I'm curious about the new Kohler walk behind engine's reliability, too. On paper, it looks good---commercial grade components and a design similar to the Honda GXV walk behind engine. How's it holding up in real world use?

Trust me, the Chinese Kohlers do not meet the GXV standard although they seem to be o.k. for a consumer mower. I sold a few and ran into carb problems with them. Seems the factory uses either a very poor grade of fuel for initial run up or a gummy preservative for shipment. Every one needed the fuel system completely flushed before it would run.

From my pass experiences most stuff from china should stay there.A chinese built engine of any kind is very cheap and extremely low quality.Kohler used to be a very good name but like most companies these days they had to look to china so that they could stay in business.

My position is I do not care where the engine is built a name product is a name product. If a company starts building crap then they will join GM. Once you loose your name it is almost impossible to get it back. ask GM.

"From my pass experiences most stuff from china should stay there."

Agree.

Walt Conner

Rolm GM did not get itself into trouble by building crap it was the constant demands the union made like the crazy wages!Here in Canada some of the workers were getting $70/hr and outragious benefits too.Nowonder cars are so pricy today.
The union is a good thing cuz it prevents companies from screwing it's workers but look what it can do to a company over time ie. GM

Do not go blaming the unions for the down turn of GM. They do not make $70 per hour. They are getting $25 to $30 in wages and there benefits package
is maybe another $20 on top of that.
Ya just can not believe every thing that you hear on the TV
I really hate when people talk out there butthole.
The Non union car plants make close to the same $ with out a pention plan.

GM simply had too many divisions and brand models competing against each other in the US. Plus the unions bleed them dry with their pension and benefit demands.
Now back to lawn mowers

The Courage engines use plastic cam shaft gears. Everything that I've read states that these gears fail in as little as 5 hours causing catastrophic failure. Many shops back this up. I emailed Kohler to ask if they are remedying this with metal gears....no reply. I'll go with briggs. I really wanted an Ariens mower but they can keep them. I'll go with the sears version with the briggs. same mower, different eng.

Plastic gears??OMG what next?

I don't know about the China Kohlers, but I just picked up a 1 year old WalMart Yardman with a China clone of an Honda GXV. I am glad it was free. I have revived several Honda, Kawasaki, Toro-Suzuki, and Kohler/Yamaha small engines with little more than a carb cleaning. All these engines had high hours, but lots of life left to go. This Clone is already a major pain in the butt. I cleaned the carb and it still will only run when primed. The carb looked like it had sat for several years, not just this past season. All the rubber lines, gaskets, and O-rings look like crap. The only way I will ever mess with China Clones, regardless of the brand stickered on the shroud, is if they are free. In my opinion, they are not worth scrap price when they are new. I used to love Kohler when the K-series ruled. Now the ONLY Kohler I will use is the CS series, which are made by Yamaha. I also no longer use Briggs and Tecumseh engines as they are throw-aways with plastic cam gears and lobes and super cheapie carbs.

On here looking for a good name for a lawn mower but since you brought it up ... it's not the unions and the men that make decent money that you should be against! It's the Corporate executives and all their perks and bonuses that have broke the car companies!! The guys in the factories work their butts off trying to make a decent living .. doing work that cripples them in the long run and then are put down by their peers!!! What a shame!!! Bring back people like Iaoccoa (sp) that know how to run a business and respect those that work under them and you'll see everyone prosper!!!

"On here looking for a good name for a lawn mower but since you brought it up ... it's not the unions and the men that make decent money that you should be against! It's the Corporate executives and all their perks and bonuses that have broke the car companies!! The guys in the factories work their butts off trying to make a decent living .. doing work that cripples them in the long run and then are put down by their peers!!! What a shame!!! Bring back people like Iaoccoa (sp) that know how to run a business and respect those that work under them and you'll see everyone prosper!!!"

There's plenty of blame to go around. Corporate fat cats, union thuggery and don't forget our government and it's excessive EPA regulations and the worlds highest corporate tax rates.

It does P!ss me off that this discussion even has to exist and that Kohler somehow came to the realization that the American people wouldn't pay $10 more for walk behind mower with a Made in USA sticker on it. Kohler built a village and an industry by those ideals. It is old news by now, but Kohler, Harley D , Mercury Marine workers took concessions aplenty in the last 6 months or so to keep their jobs in the great state of Wisconsin. I seem to see something else in the news lately on Wisconsin unions...

Yeah a Sad state of affairs . I had several Kohler Free Air and Fan Cooled Snowmobile engines back in the 70's they were very dependable units . Numerous Kohler Engines were also used in the Mining Companies for Ventilation System Prime Movers . Sign of the Times unfortunately .

Tomplum-You are way off base with your comment"Great State of Wisconsin" Our gestapo governor has changed all that.Teachers and government workers already agreed to wage and benefit cuts and he just wants to bust the unions.Only way this is a great state is if you are Republican and own your own business.

"Teachers and government workers already agreed to wage and benefit cuts and he just wants to bust the unions."

Naw, the union is irrelevant. He just wants to reduce the cost of government. I read somewhere that government workers didn't pay a nickle for health insurance - the taxpayers paid it all. Can that be correct???

Government unions should be busted.

Well Gorper, my comment was really about the OPE industry and its roots in WI. Briggs, Areins, Gilson, Tecumseh, Kohler, Toro, Lawnboy, Deere, Simplicity etc etc either had their roots there or a solid presents there. Good luck with the Gov!

"Government unions should be busted."

Why not all unions???

"Why not all unions???"

Because collective bargaining is still valid in some instances of the private sector. I see favoritism and abuse at my current workplace every day. I'm protected because I'm a skilled trades worker and have value beyond what the union has to offer but the common floor workers are taken advantage of terribly. The problem is that once a union is in, they quit being reasonable and start demanding everything.

Why should collective bargaining be any more or less useful at a private company than at some governmental department? A mechanic could be hosed in a governmental garage as easily as in a private one.

* Posted by rank543 (My Page) on
Fri, Jul 3, 09 at 4:10

The Courage engines use plastic cam shaft gears... I'll go with briggs...

==============

And you will still be getting a camshaft with plastic gears.

Great discussion. How about answering the original question. Where are the engines made?

In my view the best WB lawnmower engines are Briggs and Stratton 2nd the Honda engines, The chinese engines are way down the line for know, Never forget that is what we said abought Japanies stuff look where they are now. Times they are a changing and we have to change also.

skane1(3) and walt2002 both think 'pass' is the same as 'past'. One good reason to ignore their comments. The other being: they both talk shite. Lay off that moonshine boys and don't forget the Factor 50 on the back of your necks.

"Plastic gears??OMG what next?"

"The Courage engines use plastic cam shaft gears... I'll go with briggs..."

I've heard Briggs is using plastic cam gears. Even if, GM had fiberglass camshaft gear in the 78 Delta88 i owned. On mine and 4 others i knew of, those lasted over 120K when sold. So the point is unless it is a flaw in design and 40% break after only 10 hrs of operation, it is Obsolescence at work and not bad design.

People grip about autoworkers wages,what about the big shots. If they would give in a little,there would be no china

fyi GM cars were really crap.. How can one defend them ?

I have two push mowers with Kohler motors made of Chinesium junk in China. Only reason I bought them was for the Kohler engine. Big surprise and disappointment. 5 hours use and won't start. Venture capitalists have been buying up these good names (Hoover, Electrolux, Kohler) and then make them in China and undercut local made. Takes about 4 years before people wake up to the scam. These capos don't care because they've made their money and moved onto the next one. You are left with Chinesium landfill. Chinese workers get $20 for a 10 hour day, 6 days a week. No pension, no workers comp insurance. Get your arm cut off in a machine you become a beggar on the street. Henry Ford said he wanted to pay his workers enough money so they could afford to buy his cars.