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Additives/Treatments

Posted by saxman1 VA 07 (My Page) on
Sat, Aug 9, 08 at 17:01

I use a lot of additives/treatments and always have. This, along with special oils has given me basically unlimited service on my outdoor power equipment. I know many here shun additives, but check this out; yesterday I saw my neighbor struggling with his mower. This mower has been running rich and sputtering for several years. Even so, it still blows only gas smoke, no blue in it, which is a testament to the Tecumseh engine. Anyway, I couldn't take it anymore, so I picked up a can of B-12 Chemtool carb/injection cleaner and took it over there. I told him to put one ounce in the fuel tank and run the mower. Just an hour ago, I heard the mower running sweet and smooth. I went over there, and sure enough it was the same one. He was amazed. I told him if he had been using practically anything in the gas (MMO, Seafoam, STA-BIL), he would never have had the problem. I didn't even get started on the oil. Bottom line: regular oil and gas are not enough, particularly where E10 fuel is mandated. If everybody used certain additives/premium oils, the repair shops would lose 50% of their business.


Follow-Up Postings:

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RE: Additives/Treatments

saxman,

You're singing my song! Problem is, many do not know what we do and what is effective and what is just hype to sell products. That's the beauty of this forum...we get to share and reason with each other.

Your comment about "unlimited service" made me smile. I'm still using my first Lawn Boy mower (for trimming)...a 1966 model, still tilling my garden with my first tiller...a B&S powered 1972 model, and still blowing snow with my first snowblower...a Tecumseh powered 1976 model, and still boating with a 70HP Johnson, a 1979 model. They are all still purring like new, and are doing so because they've been cared for and have benefitted from the use of additives targeted to specific concerns/conditions. With that said, MMO and Sta-Bil are good ones, and Seafoam gets excellent reviews too (I've not used it...haven't had the need).

Keep doin' what yer doin'....it works to keep our favorite machines young, doesn't it? (now, if somebody just made equivalents for MMO and Sta-Bil for the human body, wouldn't that be great?) ~grin~

Hal in PA


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RE: Additives/Treatments

'(now, if somebody just made equivalents for MMO and Sta-Bil for the human body, wouldn't that be great?) ~grin~'

Okay, I'm working on that. So far I have brandy and a good cigar once a day which seems to be working!


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RE: Additives/Treatments

I use some of these 'treatment/additives' myself,
but I've never seen any positive proof such as you
describe. When I was just a novice wrench turner
I had it drummed into me: "There ain't no fix in a can".


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RE: Additives/Treatments

I agree with Ibpod I have never seen any of that crap in a can work. Just a waste of money and time. If only the fix's were that easy.


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RE: Additives/Treatments

lbpod & rolm: May I suggest you re-read my first paragraph? Carefully this time, perhaps?

Meanwhile, saxman and I will continue to enjoy the longevity of our relatively trouble-free equipment. For anyone to claim that "there ain't no fix in a can" when speaking specifically about Sta-Bil or carb/injection cleaner tells me a lot about them, not the product.

saxman...shame on you! See what you brought out of the woodwork with your post? ~grin~

Hal in PA

P.S. to lbpod and rolm: hey, guys...chill out a bit, OK? This is a forum to share and, hopefully, learn a little. Tactful posts are encouraged, others will eventually get ignored. A word to the wise.....


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RE: Additives/Treatments

I fully expected such comments and have no concerns about them. There will be more, and more vehement. I just had to post it, though. I used to have a 1976 GMC van with 350 4V and TH350 auto that wasn't driven much. The valve stems tended to stick which gave it a lumpy idle. Not a big deal, but I didn't like listening to the 'putt-putt' at idle. I would treat it with Marvel Mystery Oil and it would smooth out for a few months. For anyone using E10 in anything, lawn or automotive equipment, some manufacturers are recommending anti-corrosive and water-absorbing additives. I believe I first saw this in the Honda engine manual with my LB 22271. I was already there, since I have been using STA-BIL+MMO in everything with a piston in it for some time. This mixture cleans, lubricates and prevents corrosion in the fuel system and combustion chamber. Today's engine oils are so much better than they were just ten years ago that I rarely use any oil additives anymore. The stuff I used to add now is already in there.


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RE: Additives/Treatments

To my point I am using a 28 year old B&S mower and guess what, runs perfect no oil burning or leaking, 2nd pull starts everytime and you are good to go. My lot is 50x180 and gues what no additives. It's a waste of money period!


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RE: Additives/Treatments

I can't believe that anyone would consider using Sta-bil wasteful. I use it in all my outdoor power equipment all year, as well as 2 seldom driven older cars.


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RE: Additives/Treatments

Diehard Seafoam fan here!

This stuff keeps the rings on all my twocycles free from carbon buildup so I have all the power of a new engine even though some are forty plus years old!!
Helps keep the carbs clean as a whistle too.

Neal


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RE: Additives/Treatments

ood old fresh gas a an oil change every year and a plug change every 5 years or so will keep an engine running for ever. Most engines a destroyed by over-heating or the lack of oil changes at least once a year. As I said I am still using a 28 year old B&S 3 1/2-HP mower and it runs and cuts like a champ. My point is if you are having a probplem with an engine don't run out and buy all those additives and wast your cash. Fresh gas and an oil chage change and you are good to go for at leas 30 years with and mower, 1-problem is the decks are made so thin that they will rust out before to engine will give out.


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RE: Additives/Treatments

Rolm, thats a great point. I also see where you are coming from but I use mainly two cycle engines and the seafoam does help keep carbon at bay inside the two cycle engine.

I also use seafoam inside my four cycle engines crankcase before an oil change every so often just to keep any sludge from building on the innards.

Regards.

Neal


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RE: Additives/Treatments

'My point is if you are having a probplem with an engine don't run out and buy all those additives and wast your cash.'

So according to this strategy I should have let my neighbor take the mower to the shop and pay $75 for a carburetor rebuild instead of just dissolving the gum and varnish in the carb with a solvent? Just like anything else, additives/treatments are tools. You have to know what you're trying to accomplish and what will do it without damaging anything. So, for the non-mechanically-inclined, maybe you shouldn't go dumping stuff into the engine after you get a problem, but rather, use known safe treatments all along to prevent problems. The absolute best thing you can do for a mower engine is to use STA-BIL in the fuel all the time. It only takes an ounce for two gallons and can save you a ton of trouble.


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RE: Additives/Treatments

For the record, my first response to the original post
said: "I use some of these 'treatments/additives' myself".
My point was, years ago, they were looked down upon by
the engine repairing people. And if you go to any
auto supply store, you will see shelf, upon shelf of
'fixes in a can' that don't work. Sta-bil, SeaFoam
and MMO are exceptions. Also, I take back the statement
I made that said I never witnessed a 'dramatic' fix
by an additive. Back in the mid 70's, the fleet I
worked on got a bunch of 1/2 ton Chevy pick-ups and
they all suddenly developed a very loud chirping noise
in the rocker arm assemblies of the straight six engines.
General Motors responded by sending us little bottles
of an additive meant for limited slip differentials.
They said to add one bottle to the crankcase of each
vehicle. The old timers looked at one another and
laughed. Well, it was amazing, but within about a minute
after adding the additive, the noise went away completely.
The old timers raised their eye brows and said that
the noise will be back. Well, the trucks went down
the road several years later, but the noise never
came back.


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RE: Additives/Treatments

saxman: Well said! You and I are on the same page, as usual. Preventive measures are far preferable to trying to fix a condition after the fact. The products we've mentioned have a great track record of doing just that...prevention.

lbpod: Perhaps I misread your meaning in your original post, but you've certainly redeemed yourself with your last one. Even though the most effective additives are the ones to target specific known areas of risk, there are a few "fixes" that work, too. Knowing which is which, and knowing why, is vital to avoid "wasting money, period" as rolm puts it.

and now, rolm: I still have not the slightest idea where you're coming from. I sincerely hope it's just that you have a bit to learn about targeted applications. That said, you've done quite well with that B&S engine. Wish you well!

Regards to all,

Hal in PA


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RE: Additives/Treatments

Hi,

I use Stabil. Mainly because it is easily available at my local Home Depot which I seem to end up at alot.

Petrol for mowers and garden equipment tends to be left standing around for a month or so. Or even more if over a winter. Gasoline degrades over time. This is not an issue for cars, because you usually use up the petrol within a week or so. In the days of old, petrol was made by just distilling off the right fraction. These days more of that petrol is also being made by cracking heavier distilates, and making petrol. The cracking process tends to make fuel produced degrade more quickly.

Stabil and other fuel preservatives have bactericies that kill off bacteria that degrade the fuel, hence making it last longer.

Best, Mike.


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RE: Additives/Treatments

Nothing beats a good tune. Maybe some stabil in the gas. Otherwise keep'em clean and dry and they will serve you well.


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RE: Additives/Treatments

I just stumbled across this thread.. I've got a few Honda based items used for the yard (mower+tiller). I've had issues with the mower wanting to stall on the crappy gas. A visit to the place I bought it from indicated I needed to use super unleaded -- preferably from places like Union-76 (the high-end gas station -- not the local Arco) and that if I did that my problems would disappear. I like the idea of additives much better since it takes a while to eat a gallon of gas on these guys. What is the suggested use for MMO or the others.. I saw the 1oz of Sta-bil or equiv to the gas -- what about the MMO?

For the FG100 Honda tiller -- what can I add to it's mini-tank (23.7 fluid oz or 0.7 Liters) and oil system (3.4 fluid oz)?

I am about to take the tiller to the repair place since it stalls as soon as I hit the thottle.. Not sure what it is but the fuel system is suspect..


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RE: Additives/Treatments

Stabil + Lucas fuel conditioner.


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RE: Additives/Treatments

Before running down to Pep Boys and grabbing bottles of miracle engine elixir to fix an undefined problem, I would suggest that you rule out the easy stuff first.
1. Is the gas fresh - within 30 days.
2. Is the gas stored in a well made and truly airtight can. Not some cheapo can from Walmart.
3. Does the gas sit in the tiller gas tank for months?
4. Have you kept up on maintenance like new aircleaner, plug gapping, oil change, etc?


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RE: Additives/Treatments

I ALWAYS use Stabil and have had great luck. I will sneak in a little Seafoam from time to time as well.


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RE: Additives/Treatments

I was told by a Pro the was turning wrenches for over 30 years. There is no Fix In a Can.

Beware on many of these forums companies push their products.

All I can say non-sense, nothing replaces keeping any machine in good repair. NO Additives save your money.


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RE: Additives/Treatments

I got a friend that's a mechanic. He said when he takes engines apart he sees the havoc these new E10 fuels are causing. Corrosion especially. He says something like Sta-bil is a must.


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RE: Additives/Treatments

My Toro is 10 years old and have not had any problems with it.Still starts on first or second pull.Same with my Echo trimmer.I add Seafoam and MMO.Not at the same time,I alternate between the two.On my trimmer,I use 91 octane gas with no eth.added and seafoam every so often.


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RE: Additives/Treatments

roadbike --

Here are the answers to your questions with regards to my tiller :

1) No -- It takes me at least 6 month to go through 2.5G
2) Not sure -- a typical plastic gas certified container (is there something to look for?)
3) Yes (but perhaps not from now on)
4) Yes

I spent $20 and rebuilt the Walbro WYL carb and it fired right up although it seems to have a minor issue with the high-end RPMs wanting to stall a little. There might be some other gunk further in I suppose. I was able to use it just fine last weekend. Darn carbs have itty bitty parts!

BTW: IF I want to use something like MMO, is it a few Tablespoons in the volume of oil in the small Honda 4 strokes or ?? Unfortunately, this tiller does not see lots of use like the mower/edger/weed wacker.


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RE: Additives/Treatments

Are you guys that are singing the praises of STA-BIL Fuel Stabilizer saying that you use it all the time, every tank, all year, even during the busiest time of the season?

I (and I think many others) have only associated it with storage when the machine is not being used.


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RE: Additives/Treatments

I use Chemtool B 12 as a cheap easy long shot alternative to a carb over haul. Most of the time it does the trick. My OPE gets a capfull of MMO every fill up. The engines on my stuff start easier and run smoother. This stuff isnt engine rebuild in a can, it is a varnish dissolver and a top cylinder lube. Gas simply doesnt have the additives needed to keep an occasionally used engine happy.


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Strong believer in Lucas Top End Fuel Cleaner / Conditioner and Stabil . Fresh Gas and Oil every Year goes a long way also . Air Filter and New Plug When Warranted .


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RE: Additives/Treatments

'Are you guys that are singing the praises of STA-BIL Fuel Stabilizer saying that you use it all the time, every tank, all year, even during the busiest time of the season?
I (and I think many others) have only associated it with storage when the machine is not being used.'

Yes, all the time, particularly where Ethanol gas is in use. This is because the Marine Formuia (blue super concentrate) is for Ethanol fuels and contains more cleaners and water removers. It is designed to prevent corrosion associated with Ethanol fuels. Even with non-Ethanol gas, I like having the stabilizer and cleaners in there all the time. A side benefit is you then don't have to do anything special about the fuel at storage time, and your leftover gas is good next spring.


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