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Silver Arrow stem is turning brown

Posted by Forest_of_Houseplant none (My Page) on
Mon, Sep 2, 13 at 3:03

Hi everyone!

I have many Silver Arrows in "Deco" pots (that is water with stones popular back in the 1970's so you know how old these plants are) and one of the tallest (almost 4 feet tall!) the stem from top of pot/stones to about 2 feet has turned brown. (See photo-stem in background) I know sometimes this happens and it gets mushy then the plant (which is still now green and healthy for next 2 feet above ) will wilt and fall over.

My question is ---since its been so long that I have done this, how do I save or propagate this plant?

Do I cut just above the brown section? Or does the brown section need to be in the water too?

Should I just use plain water to begin with? Or from day one use the special high fertilizer "Deco" brand mix I still have?

How long to wait until root system develops?

I ask this as a smaller plant (only 10 inches tall) did this in another pot about two years ago, I just cut it off and stuck it in water and it grew roots but when I put it in the stones I got fuzzy white mold on them and it killed the plant (I had sterilized the stones using hotwater/bleach and rinsed out well and air dried for a week before the transplant from water only to water and deco plant fertilizer in the rocks). I tried to kill the mold with alcohol and Q-tips, etc. nothing worked.
.

Hope someone can help me before I make the same mistake with this tall plant! Its beautiful but suddenly turned brown (I mean in mid August, it took me a while to find your site and sign up).

Thanks for all your help!

(Does anyone else out there still use Deco plants?)

This post was edited by Forest_of_Houseplant on Mon, Sep 2, 13 at 16:21


Follow-Up Postings:

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RE: Silver Arrow stem is turning brown

Hi I'm not for sure what these look like. I would love to see a full picture! It sounds very interesting.


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RE: Silver Arrow stem is turning brown

i would also be curious to see more macro photos of this. i just started messing around with growing some things "semi hydro" in diatomite


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RE: Silver Arrow stem is turning brown

Thanks all for replying!

Didn't know how to refresh my post-- so I edited it and lost posting for a while! sorry!

Anyway, I would take more photos but have to move pots else show too much windows they are in front of and my "location" which I guess I'm not supposed to do on open web pages...so give me a moment to accomplish this and I'll show you empty Deco pots too and stones.

There is a hydroponics store near me but I never used their methods so can't go asking them for free advice, so I'm still looking here for help as well.

Hope to write/post photos soon.


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RE: Silver Arrow stem is turning brown

I guess I can only post one photo at a time. So here are four one at a time!

I hope there is no daily limit, else I'll post the rest tomorrow.

Ruler gives some idea of scale. Only could fit 2 pots in this area, so took several views. This is the one with the brown stem as you can see more of it.


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RE: Silver Arrow stem is turning brown

This is the best view.

This post was edited by Forest_of_Houseplant on Mon, Sep 2, 13 at 21:45


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RE: Silver Arrow stem is turning brown

Trying a different angle, can't stand up higher to get very top of plant.


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RE: Silver Arrow stem is turning brown

Close up of the smaller pot with multiple plants. Its flowering right now--white flowers in green pods, will turn bright red in a few weeks.. You can see the pots have windows to measure the water level.


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RE: Silver Arrow stem is turning brown

Do these 'PODS' look like the ones in the pic in the link?

Here is a link that might be useful: link


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RE: Silver Arrow stem is turning brown

Well I am so glad you posted these pics. Those are just lovely! And I've never even knew they bloomed. This was certainly an educational thread. I've seen the small ones growing and even purchased a few for gifts but it's very nice to know what they end up looking like after several years! Thanks for sharing !!!


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RE: Silver Arrow stem is turning brown

Yes, asleep_in_the_garden, these are very strong and healthy plants. Just like in a mall nearby, which was the look I was going for in adopting them myself. Thanks for the link!


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RE: Silver Arrow stem is turning brown

You might find it interesting that those "pods" are berries...each containing a large seed. If you can get them to germinate,..you could end up with seedlings like I did.


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RE: Silver Arrow stem is turning brown

forest,

it appears that you have one or more aglaonemas. i had never heard of them referred to as Silver Arrows - i guess you learn something every day.

to answer some of your questions... (1) yes, you should cut the top off, above the rotted brown cane before it kills the rest of the plant. take a clean sharp knife or razor blade (dip in 10% bleach) and cut at least an inch or two above the highest part of the visible brown rot. if there is quite a bit of bare stem above the rot, then cut farther away. once you make your cut, look carefully at the cut stem. if you seen any brown or mushy looking stuff, re-dip your knife in bleach water and cut even higher up on your stem cutting. i've had at least one kind of rot that could run up the inside of the canes a fair distance before it showed itself on the outside. if you want to be extra careful, you can dip your new stem cutting in the bleach water before placing it in a clean glass of water to root.

(1a) if the brown stem goes back to being green before it gets to the roots, you could try cutting below the brown rotted area and then wait and see if the roots and stem base will sprout new growth. on the other hand, if the stem is brown all the way down to the roots, you should probably de-pot the whole thing and remove the rotting roots.

(2) you don't need to add fertilizer to your rooting water.

(3) as for sterilizing your 'stones' as you called them... most of the folks who grow hydroponically don't recommend using bleach on the ceramic media (it's fine for the outer pots) because it can get down deep in the balls and won't completely rinse out. i don't have personal experience, so i'm going on what the pros say. what i know is safe is to wash or rinse them in clean, plain water and then either boil them on the stove or bake them in the oven. i've used the boiling method myself - i can't remember but i think i went for 15 minutes or so.

your last question was about white fuzzy fungus when you moved a rooted cutting into the stones... could you describe this a bit more? was the fungus up on the leaves, down on the roots, everywhere? did it show up right away? had you covered the plant and pot with a plastic bag/tent to keep it more humid while the new plant sunk its roots deeper into the pot? and do you flush your stones with plain water regularly so you help reduce salt buildup?

cheers,

nancy

ps congratulations on having these plants and pots so long. the Deco craze was ahead of its time. it's too bad it died out. i bought one of their books (used, of course) when i wanted to learn about growing house plants hydroponically. it's amazing how dated some of the books from that time period look though :-)


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RE: Silver Arrow stem is turning brown

forest,

i forgot to add...

if you have long areas of healthy, green, leafless cane (no rot!), you can cut them into pieces at least 3 or more inches long and try rooting them in water as well. they will be slower than cuttings with leaves though. the only tricky bit is to make sure you keep them right side up to root.

cheers,

nancy


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RE: Silver Arrow stem is turning brown

Hi nancy_pnwzone8 :

Thanks for such great information and reply to my cry for help!

I really appreciate it! Silver Arrow was the Deco name they gave for this and I always called it that but you're right its listed as aglaonemas, so I appreciate the proper name.

Thanks for how to save the top, its over a foot long...and might be able to get some smaller cuttings off the long green stem as I don't have a bottle/vase that tall to hold all of it anyway.

I didn't mention to the reply above by asleep_in_the_garden about growing them from seeds in the red pods, as usually I don't have much success from seeds, so certainly I'll try your method at least I have something "green" to start off with. I'll keep them in separate containers in case the rot came with any parts of the stem I only lose that small part not a bunch of them.

I long ago contacted my local nursery about the white fuzz and took a photo while the plant was still alive, so if I look in my digital collection (I was carrying it in my phone in case I stopped in they told me, I could show them the fuzz and they could identify it), I might find the photo and post it here for you and everyone to know and be wary of this fuzz, its really hard to get it to stop. So you are really helpful if you know what it is in case it comes back.....seems to like it among my plants but of course only the sickly or weak ones get it!

Thanks so very much again for all the detail (about using the bleach, etc on knife not the "balls") and the comments about the Deco system. I really appreciate it all and will let you (and the Forum) know how everything turns out!

Best regards,
Forest_of_Houseplant(s)


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RE: Silver Arrow stem is turning brown

Report from the "Front":

Hi Nancy:

Hope I'm not over loading you with messages.

1. I found the photo with the fuzzy mold (attached to this message). Note, it looks fuzzier in person, only early version of digital phone 8MP sorry.

2. I also found another one I was also supposed to show the garden shop.

3. Why didn't I go? Long story, short end of it the "expert" who has been helping me for years got sick, got operation, and then limited time at work before he decided to retire.

Also the huge company last year or so moved to a hard to get location just before entrance to highway on a high bluff..you miss their turn off and you're on a no exit highway for 20 miles! Its prominent location just hard to get in and out of, so I avoid going there in person now. Big web presence so anything but plants themselves I buy online......

So again I appreciate it if you can look at other mold/growth too if you have any opinions on that and the old plant (more about it later) in plain water.

Thanks!

Best regards!

Forest


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RE: Silver Arrow stem is turning brown

Hi Nancy:

This is the strange jelly like mold growth.

I wash it out of the roots every so often, but it returns.

Plant is (gasp!) over 30 years old. About 4 yrs ago I split it into 2 groups so in case one dies I have other one. My grandmother had it on porch outside for who knows how long, I've had it 30 years (ohoh did I reveal my age?)

Never knew what it was, always called it a corn plant, very narrow stem before each leaf, never saw it for sale anywhere or identified so kept growing it cuttings from it in water as original pot was too big to take with me.

The gelatin mold began in 2011-2012 so its only relatively recent event, spread to both containers before I thought to move them apart so they are together.

Here is another two views of the plant itself in next two postings:


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RE: Silver Arrow stem is turning brown

Unknown corn like plant photo one.

You can see the aglaonemas next to it to the left, the small one I showed in earlier photo for size comparison.

Yes I know one leaf has died, I'm very slow to cut off leaves until they are totally brown as this plant grows very very slowly, even when it was in a pot.


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RE: Silver Arrow stem is turning brown

Unknown corn like plant photo two:

Thanks again Nancy for all your help!

I put this here as I forgot it earlier. You asked me about the fuzzy mold: It is on the exposed roots only and up the stem a bit where it gets wet. Not on leaves. No brown leaves just mold I can't get rid of it. And not on the roots under the water, water "kills" this mold!

Yes, I do most of the smaller Deco pots I can lift to wash out at sink sort of irregularly (used to be more careful like each month, now too busy, irregular washing out) and the largest 2 pots never again, too heavy to lift and can't spill it out without plant and stones washing out too, so can't carry the water to the plant so just sits in the Fertilizer water combo with rocks.

But the small one here I certainly washed out more often than rest as its small and had the mold...thanks again for reading this!

This post was edited by Forest_of_Houseplant on Tue, Sep 3, 13 at 20:53


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RE: Silver Arrow stem is turning brown

Hi Nancy:

I had time today, so I "did it"---cut down the stems.

Have two small happy plants about a foot each with leaves (there were two branches of the brown stems) and three "headless" stems--- all 5 sitting in plain, room temperature water jars.

Forgot to ask! What about the light? Should I use dim light as in a basement? for a few days? Or Ok where they normally were growing in filtered window light?

Thanks again for the detailed instructions, it was a breeze to follow!

Forest


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RE: Silver Arrow stem is turning brown

forest,

sorry i didn't log on yesterday, was busy working on other stuff.

here are my thoughts in no particular order...

1) your cuttings should be placed in the same type of lighting that the mature plants like - in this case, bright, indirect light.

2) i have no idea what your 'corn' plant is. maybe someone else will chime in with ideas.

3) fuzzy white fungus... what this looks like to me is mineral crust, not fungus. when water evaporates, the minerals are left behind. the minerals will concentrate at any place that acts like a wick because wicks increase evaporation. on the other hand, the photo isn't great and i can't see it in person which would help.

4) gelatin fungus... i have never seen this and have no idea what it is. if it's not harming the plants, then i wouldn't worry about it. if it is harming the plants, you could try to remove as much of the 'gelatin' as possible, wash your hands, the container, the whole plant, everything (!) in 10 % bleach water, refill with clean water and repeat the whole process in a week and then wait and see if it comes back. cutting off most or all of the roots and re-rooting from a cutting in a clean, sterilized, jar might be an easier strategy.

and, this isn't an answer so much as a question... in the photo showing the white fuzzy fungus, it looks like your water solution is all the way up to the top of the grow rocks. i thought that the Deco system was supposed to be a 'hydroculture' like set-up where there was only an inch or two of fluid in the bottom (which is why that little window is only down near the bottom). are you filling yours higher?

if you are, then what you're doing is water culture. letting the water level drop helps get oxygen to the roots.

anyway, whatever you're doing... it's been working if these plants are 30+ years old. so i hesitate to encourage you to change your methods.

the only other suggestion i have... is that when you grow in plain water - such as those jars of 'corn plant' - you might want to consider adding some algae (as long as you don't mind the look of it). you can add a little fertilizer and move the container a bit closer to a window and the algae should show up on it's own soon, or you can grab a few strands from a creek or lake. the algae will help oxygenate the water and consume waste products made by the plant's roots. if the algae ever gets too vigorous, simply remove part of it the next time you wash and refill the container.

i'm not sure if any of this will help, but best of luck.

nancy


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RE: Silver Arrow stem is turning brown

forest,

the more i look at your 'corn plant', the more i think that it might be a very hungry aspidistra - also called Cast Iron plant. a bit of fertilizer might help green up the leaves.

cheers,

nancy


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RE: Silver Arrow stem is turning brown

Hi Nancy!

Thanks for thinking about my problems and responding!

Of course everything new helps!

I'll go over what you wrote in the order you wrote it so I don't miss anything...... :)

No need to apologize, I understand the idea of these help forums and each of us have our own lives and duties which come first so I'm always appreciative of help...

I noticed that this site does not have "awards" or "points" for successfully answering questions or having members voting on those answers, just a thought that people like to work for rewards as well.. maybe getting a "leaf" for a good/best answer??? just a thought..

(1) Yes, I put them in the same light as the mature plants, that was easy enough to do, but I did notice when I took the photo (thanks for the suggestion it pointed out several things to me that are not visible on photo, but one that is---is why did the little pot have lighter leaves than the bigger pot? Most of the plants have the beautiful dark and silver leaves while the little pot has lighter leaves..... my answer is that it is smaller so its up "higher" on the stand, closer to the source of light and more in sunlight more hours each day than the darker ones (which I guess in the plants tropical natural state), they love the floor of the jungle! not the upper reaches so the plant lightened it leaves in color versus the lower plants! Well, I certainly will keep most of them lower down, but limited space there, so I put the stems up higher for now until I see roots and leaves.

(2) thanks, maybe I'll start a new posting with that photo now that I have it here on computer easily posted, so I can just ask: "can you identify this plant"?

(3) Sorry about the quality of the photo I had to eventually throw out that plant as it became sickly and fell over, so I don't call that mineral deposits. It seems to come and hit a particular plant but not the surrounding plants, so if its mineral deposits then why is it doing it? (it appears on others and now I cut it out or discard early). (which is my hidden fear that what if it attacks one of the plants I can't easily replace or discard so easily?) About viewing it in person I looked at your page, I'm all the way East, approx. 2,900 miles, so visiting to view it could be quite a "road trip"....

(4) Good thoughts and ideas.... Lots more information I could give you about the plants and their "history". I have had them for 30 years in same exact location (next to some of the "lighter" color aglaonemas plants (some of this refers to your comments later on as well)... I originally had lots of algae growing in those bottles. When I separated the plants after 30 years it was due to the appearance of the gelatin fungus----- I had originally had algae lots of it! in the water bottles with no Deco fertilizer ever! They just have plain water, left to air out and get to room temperature before its used--no chlorine here so none in tap water--- I used to wash out algae when it got too thick or made the bottles "ugly" as guests noticed it...and preferred the clear water. The gelatin mold came just to this species of plant--no where else....algae is either present or not in other bottles, they are all growing or not with or without the algae.. sigh.. that is why this geletanous fungus is so puzzling and they at the garden shop wanted to see a photo too...

(4a) I never used 10% bleach, but if it does not harm the plant itself and I can clean out the algae too(??) as well as the gelatin stuff then I'm certainly willing to try it (I will only do "one" plant first as a test to see what happens as I don't want to lose both of them if I do it wrong.

(4b) These corn plants have a tropical like stalk, more like Grandparents' pet huge "palm tree" which I wanted to bring back but no one would move it up north, so unfortunately I don't have a "potted palm" (remember old movie "Mr. Roberts"?) but I don't think a cutting will work on this style of plant as only one very slow growing stalk per plant. Still have the same number of plants as I took up here... so I don't know how they propagate, no flowers ever, no rootlets, so wondering what it is--species/name before I do anything like trying to cut it..... my own dividing up the plants was an emergency idea to save it from having all in one huge pot and losing it all to some disease....

(4c) about your "question" --yes in the photo, its not an official Deco pot. I have plenty of stones still in original bags, but what I have lost over the years is the pots as my collection expanded, but no more pots were available from stores/online (some people still sell rocks/fertlizer, but I got plenty of those, missing the pots) so of course I was "improvising" there with some of my smaller ones (and the cuttings I just did will end up in those "double" pots I created for the Deco plant mixture----So In the end when I took that photo last I had the water all the way up to "Drown" the fungus I thought, usually I keep it lower since the pot has no "little window"

(4d) Didn't know I was doing "water culture". I just had them in water bottles. For years I used water with fertilizer (not Deco brand) to fill the water bottles. They grew and I was happy the plants were happy. But then I read about the mineral salts so I stopped all fertilizer as I saw other people I know, watering plants in water bottles/soil plants using tap water from the tap! and they were growing healthier than mine with fancy fertilizer! So I just switched one year a number of years ago and plants have been growing fine ever since....

(4e) Now about the algae suggestion....Yes my plants in regular glass bottles/pots, have algae! The Deco ones do not I guess due to stones/less sunlight entering the small window, etc--washing out with water for the pots I can lift up. So except for "Guests" who complain, I don't mind the algae...its green isn't it? Anything green is growing, better than brown or white or "gelatin" colored... So I guess with your words of advice, I'll wash out the algae a bit less often and let them help the plants grow. The Deco plant had fuzzy mold on it and also I get it if I transfer water plants (minus the algae---I'll try the 10% bleach next time) from water culture to soil.

(4f) Sorry if I'm giving too much information, but serious problem of mosquitos here, and tiny tiny tiger mosquito gets through screening/flies and bites in the daytime and inhabits the smallest amount of water, so they can get inside the home and reproduce and bite all day/night! inside! I use "dunkins" Mosquito Control for the water plants to try and stop/control them, but with so many water plants I've been forced to move many over the years the old water plants into soil culture--- (I use "Bontone" rooting Powder and follow the instructions from the garden shop person who is retired now as I mentioned earlier) but the white fuzzy fungus/mold is killing off my attempts to move most or "all" of my plants out of water into soil. This does not effect the Deco plants as the water level is always below the stones so no mosquitos ever or need for "dunkins". Again the reason I must abandon water plants generally, is that "dunkins" have only about a month of useful life and when I hear the sounds of mosquitos flying around and know they can carry "West Nile" disease inside the home as well, Its time to get as many water plants out to soil but having difficulty making that transition!...Without that mysterious fuzzy white mold occurring!. Again, the monthly depots of "dunkins" is a real chore as I have a "forest_of_houseplants" of many kinds, many cuttings and propagations over the decades.... sigh... its a "jungle" out there! as a television song goes....

I hope I did not write too much for you and others who read this, just trying to give as much information so I get an accurate response to all my problems....probably should divide this posting into several as "Silver Arrow stem is turning brown" no longer really defines this thread, and the name is in error, but they don't let you change the name of a post once you start a thread..

Thanks again for all your suggestions and help Nancy!

I will wait until you reply (no rush here or upon you) ---before I do anything in case you have suggestions depending upon what Information I just added....

Best wishes.....

Forest....


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RE: Silver Arrow stem is turning brown

Hi Nancy!

I just posted (of course they don't let you check the site AND compose a message at same time----so I did not see your posting until now)

Fantastic! You did it!

This "cast iron plant" fits all the characteristics including the "South" and "Victorian Era" and Grandparents had it in soil "EVERYWHERE!" I was only able to save about 7 bunches for myself when we had to abandon our Sourthern Summer living (long story).....

I found a link I posted below that shows the plant and answered my question about the flowers/fruits and since its never been in soil for all these 30 years its why its not borne fruit, nor has it returned to the deep green it always was....

You're a great detective! Yes, it must be hungry as its light green----I forgot it really looked dark green all the decades I remembered it, so should I clean out the geletan mold and try water fertilizer? How do I get it to soil after so many years/decades again? So it can grow tall like I remember them doing so. Grandparents never actually needed to "purchase" a plant they just got it growing "wild" on property and brought them "inside" So it fits the information in the link....grew everywhere! Even where there was seemingly no light/sun or bad conditions in home!!!

I now can buy it--as I know the name---"cast iron" here too! so I can experiment in trying to save what I got ----hoping not to fail it....

Thanks again Nancy!

Two more sites had info too relevant to my adapting care of plants back to soil:

http://plantandflowerinfo.com/aspidistra/aspidistra.html

and

http://houseplants.about.com/od/foliageplants/p/Aspidistra.htm

So I'll move it out of the "sunniest" window as I always assumed "South" and "lots of sun" were needed for these plants to survive, now I see out of direct light, ok will try that too (but one step at a time, don't want to shock or lose them all at once!)

Best wishes.

Forest

Here is a link that might be useful: About Aspidistra


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Update RE: Silver Arrow stem is turning brown

Hi Nancy (and all others reading postings here) :

Been busy so long since my last posting, sorry... catching all up at once:

I didn't forget about this helpful Forum.

I have 3 healthy growing aglaonemas from the cuttings as you suggested and replanted one in offical "Deco" pot and rest are just in glass jars until I find a new source of the pots for water culture.

Some of the aglaonemas stalks (yes I put them in the right way up), are still showing no signs of growth either roots or leaves/buds etc..

But they are still green in stalk area so I'll keep waiting and hoping and watering.

I repotted one of the "cast iron" plants that had that cloudy jelly like stuff in the water after washing it off as you suggested. The plant seemed to do well for about two weeks but now its down to just one healthy green leaf and the rest very slowly turned crispy light brown. So its good thing I didn't go and repot both of the plants from my grandparents as I worried I might lose both of them. Other than growing that jelly stuff in the water the larger other plant is just surviving in same light as the one in the earth clay pot.

I used Bontone (R) rooting powder to help the roots transition from water to earth as I've done with other plants.

Question: Any suggestions at this point to help the one with one green leaf back to more?

I purchased two new plants as this forum was helpful in reading other questions/answers so by doing so I filled in a bare area and its beginning to look the way it did a few decades ago (just by adding two plants you ask?---its a start and if you take a photo with them in the center then it looks really much better and you don't see the older plants that have left gaps as they grew taller)..

For my next question I guess I'll also start a new posting so everyone can have a chance at it but in case you can't find it, it is about a dish garden pot about 5 in high, 13 in wide (curved bottom no drainage holes) that has decades old ivy-pothos-etc vines 3 types growing out of it and entwined over a metal and glass multi-shelved 6 foot tall shelf (the cast iron plants dominate the top shelf).

The clay pot from dissovled salts in fertilizer I've used roughly monthly over decades until I stopped doing that caused the clay pot to have leaching spots, not so bad, but now one whole back edge has cracked through and through so the question is simply, now ---how does one subsitute out the existing dish garden and put in a new one when the vines are all entwined over the metal parts of the shelves? Cutting it off would kill the plant separating roots from the leaves, some of the sections of vines are bare only because the new ones blocked light from the old ones.

Oh and the reason I'll copy this elsewhere is that short of buying a full new "dish garden" a search of the web does not produce anything shallow like this and wide that is sold "empty" for replaceing dish gardens (there are two more that I could do with replacing but they don't have the vine problem this does so I could use 3 dish gardens from some source). but the garden store only sells them filled, not empty!

Thanks again for all your help! And Thanks for identifying correctly my plants as I went looking for more of their official botanical names---

Question: Now all I need to find is some way to plant signs in the pots identifying them!

Best wishes,

Forest


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RE: Silver Arrow stem is turning brown

Forest, it might be too late now to help with that one plant you repotted, but I wanted to mention that sometimes I find it helps plants adapt from water to soil if you bag them to raise humidity.
It's interesting that you have kept these plants so long. :) I hope they keep growing for many more years.


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