Now I see what's going on. I'm sorry to say that the plant can't survive as it is now. If the roots are growing below the rock, the plant will continue to lay down layers of cells on the outside of the vascular cambium, while the cells on the inside of the cambium die. The notable swelling that is occurring in the trunk immediately above the rock is a clear indication that the constriction of the cambium where the trunk enters the rock is blocking the downward flow of carbohydrates, and they are accumulating there. The bad part of that news is the roots can't survive much longer with their food supply cut off. (Plants make their own food in the leaves & then translocate it to roots and other parts. Fertilizer isn't plant food - sugar, made during photosynthesis is.)

There is good news though. What you CAN do, is convert your plant into a root-over-rock bonsai.
{{gwi:67909}}

{{gwi:30121}}

The pictures above are just taken so I can review my plants' progress. I'm not saying they're masterpieces, only that you can get the roots to grow over the rock & end up with something like the above if you like. No matter what you do, getting roots to grow from the trunk ABOVE the rock is imperative if your plant is to survive.

Al

Thank you Al! This is not bad news at all! May main concern is keeping her alive. What's the best way to prop her up while the roots grab? Why do they sell them like this? There were atleast 50 for sale! All growing through rock.

Thank you Al! This is not bad news at all! May main concern is keeping her alive. What's the best way to prop her up while the roots grab? Why do they sell them like this? There were atleast 50 for sale! All growing through rock.

For a time, the plant can live, even thrive as roots permeate the featherstone, sort of like rock wool, if you're familiar with that soil amendment/horticultural product. Eventually though, the plant is going to perish.

Essentially, you have a situation something like this one that I created intentionally to get rid of the old root mass on this plant and replace it with an entirely new root system.
{{gwi:10877}}

The little zip ties wrapped around the trunk provide the same constriction the rock is imposing on your plant. The trunk will swell above the ties from the carbohydrate/growth regulator (auxin) build-up, and roots will occur immediately above the bands after the plant is repotted deeply in the soil so the area stays continually moist but not wet. In order to make the roots emerge at the same level and evenly spaced around the trees base, something highly coveted for bonsai, I helped the tree along like this:
{{gwi:10879}}

The little holes were drilled with a brad-point drill I just spun with my hands until it cut through the cambium. I then filled the holes with a little rooting gel (Clonex CLO100) and repotted.

In a year or two, I'll end up with a root system like you see on this plant, on which I used a thick wire to 'girdle' the trunk.
{{gwi:2314}}

If you look closely, you can still see the wire and you can notice the swelling that occurred prior to or in conjunction with new root formation. Your plant should root fairly quickly if it makes it.

To root your plant, you'll need a pot deeper than the bonsai pot and barely large enough to accommodate the size of the stone, and a bag of perlite. Drilling the holes and the rooting aid are optional, but they will speed up the process and allow you to choose where the roots grow, instead of having them occur randomly. There is a lot to be said for having roots grow where you want them so they clasp the rock nicely, but you can decide .... put a wick in the bottom of the pot, then an inch or two of pure perlite that has had the fines screened out and has been rinsed well. Set the stone on top of the perlite and settle it gently. Then fill in around the stone with a mix of about 85% screened perlite + 15% MG potting soil so the soil is even with the top of the rock and settled around the roots. Then, add enough MG soil mixed 50/50 with screened rinsed perlite to cover the top of the stone by about an inch or slightly more.

Your soil is VERY water retentive, and that's normally not something you want to use for rooting cuttings or for this application, so the operative words are gong to be 'DAMP - not wet'. After you get your planting put together, return it to the plastic bag with a good-sized opening at the top for air circulation. Use a spritzer bottle with distilled water to barely keep the soil on the top 1" moist (NOT SOGGY). You may not need to water more than once or twice before it roots. When you water, remove the planting and spritz only the surface of the soil, gently, and don't mist the plant. The bag will provide the humidity needed and the opening in the bag will provide enough air flow to keep the fungaluglies at bay. Keep the planting in very bright but indirect light. Outside in open shade would be best, but poke holes in the bottom of the bag in case it rains.

I'll let you know right now that Miracle-Gro soil is wholly unsuitable as a bonsai soil, and I'd say the majority opinion holds that it may well be unsuited, as it comes from the bag, as a soil for any plant. Given the modifications I suggested, it will work ok for you for now, but if you really want to be a good provider for your new charge, I suggest you read this thread, that provides a general overview of growing in containers, followed by this one that explains in detail why your soil choice is so important to the health of your plant(s). An understanding of the information in the later you will find to be critical to successful growing in shallow (bonsai) containers and something that will save every fledgling bonsai artist a world of grief.

Al

Rick

I hope you don't mind me jumping in and asking Al related question (actually, just confirmation that I understand it properly...):

Al, do I understand it correctly:

1. Rick's plant is to be burried with the rock;
2. New roots will eventually grow from just about the rock, and if there were holes drilled, they will be in the 'pattern' of drilled holes (desirable);
3. After having a good amount of new roots, the original ones (ones that are now growing thru/below the rock) will be removed;
4. The new roots will be 'trained' over the rock;

5. The whole process of growing new roots may take somewhere between 1-2yrs.
6. Drilling holes will 'speed-up' (?) the process besides getting the roots to grow evenly spaced.

How long should the plastic bag be kept on?

Thnx.
Rina

Yes, you understand correctly, excepting that it's not necessarily the drilling of the holes that will 'speed' the rooting process. That would be attributable to the IBA in the Clonex. The roots currently growing below the rock are destined to die as a result of the interruption of their food source. So they would rot away if they weren't mechanically removed at repot time. The trees I layer off usually take up to 2 years to produce new root systems because I start from scratch, but the scheff we're talking about is itching to root (already a large build-up of carbohydrates and growth regulator above the constriction). The problem might lie in the viability of the OP's plant, which has fallen on hard times of late, with no way of knowing what the existing root system is like insofar as IT'S viability is concerned. Still, scheffs are very resilient if you don't over-water, so I have high hopes for a positive outcome.

Experienced bonsai artists wishing to build a quality tree look first to the root system. They know they can build a high quality tree from almost any material if the roots are good. As a bonsai judge, I can attest to the fact that a high % of trees that appear perfectly groomed are passed over for ribbons in show after show because of a weak root system. Knowing that, I started layering off a lot of trees while young to make sure the roots are sound. Trees that I don't layer off, often have roots grafted to the bole in places where it would improve the buttressing (nebari) or when layering off the top isn't practical (older & more refined trees). Still, an amazing number of high quality shohin (small) size trees become almost instant bonsai when the tops of high quality old trees are layered off during a makeover (restyling).

I'm not talking about myself when I say the horticultural skills and knowledge of the established bonsai community are widely unappreciated, and by unappreciated, I simply mean that people don't realize the kind of rapport with plants it takes to graft branches and roots where there were none previously, or even remove a branch from one side of a tree and move it to the other side. What some of the masters are able to do with plants, if you're exposed to their work's progression, would be absolutely jaw-dropping to the average hobbyist.

I'm easily moved, and I get sappier as I get older. I cry during the National Anthem - no matter where I am, at movies that aren't even necessarily sad - just moving, ..... heck, I even cried at Riverdance in appreciation for what I was seeing and the effort it took for the dancers and singers to entertain me. I was in Chicago over the weekend for a show, and I saw trees that were soo beautiful they just grabbed me and held me captive in appreciation for both the beauty of the plant and the years of effort and planning it took to produce it.

OK - I'm getting off track here, but there's a method in the madness. I put a bug in Rina's ear a while ago about bonsai, and Rick may or may not gain a degree of appreciation for the art after his experience here on the forum. My meanderings are intended as interesting asides, but as my way of nudging someone in the direction of bonsai if they have the inclination. It's not for everyone, because it takes the same kind of dedication it takes to attend to a bunch of pets - even more so than having a number of houseplants - but the potential for personal rewards are so great I feel almost obligated to share some of my feelings when the opportunity presents itself.

Al

Al, you have so much fun with the plants, inspired as always! How cool is this?!! I also have 2 questions. Is Rick's plant, in the condition at purchase, considered a bonsai? If not, at what point during the conversion process could/would it be correct to call it bonsai?

Rick, your plant is adorable. Sincerely rooting for him!

Why do they sell them that way? C'mon you know, $. It worked on you, and now I want one too. But instead of beating WM up, the positive is the opportunity to save/fix a plant, and often to obtain something usually otherwise unavailable. Like the little spiky plant in the seashell magnet, and the way they make "lucky bamboo" out of all available Dracaena sanderiana. If you want a potted one, you'll likely have to find a lucky bamboo to rescue, or pay a much higher price for a very big potted one. My gramma (coming up on 90) says there was no such thing as "buying a house plant" back in her when and where, we've come a long way!

.... glad you asked. I really wanted to touch on the "at what point during the conversion process could/would it be correct to call it bonsai?" thing.

We all know there are plant snobs & Nazi's. The ones that look down their noses at anyone who dares to speak of a plant by anything other than both its genus and the specific epithet ..... in italics, or the ones who come to your garden and only mention the plants that have gone over, or have ".... just a touch of PM - yes?" Bonsai has its snobs, too. Some of that probably stems from the fact that judging is largely based on being critical of imperfections, but I don't think anyone can make a good case for slapping a beginner in the face with the stark reality of an experts criticism. Too many bonsai practitioners who can't remember what it was like when they were beginners, are be much too quick to make a comment about beginner's trees not being 'true bonsai', or to be disparaging of the little Ficus or garden junipers sold by the thousands at big box outlets. I say IF, in the grower's eyes the plant is a bonsai, then who are we to argue or deny someone the pleasure of enjoying the feeling evoked by the term alone? To me, it smacks of the need to diminish someone else's joy in order to enhance our own sense of superiority, when in fact, the art would be better served by a little more humility and encouragement.

My personal sense of 'what is a bonsai or when does a plant become a bonsai' doesn't have much to do with its age. I think that a plant (for me) becomes a pre-bonsai or potensai when there is evidence of the application of techniques designed to lead the plant to an eventual destination. A plant becomes a bonsai when it becomes evocative; when it tells a story; when you can look at it and see it standing alone in a meadow, or clinging to the side of a mountain after being pummeled by avalanche and rock slide for ages; when in the dead and wizened top of the tree, you can see a lightning strike that took life away from the top and the plant has adjusted to making do with what is left, including the large area of dead wood left as the lightning made its way down the trunk and into the ground; in the mother/daughter arrangement where the mother tree hovers protectively over the daughter tree. When a plant in a pot begins to look like it was formed by nature, instead of the human hand, is when it becomes a bonsai to me, but Rick's bonsai can mean as much to him as a plant I've been working on for 20 years .... so who's to judge?

I know that no accomplished bonsai artist I know, and I have met many of the most famous in the world and most of the most famous in the US, would ever say anything disparaging about a beginner's tree unless asked, or was put in a judging position by the owner - unless, perhaps, the life of the tree was obviously in the balance and there was no question the commentary could be construed as anything other than helpful.

The good news is, if Rick's plant makes it, and the roots form/embrace the rock, the result should qualify him for a bonsai merit badge .... if there was such a thing. There should be, I think. ;-)

Al

Al! you rock!! Thank you for all that amazing information! This will be my weekend project. Wish me luck! Will post pics. i'm determined to save my bonsai/potted plant/shrub!

I'm absolutely certain there is no one here that doesn't wish you the best, so we're all pulling for you.

GOOD LUCK, but keep learning so you can make your own (luck)!

Al

Oh - I didn't realize I had a more recent picture of the schefflera root over rock pictured above. It might be interesting to see the progression:

{{gwi:30121}}

{{gwi:88893}}

{{gwi:10897}} Al

Al

Thank you for the answer, and yes - YOU DID PUT A BUG IN MY EARS...so I am borrowing books from library, and obviously keep asking questions. All of sudden I see potential bonsai in just about any plant...
I am not sure how far I will be able to go, but if nothing else, what I am learning is applicable to growing non-bosai, healhy plants.
(The tall Benjamina that I root-pruned following Al's tips is my 'white mice' - it never be a bonsai, but my goal is to use these techniques to keep it shorter, better shaped and most important healhy).

Rina

Rick

Great project for you...please post photos. I am looking forward to see them.
And thank you for letting me barge in.
Rina

Thanks for the explanation, Al, sincerely appreciated. Fascinating stuff!

More good luck to you, Rick!

Hey Rina, no worries the more the merrier! Feel free to chime in all you want. Saturday is the big day! Gathering all the supplies I'll need. I have the pot, rooting hormone and drill bit ready. Step by step pics will be posted.

Al, what should I use instead of MG? I'm going to pick up some perlite tomorrow.

Rick

Good luck with the major surgery!

I would strongly recommend for you to use bark-based soil mix. I believe that Al already posted link to thread explaining why is it important to have well-draining soil and also how to make it. You may not be able to get bark on such a short notice, but since you are repotting just one plant, may consider buying Repti-bark from any pet-supply store. It could be expensive to make large amount of mix, but you may want to buy small bag just to make enough for your soon-to-be-terrific-umbrella-bonsai...

Rina

Hey Rina, no worries the more the merrier! Feel free to chime in all you want. Saturday is the big day! Gathering all the supplies I'll need. I have the pot, rooting hormone and drill bit ready. Step by step pics will be posted.

Al, what should I use instead of MG? I'm going to pick up some perlite tomorrow.

Hello Everyone,

Rick...

I just wanted to say that i wish you great success!!!!!

We will all be wishing that this cute little tree will become a healthy little Bonsai for you!!

If you can't find all of the ingredients, there is a product at most nurseries that is called Bonsai Soil Mix ( Hoffman) that consist of Turface, Granite and Pine Bark and Haydite that is sold in small bags. 2 Quart bag for $ 7.99 Just in case you need a small amount and can't find everything in time. If you want.. I can take a pic of the bag and post. Let me know.. Have fun!!!

I agree with AL, It is how we look at a tree and see the beauty that makes us happy and how we feel the connection between what we see and how we respond to our trees.

Lots of great help here on this thread...

Al, Your trees are beautiful and i really enjoy the root over rock technique.

Thanks for the insight as far as what makes us feel special when we see or hear something that touches our hearts. Its all good stuff!!! : )

Take Care,

Laura

I really enjoy threads like this because they give me a chance to express some of the things I often reflect on but seldom get to mention .... just wanted to say that.

Rina said: All of sudden I see potential bonsai in just about any plant ...

I get that completely. I bought a cluster of plants in a 2" container in May. Separated them, and planted one in a little pot so I could fuss with it. I had no idea what it was, the label said 'Miniature Terrarium Plant'. Maybe someone can ID it for me. ;-) The little black pot was a gift from my best friend, who said, See what you can grow in it". It's about the size of a dime, viewed from the top. The little cactus is hardy to MI. (see pic below)

Rick - If I thought there was time, I'd have offered to send you a small bag of bonsai soil. Rina is right, in that a well-aerated, fast-draining soil is a prerequisite for keeping our bonsai healthy over the long term and would be best, but I wanted to make it easy on you, so that's why I gave you the perlite/MG recipe; plus, you don't have the luxury of time. If you happen to have a large pet store near you, you might be able to find all the ingredients for a good bonsai soil in 1 stop, but there's the price point to consider. Your call.

You would use Schultz Aquatic Plant Soil - which is Turface MVP, fine aquarium gravel, and Repti-Bark. My personal opinion is this: If you're serious about houseplants or bonsai, you should spend some time learning about soils. If you are focusing on reviving your plant and keeping it happy, there are ways to do that using the instructions I gave and worrying about the more distant future after your plant gives you the {{gwi:6022}} sign.

If you have a large plant store nearby, you might find some Hoffman's Bonsai Soil, which you can cut with screened perlite or aquarium gravel.

Keep the roots moist while you work. After you fill the holes with the IBA gel, let it dry for 10-15 minutes before potting the plant, but keep the roots wet while the gel dries.

Al

{{gwi:98805}}

Take care,

Laura

Al thank you for holding my hand throughout! I see soil in a whole different light now. It's not just dirt!!! I'm really glad I decided to post here. You guys are all great!

Laura - I found a plant store that sells the Hoffman mix so i'm picking it up tomorrow. Thank you!

Meanwhile our little patient is resting up before her big procedure...

Good Luck Rick!!!

Al.. Looks like i was posting the same time you were.. LOL Sorry for that!! Looks like we were both talking about the Hoffmann mix.. It is good for little repots like Ricks. Then when he wants/ or is interested in making a better mix for his trees, he can do more research and learn all about how and why the other mixes work so well.

Sorry to cut in between posts... : )

Take Care,

Laura

Pardon me butting in here. I didn't read the entire thread, so maybe someone already said this. Are you certain that's a schefflera? It looks more like a desert rose to me. It looks to have the beginnings of a caudex at the bottom. ???

KMC

Here are the pics.

pic 2

potted

I see a tiny leaf sprouting!!!

ROCKIN!!! Now just be careful not to over-water. Remember 'damp, not wet' is the odre du jour! ..... give a little fertilizer now if you want. Great job!!! - really glad for you - your plant's gonna make it! I'm sure we're all breathing a collective sigh of relief.

Al

So far so good!

Al, I can't thank you enough! Thank you for the education!! I'll keep you posted.

That is sooo cute! Glad to see it's recovering well. Nicely done, Rick!

Rick

I was wondering if you had chance to pot it...and already, signs of life!
Great, hope it grows many new roots soon. Hope to see it's progress.

Rina

Well guys I uncovered a bit of soil this morning to find little roots growing from the drilled holes. Again thank you Al!

It's growing really well. Can't wait to see the roots over rock! Might be a few years though.

I found this thread to be very interesting. I also almost peed myself when i saw that your plant is actually a 'desert rose'. Not only did you bring it back from the dead but you actually got a lot of growth from it! I am envious! I have managed to murder every desert rose i have EVER tried to grow! Bravo!

Awesome update, awesome job, Rick! Thanks for telling us and showing these pics.

So it's a dessert rose not a Hawiian umbrella? Are they one in the same?

No, they're quite different. Please be sure to keep a tight rein on the watering can. It tolerates dry conditions much better than wet soil.

Al

I am, I took that picture right after a sprinkling.

A little update. Almost a year later and look at those roots!! I'm trying to be patient Al...I repotted a bunch of my house plants in your gritty mix and they are LOVING it! They're thriving. I currently have a gardinea in bud!! I know as soon as I post this the buds will turn yellow and drop but I just had to tell you your gritty mix is amazing.

Thanks Al!!

Here's another shot. I had to cut the lead stems because it was getting too tall. It just sprouted side braches and kept growing upward!

I was excited to see this discussion pop back up, and even more excited to see it's because there's an update from Rick. What an amazing recovery, and great job! I'm a fan!

One thing though, this isn't a Schefflera. What is it? Did folks decide it's Adenium? That's not a plant I know at all.

Hey Purple! Thanks for the kind words! I'm hoping the new roots will wrap around the rock. I'll give it one more year before I check. It's really cool how this little guy was on the brink just one year ago and here it is flourishing. I'm still not sure what it is. I'm hoping someone will jump in and tell us. In the meantime I'll keep updating....

Had to do a repot. She's looking great!

Hugging the rock

New home. Again thank you for your guidance Al!

This is awesome! Looks like it's riding slightly higher in the pot?

What an amazing thread to read, I found it after it was linked to another thread over on the Adenium Forum....which is where I actually belong, lol! Why not have a look over there?

Yes, it is in fact an Adenium, aka Desert Rose, maybe it's the commonest form of Adenium, the Ad. obesum but there's nothing wrong in that. They often have pink flowers but hybrids can have most colours. I hope it goes onto thrive and grow over the rock just as you want. Great results from Al's invaluable info as usual. It may start to go dormant come the colder months, if so be very careful with the water, it will need very, very little when leafless.
Gill UK

Hey Gill, thanks for the post and the ID! I've had it for about two years and it's never flowered. It lost some leaves after the most recent repot but it bounced back like a champ. Still going strong!

This post was edited by NycRick on Fri, Nov 22, 13 at 12:26

Such a great thread, i love seeing this almost doomed plant get to come into its own like this. Great information all, and great execution rick! Fantastic plant.