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growing_rene2

Trouble shooting- can I have help?

growing_rene2
10 years ago

This is my Proud Land. I am in zone 7, NC. We have had a lot of rain and I spray as I see needed...about once a week when it isn't raining. iwas using the neem fungal/insecticide but switched to nutri 3 in 1 last weekend. . I don't want to spray right now b/c it looks like a struggle is going on.

Can anyone identify what's going on? I am thinking a deficiency.??

Comments (20)

  • growing_rene2
    Original Author
    10 years ago
    last modified: 9 years ago

    one more view. Thank you in advance!

  • t_bred
    10 years ago
    last modified: 9 years ago

    Possibly spider mites or could be rmv. How long have you had this rose?

  • growing_rene2
    Original Author
    10 years ago
    last modified: 9 years ago

    I bought it this year, mothers' day. It has struggled from the beginning, really.

  • michaelg
    10 years ago
    last modified: 9 years ago

    Probably mosaic virus, very common in roses produced in the western US. Many people just tolerate it.

  • growing_rene2
    Original Author
    10 years ago
    last modified: 9 years ago

    That doesn't sound good. As long as it isn't detrimental, I will take it! Hopefully RMV can prevent RRV....kinda like sickle cell can prevent malaria. :-) One could hope anyway.

    Thanks to you both

  • roseseek
    10 years ago
    last modified: 9 years ago

    Looks like RMV to me. Otherwise, the foliage looks good. It's very common from ANY rose source which doesn't take steps to prevent its spread, regardless of region. Kim

  • growing_rene2
    Original Author
    10 years ago
    last modified: 9 years ago

    Thank you Kim. Now I am wondering, how can I prevent it from spreading?

  • roseseek
    10 years ago
    last modified: 9 years ago

    Don't propagate from that rose. Despite anecdotal evidence to the contrary, it is generally accepted it doesn't spread from one plant to the next in average garden conditions. The major method of spreading is through propagation with virus infected material. If any of your other roses begin showing symptoms, there is a 99.99999% probablility the affected roses were already infected and have NOTHING to do with the infection in this plant. Don't worry about it spreading from one plant to the next in your garden. Kim

  • racin_rose
    10 years ago
    last modified: 9 years ago

    I have a Jubilee Celebration that has RMV. The garden center where I bought it gave me 20% off because I pointed it out...but in truth, I would say a good 60% of the Austins there, of all varieties (and they have a LOT) showed some sign of it...most mild, others really obvious.

    Anyway, my particular JC is a HORSE that pumps out big fat blooms and never misses a beat...so I no longer worry about it. I do, however, prune it with a set of scissors and use my normal fiskars shears on all the others...just a precautionary thing. Probably not even necessary!

  • growing_rene2
    Original Author
    10 years ago
    last modified: 9 years ago

    I will spare this one from propogation and keep up with cleaning the shears. I definitely don't want to add to the disease's growth. Thank you for the additional input; maybe I will be successful with roses yet! :-)

  • henry_kuska
    10 years ago
    last modified: 9 years ago

    Proud Land is an out of patent rose so where it was produced (its origin) could be anywhere. An earlier poster suggested Western U.S. Do you know the origin of your rose (do you still have the label)?.

    It has been around long enough to possibly have multiple viruses.

    Plants, annimals, and insects all have siRNA-mediated RNA silencing immune systems against virus infections. This type of immune system is temperature dependent. At high temperatures it is very good, but at low temperatures it is not very effective. I have summarized what is known in the link below. North Carolina is sort of in the area where if asked if the immune system will be effective, one would have to answer: "yes, no, maybe".

    ----------------------------------------------------------

    Here is a link to a recent summary of the immune system. The link gives an example with mosquitoes. http://forums2.gardenweb.com/forums/load/roses/msg0700560420854.html?2

    ----------------------------------------------------------

    Regarding the statement: "Despite anecdotal evidence to the contrary, it is generally accepted it doesn't spread from one plant to the next in average garden conditions. The major method of spreading is through propagation with virus infected material. If any of your other roses begin showing symptoms, there is a 99.99999% probablility the affected roses were already infected and have NOTHING to do with the infection in this plant. Don't worry about it spreading from one plant to the next in your garden."

    H. Kuska comment: The Missouri Botanical Garden gives the following:
    "Rose mosaic
    Symptoms of this viral disease can include a general dwarfing of the plant, lack of proper chlorophyll production resulting in a mottled appearance on foliage, yellowing and in some cases rings on leaves or fruit as well as necrotic (dead) areas. Often only a cosmetic problem. The disease can be spread by feeding insects or mites, or mechanically through hands and tools."

    http://www.missouribotanicalgarden.org/Portals/0/Gardening/Gardening%20Help/Visual%20Guides/Rose%20Problems.pdf

    -------------------------------------------
    A very recent (2013) reviewed, published scientific paper is:

    "A survey of viruses infecting Rosa spp. in New Zealand".

    http://link.springer.com/article/10.1007/s13313-012-0191-x#page-1

    H. Kuska comment. The following are quotes from the above paper.
    "PNRSV is known to be transmitted mechanically, by root grafting and by seed (Abdel-Salam et al. 2008; Golino et al. 2011). The virus may be transmitted by pollen in rose although this hasn’t been fully ascertained (Kuska 2003). The high incidence of PNRSV in New Zealand is unsurprising as it is also vectored by the Western flower thrip (Frankliniella occidentalis) which is reportedly spread throughout New Zealand (Greber and Teakle 1992; Teulon and Nielsen 2005) and is known to infest many glasshouse crops (E. Milleza, unpublished data). "
    -------------------------------------------------------
    "Reports of pollen transmission of ApMV in rose are inconclusive (Kuska 2003), but in view of the characteristics of other ilarviruses, it is possible that ApMV could be dispersed by pollen."
    ------------------------------------------------------
    The reference that they cite is: "Kuska H (2003) Can North American rose hybridizers use pollen from virus infected roses? Rose Hybridizers Assoc Newsl 34:7-10"

    Here is a link that might be useful: Should northern rose growers be concerned about possible above ground spread of Rose Viruses?

  • jerijen
    10 years ago
    last modified: 9 years ago

    Rene -- Don't let any of the above scare you. You will not spread this to your other roses. AAMOF, it is probable that most, if not all, of your other roses already have it.

    It's also probable that this plant will rarely display signs of virus, once the plant matures.

    Any cuttings taken from this plant will have the same virus (or viruses) but you won't spread it to your other roses.

    Jeri

  • ken-n.ga.mts
    10 years ago
    last modified: 9 years ago

    As far as RMV goes, back in the late 1980's early 1990's, Florida Southern Colliage in Lakeland, FL. did a huge expermint with RMV. They took 30 some odd bush's of Double Delight (school colors were red and white) and infected some with different RMV and kept some clean. They were all planted in 25 gal nursery pots using the same everything in each pot. Lined them up in front of the gymn and studied their growth and flower production over several years. All receiving the exact same care (amount of water, amount of fert.). Over the years there was a small difference in flower production on several bushs. Now, back then I lived 12 miles from the school and was a big supporter of the school's activities. I grew roses, so I wanted to see what was happening. To the average rose grower, no one could tell the difference in any of the bush's except that several bush's had varigated foliage. That row of D.D. was stunning. What I'm trying to say is, I wouldn't worry to much about varigated foliage. You're rose should grow and bloom just fine.

  • growing_rene2
    Original Author
    10 years ago
    last modified: 9 years ago

    Thank you all for the input. I won't be scared, though that wasn't my first reaction. :-) Henry, it looks like my North Carolina will fall in the "maybe" category...especially this year. We have not yet seen any hot temps, nor cold really. Thank you for the link, it has been a while since I have read scientific literature but I'm pretty sure I got the point. Now I just want to study botany or horticulture so I can understand the specific chemistry behind it all. :-)

  • henry_kuska
    10 years ago
    last modified: 9 years ago

    ken-n.ga.mts the link to the full paper is given below.

    He used 10 uninfected, 10 infected with PNRSV, and 10 infected with ApMV. He reported on his results for 3 years.

    Most of the ApMV infected plants died during the 4th year.

    Regarding spread, statistically, 10 uninfected plants is too small a sample size to reliably test for yearly spread of around 1 or 2 % (the numbers that most often appear in the literature). Plus, as discussed earlier above ground spread is expected to be very low in hot climates due to the temperature behavior of the rose's immune system. The fact that they were each planted in a sunkened pot rules out any root to root virus transfer of the type reported by the Davis, California research group.

    The fact that loss of flower production was significant only in the spring flush is consistent with a temperature effect on the immune system.

    Here is a link that might be useful: Florida study

  • growing_rene2
    Original Author
    10 years ago
    last modified: 9 years ago

    Henry, I do have the tag. However, it is just the one from Lowe's & I do not see anything identifying location. Does that help any?

  • henry_kuska
    10 years ago
    last modified: 9 years ago

    Unfortunately, I have no information on where Lowe's obtains its roses.

    One of my concerns was, if it was produced locally, it could contain Blackberry chlorotic ringspot virus (BCRV) as BCRV has been reported in North Carolina.

    Here is a link that might be useful: link for above

  • growing_rene2
    Original Author
    10 years ago
    last modified: 9 years ago

    Thank you. I will keep my fingers crossed that blackberry won't ever show it's face in my garden. So many viruses that can affect such a pretty flower, it's not fair! ...But well worth it in the end :-)

  • susan4952
    10 years ago
    last modified: 9 years ago

    Blackberry Chlorotic Ringspot Virus? Really? Another disease to worry about?

  • Campanula UK Z8
    10 years ago
    last modified: 9 years ago

    Try growing fruit to really test your patience regarding pests and diseases. Roses are a walk in the park compared to my trials and tribulations with Big Bud mite, aphid blister, peach leaf curl, raspberry cane blight, leaf curling aphids on plums, redcore in strawbs, pear midge, scab, reversion, American gooseberry mildew, silverleaf...........the list goes on and always, there is at least one complete disaster (usually a couple) and several deathrisk moments during a season of fruit growing. Not to mention the endless netting to deter thieving and destructive urban bird life (feral flying rats, aka pigeons).
    But we must have jams. jellies. cordials........