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monkeyleg

Need help identifying plant

Monkeyleg
9 years ago

I've had this little bush in my dining room for several years. I don't know what it is, and all the searching on different plant identification sites has led me nowhere.

The plant is like a small tree or shrub, with woody branches that terminate in clusters of leaves.

It's been healthy, but in the last few days I've had several leaves turn pale yellow and fall off. Nothing in my care of it has changed. The leaves aren't doing this in any particular section of the plant. It's all over.

Any suggestions as to what it might be?

Comments (40)

  • subtropix
    9 years ago

    Could be a Crotron (a tropical), or Aucuba japonica (an outdoor plant in zones 6b plus).

    This is Aucuba japonica below.

  • rhizo_1 (North AL) zone 7
    9 years ago

    I agree that it is Aucuba japonica 'Variegata', aka Gold Dust Aucuba. It is more commonly known as a warm climate landscape plant, but can make a great houseplant, too.

    How many times have you repotted it in the past several years? Tell us about the type of potting medium you use, and your watering and fertilization schedule.

  • Monkeyleg
    Original Author
    9 years ago

    Thanks for the replies. I got this (and other plants) as leave-behinds from my ex. It's been growing really well, as have the others.

    I haven't repotted it, and was thinking that might be the problem. It's a good-sized plant, and in an 8"x8" or 10"x10" container. I let it get a bit dry before watering. That's worked well in the past. There was a time when the pot would get light from lack of water and the plant would tip over. That was my signal to water. ;)

    The soil is just potting soil. No fertilization.

    I keep it by a north-facing window. I was thinking after reading your posts that maybe it was the cooler weather outside, but I've kept it by that window for a year and a half without problem.

    It may also be that the eight or so leaves I got today were from the plant getting too dry the other day. I usually see a couple of yellowed leaves right away when it needs watering, but maybe these were just late in turning.

  • missingtheobvious
    9 years ago

    I'm in zone 7a, and the Previous Owners left me a Gold Dust Aucuba planted on the west side of the house. It would have some frost burn in unusually cold winters (when the low was a few degrees below zero rather than the normal few degrees above zero). So although I've never grown one indoors, I doubt a cool window would bother it.

    It did tend to lose a lot of yellow leaves at a particular time of year, but I no longer remember if that was spring or fall. [I had it removed as part of redoing the foundation beds.]

  • subtropix
    9 years ago

    Yes, I was going to say, I would confirm its identity before exposing it to a chill. I was leaning toward Croton as well. Leaves will be thicker, glossier, and shinier on Aucuba. Maybe a closeup would help.

  • Monkeyleg
    Original Author
    9 years ago

    It looks like the Acuba is close. I have a croton, and that's not it.

    It's been in the same spot for a year and a half. I would think a chill would have affected it last winter. I'm thinking it's outgrown its container.

  • Dave in NoVA • N. Virginia • zone 7A
    9 years ago

    Hundreds of varieties of croton. They really vary
    In leaf shape, color, etc.

    Just how cold is this room?

    A closeup of a leaf, especially the leaf stem (petiole), would help.

    Crotons have a rather unique curved petiole.

    Could certainly be
    Codiaem variegatum 'Gold Dust'. At least I would not rule it out.

    This post was edited by dave_in_nova on Mon, Oct 27, 14 at 8:52

  • Monkeyleg
    Original Author
    9 years ago

    Well, I had over 50 leaves turn yellow this week. It could be the cold, although it's been in the same spot for a year and a half. I just can't figure out what else it would be.

    Usually, I'd get a few yellow leaves if I let the plant go without water for too long. But I don't remember losing this many leaves.

  • gardengal48 (PNW Z8/9)
    9 years ago

    If truly an aucuba, the chill is not an issue. This plant can tolerate outdoor temps well below freezing.

    There may be other issues involved. How large is the container it is in and when was it repotted? Aucubas can become large shrubs in the landscape and can easily outgrow a container given enough time. That would affect its ability to take up enough water to keep fully hydrated, hence the drop in foliage. In addition to becoming rootbound, potting soil deteriorates over time and needs to be replaced. The plant will also require periodic fertilizing as well.

    If you are convinced it is an Aucuba, check out these factors. But are you certain it is an aucuba and not a croton? A croton could be much more sensitive to chills and cold but can also be affected by the same restrictive growing conditions as the aucuba if a large enough plant.

  • Carrie B
    9 years ago

    I doubt that an Aucuba would survive indoors for several years. Looks more like a croton to me.

  • carol23_gw
    9 years ago

    Aucuba actually do very well as house plants. I knew a gardener who kept plants in containers inside.. She also grew it in the garden. Cuttings readily root in water.
    One trait I've noticed is the green stems on Aucuba. I don't think the mature stems on a croton are dark green.

    Here is a link that might be useful: Aucuba - house plant

  • Dave in NoVA • N. Virginia • zone 7A
    9 years ago

    Aucubas have opposites leaves on stems.

    Croton's are alternate. Should be easy to look and see.

  • Monkeyleg
    Original Author
    9 years ago

    It's probably the container being too small. I thought this all came on suddenly, but I suppose the root system just gets too big at some point and it seems sudden.

    I'll repot it, and will report back.

    Thanks.

  • ken_adrian Adrian MI cold Z5
    9 years ago

    its INCREDIBLY STRESSED ... perhaps not a time to rip it from the pot.. and stress it more...

    lets see a current pic including the media ...

    if you did NOT change.. site... sun... heat ... etc ...

    all you might be left with.. is rotting off its roots ... improper watering ....

    see under both suggested names... if you can root pieces out .. ofeten.. that is much easier.. than a full out rescue ....

    ahhh.. i see you arent waiting on the repot.. good luck with that ...

    ken

  • Dave in NoVA • N. Virginia • zone 7A
    9 years ago

    Crotons can drop leaves naturally with reduced light levels.

    Also, spider mites can be an issue -- especially after house heat is on. You'd have to look closely at the leaves to determine whether it has mites.

    Crotons, as a houseplant, like just a bit of reduced watering in the winter.

  • floral_uk z.8/9 SW UK
    9 years ago

    Monkeyleg, could you check and provide the alternate/opposite information? Then the id would be straight forward, as dave_in_nova said.

  • Monkeyleg
    Original Author
    9 years ago

    It looks most like the aucuba japonica posted above. I did a Google image search for Croton, and what I saw is in the link below. I have a plant that looks just like those croton's in the photos.

    I've put it in a pot that's three times the size of what it was in. I didn't pull part the root ball, as I didn't know if it would damage it. I knocked off some of the dirt, though, before putting it in fresh potting soil.

    I know it did not drop leaves last winter. Sometimes it would get dry enough that it would tip over, but it would only get a few yellowed leaves.

    I hope the repotting takes care of the problem.

    Here is a link that might be useful: Google images Croton

  • carol23_gw
    9 years ago

    From what I noticed in the OP's photo, the stems are brown like a croton, not green like Aucuba.
    Here is a link to show opposite vs. alternate leaf arrangement so you can absolutely have the correct ID.
    Croton leaves are not opposite each other. Aucuba leaves are.

    Here is a link that might be useful: {{gwi:204029}}

  • floral_uk z.8/9 SW UK
    9 years ago

    Please just tell us if it has alternate or opposite leaf arrangement .... then there would be absolutely no doubt what it is. (BTW the 'Crotons' you found are only some of the many different cultivars. There are ones which look a lot more like Aucuba japonica. Look at the link and you'll see why the confusion.)

    Here is a link that might be useful: 'Croton'

  • Monkeyleg
    Original Author
    9 years ago

    The leaf arrangement is opposite. Going up on a stem, there are two leaves at 180 degrees of each other. Then, up from that, there are two leaves at 180 degrees of each other, and at 45 to 90 degrees of the previous pair. Same with the next pair, and the next pair.

  • Tiffany, purpleinopp Z8b Opp, AL
    9 years ago

    Aaaah, closure. TY!

  • Embothrium
    9 years ago

    However, the leaves look alternate in the original photo - as far as can be made out. A closer view would settle it for everyone, the shape of the leaves also looks like croton rather than aucuba - as do the older stems.

    This post was edited by bboy on Wed, Dec 3, 14 at 11:06

  • Dave in NoVA • N. Virginia • zone 7A
    9 years ago

    I agree with bboy --- I still think croton.

    A closeup photo of the leaf petiole meeting the stem would settle it.

    Also, aucubas tend to have serrations on the apical portion of the leaves. I do not see any serrations here.

    See attached photo of Croton 'Gold Dust' that I found on the web.

    This post was edited by dave_in_nova on Wed, Dec 3, 14 at 12:42

  • Dave in NoVA • N. Virginia • zone 7A
    9 years ago

    The OP may not know exactly what opposite/alternate means.

  • Monkeyleg
    Original Author
    9 years ago

    I hope this photo will help. The leaves are in pairs, with each one of the pair exactly opposite the other, 180 degrees. The next pair up the stem are at an angle to the first pair, but not 90 degrees, as in the Whorled diagram.

    It looks like the croton in dave_in_nova's photo.

    Since repotting, the number of leaves turning yellow has slowed. I picked off about a dozen yesterday and today. The plant has thinned out quite a bit, but if the repotting fixes the problem, I hope it will come back.

  • Monkeyleg
    Original Author
    9 years ago

    I hope this photo will help. The leaves are in pairs, with each one of the pair exactly opposite the other, 180 degrees. The next pair up the stem are at an angle to the first pair, but not 90 degrees, as in the Whorled diagram.

    It looks like the croton in dave_in_nova's photo.

    Since repotting, the number of leaves turning yellow has slowed. I picked off about a dozen yesterday and today. The plant has thinned out quite a bit, but if the repotting fixes the problem, I hope it will come back.

    {{!gwi}}

  • carol23_gw
    9 years ago

    Living stems of Aucuba are green, not brown. Your photo shows alternate leaf arrangement and thin, brown stems. It cannot be Aucuba.

    Here is a current garden photo of one cultivar of my Aucubas which clearly shows green stems and opposite branching as well as opposite leaf arrangement.

    You have a croton.

    This post was edited by carol23 on Wed, Dec 3, 14 at 18:10

  • carol23_gw
    9 years ago

    another Aucuba. Note the leaf edge.

  • Monkeyleg
    Original Author
    9 years ago

    I saw that tooth edge in photos when I searched. The edges of the leaves on my plant are smooth, not jagged.

    I guess it's a variant of a croton or an Aucuba. ;)

  • tete_a_tete
    9 years ago

    I was going to swear blind that you have an Aucuba japonica variegata, but when I saw the picture of the Croton (I forget whose pic it was now) I realised that it makes far more sense that what you have is in fact a Croton. I had COMPLETELY forgotton those types of Crotons.

    (They are really nice. I like Crotons very much.)

    Aucubas are tough things but Crotons are a little more sensitive to everything I think. They loathe being over-watered. They hate the cold. I am convinced that you have a Croton.

  • floral_uk z.8/9 SW UK
    9 years ago

    "I guess it's a variant of a croton or an Aucuba. ;)"

    Your plant is definitely a 'Croton' (actually Codiaeum). It is not an Aucuba - it can't be - for the reasons several people have given. Your plant has alternately arranged leaves and brown stems. The arrangement of leaves is a basic identifier in plants and doesn't vary. The difficulty in identifying it at the start was that it wasn't possible to make out the leaf arrangement. Now there is no doubt.

    I think yours may have spider mite looking at the reverse of some leaves. It is also possible it has scale. Can you scrape those brown circles off with a finger nail?

  • Monkeyleg
    Original Author
    9 years ago

    I can't see any mites, even with a magnifier. How large are they?

    The brown spots do scrape off.

    It has new growth, which is one positive.

  • Monkeyleg
    Original Author
    9 years ago

    Just an update. The repotting seems to have done the trick. Just a couple of yellow leaves yesterday, and none today.

    Now, I just hope that I get enough new growth to replace the 100+ leaves that turned yellow and withered.

    Thanks for all the help.

  • 420benz
    9 years ago

    It is an evergreen but I Bo not know the name of it.

  • Monkeyleg
    Original Author
    9 years ago

    Well, back to problems again. On Friday I found that the plant needed water so bad that the leaves, which ordinarily point upwards, had flattened out. I watered, and they sprung up within a couple of hours.

    However, yesterday there were 15 leaves that had turned yellow that I pulled. Today there were 10 more.

    In the past, when the plant needed water, it would actually tip over from the soil in the pot being too light. Even then, it would only lose a couple of leaves.

    It seems like this is more than just needing water. Or is it still stressed? I know I am.

    I pulled it away from the window since temperatures outside have dropped, but it's been by the window in the winter the last couple of years.

    It's now lost over 125 leaves. The new growth isn't keeping up, so it's looking thin.

    Help!

  • Dave in NoVA • N. Virginia • zone 7A
    9 years ago

    It appears uneven watering is causing your plant to stress and drop leaves.

    Sounds like you need to become more consistent with your watering, or repot it up to a larger pot so the rootball does not dry out so quickly.

  • Monkeyleg
    Original Author
    9 years ago

    The loss of leaves has slowed to a few a day, but it's still having leaves turn yellow. There's been a dozen in the last 3-4 days.

    I repotted it, from an 8" square pot to a 10" round pot. When I moved it, I gently knocked as much dirt as possible off the roots, and spread them out as much as I could.

    I've tried moving it to a different part of the house where it might be warmer, but that made no change.

    It was in the same location for over two years without a problem. I don't get it.

  • Monkeyleg
    Original Author
    9 years ago

    Here's the end of this story (I hope). The plant was still losing leaves, although not at as rapid a pace as before.

    I'd looked at both sides of leaves with a 10X magnifier, and couldn't see anything other than what looked like bits of dust, and some very tiny specks. I didn't think the specks were big enough to be any sort of living creature.

    Nevertheless, I used paper towels and a 50/50 mix of isopropyl alcohol and water, and wiped down every leaf. That was last week. There hasn't been a single leaf that's gone bad since. (Knock on wood).

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