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Chlorophyllum break, a sign of virus.

Posted by orchidnick z9Ca (orchidnick@yahoo.com) on
Tue, Dec 31, 13 at 12:30

Virus has been discussed ad infinitum, I have nothing new to add. As part of my yearly inspection and clean up of all of my plants, I made the sad discovery that a very large, high quality Dendrobium speciosum (Len's Good Gold) is virused. These plants are so tough that I never thought they could do this but in the end they are orchids like all the others and are susceptible too.

Here is a picture of the color break in the new leaves for the benefit of newcomers to the hobby who may not have seen this. Also noted was pleating of the new leaves and uniform appearance of all the new leaves. No matter how valuable that plant may be, it's in the trash. When you see obvious color break like that on green leaves or color break in the flowers of for example Cattleyas, there is no need to test. Just discard the plant.

Merry (Ha, ha) New Year, I hope the new year will be better than the last day of this year!!!! Don't need surprises like that.

Nick


Follow-Up Postings:

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RE: Chlorophyllum break, a sign of virus.

  • Posted by saldut 9-10 st pete, fl (My Page) on
    Tue, Dec 31, 13 at 17:47

Thanks for posting that pic, it's good and clear.it's an education in itself.......the virus has somewhat the same appearance in roses, strange to say, it will show as mottled blotchy yellow areas... however, most commercial rose growers have virused stock and don't intend to change or do anything abt. it.. and most roses still grow and bloom but prob. not at their best, so you just keep the rose and treat it well and hope for the best....sally


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RE: Chlorophyllum break, a sign of virus.

Nick, I'm still learning. As a total newbie, I think I'm missing what you see as obvious. Could you post a pic of a healthy leaf so I have something to compare this to? I know it sounds dumb, but I only have the one phal, and am totally averse to purchasing other orchids until I know more about them. ?I don't know what color break and leaf pleating are.
LynnT


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RE: Chlorophyllum break, a sign of virus.

Couldn't that be a nutritional problem? I've had breaks in leaves and it seemed to be related to pH or fertilizer.

If the plant hasn't been trashed yet, a clearer pic would be appreciated. You've sparked my curiosity.

Happy New Year,
Jane


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RE: Chlorophyllum break, a sign of virus.

Here is a picture of a normal leaf. There are about 40 of these, all of the new ones affected by the virus

Nick


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RE: Chlorophyllum break, a sign of virus.

A picture of one of the pleated leaves.

Nick


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RE: Chlorophyllum break, a sign of virus.

Another view of the pleated leaf. This is longitudinal pleating, parallel to the long axis of the leaf. Horizontal pleating, at 90 degrees to the long axis, is very common, especially amongst Oncidium and Miltonia types as a result of water problems. Horizontal pleating is not a sign of virus.

I don't view the longitudinal pleating as shown here as an absolute sign of virus but will test a plant that shows it even if there is no other sign of virus. In this plant the evidence is so overwhelming that I only kick myself for not having picked it up sooner. I absolutely reject the concept that Ph, fertilizer or other chemical insult can do this especially if other plants surrounding it are normal. The plant was in a corner and only during the yearly clean up did I become aware of these leaves which formed last spring. I don't test plants with horizontal pleating which is a sign of water problem.

Sally, don't be concerned about virus at this stage of your hobby (correctly called addiction if you have been properly infected). You won't find plants which show evidence of virus at Trader Joe's or Home Depot. You won't even find plants which show sign of virus at orchid shows or have them mailed to you from vendors. We all know better. Any one of these plants may actually be virused but won't show signs of it until much later. Once your addiction grown from 1 to 10 to 100 plants and has taken over 5o% of your available living space, once you start dividing, trading and swapping plants with other addicts, then it will be time to beware of infected needles. By then you will know how to spot the signs.

In a well kept collection, virus is really not a problem as it very seldom crops up. I must have cleaned up 2,000 plants and this was the only affected plant I found. Instead of being some ugly catt hybrid or a NOID, it had to be a desirable large Dend speciosum which would sell for $300 to $500 at any orchid show. I'm probably being punished for being a hooker in a previous life or something like that.

Nick


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RE: Chlorophyllum break, a sign of virus.

Nick, thank you. So, color break means the light streaks in the leaf, and with the different angles I see now what pleating means. I look at blooms on the gallery, and as much as I would love to have these lovely things in my home/life, orchids are still mystifying to me. I'm tickled that it's growing a spike, but I'm also intrigued with the fact that your "normal" Dend leaf looks, by itself, and at least to me, exactly like a leaf on my little phal.

So, again I say, I need to learn more. I'm off searching for pictures of whole orchids. With names. Does anyone know of a particular place that's good for that?
LynnT

I also apologize in advance if I am "highjacking" this post. I don't mean to, it just seems a natural progression from the start.


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RE: Chlorophyllum break, a sign of virus.

Nick, I love your writing style. Thanks for this useful post.


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RE: Chlorophyllum break, a sign of virus.

Lyn, don't worry too much about learning all about orchids. They are extremely easy to take care off. Just follow these 5 simple rules:

1) Water them once a week.
2) Fertilize them with half strength fertilizer every 2 weeks.
3) Give them a lot of light but keep them out of the sun.
4) Give them moderate temp, not too hot, not too cold.
5) Repot them with fresh bark or whatever every 1 1/2 years.

If you follow these simple rules, 75% of the commonly available ones will love you, grow and bloom. You don't want the other 25% for at least 3 or 4 more years of growing. Now throw away the books and enjoy your plants. (Remember, they are like potato chips, one is never enough)

Nick


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RE: Chlorophyllum break, a sign of virus.

LOL! I love your writing style too. Potato chips, huh?
LynnT


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RE: Chlorophyllum break, a sign of virus.

Humor asides, if you do follow these simple rules you'll probably do well.

Nick


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RE: Chlorophyllum break, a sign of virus.

A Catt I bought a year ago from Odoms. Blooms were normal last year, no breaks. I have been concerned about some streaking of the leaves from the new growths. After looking at your pics, would like your opinion.

 photo CE855A5D-258C-49FF-9264-F054B46BFDBD_zpscqabxxsp.jpg

 photo 6541ED1D-E981-4037-AA49-A8AFEB876064_zpssk79k70w.jpg

 photo 7F38EE81-2DC6-4DF0-9186-37600F68ED9A_zpsk1u0zmbn.jpg

Jane


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RE: Chlorophyllum break, a sign of virus.

  • Posted by arthurm Sydney, NSW AUST (My Page) on
    Sat, Jan 4, 14 at 20:20

Might be abnormal ploidy.(4n), (3n) etc.etc.
I once bought a speculative Cattleya cross with abnormal ploidy and the leaves always grew contorted. Never flowered and it ended up in the dustbin.
Many desirable Cattleyas are (4n) x (2n) crosses. The babies are (3n) beautiful, but sterile and sometimes with lumpy leaves.


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RE: Chlorophyllum break, a sign of virus.

I don't see chlorophyll break, just streaks which are not as significant. I think I see some ridging or pleating though which is not a good sign. I also see a couple of buds ready to open which will give you the answer. If there is color break in the flower, please post a picture as it will complete the scenario for virus. If there is no color break I would probably test the plant but certainly not toss it on the basis of what the picture show.

Nick


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RE: Chlorophyllum break, a sign of virus.

I have a Cat that had similar streaks last year. I tested it for CMV and ORSV and it was negative for both. The new growth this year so far looks normal. The flowers looked ok but they are white, so I don't know what color break would look like on a white flower.


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RE: Chlorophyllum break, a sign of virus.

Thanks for the comments. I've been bothered by the leaves all year. Bought the plant at our Orchid Show last year and chatted with the owner of Odoms as I've bought Catts from them over many years. At the time I purchased, I didn't notice anything unusual. The plant was in bloom and everything was normal.

The streaking is very regular and runs the full length of the leaf.

Our show is in 2 weeks. Odoms will be there and I'm tempted to bring the plant with me. There are 6 buds which should be open by then. I'll be able to tell if there are breaks.

Last years blooms:

Pink Sensation - Odoms 1-2013 photo PinkSensation_zps5698925a.jpg

Jane


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RE: Chlorophyllum break, a sign of virus.

Here is a photo of mine from last year when I tested.

DSC01774_zps76a600b9 photo DSC01774_zps76a600b9.jpg


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RE: Chlorophyllum break, a sign of virus.

I have tested plants with pleated leaves over the years and got mixed results. I will continue to test such plants as I got some positive tests. As I said earlier, I would not discard a plant because of this alone but certainly keep a close watch on it.

Nick


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RE: Chlorophyllum break, a sign of virus.

Sad to say, I found another virused plant. The leaves were somewhat hidden so I must have missed it on my first go around. This leaf shows the effect of the Odontoglossum ring virus. Normally the circles are more round and also more clearly defined but this is almost good enough for me. There are some insects, the false spider mite for one that can do this. Or so I'm told.

Nick


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RE: Chlorophyllum break, a sign of virus.

Here is another leaf showing the typical circles, or near circles of this virus.

Nick


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RE: Chlorophyllum break, a sign of virus.

Here is a poor picture of the flowers. they are clean, absoutely no evidence of color break. The Odontoglossum ringspot virus (ORSV) often does not show the color break in the flowers. The Cymbidium mosaic virus (CyMV) and the Tobacco mosaic virus (TMV) do show the color break in the flowers along with other signs. I have no affected flowers, if someone can post a picture of a flower with color break we'll have all the major 3 things to look for demonstrated in this thread. Chlorophyllum break, ring spots with necrosis and flower color break.

I was going to toss this plant but a friend of mine insisted I test it as he says that false spider mites can cause this damage. I will report on the test. In the meantime it's at my daughter's house where she can enjoy the flowers and no harm done.

Nick


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RE: Chlorophyllum break, a sign of virus.

What a beautiful flower. I'm still waiting for my buds to open but the temps dropped to 35 last night and I had to bring a bunch of plants inside...I dread to think what is living in the pots.

I think I should buy some test kits.

Jane


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RE: Chlorophyllum break, a sign of virus.

Are the test kits really around $100? How many plants can you test?


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RE: Chlorophyllum break, a sign of virus.

The tests are $125 for 25 of them. The plant whose leaves I showed above tested NEGATIVE! I was really shocked as I normally would discard a plant like that. I have to readjust my attitude to this and test more. That particular plant will be sprayed with and washed to get rid of any possible bugs and then I 'll watch and see what the new leaves look like.

Over all. I will still discard plants who have the green chlorophyll streaks/breaks shown in the 1st plant, I will also discard plants with well defined color breaks in the flowers but test a plant with pleated leaves and black discoloration on the leaves. Better to discard a healthy plant than to retain an infected one which can spread the problem to others in the collection.

Nick


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