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Seeding and using straw
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Posted by
cpo1 Central Indiana (
My Page) on
Wed, Sep 14, 11 at 8:10
| Thanks again for the posts to this forum. I've read a lot of good information in the past few weeks. I'm in the process of reseeding a lawn area (Bluegrass mixture) of about 9000 sq. ft. At this point, I have tackled approx. 4000 sq. ft. so far. It seems to take me about 2 hours to do about 1500 sq. ft. I used roundup about Aug. 15th in all areas where weeds (mainly crabgrass) were dominant. This was about 1/2 of the 9000, I'm guessing. Then I used my Mantis tiller with the slit blades attached and dethatched-slit sections, raked off most of the thatch and dead grass, applied starter fertilizer, and new seed. I then added straw to areas that had been treated. I have a spinkler system and have been watering these areas 10 minutes per per episode, three times a day to keep the soil and seed moist. I know the Mantis is a little light for this much work, but it seems to work fine, especially since I do about 1500 sq. ft. at a time. I may, or may not get all of the 9000 sq. ft. done this fall, but, so far, so good. Some say you don't need straw and it complicates the renovation, but my local ag. co-op says most people use straw to help keep the birds off and seed moist. My questions are how much straw should be applied? Lightly to allow more air and sunlight, or more heavy to keep the seed more moist? Also, would rolling the areas be beneficial? Next spring, I plan to use a pre emergent, fertilize as appropriate, and water with 1" weekly waterings. Hopefully, this will get me on the right track for a decent lawn. Thanks again for your replies. They are very helpful and, I believe, appreciated by everyone who visits this forum. Next spring and summer, I will report my results, along with pictures, regardless of the outcome. Thanks again for your help. |
Follow-Up Postings:
RE: Seeding and using straw
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| Straw isn't necessary, but it does help a bit in keeping the soil moist. The whole bird thing is usually a non issue, unless you just seed on top of bare soil, but even then they don't really seem to flock to it. It can also help with erosion on moderate slopes. I you are going to use straw use shredded straw. I have used shredded straw and I find it is much easier to work with, and spreading it by hand doesn't take too long. It breaks down in a month or so too, which is good for the soil. Never use hay. |
RE: Seeding and using straw
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| Sorry for hijacking cpo1...but figured this would help you as well. Timeco, what would you say is the proper amount of straw to use? I put down some shredded Salt Hay so 0 seeds, and am not sure what it should look like after you put it down. Should you be able to see down to the soil everywhere, see the soil in most parts, or should the straw mostly cover the soil? I went about covering so that it was spread out evenly over the entire area but so that I could for the most part still see some soil through it, with obviously some areas being covered more than others and vice versa. My main concern is whether I am smothering any potential growth or not? Thanks for the input! |
RE: Seeding and using straw
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| Sounds about right. Ideally you want it just one layer thick, of course it's impossible to be exact, but the seedlings will have no problem with it a bit thicker. After you water it for the first time you can reapply it to areas that look thin, so it's much better to err on the lighter side, than being too heavy with it. |
RE: Seeding and using straw
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| Thanks Timeco...cpo1 hopefully these pics help as I had trouble finding any online. [IMG]http://i51.tinypic.com/3129qxi.jpg[/IMG] [IMG]http://i54.tinypic.com/vzvj3p.jpg[/IMG] |
RE: Seeding and using straw
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| whoops! 
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RE: Seeding and using straw
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| Well first off that's not shredded. Shredded straw comes in a compressed bale. It's composed of short pieces (.5 to 2 inches) of straw and it spreads easily by hand. Your layering looks a bit thick, and with hay that long you might have to rake it up when it's time to mow. Just make sure your grass isn't having trouble growing through some of the thicker areas. |
RE: Seeding and using straw
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| Thanks timeco. I thought it was shredded as the pieces were much smaller and lighter than what else I have seen. I am planning on leaving it on today as is since were expecting a lot of rain and then tomorrow lifting off a lot of the heavier areas. I was going to try to gently lift off as much as possible before the first mowing and then mow the rest up with it. I just finished Day 3 since planting and no sprouts yet (whats there is the old grass). Should I be worried or is the 3-5 day germination really just a stretch? I dont think the straw would have suffocated anything as of yet as no spots are beginning to come up yet. |
RE: Seeding and using straw
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| I think it's fine, especially with the rain coming. It won't suffocate anything, the seeds will germinate without issue. Depending on the seeds you used, germination after 3 days is too soon, except maybe for perennial rye, but still a bit early. For PR, 3-7 days, TTTF is 5-14 days, KBG is 8-21 days. After the rains removing some of the hay carefully is a good idea, as it might pose a problem during its first mowing. If you use a rake be careful you don't disturb the seed bed or any new seedlings. |
RE: Seeding and using straw
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- Posted by cpo1 Central Indiana (My Page) on
Thu, Sep 15, 11 at 12:48
| Thanks for the replies and the pictures. This helps. One more question though. Is rolling with a 280 pound roller behind a zero turn or RTV a good thing or bad to help level the yard and press the seed into the ground? Or will the equipment just do damage to the process? |
RE: Seeding and using straw
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| I probably wouldn't as the weight of the RTV might leave ruts in the moist soil that won't be leveled by the roller. If you used a water filled roller that you push yourself, that would be fine. It might even make removing the excess hay easier. |
RE: Seeding and using straw
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- Posted by cpo1 Central Indiana (My Page) on
Thu, Sep 15, 11 at 22:12
| Thanks again for the replies. I appreciate all of them. Plan to be finished before Monday. Project coming along nicely. |
RE: Seeding and using straw
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| Since it seems cpo1 and myself have gotten some good advice from you here timeco I thought I would just ask my question here rather than start a new thread. When is the best time to switch my watering routine? The grass is starting to sprout now and I wasn't sure what the size should be when I switch to just once a day more deep watering instead of the lighter watering couple times a day. Also, when is the best time to add some more starter fertilizer to the lawn? I read a lot here about mixed reviews on when to put it down but since PR is fast germinating I figured it would be good to put it down with the seed. Should I put down a second light spreading now that they are popping up (1 week after the first) or is it overkill and I should wait a little longer. Thank you! |
RE: Seeding and using straw
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| You can start reducing watering frequency when you are sure that all your seeds have germinated. Of course this is all dependent on what type of grass seed you put down. Most PR will be 100% germinated after 1 week. TTTF is about 2 weeks, and KBG is 2-3 weeks for complete germination. Of course this can be highly variable depending on soil temps and watering schedules can be variable due to soil types. I like to transition to twice a day waterings for about a week after complete germination. Then once a day for another week, then every other day, and so on and so on. Usually you will increase watering duration a bit as you decrease watering frequency. If you get a day of rain, then you can probably take off the next day or two depending on you soil type. There are a lot of opinions on starter fertilizer. Some feel that it isn't needed for the first month, as the seed contains everything the grass needs to get going. Also with all the watering you do some of the nutrients are leached away, mostly the nitrogen. New roots are so short in the beginning that it can't use a lot of the nutrients as well. Personally I like to use a half app at seeding, then the other half after the first or second mowing. At that point you are still watering, the roots are a good size to better use the nutrients and your grass will be strong enough to handle the traffic from the mower and spreader. |
RE: Seeding and using straw
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| I'm sure the co-op would be glad to sell you some straw to cover 9000 sqare feet and I'm also sure he knows that straw, if fresh, has seeds in it and doesn't lose them for at least a year. You might ask him if he sells seedless straw. Otherwise, instead of a lawn you could end up with a barnyard fit for the chickens. Overseeding is expensive enough--especially if the seed is a good one and that's the only seed you should use if you expect good results but that aside, overseeding should be accompanied by something that the seed sits in...the soil...and the seed will welcome.
Such total of topping of a topsoil 1/2" over such area would also be very expensive. Example: 9000 sqare feet, tospoil 1/2" = 4500 = 13 + cubic yards.
Its good that you put effort into only a portion of that ground but eventually it bites you to do the entire area. |
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