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| I have ordered two climbing roses this year for the first time. Kordes Laguna (dark pink) and Delbard's Nahema (light pink). Both these will be trained on an obelisk sort of structure (planning to make one from instructions on another thread). I was interested to know about Clematis to go with climbing roses. It almost seems to be essential, from what I read here. So what kind of Clematis will flower through most of the warm months (9 months here) and match the two colours of my climbing roses? I would like to have quite a few choices since I'm not sure which ones will be available here in Australia. Some growing and planting instructions would be appreciated as well (like how far to plant, what fertilizers, how to train etc). Thanks in advance.
Sanju |
Follow-Up Postings:
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| Clematis can develop BIG root systems so don't plant them too close to the base of the rose, lest they overwhelm the rose's less substantial root system. They need plenty of water and don't ever let the root system dry out completely. Repeat: never never let the root system dry out completely. These are not drought tolerant plants! Clematis are grouped by how they are pruned. Type I is not-pruned-much, Type II is headed back/tip pruned, Type III is cut almost to the ground every year. The Viticella types (pruning type III) are the best for warmer climates. They work particularly well with roses because you cut them nearly to the ground in late winter, and you can easily pull them out of the rose. In spring they begin a huge growth spurt, 2 meters or more in just a few weeks, so at that time, lots of fast-acting nitrogen fertilizer. As soon as flower buds appear, no fertilizer at all until after they finish their flush of bloom. Then trim the tips back lightly and deadhead, and another round of fertilizer. The light trimming and fertilizer stimilates another round of bloom. You can repeat this several times depending on the length of your growing season, the maturity of the clematis, the weather, etc. Here the very easiest one to try first is Jackmanii, which is widely available and very common, but still beautiful. It is a deep purple which looks great with 'Laguna'. Others that have done well here are 'Perle d'Azur', 'Polish Spirit', 'Etoile Violette', 'Venosa Violacaea'. 'Perle d'Azur' is spectacular with 'Laguna'. 'Venosa Violacaea' is particularly beautiful. Check out the Clematis forum, excellent info there. |
Here is a link that might be useful: A blog entry on how fast Clems grow in spring
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| Thanks, hoovb. Your information is absolutely invaluable. I have written down all the names, hopefully I can find atleast two different kinds here to grow with Laguna and Nahema. Thank you so much. Sanju |
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| In addition to what was mentioned above, type I clematis usually blooms on the old wood, what makes trimming it slightly annoying, especially if it is planted with the rose which does not require similar pruning. Also, many of the type I tend to grow very large, what also is not always a best thing. There is one advantage though, some of them have decorative seeds in the winter (more wild varieties). Also some are fragrant. I usually check clematis in the site bellow. |
Here is a link that might be useful: Clematis database
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| Myself I have Guernsey Cream (lovely white one), Wesselton, rehderiana (lovely yellow, but big one), Purpurea Plena Elegans (impresive purple blooms), Blekitny Aniol (Blue Angel, lovely pale blue, but not a very strong grower and has troubles branching out), Etoile Violette, Warszawska Nike (both rather generic purple shades, but bloom long), Avantgarde (very interesting blooms, but mine came from discount bin last year, so I only hope it will do something this year) and few others that I can't find back the names. |
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| Thanks Elemire. I will check out the ones you've mentioned. I did check them out (hoovb's and yours) and they are mostly available through mail-order here. Thank you so much for the advice. Sanju |
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| If you can find Trikatrei for Nahema that would be a perfect match. I would also recommend to look for Viola and Romantika. In any case try to find a very dark purple for Nahema, the darkest you can get. Hoovb's idea to get Perle d'Azur for Laguna is perfect. Otherwise find a white clematis from group 3 for Laguna that would be better than a dark purple, IMHO. Betty Corning also would be a very nice pairing for Laguna - the different shape would make it interesting in case you like a bit of contrast (I do). |
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| I don't mean to deter you, sanju, because the look of roses and clematis together can be quite lovely, and I have no personal experience, but the process of combining the two does seem a litte complicated and labour-intensive. My personal approach is that simple is best, but that's at least in part due to my low energy level. To be sure, having another beautiful climber does add an extra dimension to the garden. Ingrid |
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| Today inspecting my "lets stick it to the ground and see if it survives" bed I also saw that a cutting of some clematis paniculata (I think it is it, because of the rue-like leaves, but since I got it from a friend as 5 cm high plant... not much material for identification) made it through the winter to my surprise. It is also a kind of clematis worth looking at for the fill-ups, I think it is native to kiwie land. Early Sensation is one variety, also Pixie. They do not look like much flower wise, but have rather interesting foliage (can't remember if they have seeds for winter). |
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| Thank you everyone for your input. Ceterum, I have found Romantika and Perle d'Azur here, but none of the others you mentioned. Romantika does look very beautiful. Am trying to find a white one for Laguna, as you said a contrast will look nice. For Nahema, I might go with Jackmanii Superba, since its supposed to be good for beginners or Romantika. Elemire, I did find paniculata, it does look beautiful. Has anyone tried Snow Queen? It seems to be a much smaller plant and is in pruning group 2, so it might have more flushes. Ingrid, I agree with you, I am jumping in at the deep end with all these plants I'm buying this year. I haven't decided for sure about the Clematis (will have to mail-order from a 4th nursery, since my rose nurseries do not have them), just love the look of the two plants combined together. |
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| Strange that such an old classic as Betty Corning (the few fragrant clematis) would not be available there. There is a gorgeous relatively new Japanese clematis that I am dying to get named Omoshiro. It is not available in the US any more but it maybe available in Australia. Too bad that it is a group 2 clematis, so for this reason I would not recommend it for Laguna otherwise it would be a perfect match if Betty C.is not available. |
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| It's probably available at other nurseries, the one I've been checking out on the website did not have one. I haven't researched clematis much as yet. I will look for the Japanes clematis Omoshiro you mentioned. Why did you say that a group 2 Clematis is not good for Laguna? Sanju |
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| Hoovb explained in her post that since group 3 clematis should be cut practically to the ground as opposed to group 2 it is easier to handle if it is intertwined with a climbing rose. Group 2 clematis can wilt, that is another problem though I had this problem with some group 3 as well. On the other hand, a clematis expert told me that she treats group 2 clems like group 3s, that is, she cuts them back to 2 feet or so after blooming thus prevents them from from wilting, makes them more vigorous and she gets more blooms. I never tried that myself so I don't know how it works. |
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| a clematis expert told me that she treats group 2 clems like group 3s, Yes, that works. You lose the early spring bloom cycle, but you get a later one. I like the early spring bloom cycle myself. You can also treat the IIs like group IIIs every other year or every third year instead of every year, that works too. I've just found that some of the type IIs don't appreciate a mild winter--they seem to want the stimulation of a winter chill. The only tough part, which isn't all that tough, is getting them to grow a BIG root system the first 2-3 years. And keeping them moist. Other than that, way easier than almost any other flowering plant. |
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| Well generally you can prune any group to some extend, just that you have to see when to do it, if clematis blooms on old wood, then better to do it after spring bloom. The main difference for me mostly is that group 3 usually is less trouble if you neglect it for a year, since you just cut it back in spring, when the other groups can be rather annoying toothpicking, especially if it gets between the other plants. Also, you do not have to necessarily cut it back to a few inches even if it is in group 3, it is more about where you want the blooms to be. This group clematis blooms on new growth, so if you cut it lets say at 1 meter high, all the flowers will be higher up than that. It is useful if you want clematis to bloom above your shrub roses for example. In general though you have to keep in mind that clematis attaches itself with the leafstalks to the other plants and structures, so usually it is annoying to get it out of the rose no matter what pruning group it belongs to (unless you prune the rose or don't care about leftover wood). I prefer to have roses and clematis near each other, but so that only few canes/liannas mix, or plant together varieties that do not need annual pruning, just some tidying up. |
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| Hoovb, I think she cuts them back after the first flush, so she does dot lose the early blooms; she force them to regrow after that and bloom again, if I remember correctly. |
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| Thanks everyone for your comments. I think I will stick to group 3 as advised by you all since I am a beginner, and cutting it all back to the ground seems easier on the whole. Hoovb, I will try and keep it moist all the time for the first 2-3 years. Since it can get very dry here, the new roses need regular watering anyway. What group is Jackmanii? Elemire, I will check out all your clematis names tomorrow. Have been very busy with kids school holidays. Sanju |
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| What group is Jackmanii? group 3 Try to get Jackmani Superba, the improved Jackmanii |
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| Oh, I thought they were the same, that's the one available here. So I will definitely get Jackmanii Superba and perhaps a white one to go with Laguna. Thanks. Sanju |
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