Mmmm, I often follow the various discussions regarding virus infections in roses - usually with a degree of bafflement as this issue simply does not really arise in the UK. I know things are different across the pond (the annoying replant syndrome does not appear to be much of an issue in the US) which makes me wonder how much of our plant management is a cultural issue rather than a more scientific pathological approach. I am sure there are virus problems in the UK but because they are never flagged up, we collectively have our heads in the sand. Of course, I cannot speak for rose growing professionals but in the amateur rose appreciation field, mosaic virus in roses rarely gets a mention.

I just ordered Aanchen von Therau. I hope I was in time.

Campanula, I believe England enjoys what I understand is a mostly favorable climate for growing roses, without extremes of either cold or hot and dry weather. In the USA, gardeners have to engage in the practice of zone pushing to grow the beauties we crave. The presence of virus can severely compromise the abiliby of a rose to withstand environmental stress. In reading old rose annnuals, I find gardeners in the cold Midwest growing tender HTs, with winter protection to be sure, which I would shrink from attempting, and I cannot help but wonder if those early 20th century gardeners did not have stronger clones available before RMV had become so prevalent in the rose industry.

Woo Hoo! I've never been dissapointed with any VID rose I bought at Vintage. If you live where it's warm, the Sterling Silver VID is a good rose even on its own roots. No it's not a fast grower like it is on Huey. But it's a decent plant with amazing flowers and if you don't cut it, it will grow waist high at least. I have been very pleased with mine. When it blooms, people always want to know what it is. If you love SS then this is the moment you should splurge and get a really good one.

Kim do you know how to order some of these? I got the email but when I went to the website and looked up for example Chrysler Imperial VID I only got plain old Chrysler Imperial and I wanted to be sure it was the VID band before I bought. Some of the others were that way too or else I could not find them on the website list. What is the method of reserving roses off the third release? I am go glad to see that many of my faves are offered VID.

Kittymoonbeam, I don't see Chrysler Imperial as part of the new release -- I think the one on the website is older stock and not VID. ~ Debbie

Hi Kitty, Gregg's email says:

Understandably these are much in demand, and we recommend that you lose no time in checking out the 123 varieties on this list, and let us know right away if there is anything you would like to order from it. An online order is always the best way to place or to add to your orders. It takes less time for you and for us. But, we are always happy to have you email us your order, and then follow up with any payment information you need to provide, by phone.

We have starred a few items in this list that do not appear on our website; these items can be ordered by email, or by adding a note at the end of your online order, letting us know you'd like to include them. Quantities of each item available follow the name of the rose in our list, so that you have some idea of what may sell out quickly.

We will upload to our website PDFs of this new short list, as well as an updated complete list of what can be ordered from our currently available roses.

We anticipate another release of roses in mid-October, and will send out an email to let you know when that happens.

I don't see Chrysler Imperial as part of this release so I imagine the one on the web site isn't VI. You might email to inquire. Kim

Hi Kitty,

I noticed the same thing with another rose, King's Ransom. It showed up on an earlier release list as VID (and on the list of roses in stock as of 8/29/12) but not on the website with that designation. Only one King's Ransom showed up, sans VID, and that one is listed as being "currently available". No other King's Ransom is listed as "custom root". Chrysler Imperial seems to be a similar case.

"VID" is the designation for roses that have been treated by UC Davis. There doesn't seem to be a code like that used for roses that have gone through the heat treatment program at Florida Southern College (Malcolm Manners). Interestingly enough, one can do a search on the Vintage website for VID by putting those letters in the name box on the search page here, http://www.vintagegardens.com/rose_index.aspx

That will produce a list of roses shown on Vintage's website as being "VID", both currently available and custom root (a list that doesn't necessarily match the release lists sent via email or the downloadable availabilty list). However, there doesn't appear to be a way to use that search function to find roses that have come via Florida Southern College/Malcolm Manners. Marechal Niel happens to be one of them, but I found this out by pure chance, by clicking on the page for Marechal Niel at Vintage, and reading the text, here: http://www.vintagegardens.com/roses.aspx?cat_id=37&product_id=2581

Which says this: "Malcolm Manners gave us this virus-free clone of Marechal Niel, long one of our favorite roses which had never performed strongly; this form is quite vigorous and flowers incessantly. Deep golden-lemon flowers with recurving petals, the flowers holding a goblet shape and nodding effectively from above. Fragrant."

I bought a Bourbon rose, Madame Pierre Oger from Vintage last year, partially based on its page description:
http://www.vintagegardens.com/roses.aspx?cat_id=3&product_id=138

"A sport of Reine Victoria and extremely popular. One of the "Shell Roses," with very cupped smallish flowers of ivory usually distinctly edged cerise pink, everblooming. Now a new clean virus-free clone has been made available by our dear friend, Siegfried Hahn."

However, this beg's the question, how would one search for this information, and where did this plant from Siegfried Hahn get treated/tested free of RMV?

Back to King's Ransom and Chrysler Imperial, I checked the pages on both at Vintage, and there is nothing in the text one way or the other about RMV.

I can't find a policy on Rose Mosaic Virus on Vintage's website. Has anybody else? They really should have something. What IS their policy? Do they have roses which exhibit RMV symptoms or which they know have RMV? Which roses are they? What about roses they don't know the RMV status of? How is anyone able to tell the difference? And which roses came from Florida Southern's program????? With regard to roses which are available without RMV from either Davis or Florida Southern, does Vintage stock the RMV free roses, all the time, most of the time, some of the time? How is the rose shopper to know without Vintage making its position clear?

Melissa

I just saw it on the full inventory Aug. link on the Vintage homepage and then could not find it when I went to buy. Thought there might be another way to select it without bothering them by phone. I'm really excited about getting 2 French Lace VID for big pots on each side of my path. VID is a wonderful thing.

I'm glad to see the wonderful Kordes HT 'Oldtimer' (aka 'Coppertone') available again at Vintage after a too-long absence. Every year it turns up as one of the body bag varieties at my local Lowe's, only it's never the real deal -- just some pallid yellow imposter instead.

I'm confused, though, by Vintage's newest list of releases. 'Oldtimer' appears twice -- once with the VID designation and once without it. The number available for each is quite different. Seems odd. What are we to make of the one sans the designation? On the website, a couple of other 'O' roses appear as being currently available, so perhaps it's simply an entry error.

Companula, you're correct tht RMV is largely an American problem. The virus (or complex of viruses, in some cases) is not actually rose-specific, but was first detected in certain fruit trees. The scourge is attributable to the use of infected rootstock by U.S. growers. It would seem inevitable that virused budwood of American-bred roses made it to Europe. I'm amazed that RMV didn't become more of a problem there.

Taking steps to have a rose indexed is expensive. The varieties listed as VID, as has been stated, are those obtained directly from UC Davis' program. Those without the VID designation were most likely obtained from other sources, whether they were other nurseries or individual or public gardens. If you look at Vintage's Big Catalog, it frequently states where they obtained what roses. MANY were initially Armstrong and Roses of Yesterday and Today bare roots. You can't fault them for obtaining them from those sources as VERY often, those were the ONLY sources of the roses sought. Kim

windeaux I do not know where you got your information about the history of rose viruses from, but I suggest that you look at my link below.

I recently found a very complete (independent) historical review in the 1983 New Zealand Ph.D. thesis of Dr. Gardner.

http://mro.massey.ac.nz/bitstream/handle/10179/3563/02_whole.pdf?sequence=1

Here is a link that might be useful: my historical rose virus link

LOL. Some things are so predictable, aren't they?

Henry, my dear, I am hardly surprised that not knowing where I got my information is yet another among the legion of things you do not know.

Truth to tell, Henry, I've learned to ignore any thread you initiate, and every link you foist into threads initiated by others. Your dense, tiresome arguments here have been fatally refuted time and again by Dr. Manners and others, but we understand that you're compelled to tilt forever at your favorite windmill. Carry on with the joust . . .

Aanchen von Therau is no longer available. I hope I was in time for one.

Nursery owners please take note: There Is A Market For Albas!!!! We Want Albas! We will pay! Name your price!

Help-Me-Find should be a "neutral" starting point:

"The most common viruses infecting roses are a group of viruses that can cause yellow patchwork patterns on the leaves - - thus the name, Rose Mosaic Virus. These viruses also infect other plants:
-Prunus necrotic ringspot virus
-Apple mosaic virus
-Arabis mosaic virus
-Strawberry latent ringspot virus"
-----------------------------------------

http://www.helpmefind.com/gardening/gl.php?n=293
-----------------------

The three viruses (of the 4 listed above) that traditionally have been a problem in England are: Arabis mosaic virus, Prunus necrotic ringspot virus and strawberry latent ringspot virus.
http://onlinelibrary.wiley.com/doi/10.1111/j.1744-7348.1984.tb03045.x/abstract
---------------------------------------
"The detection by serological methods of viruses infecting the rose
BJ Thomas - Annals of Applied Biology, 1980 - Wiley Online Library
... INTRODUCTION Commercially produced field-grown roses in the United Kingdom (UK) are frequently infected with arabis mosaic virus (AMV), prunus necrotic ringspot virus (PNRSV), and strawberry latent ringspot virus (SLRV) either singly or in combination (Ikin ..."

http://onlinelibrary.wiley.com/doi/10.1111/j.1744-7348.1980.tb03900.x/abstract
--------------------------------------

Please notice that 2 of the 3 are not even considered "serious problem" rose viruses in the U.S.

I recommend that individuals interested in the history of rose viruses read the 1983 New Zealand Ph.D. thesis of Dr. Gardner. (the 1992 recipicant of TA Stewart Memorial Award. This award is presented to a person deemed to have given outstanding service to the rose in Australia or New Zealand.)

http://www.nzroses.org.nz/rose-society/roll-of-honour/ta-stewart-memorial-award/

Wow - that photo of Sterling Silver VID at Vintage makes me want to get one. Is the color really like that??

It CAN be that, but part of that image is due to ultra violet light in shade. Ultra violet light is "blue" and the cause of anything photographed in shade, very early or very late in the day or on overcast days being too blue. UV filters were created eons ago to adjust colors by removing the excessive blue, rendering them more natural, more like full spectrum sunlight and have often been used as lens protectors. When you view images on HMF for mauve roses and they look REALLY blue, it's often because of Ultra Violet light. I'm sure you've had family and vacation photos where the people appear oxygen deficient as they came out too blue. Same reason.

Sterling Silver is a richer mauve than most others and that scent is intense. I've always loved how blue green the foliage is and that lovely 'bloom' to the foliage is, I believe, one of its secrets to why it can resist many fungal infections as well as it can. It's a trait inherited from the obvious Grey Pearl connection in its back ground. Kim