I don't know what your geologic situation might be in Georgia. Find someone who has an inground pool in your area and ask about their problems. One person I spoke to said it was a money pit but that was further north.

Going by comments I've read in pond forums I think cost is the main factor. A concrete pond cost is about twice as much as liner. Comments I see are along the lines of "if only I could afford it" type deal.

That said, a concrete pond shouldn't be confused with a hole in the ground with some concrete. Most DIY concrete ponds seem to be done with zero research, or ignore proper building practices. Where a concrete pond calls for 8" of steel reinforced concrete a DIY might do chicken wire an maybe 2" of concrete. For some reason there often seems to be a distrust of standard building methods. The person with no experience just knows in their gut that 2" is plenty.

Most fail to hold water on day one. Cracking happens while the concrete is curing. There are specific methods for reducing cracking but DIY normally ignores those too.

I'd guess virtually all DIY concrete ponds fail within the first year. That's normally when they start doing research and appearing in forums looking for some coating that will stop the leaks. But the problem is the underlying structure isn't right and the coatings fail too. Coatings can be used over concrete as long as the concrete part is built to the spec required by the coating.

The cheapest and most reliable fix is to add a liner over the failed concrete. But most threads I read that option is strongly resisted. Seems to be personal, like admitting a mistake.

Most concrete ponds in the US are structurally the same as concrete swimming pools. Only the mechanics are different. Larger diameter pipes for the bottom drain, etc. Professional pond builders will sometimes hire local swimming pool companies to do most of the work to the pond builder's spec. So if you want to build a concrete pond a good place for info is how concrete swimming pools are built.

In Africa and the Far East concrete ponds are common and they often use different building methods. Mostly it evolves patching cracks as needed and/or new skim coats to fix leaks. So that would be another information source if you liked that type of pond.

The majority of these sites promote and advocate the use of rubber pond liners. Why? Because they sell them. Rubber liners are profitable, primarily because of the add-on products related to the pond liner industry. For example, when you construct your pond using a pond liner, you have no choice but to buy all of the related accessories such as a biofilter, special skimmers and drains, and the large variety of energy-sucking, inefficient, short-lived sump pumps.

Rarely do pond liner dealers or installers tell you the whole truth about the unpredictability of liners and sump pumps. Rarely do they acknowledge the truth about the vulnerability of liners after they are installed - whether it be attacks by rats, mice, ground squirrels, gophers, chipmunks or the sharp claws of animals that can puncture the liner in their attempt to get out of the pond after accidentally or purposely entering it. Animals burrow under the liner through the easy access of the loose rocks piled around the pond and waterfall. Against the coolness of the liner, they build their nests and raise their families that can then chew holes in the liner.

Over the past twenty years I have replaced countless leaky waterfalls and ponds constructed using rubber liners with concrete and rebar construction. In thirty years of building over 2,000 waterfalls and ponds, I have never had one crack or leak.

Liner advocates tell you their liner has a thirty to forty year warranty, but fail to mention it is against factory defects only. They don't mention the other issues like rodents, heavy rocks stretching and ripping the liner, and damage from children with sharp sticks or garden utensils. I've seen it all!

Many water garden contractors will misrepresent the liner as the best construction material by saying concrete is expensive and it cracks. Yes, that is true, if you don't build it properly using 3500 psi concrete and rebar 8 to 10 inches on center. Plus, they say the alkali poisons the water. That is true only if you don't seal the concrete with a sealer after it is poured. Concrete construction costs 20-25% more than a liner, but it lasts for decades. You only have to replace one liner for the concrete pond to cost considerably less in the long run. In the past five years there have been scores of lawsuits against pond liner contractors and their clients win every time.

Concrete is much more expensive than liner, however, if built correctly it is more permanent. If you plan to live where you are for 25 or 30 years that may be important to you. I'm not sure where you can get a concrete pond built for 25 to 30% more than a liner, especially given the specs that you must use. As for concrete adding value to a home, that's depends on where you live. Here in the midwest part of the US pools and ponds,whether concrete or liner, will not add to or detract from your homes value. Most real estate agents will tell you it's better without them. If you live in the deep south or southwest it may be different.

Also in the more temperate climate where the ground freezes and thaws concrete is susceptible to heaving and cracking. Liners on the other hand are susceptible to high ground water and being pushed up as well.

In my 25 years with ponds I have never had a problem with any kind of animal or rodent causing damage to my liners. It is true that some burrowing animals may build a nest close to your liner and could cause damage, I've just not had that problem. I have had animals get into the pond and scratch at the sides trying to get out but none have caused a leak. Most pond builders provide a stepped or layered design (plant shelf) and that has made it easy for animals to get out of the pond without damage. My dogs love to play in the pond and have never caused a problem with the liner.

Pumps and skimmers and the like don't make any difference at all whether you have concrete or liner. Cheap pumps are cheap pumps and will fail no matter what installation you use them on. Good stuff will do the job on either type installation. I don't recommend using a "sump pump" on a pond. They are not designed for continuous operation and that's why they fail. Get a good pump designed for the purpose for which you are buying it. Today's market has very good pumps designed for in water or out of water situations. Both have pro's and con's. Do your homework and decide accordingly.

My advise is to listen to those who own ponds and their experiences and not to those in the business. Those in the business, no matter which business it is, will always have a bias. Those who have to live with the the results of their decisions will provide the most meaningful advise, and as with anything, there will always be those who have had a bad experience with a good thing and those who have a good experience with a bad thing.

No matter which way you decide to go I wish you the best of luck. Let us know what you decide.

They didn't use a liner to build the Hoover Dam- LOL

Why are waterfalls so popular? Could it be the symphony of sound produced as the water cascades over the rocks? Or maybe it's the mesmerizing sparkling dance of the water as it splashes its way to the pond. Amazingly, the major attribute of a waterfall is not what you can see or hear. In fact, its greatest attraction does not involve the five senses at all; yet, it makes the greatest impact. What does? Negative ions!

You will find this same characteristic at the ocean shore. How do you feel as you stand on the beach - relaxed, calm, peaceful, tranquil, and yet exhilarated? Do you feel the anxiety, stress and worry melting away? Why is that? Is it a result of watching and listening to the waves crashing on the shore? Yes, this gives pleasure to the senses, but the source of well-being is derived from breathing the air at the ocean and around waterfalls.

The friction of the ocean waves slapping the shore and of water running over the rocks of a waterfall releases negative ions into the air, and your body responds positively to the negatively charged air. You may have heard of ion generators for the home or office. Another great source of negative ions is a thunderstorm. Have you noticed how fresh and exhilarating the air is just prior to, during and following a thunderstorm? This, too, is the result of the same process.

The best way to enjoy this healthy, relaxing and stress-relieving phenomenon is to own a back yard waterfall. A waterfall alone is not that expensive compared to a pond. In addition to the construction costs, there is usually a considerable amount of long-term maintenance and upkeep involved with a pond. Another factor is meeting all the city, county and state building codes that are related to ponds. Some of the issues involved here are set-back, depth, fences, special gates, engineering, door alarms, and supplemental homeowner's insurance covering the added liability.

So, is there a solution to all this? Yes, I discovered a way to solve most all of these issues back in 1984. A client wanted a waterfall in his front yard. So as to eliminate all the liability issues a pond creates, I decided to eliminate the pond, replacing it with a covered catch basin. This design would eliminate the possibility of a drowning hazard for children or pets. I called it a "child-proof waterfall."

In the early nineties, flat rubber roofing material became popular as a pond liner and, several years later, someone adapted the liner to a basin pond waterfall and called it a "pondless" waterfall. But the major drawback to using liners is that they are susceptible to leaks from many sources: sharp objects, animal claws, rats, mice, ground squirrels, gophers, chipmunks, tree roots or heavy rocks that eventually stretch and rip the liner. Even a pin hole will produce a leak that amounts to five gallons in 24 hours.

A properly constructed concrete waterfall will last for decades and never crack or leak. Concrete waterfall shells only cost ten to fifteen percent more, depending on the size. In many cases, when comparing smaller water features, the concrete construction was actually cheaper.

If you are interested in a temporary or short-term waterfall and need to eventually move it, a liner is the best route to go. Otherwise, I recommend concrete construction. You should make sure it is 3500 psi with stealth fiber added and reinforced with rebar 8-10" on center. The concrete shell should be sealed before placing the rocks and applying Thoroseal, which prevents lime leaching and leaking. (This product is sold nation-wide.) After following these basics, you will have a waterfall that will give you decades of pleasure.

Warning: stay away from sump pumps! They are not energy-efficient and create extra maintenance. Use an out-of-pond pump (centrifugal); they operate on sixty percent less energy and have triple the warranty. Sump pumps were never designed for extended use and only last one to two years. Plus, you need to continually lift them out of the pond to pull the leaves and debris from the intake.

The rocks of a rubber-liner waterfall are loose, resulting in a hazard for unsuspecting children (or adults) climbing on them. With a concrete liner, the rocks are securely mortared in place, keeping the shell covered up. With liners, the rocks can easily shift, exposing the unsightly liner. Last but not least, do your homework. Google "pond liners vs. concrete" and make your own decision.

To ensure the best results in creating your water garden, take your time, plan it out, do your research, ask many questions of professionals and you will increase your chances of ending up with a trouble-free, backyard vacation resort.

Hey Joe- Great rely, I agree with most of comments- the gnawing rodents are a bigger problem in arid climates...

The pond liner advocates have maligned concrete constructed ponds and waterfalls for years by making spurious claims that concrete will crack and not hold up over time or in cold freezing climates. This article will expose this fallacy for what it really is and explain the facts about the differences between the rubber liners versus concrete and rebar construction.

I have ponds in Northern Michigan and it's upper peninsula for 15-20 years and none of them have cracked.

The pond liner advocates have maligned concrete constructed ponds and waterfalls for years by making spurious claims that concrete will crack and not hold up over time or in cold freezing climates. Here are the facts about the differences between the rubber liners versus concrete and rebar construction.

My first case in point would have to be the most obvious illustration of the practical application of concrete in relation to rubber liners as a worthy, reliable construction material with structural sustainability. Let's use dams for my example and illustration.

There are four main types of dams: arch, buttress, gravity, and embankment dams. The type of construction for each dam is determined by the structure's proposed use and/or application, the characteristics of the proposed location, volume of water to be retained by the structure, local construction materials available and last but not least, the budget limitations.

Arch dams are constructed in a horizontal arch facing upstream to most effectively resist the retained water's force. Arch dams are most commonly utilized in narrow canyons and are almost always constructed of concrete.

Buttress dams are characterized by a set of angled supports on the downstream side that help to support the structure against the water's force. The buttress dams are more suited for wide canyons that lack the availability of bedrock. This type of steel framework structure and the associated labor involved makes then unfeasible economically in the current financial market.

Gravity dams withstand the force of water by virtue of its own weight. This type of dam is constructed of cement or masonry, normally utilizing solid rock for its foundation. But can also be situated over unconsolidated material as long as water can be prevented from flowing under the structure.

Embankment dams use locally available material (rocks, gravel, sand, clay, etc.) in their construction. For this reason alone, embankment dams or levees are the most economical to build. Similar to the gravity dams, these also use their own weight to retain the water's force. The major drawback is that the materials are permeable, allowing water to seep into and through the structure. An impervious membrane of clay or rubber liner (the same as used in pond liner construction) must be built into them to lessen or minimize the flow through the dam which can weaken the integrity of the structure. Since all the construction materials are purchased locally, the construction of these dams is extremely less expensive, making embankment dams very desirable and popular.

Are you starting to see the connection between dams and their construction material with that of koi ponds and waterfalls? If not, let me help you.

Pond liner advocates promote their product by maligning the use of concrete as an effective, long term construction material for pond construction as opposed to rubber liners with plastic accessories. Straight to the point, of the four types of dam construction, the Hoover Dam is an Arch dam, straddling the mighty Colorado River, which forms the border between the states of Nevada and Arizona. Considered to be the world's largest dam and an engineering marvel at the time of its construction in the 1930's, the Hoover Dam brings much-needed water and power to the Southwest. Was it constructed using a rubber pond liner or concrete and steel?

Now let's look at the cheapest form of dam design, Embankment dams or levees. Many are constructed using rubber liners and loose, earthen materials. In many cases, these type dams are compromised by burrowing animals such as ground squirrels, gophers, chipmunks, groundhogs, rats, or mice. Once any number of these animals chews through the liner, the water follows the burrows, washing away the soil until eventually, without the necessary support, the force and pressure against the liner causes it to burst. This is the same scenario for pond liners, but in these cases it is very difficult to find the hole, depending on its location.

Another ploy to discredit the use of concrete versus pond liners is to claim concrete cracks in frigid climates either from frost heaving or the hydraulic pressure of expanding ice pushing against the pond's walls. This can be true depending on the engineering and shape of the pond's shell. If the sides of the pond are slanted outward slightly as the surface water freezes, the ice is allowed to rise up the sides with the pressure being exerted in the upward rather than sideways directions. Also, depending on the local climate and how thick the ice gets on bodies of water, the pond can be designed deep enough to prevent it from freezing solid.

In this case, as long as the water level is deeper than the thickness of the annual freeze, the temperature of the water prevents frost, which will cause the concrete to heave, move or crack off. Another assurance against this situation is placing a horse tank heater in shallower ponds to keep them from freezing solid. If you drain your concrete pond for the winter, you are removing the very source of protection against frost and its damaging forces. You are now enabling the earth to freeze under the concrete pond shell which in turn, will expand the soil due to the freezing moisture contained within it.

In conclusion, proper engineering and construction methods and material can make all the difference in the performance and longevity of a project. I would say that "You get what you have paid for" applies to the type of materials used and the construction methods applied -- and last but not least, the choice of pond equipment installed.

One great advantage of the EPDM lined water feature is that it is somewhat adaptable and flexible. You may want your next water garden masterpiece to last a life time so to be your legacy but you also may not.

If you don't like the edge on the one side over there, or you want to make the weir of the water fall a little less wide but increase the depth by a rock or two... EPDM can sometimes accommodate that.

BTW I've written before on this site, much of the design advice given to would-be water gardeners (by practitioners and books on the subject) is to have many tiers for planting ledges within the pond -- since different plants like different planting depths. I took that advice but like many folks I quickly realized that I've had a change of heart, like I want a lower pool within the water garden to be an ALL lily pond pool. Many gardeners have lamented the over-use of planting shelfs / ledges in their ponds.

I think my own expectations have changed as to what I want that THING out there in the yard to be... and sometimes it's better to allow for that recreation.

It leaked in a few spots last year, and I patched it, but this year the plastic is brittle and cracking everywhere. So I ordered a trickerlite liner 15' X 16', which costs about $200, should arrive here shortly. Planning to leave the old liner as an underlayment, and if the rubber one fails (they claim it's good for 30 years), I'll just pour concrete over that.

Speaking of the durability of concrete ponds, I was much impressed as a child by the "kitchen pond" behind Jefferson's Monticello. It's a shallow round pond (maybe 25' across?) that they used for keeping fish they caught alive until needed. That pond has been around for ~250 years, and I'm sure there are other examples.