Then again, maybe it was Dong... something else, or...?? Anyhow, it was all about 10 yrs ago, but at the time it was something of a scandal in the 'alternative' world.

Brendan, wrong about something is one thing wrong about "Big Pharma" is absurd.

Cancer in the hands of "Big Pharma" is a death sentence. Chemo weakens the body to such an extent that when you finally come around to alternative medicine you've already got one foot in the grave.

According to "Cancer: Think Outside the Box" by Ty Bollinger his well documented figures show "Big Pharma" is still after 70 years at a 3% cure rate on cancer. Were not talking about tumors here just cancer. I think if cancer was totally left untreated there would probably be a 3% cure rate, JMO.

"Big Pharma" is out for the money and that is all. Many pills that cost the public between $50 and $200 per month prescription cost only between .02 and .06 cents per pill to produce. Profits are perfectly acceptable and a way of life and no one expects a company not to make profits but OBSCENE profits are a CRIME.

The traveling "snake oil medicine man" of the western era has turned out to be the "Big Pharma" man of our era. Fancy drugs with colors, fancy commericals, fancy fraud.

Lucy, what is your opinion of the two drugs, Fentynal and Abilify? If I may ask.

Would you recommend either or both of these as a treatment for what they are prescribed for?

Thank you for a response.

The Ty Bollinger that patriotsniper refers to, identifies himself online as a former competitive bodybuilder, a "right-wing fundamentalist Christian" and a CPA. Those are his credentials for advising people on cancer therapy.

"Thinking outside the box" is fine, but if as a result your thinking is confined to a different, cramped and warped box, not so good.

" Chemo weakens the body to such an extent that when you finally come around to alternative medicine you've already got one foot in the grave."

This is a common excuse used by promoters of ineffective and quack "alternative" treatments for cancer. When they don't work, it's the patient and physicians' fault for having used mainstream therapy.
The corollary to this is when a patient has had mainstream therapy and used an "alternative" treatment on the side and does well, the "alternative" treatment is solely credited with the patient's recovery,

Quacks are good at working all the angles.

My own doctor has told me that he will NOT PUT ME ON CHEMO until the last minute because it opens a whole "other can of worms"...

Research can be done by anyone and not sure where you got your info. I do know his ENTIRE family (pretty much) has died from cancer within the past 10 years or so and that is his motivation. His dead family all followed the "Big Pharma" approach to curing/containing the cancer only to lose rather quickly. I guess they didn't qualify for that 3% success rate.

What are your credentials that qualify your opinions (advice) here on an herbal website? Do you have a degree as a health care practioner?

Fentanyl (correct spelling) was proven deadly years ago, especially when combined with another drug. Abilify I've never heard of so can't comment.

Patriot Sniper what form does cancer take besides leukemia and tumors? Keeping in mind that two or more non blood bound cancer cells together constitute a microtumor. Tumors are how we measure cancer. A large tumor is made of lots of cancer cells, a small tumor is made of a few cancer cells, a large tumor is made of a lot of cancer cells, with an exponential rate of growth and a lot of cancer in a big tumor sends off more cells than a little cancer in a small tumor. Also Chemo does screw you up, no one will deny that, cancer will screw you up more. Also I refuse to pay one red cent to an accountant for his cancer manifesto, you can cite his sources and I will look at them, but until you do that is not a valid point in an argument.

I blew it - did not look up Fentanyl, which is not either Phenergan or Fenfluoramine. Too lazy, too quick to respond... I hope no one here does have to take Fentanyl though!

Here's a site in which Ty Bollinger discusses his "qualifications" for recommending bogus cancer therapies, including his CPA and former bodybuilding career.

But let's say qualification aren't everything (I'm an M.D., which makes me a pharma agent and untrustworthy in your eyes anyway). Look instead at the distortions and gross errors in what these "alternative" websites are telling you (for instance on "acid" diets and cancer). As an example of one common story parroted on these websites, a survey of oncologists at McGill University supposedly showed over 90% would personally refuse chemotherapy for cancer. Dig around some more, and the survey elsewhere is being talked about as a response by oncologists on whether they'd want to take one particular drug for lung cancer, or participate in experimental trials. What the survey might actually have showed is another matter, since it doesn't appear in a published medical literature search. And it's over 20 years out of date anyway.

These purveyors of fear and suspicion have you over a barrel, patriotsniper. They've encouraged you to discount any evidence by people who know what they're talking about, in favor of canned quotes and lies by people who have no business steering patients away from potentially life-saving therapy.

Lucy, thank you. There are others but those two came to mind. One of the side effects of those drugs is DEATH. I was curious as to your view of them.

Eric, why does an MD spend so much time on a site like this? "Big Pharma" does not do studies on "herbals" to my knowledge and certainly to no extent if they did. They have RULED OUT "herbs" as treatment for anything. Why does "Big Pharma" feel the need to have a presence here? There are plenty of "Big Pharma" websites on the internet and I'm sure many have forums, why would an MD be here on an herbal site? No matter what your answer might be here, people should think about the questions. And to make it more interesting we have numerous "Big Pharma" representatives here on this little herbal forum. This should raise at least one red flag to someone.

Character assassination, misdirection, divide and conquer are all tools of Big Government (Big Pharma, Public Traded Corporations, this Government, etc.) I noticed you did all your research on Ty Bollinger and NOTHING on what he presented as evidence which others have concurred upon. You chose to "character assassinate" rather than research his findings.

I have NO FEAR but I do have suspicion. Life has taught me to check things out for myself and not believe in "advertising propaganda". God gave us all a brain and I think his intention was for us to use it. In the old days patients were encouraged to get a second opinion, for good reason. And how many really do it today.

Actually, we've covered Bollinger's claims about "acid" diet and incorrect statistics on successful therapy for cancer. His background should help explain why he doesn't have his facts straight (his other whoppers include the mystery vitamin that supposedly prevents virtually all cancers, how we're "poisoning" children with vaccines, and how genetics doesn't have anything to do with cancer - all nonsense).

"Why does "Big Pharma" feel the need to have a presence here? There are plenty of "Big Pharma" websites on the internet and I'm sure many have forums, why would an MD be here on an herbal site?...And to make it more interesting we have numerous "Big Pharma" representatives here on this little herbal forum. This should raise at least one red flag to someone.

Character assassination, misdirection, divide and conquer are all tools of Big Government (Big Pharma, Public Traded Corporations, this Government, etc.)"

Oops, my irony meter just busted. :(

No problem Eric, I'm sure "Big Pharma" has a very expensive pill for Irony, not to be taken at the same time as the "toenail fungus" pill however.

Not to change the subject entirely here is "Discover Magazines" take on some of the "Big Pharma" practices.

20 Wonder Drugs That Can Kill

http://discovermagazine.com/2008/jul/20-wonder-drugs-that-can-kill

Particularly note some of what is said about the "Pharma" industry as a whole and how it's about the money.

Patriot Sniper what form does cancer take besides leukemia and tumors?

http://www.cancer.gov/cancertopics/alphalist

Patriot sniper You have linked to an evil government site that shows a bunch of tumor forming cancers of different types and a bunch of leukemias of different types. What you have failed to do it to show any cancer in any form that is not a tumor or a leukemia.

http://www.what-is-cancer.com/papers/newmedicine/cancer.html

That's quite a collection of goofiness, coming from a physician yet.

Sample gem:

"Apparently the growing tumor is vital to the organism, and it is ready to suffer secondary damage caused by it. Which poses a challenge to treatment. Tumor removal prevents secondary damage, yet somehow harms the organism."

Fascinating theory, doc, but not based on fact. If you really believe that tumors are essential, let's hope you're not working as an oncologist or surgeon.

I'm not "shocked" by Zajicek's claims, as he suggests nonbelievers will be - just amused and disgusted by how far off the rails even educated people can get.

"Wisdom of the body", a.k.a. WOB seems to be this guy's mantra. Well, the body does some really dumb things, like constantly demanding more fat, salt, sugar and calories. Sometimes the brain needs to step in to keep the body in line, like suggesting it stop making embarassing noises in mixed company while digesting a bean and bratwurst dinner.

I'm sure "Big Pharma" will poke holes at any other research because OF THEIR STELLAR SUCCESS RATE AT CURING CANCER.

Sheep Sorrel may reduce tumors. This is also one of the ingredients of Essiac Tea.

Here is one write up about it. (there are others)

http://www.motherearthherbs.com/sorrel.html

Patriot Sniper You linked to another site about cancer growing as tumors, Do you have anything else for us or are you admitting that Ty doesn't know what he is talking about?

PatriotS - If YOU can produce a substantial number of real, traceable stats from somewhere that has documented both diagnoses (and how they were made) and 'cures' for cancer, again with serious and traceable information from reputable medical facilities (and I do stress medical vs ashrams, hole-in-the-wall places in e.g. Mexico or the Philippines or Timbuktu with no credentials, or religious institutions) why not produce them, seeing as you apparently can't find any such stats or examples of 'Big Pharm's" cures (though they do tend to call them remissions)?

Lucy, you know Big Pharma does not do studies on "herbal cures" and you only believe in what is printed by Big Pharma so it is not possible to produces studies you'd accept.

Eric ONCE AGAIN, why does an MD spend so much time on a site like this? "Big Pharma" does not do studies on "herbals" to my knowledge and certainly to no extent if they did. They have RULED OUT "herbs" as treatment for anything. Why does "Big Pharma" feel the need to have a presence here? There are plenty of "Big Pharma" websites on the internet and I'm sure many have forums, why would an MD be here on an herbal site?

See this thread as to why I'm here. Then again, you posted in that thread so you already know.

" "Big Pharma" does not do studies on "herbals" to my knowledge and certainly to no extent if they did."

You'll find tons of studies done on herbs by people you'd label as "Big Pharma" here. Enter a term in the search box and you'll pull up a bunch of publications on virtually any herbal treatment you care to investigate. Drug companies are constantly testing new plant-based remedies. We wouldn't have anticancer drugs like taxol and vincristine without that work. Our government also funds alternative medicine research to the tune of millions of dollars annually.

If you'd like to hear about forums you can go to where everyone shares your point of view and dissenting opinions are not tolerated, e-mail me.

I believe what is backed up by strong and disciplined research that not only is well documented and peer reviewed, not only carried out on many, many people in regulated circumstances (science does demand credibility), but also (in appropriate cases) can be duplicated consistently, not factors often found in alternative medical settings. Just what is so wrong about wanting to see that treatment has been well researched by qualified people? Of course mistakes and problems occur, but the ratio of them to the vast array of studies done day in and day out by "Big Pharm" is miniscule.

My! My! and i was told to behave? Will one of you THREE very INTELIGENT? ARTICULATE? SOPHMORIC?
FRUSTRATED? ANTIHERBALISM? SOCIALLY INHIBITED? MALADJUSTED? POOR PEOPLE PLEASE! PLEASE! PLEASE!
identify that valarian plant for that confused poster on another thread. You can do that or can you LOL

patriot,Havent you noticed the real reason these Medical people are on here? They are not in the pay of Big business Medical Industry. : 0
Except Brendon will be someday if he graduates.

They are here because they are frustrated by something in their make up or lives and they think we are easy pickings to rant at. They cannot do this on medical forums because they would be laughed off of the forum. Just my educated guess. They sit here day after day going over the same tired ole arguments about the evils of herbs and the glorious wonder of medicine, that manages to kill 1OO,OOO people a year.(3RD RANKED CAUSE OF DEATH IN THE USA) NUMBERS ONE AND TWO ARE HEART RELATED DEATHS AND CANCER DEATHS.

These people seemingly get their jollys by coming on an herbalism forum and talking about Medicine always. Have you noticed anyone of them answer anybodys question about herbs lately except tazymo. They can only get on and vent their frustrations by eletist,scalding, scolding unsocial,manners and when their manners are pointed out, they turn against the offended person and say you are the social outcast and never look back to see how many people have told them the same thing. They also love to say to others. But you don't make sense,not realizing that most others who don;t have their problem can see right through them.Some of the posts i bumped up are of people who told them they were rude. I really don't think they know what they are doing. they are sick and need help. and i feel sorry for them. ONE FOR SURE CAN'T HELP ANYONE WHO DON'T WANT IT.but it would be nice if they took their fustrations out on another forum that is for western medicine and not herbalism. And they should definately seek some psychological help.They would be a lot happier,and so would all of us. So patriot any point about herbalism just gives them the joy and self satisfaction of running herbalism down and feeding their egos in an inappropriate way.

It's intresting about eric, He sends you to sites that insults your intelligence. But he must injoy them.Why does he want you to e-mail him? Does he want to get your addy? Hope you don't have real info on your website. But he must enjoy them.Does his explanation of why he is on this forum make a lot of sense after reading any of his posts?LOL Not being offensive, just a curious person. Of course I'll be the one accused of attacking them tho they attacked first,and they can't see that. That is really a fact yet they are in denial. I can be as vicious as anyone else and only to protect something or someone. Guess i'm as ignorant as everybody else. I bit the bait the medical people threw out and gave them a goody to chew on.THEY CAN rant again. Well go for it and enjoy.

I think you are missing the point by a mile! I asked PS for some believable documentation on HERBALISM that shows it can 'cure' people as he seems to think it does. Nowhere have I said a word about herbalism being bad as such. If wanting to hear some logical arguments for your beliefs makes me 'sick' (thanx a lot!) then are you saying that herbalism demands illogic and leaps of faith to work?

Oaklief, I try to give everyone the benefit of the doubt about their points of view. But some definitely have a "hidden agenda" and when I found that this site was owned by General Electric I answered some questions I had.

I started posting over at Dave's also. Maybe we will run into one another over there. Do you use the same "handle" over there? I do.

Hi, my husband's friends daughter (13) had a tumor in her mouth & was sent home to die. The mom took her to an herbalist who told her to drink fresh pineapple juice only, no fiber all day long. 6 weeks later, she went to the dr., no cancer. The girl told my husband that she would have rather died, it was so horrible. Well, we saw the girl, now 30+, and she had 2 children running around.
I also read a book about Enzymes, Pineapple, papaya, figs, and aloe vera seemed to be high in emzymes and often used for cancer. I hope the best for you and your children.

"The mom took her to an herbalist who told her to drink fresh pineapple juice only, no fiber all day long. 6 weeks later, she went to the dr., no cancer. The girl told my husband that she would have rather died, it was so horrible."

Death is preferable to pineapple juice and "no fiber all day long"? True, unless you were healthy to begin with you could well get well into malnutrition and other consequences of such a diet within 6 weeks, with potentially serious results.

This story has numerous elements of urban legend Internet cures. Of course, 13-year-olds with oral tumors are not "sent home to die", unless they've gone to a quack in the first place. That certainly sounds like a good possibility, given that a doctor saw no cancer after the girl went through the pineapple juice "cure". If someone is misdiagnosed as having cancer by an alternative "healer", whatever treatments the quack prescribes are likely to "work", since there was no cancer to begin with.

Enzymes are like circuits, a kitchen full of appliances and a computer both have circuits, a computer wont keep your food cold and you can't type your response to me on an oven. Also your stomach contains a substance known as pepsin, pepsin in the presence of a strong acid (i.e. stomach acid) will break down most proteins (99.9999% or so) and enzymes are all proteins. Once it hits your stomach if you have chewed it up enough to digest it then enzymes don't do much for you.

Yes, good point. Taking enzymes is not going to do any good when they get chewed up and destroyed in your stomach. The same goes for concoctions containing "DNA" like this one which get digested before they can reach your bloodstream - not that some other creature's DNA is going to help you anyway.

Question for you Eric, has anyone in the history of ever been recorded as having a DNA deficiency? It sees implausible to me. Also a comment, any idea where the cheapest source of DNA is? Salmon sperm,they used to have to throw away dumpsters full of it, isn't that a pleasant mental image!

I think the main point is to have a diet rich in substances in particular microelements that are used in the production of DNA and enzymes.
As for anticancer in general the idea is to eat foods with plenty of antioxidants that prevent cellular membrane decay. A good source of antioxidants is green tea and rooibos. Rooibos is particularly suited for children as it has no caffeine.

Here is a link that might be useful: Rooibos tea health benefits

Is there any evidence (aside from folklore) that this tea has health value, or that it's superior to other teas on the market (i.e. green tea)? A link to any good info on safety would be appreciated also.

Incidentally, while antioxidants have become something of a buzzword in health, the benefits proved so far don't match the hype, and there are indications that overconsumption may not be a good thing.

Well theres always Rooibos health facts for example.
As for overconsumption I'll have to agree but I think that is very difficult to overdo your antioxidants intake using only natural sources such as tea. Pills and extracts are another matter of course.

The synthesis of DNA is actually quite similar to the process for burning sugar, and quite closely tied in. You have to be very very very ill before you have any trouble at all making DNA or RNA, you actually keep on making it for a short while after you are dead. Moral of the story, that's helping with a problem that no one has.

The "rooibos health facts" page linked to by rooibos (are you working for this industry group, by any chance?) provides some scientific references, including three "comprehensive reviews". Of these, one is about production (not health) and one goes to a dead link. The remaining one reviews rooibos and another South African herbal tea, commenting "However, human studies of rooibos are limited and of honeybush are absent."
A list of selected rooibos references that follows bears out this problem, as all the studies seem to involve cells in test tubes or animal studies, i.e. rats.

Very little there to back up claims of disease or cancer-fighting ability, and also I see nothing about potential interactions with other drugs/chemotherapy agents (the boy mentioned in the opening post was having chemotherapy for his tumor(s)).

As for overdoing antioxidants, many people are already taking multivitamin supplements in addition to their regular diet and drinks with antioxidant activity. Some may figure that if a little helps, a lot will be even better for curing disease and leading to a Fountain of Youth. There may, however be a downside.

I doubt that the drinks are having that much of an effect. I would recomend that you listen to the Skeptoid on it, seems that a simple apple has far more antioxidants in it that most of those drinks.

Here is a link that might be useful: Study!

Good link, thanks.

What I didn't see mentioned was the cost to the environment and drain on energy supplies related to the production, shipping and disposal of all those fancy juice bottles, as compared to growing apples.
Of course, it would have been nice if they'd compared the juices to some other apple besides the Red Delicious, which is one of the least tasty apples commonly sold. :)

Had they used a less common apple they would have been accused of picking one with a super high TAC.

Girlyfab:

Dr.Robert morse has a95% cure rate on cancer and all disease...please look him up at godsherbs or herbalhealthclub YouTube. He is in port Charlotte Florida. He is a naturapathic herbalist biochemist... He saved my life. He basically puts you on herbs and a raw food diet of lots of fruit(fruit does not feed cancer) if I was u I would make sure to get good reverse osmosis or water filter/shower filter and feed him only fruit and vege nothing else... Please contact dr robert morse, he WILL save this poor beautiful soul. He did this for 40 years! My blessing are with u!
Joe

If you don't have the money to visit him I would at least give him a call. Chemo and surgery is probably thousands of dollards dr morse is just a few hundred... You can learn from him free on YouTube Dr morse nd. I would bumy his book,it will teach u everything u need to know"dr Robert morse detox miracle sourcebook" prayers are with u
Joe

I can't believe what crap you guys are learning. Simple sugars are essential for life. Without we would die. Ur telling the kid to stop eating simple sugars(fructose,fruit) but ur telling the kids to eat eggs and milk! I understand u all have good intentions but why would u even comment with such inexperience? Gets me sick what the big government is feeding down urbthroats, and u guys believe it? It they knew and chemo and radiation works, why the he'll we have more cancer than anything? We didn't have cancer back then. Don't give BS advice, what if they listings to u and the kid died. Knowledge before you you talk goes a long way. U have to be taught before you are the teacher, huh? Dr Robert morse cancer the raw truth look it up you will see what I am talking about. Always seek nothing but the truth. Always be skeptical. But don't let your closed minded skepticism to block you from the truth! Research and learn for yourself. I wantto see this kid live. It's not that difficult.. Dr morse cures these cases everyday. Much love to all you, best of luck.
Joe

"We didn't have cancer back then."

Back when? Cancer has been found in mummies in Egyptian tombs, fossilized human remains and even in dinosaur bones. It appears more prominent now because people are living so much longer; those who live into their 70s and 80s are more prone to develop cancer than people in earlier times who died in childhood, or in their 30s and 40s from infection, malnutrition, trauma etc.

"It they knew and chemo and radiation works, why the he'll we have more cancer than anything?"

Cancer death rates have been declining in recent years, largely due to early detection and treatment, as well as development of effective remedies for once commonly fatal tumors including lymphomas and some germ cell tumors. Those results have a solid evidentiary basis, unlike naturopath Robert Morse's unbelievable claims of curing 95% of cancers.

Here is a link that might be useful: U.S. cancer death rates decline

Eric:

Man man man, what am I going to do with u. All this negativity when I'm trying to show you guys a doctor who well teach you how to help yourself as well as your beloved family.. If you think cancer declined you obviously don't work in a cancer clinics, or even better in Dr. morse office... If you see all the disease out their, you wouldn't say this BS... You love to read a "legit" article published by "legit" people and believe it. Due to treatment based thinking, ur kidding right... You understand that the patient in "remission" could die a few years later from the affects from the "treatment" your talking about and they label that is "cured". If you think his claims are ridicicolous, go to his clinic in Florida, work with him for a month, you'll see what I see. Maybe it's unbelievable because you love the allopathic "early detection" "treatment" " "let's kills cancer". cancer is not a living organism, people are dying everyday, trying to kill cancer" look around you, does this world look healthy? Go sit in the waiting room at a M.D office, see what kind of success they have! I completely understand you are Skeptical, but you don't take the time to thoroughly research this great doctor, who saves hundreds of thousands of lives.. The FDA doesnt want you to know.... Stay skeptical

Joe

Of course the allopathy community does do some great things, surgery, ER,etc. But when it comes to understanding dis-ease and the body, they don't know the frat thing... Maybe to treat acids with acids, sounds like a good idea?... Gets me sick.. There are great M.Ds out there trying to do right! But they are only as good as they are taught... They are taught money, chemicals, drugs. They are not taught nutrition,herbilism, wellness, and spirituality... Do you guys see as many wild animals getting diseases like we do? Of course their are some, from pollution,etc... But far less than what humans do to treat their disease.. treat? Why not cure? Why is it all treatment? They don't know the cure? Keepwalking, make en more money...

Joe

You guys have to understand. I am here to help get people healthy. I am not trying to promote a quack and take your money.You do not need much money to get well. You Don't need to pay thousands if dollars for some treatment. Everyone knows what you eat,drink,breath and put on your skin has some health affect, some people just think it has more influence than others. My father passed away from lung cancer in 09'. I researched for a couple years to find true healing.. I am truly to spread my findings and help people get well. I understand their is always going to be some skeptics and conflicts, they will soon realize the truth. Wish you all well.

Here is a link that might be useful: True Healing

Oh, my!

HerbDoctor

Oh my is right my friend! It's time for people to stop suffering from these mysterious diseases, it's time for them to take care of their own health! It's time to step up and be in charge, no one else is going to help u! It's time to stop fearing these "diseases", start curing them! It's time to put all the negativity and BS aside and get well! The truth will come out in the end! Get well

Joe