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Ultra Sound

Posted by hopefulauthor z5IL (hopefulauthor@sbcglobal.net) on
Tue, Nov 5, 13 at 9:48

Does anyone know how accurate ultra-sounds are?

Someone very close to me had an ultra sound done last Wednesday.
The detailed report said, 'Cell Renal Carcinoma.'

Does anyone know what this means? I looked it up of course, but my question is, how accurate is an ultra sound? Thanks, Toni


Follow-Up Postings:

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RE: Ultra Sound

Hi Toni,

Not wishing to be rude or disrespectful but pls. don't play doctor w/ a diagnosis. Just ASK AN ACTUAL DOCTOR, or whichever doctor gave that diagnosis. If it’s someone so close to you, are you next of kin, such that YOU could ask the Dr.

Ultra sounds are quite accurate (I believe & have always believed so). They're plenty good for pregnant women (for the last 15 yrs. at least) -- is there some reason you don't think they'll be good enough for you?

It's a bit of folly to ask for an interpretation of a diagnosis from a bunch of lay people. Just lookin' out for ya Toni.

I just had one of my thyroid not TWO months ago, to check an odd finding on a cardiovascular scan. I don't have any reason WHATSOEVER to question its veracity or accuracy.

Sounds like you're looking for trouble Toni -- I'd go DIRECTLY TO THE HORSE’S MOUTH!

Speaking literally (likely to frighten you even more):

Renal = kidney

Carcinoma = cancer

While I'm not a Dr. I'm a very experienced lay person. (By the time I was 14 yrs. old, we’d had the Hospital bedside ‘speaking’ of Dad’s will 3 times. My late Dad later had 2 cardiac bypasses & a sub-total gastrectomy. My Mom was gravely ill when I was 5 yrs. old & we almost lost her (rare diseases, she was photographed for the Medical Books for & w/ it)).

Pls. stop speculating & actually ASK for your own sanity & best of luck w/ it.

(PG) Karen


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RE: Ultra Sound

Karen, sorry...I was planning on replying last night, but having IE problems again.

I want to make it clear this issue is NOT about me..

This problem regards my son, and no, I cannot ask his doctor..
Legally, information can't be given once someone is 21 yrs of age.
Believe me, I've tried when problems were going on in the past.
Wish I could go directly to the horses mouth. Too many people are afraid of being sued, so it's NO TELL.
We go to different doctors, the staff doesn't know who I am. If they did, they might explain the situation in detail.
Legally, I cannot phone or go to his doc's office to find out any information.

Yesterday morning, I had an appt with my doc..I showed him a copy of the ultra sound results..
He looked at me, asked who the person was. I explained. He asked, 'what did his doctor say?' He shook his head..His last remark was, 'make sure he goes for the cat scan.'

I know the meanings of renal and carcinoma...shoud have worded my sentence/question different...

Actually, I'd like to know how accurate ultra sounds are, regarding illness/disease, something other than pregnanacy.

So, that's my question.
If anyone had or knows of someone who had an ultra sound, were they diagnosed accurately??

Karen, I'm sorry about your problems too. You were so young..
And your poor mom.
May I ask if she's still on earth? If you'd rather not talk about it I understand..

Did you follow-up on your thryoid. Karen, I pray you did. Don't procrastinate.

My brother had to have half his thyroid removed a couple years ago. Please don't wait.

Hugs, Toni


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RE: Ultra Sound

Hi Toni,

Short version as (1) we're in public & (2) am at work.

The BEST & really only thing you can do is ask your son about it directly &/or ask his permission to speak to his doctors.

"Legally, information can't be given once someone is 21 yrs of age."

True, but w/ his permission they CAN speak to you. With his permission you CAN ask his doctors directly, tho' I'd guess they'll have him sign his consent to this (for legal reasons).

I myself have had an ultrasound to confirm an ailment & the need for surgery & had such surgery which went absolutely fine. Also had ultrasound to follow up a year or 2 after the surgery that all was OK which it was.

Mom is still w/ us, tho' 85 & starting to fail more & more (thought to have had a stroke or something earlier this year, but can't confirm it 'cause she can't have an MRI (has pacemaker).

I absolutely followed up my Thyroid, even more than was recommended. I had the recommended ultrasound, but then also have special access to low dose CT scans & had one for that, which indicates we need to keep an eye (which we already knew). (FYI: I recently read that thyroid cancer is the fastest growing cancer in the U.SA. now; good news is it's supposedly very treatable.)

I understand he's your son Toni, but if you don't ask him directly for info. or for permission to speak to his doctors that's it, there is NOTHING more you can do & it's borderline questionable ethically to ask other doctors about it round-aboutly as you did.

You could offer to take him for the CT scan (then you KNOW he went to get it). Did he tell you he needs one or else how did you find out?

Then again, tho' I know you're looking for personal info here, not online (impersonal), but you could do a Google search of the exact question you asked here; likely to yield a fair amount of info. for you to read as you can't be the only person to ever ask this question.

My other info. is just too personal to post, sorry, maybe a private email if time allows.


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RE: Ultra Sound

Hey Toni,

"Yesterday morning, I had an appt with my doc..I showed him a copy of the ultra sound results.. "

I just re-read your answer & saw the above comment.

Whoever GAVE you a copy of the ulta sound results ALREADY violated your son's privacy. So what did THEY say, or did they give it to you w/out comment? What they did is irresponsible (likely also against the law).


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RE: Ultra Sound

Karen,

Thanks for responding.

I pray your tests come out well, 'whatever the ailment.'

Let's see,., first, after son, Michael was examined and had the ultrasound report in-hand, 'he' asked me to read the copy.

Although I know what carcinoma means, after he left the room I got online, Googled findings on his ultrasound, which was cell renal carcinoma...spent more than an hour looking up information.
Every site said kidney cancer, symtoms, etc. I thought, surely there's a mistake.

When I started this thread, my question was only to find out how accurate ultrasounds were. You see?
Example, 50% or 100%?

Anyway, Michael had a cat-scan done last Wed. The results were sent back to his pcp. .
The nurse phoned yesterday...after Mike and she talked, I asked Michael if he minded if I spoke to her. He gave permission.

Although she's not supposed to give specific info or %, 'she said, there's a 95% Mike has renal cancer among other comments.

Today he goes back to PCP for blood work, and later this month a biopsy.
His appt is set for Nov 21. These damn doctors make people wait and worry!

There's three things that pisses me off..

1. Mike should have had a urinalisis. 'Reasons are on Google.
2. Waiting so long for the biopsy.
3. After he had the cat-scan, the idiot tech told Mike. 'You do unerstand why your doc ordered this test?' Mike looked at him. Tech said, 'he thinks you have cancer.' !!

What assxxx would say such a thing? I thought it was illegal for techs to give information, let alone make such a f'ing stupid statement.
When Mike walked out of the room, 'after cat-scan' he had tears in his eyes..And believe me, Michael rarely cries. The last time he cried was in 2006 when he saw his grandma on her death bed. DH's mother.

We'll know more Monday.

Karen, I tried getting in touch, but you never replied.

You wrote, I had the recommended ultrasound, but then also have special access to low dose CT scans & had one for that, which indicates we need to keep an eye (which we already knew....

What do you mean, 'I also have special access to low dose CT scans?'

Good luck, May God be with you...Toni


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RE: Ultra Sound

Hi Toni,

Sorry your family is going through this, I'll think good thoughts for you & your son next week.

Remember that I'm an ex-smoker? I participate in some studies here looking for the gene marker for lung cancer. One of the requirements is a participant must have smoked for 20 yrs. in order to participate.

So they study me, my blood work, some respiratory tests from time to time some CT scans, which they say are lower dose whatever.

That's what saw the Thyroid stuff I need to monitor. Suggested repeat CT next year & already on for repeat ultrasound in six months more.


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RE: Ultra Sound

Hi Karen,

Sorry I didn't respond sooner. IE isn't working, 'again,' so I don't get emails.

Karen, thank you.
Two more days before his biopsy.

Yes, I remember you quit smoking, and how you ran out of cigs one day...decided you wouldn't go out in the cold to buy a pack and stopped cold turkey.

The study you're involved in sounds great.

Radiation is probably the lower dose, whatever' between a chest x-ray and c-scan.

They removed a portion of my brothers thyroid..2-3 yrs ago. Thank goodness, no problem since.

So, you're not having problems, right?

Karen, you'll be in my prayers. Hugs, Toni


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RE: Ultra Sound

No I'm really NOT having any symptoms (just was discovered on CT scan), just like my Thyroid under producing was discovered by my last Doc who was a hematologist/oncologist & spotted it in my bloodwork.

I figure partaking in the search for the lung cancer gene is the ONLY redeeming thing I can do of any value w/ 42 yrs. wasted smoking, wasted health & wasted money.

FYI: The folks in this area (forgot if it's American Cancer Society or the Pulmonologists (lung docs)) who are now recommending for long time smokers like you & me to have this CT scan yearly to check for problems. This is prophylactic only (& a brand new recommendation) am certain it's not covered by insurance. Should you have any chance to do this test, pls do so (at least once, as a baseline).

(Said by the woman who keeps putting off a colonoscopy, am 57 now, the docs are pushing it as is my best friend, a nurse of 30+ yrs.)

Saying prayers for your son & you for the Biopsy. Pls. try not to worry, tho' I know that's a ridiculous thing to ask of a Mother. May whatever the docs find be (1) nothing at all or (2) totally treatable!

Wishing you the very best vibes Toni & a big, warm hug from afar.

If we don't see you post for a few days, I'll know you're otherwise occupied.

(PG) Karen


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RE: Ultra Sound

Morning Karen,

Today Michael goes for his biopsy. I'm going with for support..appointment time, 4pm.

You've had thorough testing done. That's great considering most docs, 'at least here,' care more about mamos and colonoscopys.
Did you know PCP's get points when their patients have these tests done?

Karen, do I want to die? NO. Also, I don't want to know if I'm going to die either. Every day would be hell. I have major anxiety issues now, I could only imagine how bad PA's would be if I was told..No, I don't want to know.

But, most people would. Especially if they had something to leave. I don't. Well, nothing other than plants.

With all the pain and heartache in the world and predictions, it's just a little, too scary.

You might as well get the colonoscopy. Your doc will hound you until you do.

There's two ways to do it. The first choice..once it's over a second test is done every 10-yrs.
The second is a yearly visit. I won't go into details. :)

I had the first choice done last year...docs request. Also had mam and complete blood count, CBC in Oct. All good.

Karen, thanks for your prayers and positive thoughts. Bless you. I pray all is well with you, too. hugs Toni


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RE: Ultra Sound

Karen, it's 8am. Everyone is sleeping. I had to get online to talk to someone.
Dh has a doc appt at 10pm. I have to wake him at 9.

Michael and I went to the doctor yesterday. It's confirmed he has kidney cancer.
There's so much to do.

Before going to the specialist, we had to stop at our PCP. Mike handed him his results..I thought doctors were supposed to have poker faces, but he let out a shout.
He said Oh No!
He then made copies, and came back to talk to us. He had a different attitude. He 'attempted' sounding optimistic.
He said, the good news is this type of cancer is not the worse. He went in few details, but I could see how upset he was. Mike did too.

I want Mike to go for a second opinion. He was in the army and can see a doc at the VA. He doesn't want to go.

Thanks for your concern. hugs, Toni


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RE: Ultra Sound

Well Hiya Toni,

AM sorry to learn it's not good news, but am glad you got an answer NOW & were not left waiting in anxiety much further.

I absolutely agree about a second opinion, geez sometimes maybe even a 3rd, but definitely a 2nd opinion. Pls. assure your son (if he doesn't know this) it's not more procedures to be done now; it's more Docs to interpret the results of the tests already performed. Pls. remind him knowledge is power, & it's better to know now than not know & it sounds like Docs think it's treatable.

Pls. remember (I remember these things about you) to try & eat (I know you don't want to), get some exercise, walk or ride around the neighborhood unless or until it's too cold & don't smoke everything in sight (just yanking your chain a bit). It's early yet, speaking informationally, so it's time to keep collecting info & taking it all in (takes a while, I know).

Keeping you & your son in my thoughts.

Karen


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RE: Ultra Sound

Thank Karen,

I mentioned going to the VA several times last night, but he listens to dh.
If Mike had gone to the doc when the lump first appeared, 8-months ago, maybe it wouldn't have gone this far.
Dh said it's probably a hernia, which, in fact, according to his c-scan, he has a small hernia too.

Mike said, it'll take months before getting an appt, which may be true. He's been to the VA before, 'for other reasons,' and they do make people wait.

I am distrustful of doctors these days, Karen.
Coco, our dog was diagnosed with heart-worm this summer. I wanted to get a second opinion, but timing, 'they said,' was crucial. In fact, Coco had x-rays the day after being diagnosed.
My point is if there was more time, I could have taken him anywhere, even Petco, for a simple blood test.
The vet made enough to make 5 car payments.

My problem with Mike's doc is...he was sent to this doc for a biopsy..the doc didn't take a biopsy.
Instead, while we were in his office, '2+hours,' he phoned two radiologists who worked with Mike, plus a couple other doctors who read Mike's c-scan.
I asked about the biopsy..he said, it can't be done..the needle can make the cancer spread.

I know opening a person's body can cause cancer to spread..same thing happened to my grandmother. She had lung cancer..they said the roots were wrapped around her heart...if they operated she'd have died on the operating table. She died a few months later.

Still, if there was more time, I'd beg him to go to the VA...the decision is up to him. and dh.

Karen, I have a phone call..thanks for talking to me. hugs, Toni


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RE: Ultra Sound

Hi Toni,

Lean HARD on DH to say what YOU want him to say. This hernia crap is useless & can lose your boy valuable time. I don't mean to be dramatic but if I were you, take DH aside privately & make CRYSTAL clear that if the boy loses time & is harmed by it it will be your DH's responsibility for having mishandled it.

This is only my opinion, but for DH to second guess Specialist doctors is both reckless & irresponsible, how dare he & how can you stand by & allow this? Pardon the question, but is he Mike's biological father? I just can't fathom this sort of lax demeanor of his, when cancer is being discussed!!!

Maybe make the point to DH about if Mike had gone when he first found the lump, but pls. DO NOT make that point to your son.

I'd call the Doc who prescribed the Biopsy & tell him what you were told. Is the Doc who didn't do the biopsy, the Specialist & Cancer doc? or at least the Kidney doc?

What is the Specialist? A nephrologist? An oncologist?

Sorry, as much as I love animals I will not compare their medical care to that of people.

Gonna have to do your best to trust the Docs because what other alternative do you have? Second guessing &/or disbelieving will not help your son.

Wishing well & pls. Toni, get more aggressive; fingers crossed here. Gotta run.


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RE: Ultra Sound

Hi Karen,

How are you?

Karen, you don't know dh. I've talked to him many, many times over the years and since this problem.

He thinks everything is a joke. My brothers can't believe his attitude..not just recently..this has been going on for years.
Dh and I are like day and night. I take things hard, he doesn't. He said I make myself a nervous wreck. Well, damn, our son has cancer, how the f am I supposed to be??

I'm talked gently and firm..doesn't matter.

Yes, Dh is Mike's biological father. Dh loves Mike, but he's never shown it.
Dh and his father weren't close. Think it's a pattern.

Oh, I've pointed out to dh he shouldn't have diagnosed Mike's lump from the beginning. I pleaded with Mike to see a doctor.
I think Mike pretty much figured it out without me uttering a word.

Mike had more testing yesterday, but the cat scan reveals renal carcinoma. It's 100%.
He'll be getting a body scan and a few other tests as soon as the blood/urine tests are read.

Since my last post, I've talked to three doctors and a nurse.

I don't have the specialists card handy, 'Mike has it in his room..he's sleeping, I don't want to wake him,' but the doctor deals specifically with kidneys/cancer. I'll have to check his business card when Mike wakes..

Karen, thanks for listening. If we don't talk, have a wonderful, safe Thanksgiving. Hugs, Toni


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RE: Ultra Sound

Hiya Toni,

I see you're back posting, hoping things have calmed down a bit on your end & that your son is feeling better. Am guessing your Thanksgiving was low key w/ all this.

Mine was quiet thanks, I've got a small family & very little of it left. A strained relationship w/ my Sister & my Mom in Assisted Living, they smartly did Thanksgiving a week early so it didn't conflict w/ family get togethers. So I also went Fri. after Thanksgiving to see her, sad stuff, but she is my Mom & was an excellent Mom too.


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RE: Ultra Sound

Hello Karen,

Sounds like you had a good time..gatherings and visits with your mom.

Is your mother any better? I hope so.
85-yrs is up there, 'even if she didn't have the disease you mentioned earlier.' Can she walk?

She sounds like a real fighter, that's for sure.

I wasn't planning on making a big dinner for Thanksgiving since Michael's appetite has decreased.
I don't talk to my sisters or mother, and my brothers spent time with others.
Wed afternoon, I asked Mike if he wanted turkey for Thanksgiving. He said he did. I ended up going shopping 2pm, got home around 7. Long day.

Since there's just us three, and the dog who loves turkey, our T-day was quiet, too. Afterwards, I watched Christmas movies while Mike and Martin watched football. Mike watched in his room, dh in the living room.

Yes, I posted on GW.
Since my email only works 20% of the time, I can't check the box to receive emails alerting me when a new post is written.
I didn't feel like talking plants before, especially since I'd been neglecting mine.
For some reason, when I feel down and don't give plants the care they need, this is silly, but I feel like I'm cheating by visiting GW. IF that makes sense.

Two days ago I finally got around to watering..
Also, my brother purchased succulents from China..'gifts to me.
I couldn't find care on Google, so asked on C&S forum.
Sux had been sitting in a box over a week.

Regarding Mike. Details are long...We've been to the hospital and doctors several times since my last response.
Last week, he had special urine and blood tests.
They found Mike has a second cancer, but don't know the exact location..The doc said, 'idiot,' "The second cancer can be in the bladder, a tube?, or the thing that looks like a peanut? in Mike's kidney.???'
I don't want shapes, I want names. The doc knows I research online. What the hell am I supposed to type? 'What's the thing in a kidney that looks like a peanut?'

This doctor avoids questions and hesitated when I asked for test result copies.
I swear to God, I wanted to punch his face.
Okay, deep breath.

He ended up giving me a copy of Mike's urine test results, which makes no sense. One would have to be a specialist to understand.
If the test was regarding the spine, I'd understand 95%, but know nothing about kidneys or things that resemble peanuts! And which tubes???

Wednesday, Mike's having a test/surgery where they insert a tube, while sedated,' in his urethra..sp?

A nurse from the hospital, unexpectedly phoned Mike today, told him to be there in an hour for pre-surgery testing. When he explained the reason she called, I thought, PRE-SURGERY?..the nurse told Mike whatever he's having done Wed's is considered surgery, not a test. I don't understand..maybe the reason is because he'll be sedated. Maybe, maybe not.

I'm calling the hospital tomorrow for answers. The nurse told Mike he'll be given paperwork of the so-called surgery after the pre-surgery tests were done. He was given a generic form letter..it said, take b/p in the morning. That was the info she promised!

I Googled docs name for reviews...found three..I'd bet all three were from the same 3 people since each site's reviews were identical.
Doctors/IDIOT's name is Faramarz Eghrari...

The urine report is from Genesis Clinical Lab, Department of Pathology, located in Berwyn, IL.
Testing was done at Westlake Hospital in Melrose Park, IL.

Karen, sorry for the long response, and thanks for asking about our Thanksgiving, etc.
Bet you're sorry you asked... :)

Thanks for listening. I've got a zillion things to do tonight, but feel like sleeping.
My doctor up'd my anxiety medication because my b/p and pulse have been sky-high.

Anyway, I'm happy you got to visit your mom..be thankful you have a considerate, good mother.

Take care, hugs, Toni


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RE: Ultra Sound

Hi Toni. I just now saw this post. Sorry to hear that your family is going through such a terrible situation. How is your son doing now? All my best to him and to you.


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RE: Ultra Sound

Summersunshine, thank you.

My son had surgery last Friday. They removed the tumor and part of his kidney. He's back home, recovering.

Now, it's a matter of waiting. Thanks again, Toni


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RE: Ultra Sound

Hi
Had to comment on this post as I was diagnosed with stage 4 lung cancer in July /10 after a biopsy confirmed it
The original treatment plan was for cyberknife radiation
followed by aggresive chemo. I accepted the cyberknife
but rejected chemo due to side effects. Was told less than
a 10 percent surbvival without both.
Both the tumor and the scar disappeared after treatment. In 12 two "nodules " were found in the same lung. Sent to the hospital for markers but they were unable to locate them so treatment was canceled .
In Dec of 13 cat scan revealed "Suspicious shadows "
Had PET scan with full enhancement . Just had the full
reading yesterday ." There is no cancerous activity in the lungs,pancreus,brain,prostrate." Shadowing " was undoubtedly caused by mucus " Patient continues to have lung damage caused by emphezema as expected"
Another PET scan is slated for June 14.
I'm very relieved as I can't take cyberknife again and
will NOT take chemo. I guess you can survive lung cancer?? lol gary


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RE: Ultra Sound

Toni, I hope that your son recovers quickly!

Gary, sorry to hear you too have had to deal with cancer. I am glad that it sounds like things are going better for you now.
After seeing a loved one go through chemotherapy two different times for different cancers, I did want to say that chemotherapy is not always as bad as you might expect. Different chemo drugs vary in how serious the side effects are - some are really hard on the body but some are not really so bad. They also have found better ways to treat the side effects of chemotherapy nowadays. Thank goodness some progress has been made.


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RE: Ultra Sound

Hi
Well,both brothers ,mother,father 2 uncles , one SIL and one BIL all had chemo and passed away all within 3 years . Mother in particular was bed ridden from after effects for over a year.. Treatment was MUCH worse than the cancer . Have heard about all the "progress " but don't see it .
Still got two more years before I'm "cured" so hopefully won't have to make a decision.
Hope things work out for your son!! and thanks for the good wishes. gary


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RE: Ultra Sound

Sorry, I rarely check email so wasn't aware anyone responded.

Sunshine, thank you.

Gary..I'm so very sorry.

I didn't know people survived from lung cancer, either, but you're living proof it's curable.
Thank God...

I'm unfamiliar with cyberknife radiation, but I'll read up on the procedure.

Gary, you said you have two more years before you're cured.
In the next two years, do you have to take tests? Are there certain symptoms to check for?

I'm honestly sorry you went through this, but happy you've been able to maintain good health.

We just got back from the doctor. He told son, Michael everything looks good..'as far as stitches go.
Now, Mike has a growth on his underarm, which I believe is a gland.
Another trip to his PCP to get a referral to get imaging done..I don't know if it'll be a cat scan or MRI..

In May, Mike will have another kidney MRI and blood work.
The scary thing was, chemo doesn't rid cell renal carcinoma.
I am grateful Mike went for a second opinion. The first doctor, a man I detest,' wasted time, and didn't know what he was doing.
Doctor 2 checked and tested Mike, then within 2.5 weeks, the tumor was removed.
When I think about the pain doctor 1 put my son through! 3-weeks with a stent and catheter. No pain meds!

Guess I shouldn't complain though. The tumor is gone, and hopefully, will not return.

Now, I have the gland?? to worry over.

Anyway, Gary, you're in my prayers. Continue doing whatever you do to stay healthy.
Work with plants, that'll keep you busy.. :) hugs, Toni


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RE: Ultra Sound

Toni I wish I had known about this. I could have been of so much help for you. Back in 2011 I was diagnosed with kidney cancer. My tumor was 7.8cm and they had to remove the whole kidney. Due to the size doctors did not mess around and had me in for surgery 5 weeks after diagnosis.

You are right that chemo doesn't work on kidney cancer. It is a slow growing cancer and chemo targets fast growing cells, because most cancers are fast growing. That is also why people lose their hair on chemo, because hair is fast growing cells.

I don't know what is happening with your son now, but chances are really good that he is doing fine cancer wise. The fact that they did a partial is a good sign that the tumor was most likely on the smaller size. All he needs to do is keep getting his scheduled imaging to be sure nothing comes back. Don't let them try to stop imaging after 5 years. Some doctors think all is clear at the 5 year point. Kidney cancer reoccurrences don't have a deadline. It is a trickster of a cancer. I have seen people 20 years out develop their first reoccurrence.

As for ultrasounds... you probably know this by now, but... The best way to see and diagnose a kidney cancer tumor is with a cat scan with contrast dye. Tumors have blood flow. Contrast dye shows where the blood is flowing. Contrast helps a doctor clearly see it is a tumor vs a fluid filled cyst.

I hope you and your son are doing better now. If you need someone to talk to you have my email address.


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