Is this Papa Gontier?

They both look like Papa G to me.

Wait... now I'm seeing a more purple-ish pink on the first. I wonder if its Francois Gualain or Enchantress. Both of these have the most amazingly healthy foliage for me, but the flowers are dreck.. Rare to bloom and usually balled.

I grew Beaute Inconstante from Vintage probably a decade ago. The blooms resembled photo 1 (quite small and shapeless). After a couple of years, it didn't improve and its long gone. The foliage was nice but the blooms were too small to satisfy me.

Yes, thonotorose, they are both Papa Gontier as it turns out. I have had the top one about a year, and it has never balled. Yesterday it put out the most gorgeous DARK red bloom. I think it is because i put about an inch of pine bark in the top of the pot a couple weeks ago. that combined with all the rain we've been having might account for the improvement in its' appearance. The lighter bloom is from plant number 2 (the one I bought as Papa gontier).

I think I'll put pine bark on that one also.

Cecily,
I have a genuine Beaute Inconstante on the way, so I hope the flowers grow to a decent size in Florida. I'm beginning to understand how a single variable can noticeably impact a plant.