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Alkaline soil -- would Hollytone be bad for any perennials?
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Posted by
jayco 5b NY (
My Page) on
Tue, Apr 26, 11 at 22:30
| My soil tested at PH 7.1. I have a huge bag of Hollytone which seems to be very similar in composition to Espoma's Flowertone product, with slightly less nitrogen and 2% instead of 1% sulfur. Are there any perennials you know of that would not respond well to this? Am I being dumb to consider it? Thanks! |
Follow-Up Postings:
RE: Alkaline soil -- would Hollytone be bad for any perennials?
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| I tend to save it for things that would prefer a more acidic soil, but that's because I have a stockpile of other fertilizers I got on sale. It does seem to help somewhat. |
RE: Alkaline soil -- would Hollytone be bad for any perennials?
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| Thanks -- so are you thinking it wouldn't hurt but would also not be as helpful as the Flowertone? |
RE: Alkaline soil -- would Hollytone be bad for any perennials?
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| It depends on what you are planning on putting it on. It definitely helps my rugosa roses, which want a pH much closer to 6 than 7+. I wouldn't expect it to do much one way or the other for clematis or peonies which prefer a pH closer to 7 than 6. Just for practicality, if you have a (relatively small) garden, and only want to buy one kind of fertilizer, it should be fine. If you are more like me, and should be going through a bag of Holly Tone, 3 bags of Rose Tone, and a small box of MiracleGro every year, it makes sense to divide things up by what needs the special, expensive stuff, and what will eat just about anything. |
RE: Alkaline soil -- would Hollytone be bad for any perennials?
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| OK, thanks. I probably ought to be in the latter category but fertilizer eludes me, and thus far I've kind of been ignoring the whole issue, hoping it will go away. But I don't have enough compost for my whole garden and I think I need to start fertilizing more. BTW my peonies and clematis are doing great and they don't look like they even need any fertilizer! |
RE: Alkaline soil -- would Hollytone be bad for any perennials?
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| Since the vast majority of plants, including most perennials, would prefer slightly acidic soil conditions and Hollytone does contain some soil acidifiers, it is unlikely that applying this in modest amounts will cause any issues. My preference is for using compost - I've found that a routine mulching with compost eliminates the need for virtually any additional fertilizers. If you don't generate enough of your own, purchasing a commercial compost works equally well. FWIW, it is difficult to accept that your soil is as neutral/alkaline as it seems to test out. Generally most of the east coast, especially close to urban centers, has slightly to moderately acidic soil and I'd be surprised to see yours test differently. Was this a home test or one done by a professional soil lab? |
RE: Alkaline soil -- would Hollytone be bad for any perennials?
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| If you talk to Soil & Water, they will tell you in no uncertain terms that there are lime pockets around here. There is actual real, live caliche in Ulster Co, across the river from me - one of the few places it exists outside of Texas. The official Soil Survey for Dutchess Co. claims the highest pH recorded here was 7.8. I've had my soil tested three times for various reasons, and the pH always comes back 7.2. This is a bit of a touchy subject for me since so many people are true believers in the acidic soil line, and it makes it very difficult to get reliable plant recommendations. |
RE: Alkaline soil -- would Hollytone be bad for any perennials?
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| Mad Gallica has my number! The soil test was professionally done, and we are in Ulster County. So MG, you do not use soil acidifiers for any plants except your rugosas and acid-loving shrubs and so forth? I have been using Hollytone with good results for my fothergilla, Japanese maples, my lone azalea, and my holly. I also apply a small amount of garden sulfur to the holly, fothergilla, and azalea. I guess if I looked for a list of perennials that prefer alkaline soil or acidic soil that would be smart. Still, I find myself doubting that applying Hollytone would budge the PH very much, and even 6.5 - 7.00 is still pretty much neutral, right? |
RE: Alkaline soil -- would Hollytone be bad for any perennials?
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| My current thinking on the subject is that most plants can easily handle a pH at least as high as 7.5. The difficulty is that in North America there is the idea that plants prefer either acidic/wet or alkaline/dry. So a plant that has a strong preference for a lot of water, but isn't really picky about pH gets put in the acidic/wet box along with plants that really do need acidic soil. It's not always easy to tease out which are which. A real eye-opener is to go through William Cullina's books on native plants and see how many eastern wildflowers are described as 'preferring alkaline soil'. My guess is they are things they really struggle with in Garden in the Woods, and that is what they are attributing the problems to. Another theory of mine that so far seems to be working out, is that lime-intolerant plants apparently take up too many nutrients, literally calcifying their vascular system. So if a given plant can handle a lot of water, that will help them flush the excess minerals out of their system. This is my explanation of why I have 70 ft pin oaks in my backyard, even though by rights they should be dead of chlorosis by now. Their roots are in the water table. So I have swamp azaleas in the swamp, and magnolias and witch hazels and other things that might not be able to handle the dry-land soil conditions. The flip side of this is wondering how many of the plants stuck in the alkaline/dry box may actually thrive here like lavender. |
RE: Alkaline soil -- would Hollytone be bad for any perennials?
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