a new theory" - that dandelion has no proven effects on the liver or flow of bile."

You're creating a fire hazard with all these straw men.

What I've said is:

"None of the sources you cite (including the British Herbal Compendium) indicate that any controlled studies have been done in humans showing that dandelion products effectively cure or ameliorate any defined disease (what are "disturbances in bile flow" and "digestive complaints", exactly?"

We still haven't seen you present a single valid clinical study showing that dandelion products are effective against any recognized disease.

"Where is the proof for your statement that "The very best thing we can do for our livers is to leave them alone to do the job they are highly suited for" "

I'll direct you to any good text of human physiology or online summaries such as this one.
You will find no authoritative and respected source that suggests that we must "cleanse" or "flush" our livers to maintain good health. The organ has a remarkable capacity to do its job on its own.

"My mother/father always gathered them and their parents before that." That used to be a good enough answer."

Yes, folklore used to be a good enough reason to believe and do lots of things.


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Like a cat chewing on grass...


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The question about if the green part can be removed from the dandelion flowers is yes/no. I think it must depend on the type of dandelion. In many older cookbooks the green part was removed before fermentation for wine. However, I personally have never been able to remove the green part without having the flower separate in my hand. It may depend on the age of the flower, time of the day, or some other factor. Try removing the green yourself and see what happens. You could probably mix the flower pieces in fritter batter like you would for elderflower fritters then fry.


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That's a good point Maifleur. I was wondering how someone might take the green off.

I'm a little hesitant to fry anything but tempura batter might be good as well :)


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RE: dandelion

Hi herbalbetty,
? Would you post your Dandelion Pickled Buds recipe here ?
I saw it elsewhere & think it will interest some others.


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