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Do you Superthrive?

GrowHappy
17 years ago

I've been using this(when I think about it) for the past 3-4 months. Since I don't use it regularly, I can't say that I see any real difference in my plants vitality. The instructions say that it is to be used with your regular fertilizer. For those of you who DO use it regularly, what do you say about this product's powers or lack thereof?

GH

Comments (31)

  • ooojen
    17 years ago
    last modified: 9 years ago

    Oooo, the hot topic! Hopefully, you'll get Al's scientific input on this.
    I gave ST a try, in spite of all the "snake oil" type claims on the bottle. I didn't notice any remarkable changes, either, though some people say they do. One person even went so far as to claim she saw almost instantaneous results--- faster that it'd be possible for the roots to take up the stuff and deliver it to the foliage---so I'd say there's placebo effect by proxy going on some of the time. I'm quite sure other people do legitimately see improvement in their plants after using the stuff, but ST's may or may not be the cause of the improvement. If I'd poured Mississippi River water on my plant a week or two ago, I could be convinced it was miracle stuff! Then again, maybe it was extra heat, sun and humidity we've lately that has made them take off.

  • rhizo_1 (North AL) zone 7
    17 years ago
    last modified: 9 years ago

    This has been much discussed in this forum and you might as well take advantage of what has been said in the past!

    I don't believe most of the hype, having tried it rather extensively in the past. Coincidence plays an important role here, I believe. I often use it when sticking a bunch of cuttings, however. In rooting medium, not water.

    The placebo effect is interesting. I've told MANY people (including right here in the GW) to use diluted TEA when watering their plants instead of all that cotton pickin' fertilizer! What will the tea do? Nada. Except protect the plant from over fertilization, lol. Oh, and give the person a sense that they are still doing something for their plants! Over nurturing kills many a plant.

    Here is a link that might be useful: Search 'superthrive'

  • tapla (mid-Michigan, USDA z5b-6a)
    17 years ago
    last modified: 9 years ago

    "... placebo effect by proxy ..." Good one, Jen. ;o)

    No need for me to get into what's sure to be a disagreement - Dorie saves the day w/ a link to the past.

    Al

  • pirate_girl
    17 years ago
    last modified: 9 years ago

    Well, I've used it w/ some regularity & have to say I haven't quite noticed a difference either way. So I'm on the fence abt it & have continued to use it (on water-rooting cuttings too) figuring it can't hurt.

    Recently I've received a sample of Eleanor's VF-11 & am starting to try that now. Can't really say what it's thought to be except from reading its lit., it seems more like a supplement-type tonic than fertilizer per se. Says to use it in place of fertilizer tho'.

    Am particularly interested to see if it pushes my Hoyas into bloom, that's my main interest in it!

    For recent discussions of Eleanor's VF-11, pls. search the Hoya Forum.

  • birdsnblooms
    17 years ago
    last modified: 9 years ago

    For those of you who know me, also know I like ST. Been using it for yrs..
    Honest to God, I had a plant that was on the way out..gave it a drink of ST and a few days later a new leaf formed. I was shocked. But I started using it way before this happened..
    The best way to judge is to use it..If you go to their site, they'll send a sample bottle..I think they want .60 for shipping.
    This topic is debatable and can lead to arguments, which I don't want..Please, let's don't argue. Life is too short..We either like it or don't..
    This can be said for many things..has anyone ever seen the new Miracle Gro ad on tv where a woman is spraying her flowers using MG? The flowers are beautiful. I'm sure there are ppl who use MG, Peter's, etc, and their plants die..
    So, it depends on many factors. If someone doesn't water a tropical for 3 months, then applies ST, is it going to survive? Heck no..I don't care what they use..Toni

  • rhizo_1 (North AL) zone 7
    17 years ago
    last modified: 9 years ago

    Toni? Who's arguing? Nobody, dear girl! Your input is extremely important! Of all the forums here in the GardenWeb, this is the one where we feel the most comfortable in expressing our personal experiences and opinions.

    (((Toni))) Thanks for all that you bring to us.

  • birdsnblooms
    17 years ago
    last modified: 9 years ago

    Rhizo, no one is arguing but I've seen this topic get out of hand in other forums. So much so that GW deleted the whole thing..LOL.
    I feel the same about you..You are very helpeful and I respect your opinions. Thanks to you, too..Toni

  • wiccadgardener
    17 years ago
    last modified: 9 years ago

    I use ST on cuttings and when transplanting or repotting. I did my own little (very unscientific) experiment on several cuttings and the cuttings that I used ST on did develop roots sooner. I've never noticed any difference when using it on established plants, though. Even though it has nothing to do with this post I would like to say seaweed tea is AMAZING!! It even seems to repel bugs, but if you use on house plants (always dilute it) put them outside for a while, the smell is horrendous (I've heard it doesn't smell as bad if you aerate it, but I couldn't do that)

  • tropicalfreak
    17 years ago
    last modified: 9 years ago

    i use spray and grow...i dont spray it on tthe leaves like suggested, i mix with water. does wonders. i was never happy with superthrive.
    cliff

  • birdsnblooms
    17 years ago
    last modified: 9 years ago

    I also use a spray called SuperGRo..You spray a plant once or twice..flowers last longer, leaves look nice and green. It's main ingredient is Gibberic acic, I'm sure the spelling is incorrect, but I don't have a bottle handy. Toni

  • thomasmc
    16 years ago
    last modified: 9 years ago

    (Quote)rhizo_1: "I've told MANY people (including right here in the GW) to use diluted TEA when watering their plants instead of all that cotton pickin' fertilizer! What will the tea do? Nada."

    Oh dear. I hope you aren't using that to qualify your belief that ST is useless.

    Actually, tea most certainly DOES have an effect on plants.

    First, like everything, tea has a pH level, which affects the pH level of the soil. Tea is mildly acidic, so if you have alkaline water and acid loving plants, they would love a drink of tea.

    Second, tea has small amounts of many minerals, including phosphorous, and potassium. Yum.

    Also, tea has amino acids, which will feed the bacteria in the soil.

    And tea - especially green and white teas - are packed with antioxidants, which neutralize free radicals. Free radicals damage plant DNA just as they do ours. Free radicals are also known to inhibit root growth.

    Personally, I give my plants leftover tea all the time, and they thrive on it.

    BTW: ST is not fertilizer. Says so right on the package.

  • mkiker
    16 years ago
    last modified: 9 years ago

    The tough thing about fertz and additives is that plants are so spotty anyway. I have two palm trees on my front porch and for some reason one is just sitting there and the other has tripled in size in a month (they are less than saplings). If I had put anything different in one or the other I'd have thought I'd found the miracle product but I can't think of a single difference.

    Right now I'm using VF-11 but I'm unscientifically putting it on everything (no control groups). I think it's helping on two plants that were doing well already. I have an aspidistra and a sans. moonglow that were already producing new leaves and the VF-11 may or may not have speed their growth up. On plants that aren't in production I've yet to see anything.

    I've ordered a sample of Supertrhive off of ebay. I'm going to experiment with a low dose of it WITH the VF-11 (even though VF-11 "likes to work alone"). My understanding is that Superthrive is basically a rooting hormone that causes plants to spend more time on root development that may in the long term pay off with more hardy plants.

    Someone with a green thumb better than mine and a scientific mind should do a true test. Get a sample and about 8 plants, four of one type four of another. Put superthrive in 2 of each and use just water in the other 2 to see if it helps or not.

    Since the Supertrhive thread was deleted does anyone have positive stories to share? I want to see both sides of the coin.

  • birdsnblooms
    16 years ago
    last modified: 9 years ago

    Thomas, thanks for the info about tea..Do you know if there's a difference between herbal tea and black tea? I drink herbal tea at night, and little black tea during the day. No coffee here..

    Mk, I don't have any scientific examples, but I notice plants do much better when treated w/ST once a month. AV's seem to bloom longer for one thing..Citrus send out fruit and flowers..same w/hibiscus..plant foliage looks greener.
    I also noticed when adding ST to seedlings (sowed seed) they sprouted faster than those who don't get ST.
    I agree w/you..for those who are cynical, get the free sample on their site..I think they charge .60 for shipping..give it a try..see how u like it..that's the only way to test it yourself, and make your own judgement. Toni

  • mkiker
    16 years ago
    last modified: 9 years ago

    Toni, do you use both Superthrive and VF-11? That's what I'm planning on doing.

    I've read that superthrive MAY have a growth hormone that if overdone will actually retard growth. I wonder if that's why so many people have negative effects. They may pour it on hoping for a big "boost" and either negate itself or actually slow things down. That's just a guess though from what others have theorized on the net. You can get a sample or buy it cheap enough on ebay. It gets diluted down so much the price is really quite low when you factor in how much it makes.

  • ermbonsai
    16 years ago
    last modified: 9 years ago

    I am going to do an experiment with superthrive and grass seeds to see if it really helps seeds germinate faster. I have a lawn that I am slowly cultivating so I will post later some results of my usage.

    Anybody used superthrive on moss? How about spraying superthrive on the "leaves" of bonsais like junipers?

  • birdsnblooms
    16 years ago
    last modified: 9 years ago

    MK, I've never tried VF-11, but heard nothing but positive results from those who use it..
    You know, Mk, the only neg feedback I've heard was that ST was a snake oil..LOL..Well, unless someone actually uses it, they'll never know what they're missing.. I notice a big difference using ST w/seedlings/cuttings and a few bareroot plants that were delivered to my house when it was cold..I thought they were goners..2 Euphorbia Crown of Thorns and a Variegated (Adenium) Desert Rose..I applied ST and voia, green, leaves and LIVE roots..whew..

    Emrbonsai, please do NOT mist your plants with ST..it is not to be used as a foliar spray. I realize there's quite a bit of writing on the label, but if and when you have time, you'll see it reads it's not to be used as a foliar spray..I believe it's also stated on their website.. www.superthrive.com Toni

  • tapla (mid-Michigan, USDA z5b-6a)
    16 years ago
    last modified: 9 years ago

    Superthrive or Superjivesize>

    The question regarding the value of Superthrive as a miracle tonic for plants is often bandied about in horticultural circles. Over the years, I had read claims that ranged from, "I put it on my plant, which had never bloomed, and it was in full bloom the next day." to, "It was dead - I put Superthrive on it and the next day it was alive and beautiful, growing better than it ever had before." I decided to find out for myself.

    If you look for information on the net, you will probably only find the manufacturers claims and anecdotal observations, both so in want of anything that resembles a control. Though my experiments were far from purely scientific, I tried to keep some loose controls in place so that I could make a fair judgment of its value, based my own observations. Here is what I did, what I found, and the conclusions I made about any value the product Superthrive might hold for me.

    On four separate occasions, I took multiple cuttings of plants in four different genera. In each case the group of cuttings were taken from the same individual plant to reduce genetic variance. The plant materials I used were: Ficus benjamina, (a tropical weeping fig) Luna apiculata (Peruvian myrtle), Chaenorrhinum minus (a dwarf snapdragon), and an unknown variety of Coleus. In each instance, I prepared cuttings from the same plant and inserted them in a very fast, sterile soil. The containers containing half of the cuttings were immersed/soaked in a Superthrive solution of approximately 1/2 tsp per gallon of water to the upper soil line. The other half of the cuttings were watered in with water only. In subsequent waterings, I would water the "Superthrive batch" of cuttings with a solution of 10 drops per gallon and the others with only water. The same fertilizer regimen was followed on both groups of cuttings. In all four instances, the cuttings that I used Superthrive on rooted and showed new growth first. For this reason, it follows that they would naturally exhibit better development, though I could see no difference in overall vitality, once rooted. I can also say that a slightly higher percentage of cuttings rooted that were treated with the Superthrive treatment at the outset. I suspect that is directly related to the effects of the auxin in Superthrive hastening initiation of root primordia before potential vascular connections were destroyed by rot causing organisms.

    In particular, something I looked for because of my affinity for a compact form in plants was branch (stem) extension. (The writer is a bonsai practitioner.) Though the cuttings treated with Superthrive rooted sooner, they exhibited the same amount of branch extension. In other words, internode length was approximately equal and no difference in leaf size was noted.

    As a second part to each of my "experiments", I divided the group of cuttings that had not been treated with Superthrive into two groups. One of the groups remained on the water/fertilizer only program, while the other group was treated to an additional 10 drops of Superthrive in each gallon of fertilizer solution. Again, the fertilizer regimen was the same for both groups. By summerÂs end, I could detect no difference in bio-mass or vitality between the two groups of plants.

    Since I replicated the above experiment in four different trials, using four different plant materials, I am quite comfortable in drawing some conclusions as they apply to me and my growing habits or abilities. First, and based on my observations, I have concluded that Superthrive does hold value for me as a rooting aid, or stimulant if you prefer. I regularly soak the soil, usually overnight, of my newly root-pruned and often bare-rooted repots in a solution of 1/2 tsp Superthrive per gallon of water. Second, and also based on my observations, I no longer bother with its use at any time other than at repotting. No evidence was accumulated through the 4 trials to convince me that Superthrive was of any value as a "tonic" for plants with roots that were beyond the initiation or recovery stage.

    Interestingly, the first ingredient listed as being beneficial to plants on the Superthrive label is vitamin B-1 (or thiamine). Growing plants synthesize their own vitamin B-1 as a by-product of their metabolism, as do many of the fungi and bacteria having symbiotic relationships with plant roots, so it's extremely doubtful that vitamin B-1 could be deficient in soils or that a growing plant could exhibit a vitamin B-1 deficiency.

    Some will note that I used more of the product than suggested on the container. I wanted to see if any unwanted effects surfaced as well as trying to be sure there was ample opportunity for clear delineation between the groups. I suspect that if a more dilute solution was used, the difference between groups would have been even less clear.

    It might be worth noting that since the product contains the growth regulator (hormone) auxin, its overuse can cause defoliation, at least in dicots. The broad-leaf weed killer Weed-B-Gone and the infamous "Agent Orange", a defoliant that saw widespread use in Viet Nam, are little more than synthetic auxin.

    Al Fassezke

  • christianme
    16 years ago
    last modified: 9 years ago

    mkiker,I tried eleanor's vf-11.I could tell no difference in my plants at all.I am fully aware there are those that have had different results than mine.

  • watergal
    16 years ago
    last modified: 9 years ago

    Al, fascinating experiment - thank you!

  • ricortes
    15 years ago
    last modified: 9 years ago

    Wandered in here from the propogation and citrus forums.

    Tapla had some pretty down to earth results. To figure out just how much hormone is hitting the plant is fairly easy. Label says .048% NAA => 480 ppm. If you are diluting it 5 ml/4l or ~1 to 1000 then your final concentration is .48 ppm.

    Likewise "the drop in a small cup" thing is in my guessimate 1/20 ml in ~6 oz coffee cup => 175 ml. implies a 3,500:1 dilution or .137 ppm.

    Just for reference sake, I think a lot of the people doing plant propogation would question this low of a concentration. For dry application typically 2000 ppm of an auxin would be used. The most dilute concentration I have seen in journals is something like 5 ppm applied continuously in a mist chamber. This is for hard to root plants like chestnut or walnut, but still...

    It probably doesn't hurt to have a little auxin there. It probably helps to have a little vitamin B there. I wonder if there really are 50 things in the formulation but unless they are plutonium and asbestos the concentrations are probably so low they won't be noticed. I've tried some of the other formulations in the lit, like Murashige & Skoog medium with Gamborg's vitamins and I have to use it at 1/8th the reccomended concentration to keep from burning stuff.

    I did pick up some Superthrive because I absolutely, positively, couldn't wait to get some B-1 to something I am transplanting. I have some simple techniques I use that may give an indication of effectiveness but it will be limited to the specifics of what plant I use for the test. That is, the same concentration that works for one plant surely can't be applied to everything.

    Rick

  • ines_99
    15 years ago
    last modified: 9 years ago

    I also think it is all hype, though I have purchased a small bottle of this stuff twice and may even buy it again.. (hey, you should see the cabinet in my bathroom where I keep all my "miracle" beauty creams and potions!!)

    I used it mostly for reviving cuttings, not sure if it worked or not. I believe more and more that if a plant has good quality potting soil, then it should be able to get all the nutrients it needs from that. Occasionally watering with rain water is good too. That being said, I still fertilize in the growing months of the year, with a weak solution of miracle gro or peters or the beer fertilizer at each watering - but I don't believe that superthrive does much of anything.

  • ricortes
    15 years ago
    last modified: 9 years ago

    I did just a little bit of work with Superthrive. Other then applying to a number of plants, I dried to constant weight a small sample. The label says 25% solids by weight and that is accurate within experimental error.

    I also did just a bit of figuring. After taking some weights of potted plants before and after watering I think it is reasonable to assume IAA concentration will build up to an effective level if not during the initial drying stage then certainly after several waterings. There is also the partition coefficient thing that nobody studying plants seems to quantify. Think of it like DDT concentrating in birds and larger fish.

    BUT that still doesn't give a reason to claim instant results like the advertisments.

    I've got some hints at what the other 24.9% could be. A lot of varied insects seem to be setting up camp on my plants that were sprayed with ST. The label hints at it implying plants can get on with the growing since they don't have to make certain compounds. I believe the ST formula was derived in the 40s and I'm also vaguely familiar with what was known about plants in the 50s since I was born in 1950.

    I could be wrong but to me it seems likely most of that 24.9% is some form of carbohydrates such as glucose or fructose. It could be derived from a nonobvious source such as malt syrup or corn syrup. Heck, it could even be honey! Sugars in plants is obvious from maple tree sap ~2% sugar to the mentioned malting grains. I've even used Pabst's Hop Flavored Malt Syrup but it was for brewing some beer that never got poured on my plants.

    Sugars are a well known additive in culture media. Using something like malt sugar or malt syrup would probably be an excuse to claim '50 micronutients' on the label. Vitamin B1, auxin, and sugars used for plant cultures.

    It will be a while but I will try to get access to a conductivity and pH meter. Lack or low conductivity and neutral pH would be indicative of some type of sugar vs. typical fertilizer like ammonium phosphate.

    Rick

  • birdsnblooms
    15 years ago
    last modified: 9 years ago

    I'm a firm believer in Superthrive, but that's just my opinion.
    If one doesn't think it works, then don't buy it. It's like watching a tv show. If one finds a show boring, change the channel. It's that simple.

    Rick, Superthrive is not meant to be used as a foliage spray..The directions state, specifically, "do not spray leaves."
    There are many reasons insects land on plants that are outdoors in sumemr..I don't agree sugar or sugar sources are added as fillers.
    Take a whiff..It's surely doesn't smell sweet. If you're curious about its ingredients write to the company. Toni

  • mlevie
    15 years ago
    last modified: 9 years ago

    hopefulauthor,

    It's the tannins in black tea that give it the acidity, so if you're using it to maintain a more acid environment the black tea might be better. However, since herbal teas are also made from plant leaves, I'm assuming they will also have some trace amounts of minerals that houseplants will benefit from (and some herbal teas do taste kind of astringent to me--I'm thinking hibiscus tea, for instance). Think of it as instant compost tea--it's just the remains of previous plant material that you've broken down super-fast by boiling.

    Similarly, whenever I boil vegetables (pasta too), I let the water cool and feed it to my plants, and they seem to be very happy to have it.

  • puglvr1
    15 years ago
    last modified: 9 years ago

    Thanks for sharing your results with your experience/experiments with the superthrive Al. I too have fallen to the lure of this product and have used several bottles in my gardening years. I would finish a small bottle and then say, I don't see any improvements on the plants I used it on. Several months later, I would come across it again and would say, give it one more try, maybe they have improved it, LOL... and see if the hype is true? Again I am disappointed. More than anything, I wanted it to work like some of the people that used it and swears by it. For me I never saw it. Finally I can say, no more superthrive for me...it is way too expensive for me to "keep trying" it. I am glad there are people that have seen great results but I am not one of them, I'm sorry to say.

  • birdsnblooms
    15 years ago
    last modified: 9 years ago

    Mlevie..I don't remember talking about tea..LOL..perhaps it was mentioned in an earlier post when this thread started, but it's been a while since reading older posts. Ironically, I add tea bags in old milk containers filled with water, let them sit, and use the tinted water.
    It's funny you mentioned using boiling water from veggies and pasta..I usually make veggies w/dinner. Yesterday, while draining, the concept of saving water from veggies came to mind. (cooling first, of course.) Then while reading your post tonight, I had to laugh..
    I think it's a great idea, from now on, water from veggies will go in a second pot until cooled, then placed in an old milk container.
    What does pasta water do? What I mean is, what benefits does it have? (other than starch?) Thanks for bringing it up; no water will be wasted. How about potatoes?

    Hey Pug, how ya doing? I hope all is well, and you and the family had a great 4th. How did the pups adapt to fireworks? Sam (Mastiff is hiding in the basment, lol) and Coco (Shih tzu) barks when a fire cracker goes off, which is approximately every 3 seconds. sheesh.
    As for ST, everyone has different experiences. For one, I think the type of plant has something to do with results.
    I did my own, semi-experiment. My newest loves (since last summer) are bare root Adeniums (Desert Roses) and bare root Euphorbia Crown of Thorns. I divided succulents in two sections. All in the same window, same size containers, and same soil mix. One half were given ST, the other half none. No fertilizers were applied. The half that were ST'ed sent out three times as much foliage as those that didn't get any. It may be coincidence, but I'm too optimistic in this product to believe that.
    Price can be high depending on where it's bought..a local nursery charges more than vendors on Ebay, therefore when I purchase a bottle, it's bought through Ebay or an online store. Which leads me to another reason for using it. I admit, St isn't the cheapest product around. Our income is average. If I didn't truly believe ST worked, there'd be no way on earth I'd spend money for a useles product.
    You mentioned using small bottles for your garden? Quit, waited a few months then retried. I'm not 100% certain, but IMO, I think using regularly makes a difference. I don't agree with this 1/4 teas per gallon which is way too much..The old packages said use 1-4 drops per gallon; stressed plants, 10 drops per gallon. (of water)
    I'm not trying to talk anyone into using ST..it's sure not like I have ST stock..LOL.
    Again, hope you and everyone else had a wonderful, safe holiday. Can't believe it's almost over..Toni

  • tapla (mid-Michigan, USDA z5b-6a)
    15 years ago
    last modified: 9 years ago

    Food for thought, and perhaps some help with putting things in perspective: I just scanned this entire thread, and of all the posts, only ONE poster has had positive results using Superthrive in an ongoing program as a tonic. 12 of the posters upthread find it of no use to this purpose. One finds it indispensable.

    I'm not trying to talk anyone OUT of using it, but I will caution them not to expect the wildly miraculous results claimed by the makers of this stuff (or possibly any results, as many/most of us have discovered. You can base this either on my semi-scientific findings, or the number of those reporting it useless vs those that tout it.).

    Al

  • greenbow722_hotmail_com
    15 years ago
    last modified: 9 years ago

    Hey all,
    Someone asked for any positive results form Superthrive. I came upon this product back in 1982 in Vicksburg, MS. I bought some African Violets from a woman who grew them to sell and was member of the African Violet Society. She had the most healthy violets I had ever seen, with enormous leaves. I asked her what she did to get them so healthy. Among her secrets, she recommened Superthrive. I have used it faithfully since then. From 1990 to 1995 I had my own violet business. I sold finished plants to florists and leaves by mail order, and I was an active member of the African Violet Society. I consistently grew plants that were 18"-24" in diameter, and I have pictures to prove it. My regimen included 12 hours of flourecent light per day as well as 1/4 tsp of peters fertilizer and 1 drop of Supethrive per gallon of water at every watering. It was during this time that I started using it on other plants. I used it on bare root roses, soaking them in a bucket overnight with a few teasooons of ST. I also used in on stressed plants to revive them. From 1997-2002 I was a involved with the interior plantscaping industry and I introduced ST to my staff as part of our company's normal plant care regimen. Within one year our replacements dropped by 10%. In 2003 I became the conservatory manager for Lewis Ginter Botanical Gardens in Richmond, VA. It was a brand new facility with mostly brand new plants and some older plants. All were direct planted into beds or new clay pots. We used superthive as part of our watering schedule once a week for the 3 years I was there. The plants were very healthy looking. We received many comliments on the health and beauty of our plants. I now work as a landscaper and I use ST on all our new installations and I also give it to all my customers. I continue to use it regularly on my own landscape and house plants. I have never claimed that it would revive a dead plant nor will it perform miracles. My experience is that it works very well for new cuttings, transplants, and stressed plants. It also helps to maintain healthy plants. Whatever it has in it, it does stimulate the plant. I have seen it stimulate a plant to produce leaves when it doesn't have any. I will not say that it directly produces flowers, but a healthy plant will flower. I think it may have trace elements in it. Most fertilizers do not have the other 13 elements that plants need besides the big three of nitrogen, phosphorus, and potassium. That may be why it is like a breath of fresh air when it is given to a stressed plant. If you have a plant that is already healthy and you use ST, it probably will not show much of a difference, because the plant is getting everything it needs. Ie...not all plants need fertilizer. They need it only if the soil is depleted of certain nutrients. It may be that your plant does not need what is in ST at the moment because the soil is still fertile. If you do nothing to the soil, it will eventually be depleted of certain nutrients, especially micronutrients which are not included in regular fertilizer. I will say this...Superthive is not snakeoil. It is like any other product. It depends on the situation and the way it is used as to whether you see big results ot little results. I for one, will never be without it.

  • tapla (mid-Michigan, USDA z5b-6a)
    15 years ago
    last modified: 9 years ago

    Since RR had nothing that resembles a control group, I wonder how he determined it was the ST that made the difference, rather than the other myriad changes that were taking place, along with what are his likely considerable growing skills? I mentioned that cuttings on which I used ST rooted faster, and I do use it when I repot bonsai trees, but in many side by side experiments using it as a tonic, or pick-me-up, I found it valueless.

    If a plant is healthy, and you apply ST, how do you KNOW it is helping to maintain the health of that plant? After all, wasn't it healthy before the application. Can we really expect ST to revive stressed/strained plants. I think probably not. Even the most common reasons for stress number in multiple dozens. Compacted soil, over/under-watering, nutrient deficiencies, nutrient toxicities, high/low humidity, poor light, temperature extremes, a big one - high EC and TDS in soils from salts build-up, et al, are a very few of the most common adversities that a containerized plant faces - often in combinations/multiples. Will ST cure these stress causing cultural maladies? Wouldn't it be better to focus our time, energy, and money on correcting the real source of the stress/strain?

    As noted above in 'Superthrive or Superjive'size>, plants manufacture their own vitamin B1, so to tout that as an ingredient is like a pharmaceutical producer asking you to buy their medicine that supposedly helps alleviate breathing difficulty because it contains air.

    If I had to take a best guess, I would say there is something in it that stimulates root initials (likely a synthetic auxin), but beyond that, my attempts to nail down any additional benefit have been fruitless.

    So far, Ricortes (see his post further upthread) and I are the only posters that have tried to inject enough scientific control in our experimentation to be able to judge ST-treated plants of the same genetic material against plants not treated with ST. I found no difference in multiple trials. Obviously, perceived value varies by individual, but for myself, I'll trust what I've seen on a comparative basis before I'll trust the unverifiable claims of the manufacturer or other individuals.

    Al

  • birdsnblooms
    15 years ago
    last modified: 9 years ago

    Rick, I'm happy to hear you're another satisfied ST user. BTW, I've recently become an AVSA member, not to mention, updated numerous AV's to my collection, most I've never heard of before growing so attached to these beautiful, fuzzy leaf flowering plants.

    About ST, one either believes it works, or doesn't. For those who have used and didn't notice any difference, considers it an expensive snake oil, nobody is breaking their arm to purchase.
    For those of us who use it with positive results, there are sellers on Ebay who offer ST for less than most local nurseries. Shop on Ebay.

    I visit other forums. There are literally thousands who use ST and wouldn't be without it. Like I stated, it's a matter of opinion.

    It's asked, why would a healthy plant require ST? For the same reason a healthy plant needs fertilizer. Added vitamins and hormones as fertilizer contains NPK.
    I for one do not use the recommended dosage...in other words, 4-5 drops of ST per gallon of water is sufficient, though if a plant has health issues, I increase 10 drops per gallon, though thankfully, this seldom happens.

    In US alone, there are millions who use vitamins. Like ST, some people consider vitamins an overpriced snake oil.
    Then there are a large group of people who feel healthier taking vitamins.
    Vitamins of any type take time. One bottle, of say a Multiple Vitamin may not be enough, so one continues taking daily, in many cases for the remainder of their lives. Because ST contains vitamins, one bottle may not be adequate before a difference is noted. Toni

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