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Do I need Souvenir de la Malmaison?

Posted by oath5 z7 MD (My Page) on
Wed, Mar 7, 07 at 10:44

I'm so indecisive, I have like 20 rose "options" for spring and I SHOULD be sorting them out down to like 2... however I just ran into this delicate beauty while looking around online, and I was wondering if anybody could enable me. Is she healthy? Does she set hips? Is this purchase a no brainer and am I'm just being difficult? (lol). Really, any gushing is welcome,and thanks again! You all have directed me towards some of the best choices out there and I'm so grateful for your guidance.

- Max


Follow-Up Postings:

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RE: Do I need Souvenir de la Malmaison?

  • Posted by bboy z8 WA USA (My Page) on
    Wed, Mar 7, 07 at 10:48

Its flowers may have trouble with rainy weather. Desirability for you depends on how it does with that in your area and what you would think of that happening there.


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RE: Do I need Souvenir de la Malmaison?

Oath, this is a good rose, beautiful and fragrant. It will loose most of its leaves, more then 50%, (but not all) due to BS if not sprayed here. The bad thing is that diseased plant will have more dieback during winter. So be ready that your SDLM will stay very small, if you don't spray. Some years it will dieback almost to the ground or just 2-3 very short canes left after the winter.
With spray program it performs really well here and gradually builds into a nice bush 4x4 feet. Pickering has very good clone that grows well in MD.
I really don't think the balling is such an issue with this rose in our climate. Some other roses like Clothilde Soupert, Belinda's Dream, Maman Cochet all ball like crazy here, but not SDLM.
Olga


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RE: Do I need Souvenir de la Malmaison?

Thanks Olga, I'm actually starting to consider an organic spray program anyway, it would give my mom a hobby to do while I'm at college ( she's not involved in the yard at all, she needs to get out there!) which reminds me does anybody have recipes for homemade spray? I've seen some that include some liquid soap and I have no idea if that would ruin blooms!

Actually, the fact that she stays small,the better, I'm trying to irradiate a possibly RRD afflicted multiflora from the back of our property thus I'm wanting smaller roses now since the ones I currently have will get huge and are potential targets.


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RE: Do I need Souvenir de la Malmaison?

Oath,
Get rid of the Multiflora first. That should be an absolute top priority.
Then take a look at Souv. de St. Anne. It's a sport of SdlM but has fewer petals (so it opens better and blooms more often.)
Ann, destroyer of Multiflora as a fenceline plant.


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Down with multiflora

Tee hee, will do ma'am. Me and my dad have been spraying the woods behind our house like crazy, however the sprays really only work when they have leaves, so I figured I would wait until spring and then slam em with the guillotine again. Or should I take another action? Chop it down now?


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RE: Do I need Souvenir de la Malmaison?

I grow SDLM no-spray in my garden and she is a favorite. Balling is rare. Although I have several sports of SDLM (include St. Anne's, Mme Cornelisian, and Rouge), I still prefer SDLM the best so far. Mine stays very short (2' or under) and I had to replace her once for dying back all the way to the ground and not springing back, probably because I don't spray and it is very tea-like and not vigorous.


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RE: Do I need Souvenir de la Malmaison?

Oath,
There's a lot less biomass to move if you cut it down now, then when it starts to grow in spring, wiped on herbicides will go into the roots quickly and effectively.
I've even heard of folks giving it a dose of fertilizer to spur growth, just before they spray herbicides...same effect.
Ann


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RE: Do I need Souvenir de la Malmaison?

Max, one of the true advantages of living in Texas is that 'Souvenir de la Malmaison' is perfectly adapted here. It performs flawlessly in my garden, and both the plant and its blooms laugh at our intense heat & sun as if it were saying ... "Gemme your best shot, baby!". And we don't get cold enough here during our short winter to ever hinder it.

I hope that you can grow it in your very different part of the country from mine, because this rose is of the highest quality imaginable when it likes the climate.

Randy


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RE: Do I need Souvenir de la Malmaison?

I only sprayed mine twice last year and her foliage stayed completely clean. Needless to say I was flabbergasted. Sure wish my Austins were this disease resistant. I looked at her a few days ago and the canes have come through this freeky winter (first warm then freezing cold) without any loss of limb. Now add in LARGE, perfectly quartered blooms, sheer silky pale pink petals, strong stems that hold the flower upright (no nodding downward), unusual spicy fragrance and superior repeat = what is there NOT to like? SdlM ties with Reine des Violettes as my favorite Old Garden Rose. IMHO she is must have for any rosarian who appreciates fine Old Garden Roses.

Here is a link that might be useful: Queen of Beauty and Fragrance


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RE: Do I need Souvenir de la Malmaison?

Darn it, now I think I want it! You guys are far too convincing. I told myself I wouldn't have the willpower, and I was right. I'm going out to Heritage Rosarium in May to pick up a Duchesse de Montebello, perhaps she'll be there too. I'm so excited!

On a side note does anybody have a recipe for homemade blackspot spray? I think it's about time I start spraying a little bit, it wouldn't hurt. Is the spray just like baking soda,water and soap? How much do I need? I have a sprayer, but we've used it for herbicide so I'll probably buy a new one.

You guys are great, I would still be going by color only if I didn't find this place.


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RE: Do I need Souvenir de la Malmaison?

Hi, you should be able to pull up the recipe for the bs spray on the organic rose growing forum - but most people say it absolutely does not work.

Now getting to the good stuff. My Souv. de la Malmaison did not get bs the past 2 years put got a lot of PM, however this gorgeous rose is worth even seeing 1 good bloom all year. It is the most beautiful bloom I've ever seen. It cannot be described it has to be seen.

I've remember hearing everyone raving about this rose and seeing pics and I would think, so what it's another pretty pink rose- what's the big fuss over. Then a friend sent me this rose. When the first perfect bloom opened I was in awe and staring at the bloom I said to myself "now I know what they were all fussing about".

You should definitely get it. I love this rose.


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RE: Do I need Souvenir de la Malmaison?

Every rose garden needs a couple of SDLM. You just need it, that's all.


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RE: Do I need Souvenir de la Malmaison?

And your instincts are right: keep your herbicide sprayer for Herbicides ONLY.
Get a different color and kind for fungicides so there can be no mix up.


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RE: Do I need Souvenir de la Malmaison?

Ann, I think I'll draw a funny lil' skull and crossbones on the herbicide sprayer with a sharpie, lol.

Irish rose grower, that's how I approach a LOT of roses. I have a little love-hate relationship with the color pink, skepticism is always there.

However, any powder pinks or pinks with underlying cold tones I like very much. They'd look good with my Tuscany Superb ( if he comes back from being munched to the ground that is......)


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RE: Do I need Souvenir de la Malmaison?

It is an exquisite rose when viewed in person. I would never be without it. I have 2, one from Chamblee's and one from Antique Rose Emporium. It is, without a doubt, my favorite rose.

Cathy


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RE: Do I need Souvenir de la Malmaison?

In my experience the only organic treatment that at least somewhat effective in our climate is sulfur. You can buy it as Bonide or Safer concentrated solution, dilute and use when it is less then 80 degrees. The plants should be watered very well at least 5-8 hours in advance. Otherwise the leaves will be burned. Not an easy reagent, but as I mentioned the only organical treatment that has some effect.
Don't use powder sulfur, it is easy to clog your sprayer and it precipitates easily in sprayer, you have to mix all the time.
Cornel formula (Baking soda, soap) will not work in our climate for BS, based on my experience. It can help with PM, but not BS. Neem also doesn't work. As well as milk, "rosa flora/wilt proof" and the treatments that Garden Alive sells. We have really high BS pressure here, so home remedies can't help. I tried them all.
Olga


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RE: Do I need Souvenir de la Malmaison?

How much of effect would you say the sulfur has on blackspot? I guess something is better than nothing, and I'd have a healthier plant.


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RE: Do I need Souvenir de la Malmaison?

Now I want it too. Darn you Molineux and GardenWeb!


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RE: Do I need Souvenir de la Malmaison?

  • Posted by luanne z9,Richmond CA (My Page) on
    Wed, Mar 7, 07 at 18:56

Here are my arguments:




The last is her semi-double sport, Souv. de St. Anne's. I like them both very much. Both like lots of organic compost.
la


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Drat, now I think I need a spray program

That shade of pink, I have to admit, is quite agreeable.


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RE: Do I need Souvenir de la Malmaison?

You can keep relatively resistant varieties clean with sulfur treatment if you spray every 7 days. Unfortunately you can't spray during the hot summer time and this is a big issue with sulfur.
Another organic treatment that I fogot to mention is copper,some Garden Alive remedies are based on copper. It is less effective then sulfur in my experience and will burn leaves too, especially in cold wet weather. You can't do sulfur and then swith to copper, it will also fry your leaves. I am sorry, this is all kind of pessimistic, but really organic treatments don't work that well where the BS pressue is high.
That is why I try to grow ( with some exceptions) mostly roses that can be grown no spray.
Olga


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RE: Do I need Souvenir de la Malmaison?

Quite understandable, we're quite the no-zone, it takes risks. I should put my attention towards pampering my seedlings ( so cute! fringed leaves) and chopping down possibly 50+year old multiflora bushes anyway. When I go to Heritage Rosarium in May I'll ask if they have Malmaison and ask what they do to treat theirs if they do. There's so many roses I want, it's not fair at all!

Still, the itch of " I need to buy something, now" is persistant. =D


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RE: Do I need Souvenir de la Malmaison?

As far as I know, at Heritage Rosarium roses get sprayed by Banner Max. I asked this question couple years ago.
Olga


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RE: Do I need Souvenir de la Malmaison?

Sheesh, yes!

You might have globs of liver where for blooms if it gets rainy, but the scent of SDLM will have you floating until the liver happens.

It inspires much emotion, and hints at beautiful, unknowable things of the past. The delicacy of an SDLM bloom has been known to pull a tear or two from my eye.

Lila


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RE: Do I need Souvenir de la Malmaison?

Luanne has the right idea by showing her beautiful pics ... words alone are not enough for this rose. You must experience it in person to fully appreciate it.

Randy

Souvenir de la Malmaison:
Photobucket - Video and Image Hosting
Photobucket - Video and Image Hosting


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RE: Do I need Souvenir de la Malmaison?

I used to call it a kleenex rose becuase it balled in wet May's here and then 1 day I was looking at it in a late light and I became hooked could'nt stop taking pictures of it, After all it's just another pink rose right....nah it's and amazing pink rose somtimes silver it emits it's own light. Then I had to get it's white sport Kron Princessin Vikotria nota powerful fragrance but a gfragrance that has power to make me go back again and again.


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RE: Do I need Souvenir de la Malmaison?

Banner Maxx and Mancozeb keeps most everything spotless at Heritage Rosarium when I remember to use them every 2 -3 weeks. The problem is that they are so good and require being used less frequently than the older fungicides that you can forget when you last sprayed. I guess that is a good thing. Even spraying half of the garden that needs it (perhaps 250 plants) requires only about an hour with a back pack sprayer once every 2- 3 weeks. - Best

PS - get both SDLM and SDSA. Both are exquisite!


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RE: Do I need Souvenir de la Malmaison?

OK - now I need it too. And so far I can't find it - anyone know a vendor that still has one


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RE: Do I need Souvenir de la Malmaison?

I tried the organic sulfur spray and when I kept it up I found it was very effective. My problem was keeping it up consistently, but even occasional spraying helped disease resistance better than doing nothing at all. SDLM can get by without any spraying although mine is less vigorous but I don't mind a smaller bush in the spot I planted her.


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RE: Do I need Souvenir de la Malmaison?

Here in humid southwest Florida it does just great! I have it in a container. I have never sprayed it with a fungicide and it has stayed spot free for me! This is my favorite rose too. :-D


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RE: Do I need Souvenir de la Malmaison?

rozanna, Chamblee's has Malmaison, and St. Anne too but they're not up for sale just yet, it says " Coming Soon" and since I've never ordered from them( will be though) I really don't know that that means...I'm assuming fall availibility?

Alright, I'm going to try her out as soon she becomes availible for purchase, and I'll try the sulfur spray too, since my other roses besides the ones that don't need it, could benefit a little bit from it, and quite frankly I was kinda oblivious to Mutabilis's sheding, just something he did. During the summer I have my daily rounds anyway, watering, gotta make sure the trumpet vine babies are pulled from the lawn and no pods on the momma plants are allowed to set... adding some spray come really late afternoon when it cools down might not be that troublesome to do.


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RE: Do I need Souvenir de la Malmaison?

I asked Chamlbees, and they said that "coming soon" meant September. Maybe a few would be availabe the first of May. That is close because they suddenly stop shipping in May, I think.

Sammy


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RE: Do I need Souvenir de la Malmaison?

I prefer Mystic Beauty for humid areas like my garden in Jacksonville because it hardly ever balls, a weakness of SDLM. Mystic Beauty is the pink sport of Kronprincessin Viktoria and KP is a sport of SDLM, so they are all some form of SDLM. At Roses Unlimited I saw Mystic Beauty and SDLM growing side by side and while both were beautiful, all of Mystic Beauty's blooms were opening but half of SDLM's were soggy and getting brown in the bud. Mystic Beauty's flower is also larger than SDLM, more the size of the Climbing SDLM. If you are having trouble with SDLM opening, try Mystic Beauty, which is like SDLM on steroids!


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RE: Do I need Souvenir de la Malmaison?

Yes you do! But see how it growa in your area. Out here in CA I would not be without it! It blooms for months and if well watered, will bloom again. I have it in a really hot spot and it blooms for months. I am not a faithful waterer in the heat of summer and it gets its fall flush late but I love this rose. Check with you local rose society to see if it grows well there. If it does --go for it--you will be so happy!
Sonbie


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RE: Do I need Souvenir de la Malmaison?

Absolutely! Without doubt 'Souvenir de la Malmaison' is my most successful, most beautiful, most loved rose. Her flowers are gigantic for a heirloom rose and beautiful as a bud, partially opened and fully blown. She has a wonderful scent.

If I were forced to grow only one rose it would be 'Souvenir de la Malmaison'.

Here is a link that might be useful: Zanthan Gardens: Souvenir de la Malmaison


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RE: Do I need Souvenir de la Malmaison?

Thats a really nice rose! Does it repeat flowering very well compare to the Austins?

I'm in the stage of choosing between Nehama, Pierre de Ronsard or SDLMalmaison...I'll probably get all three.


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RE: Do I need Souvenir de la Malmaison?

I just got SdlM today! I'm so excited! Between bursts of rain, I ventured out and got it. I got an own-roots gorgeous, healthy looking one from Raft Island Roses. Yeah! My 4th OGR. It was so hard walking by an Alfred de Damas Rose too. They have such an amazing selection of all kinds of roses! It's very dangerous living a few miles from there. The family that owns the nursery is soooo nice too.

Here is a link that might be useful: Raft Island Roses


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RE: Do I need Souvenir de la Malmaison?

jumbojimmy, it is a great repeater.


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RE: Do I need Souvenir de la Malmaison?

jumbojimmy, it repeats extremely well for me too. Even in the hot summer months!

Randy


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RE: Do I need Souvenir de la Malmaison?

She is also shade tolerant and will put up with as little as 5 maybe 4 hours of direct sunlight a day.


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RE: Do I need Souvenir de la Malmaison?

I'm gettin' nostalgic. Just like the good old days.

Someone asks "do I need this rose" and the fun begins. A little Molineux prose, a Luanne picture and Presto! The entire Forum is bankrupt.

By the way Oath, SDLM grows great in a container.


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Not That...

Not that I am implying that any of this enabling is intentional.


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RE: Do I need Souvenir de la Malmaison?

  • Posted by rosyone z8 / 31-33 Louisiana (My Page) on
    Tue, Apr 10, 07 at 14:10

Of course it's intentional. Forum members don't pile on to a thread in such large numbers to sing the praises of a rose unless they feel it's worthy of some enabling.


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RE: Do I need Souvenir de la Malmaison?

A bit of perspective.

The rose is called:

Souvenir de la M-A-L-M-A-I-S-O-N

As in Empress Josphine de Bonaparte's legendary rose gardens at Malmaison.

You can't call yourself a respectable lover of Old Garden Roses unless you have this goddess in your collection.

Now go buy it!

Image of SdlM by Raffaele1961 at Hortiplex


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RE: Do I need Souvenir de la Malmaison?

I have 2, a bush and a climber. The bush is about 3-4 yrs. old and this is the climber's 2nd blooming season. The blooms on the climber would take your breath away! They are perfect shell pink and quartered. The only problem was the severe case of PM on the foliage. I used Bayer 3-1 to prevent thrips and disease I hoped. The thrips were eliminated but not PM. I have sprayed twice with
Rosepride and it seems to be abating. The bush form has never had a bloom as perfect as the climber. Both are from Chamblee's I think. Buff


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RE: Do I need Souvenir de la Malmaison?

Well, I just ordered 2 SdLM from Rogue Valley roses. (Also ordered Sutter's Gold and William R Smith) I couldn't take the raves anymore about form, fragrance and disease resistance! I had to find out for myself. Hopefully, in a few months I'll have pretty pictures to share, too. :)


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RE: Do I need Souvenir de la Malmaison?

I have started my first SDLM a few months ago and guess what, the first flower balled! The plant is still small (from Chamblee). I hope it will get better with time.


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RE: Do I need Souvenir de la Malmaison?

Randy,
Great pictures. You team well with the other enablers.

Patrick,
I'm not sure I can stick to my "not intentional" position any longer. You are evil.

But folks, if you are only gonna have one OGR, SdlM is the one.


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RE: Do I need Souvenir de la Malmaison?

Harry,

He-he-he-he-he...


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RE: Do I need Souvenir de la Malmaison?

Does anybody know a good nursery that has it in stock and won't be too outrageous in terms of price ( as in shipping to Maryland)? My usual sources Ashdown and Antique Rose Emporium don't currently have it, not that they'd be inexpensive anyway, lol.


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RE: Do I need Souvenir de la Malmaison?

I ordered mine from Rogue Valley Roses.

Here is a link that might be useful: Rogue Valley Roses


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RE: Do I need Souvenir de la Malmaison?

An update. We had a 1 inch rain yesterday. Today is absolutely beautiful: clear, no humidity and breezy. I just went out to inspect my usually inferior bush-form of SDLM. It has several perfect,quartered, flawless, smelly blooms and dozens of buds. These blooms are every bit as lovely as the climbers were (it's slowing down now)! Once again, gardeners are rewarded for patience. IMHO, SDLM is a wonderful rose. Buff


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RE: Do I need Souvenir de la Malmaison?

I just witnessed my first fully open SDLM (my first one balled). It really has that heart-melting light pink color that I crave, and smells wonderful too. It smells a little like Mme Issac Pereire, but more notable to my nose. For some reason, Mme Issac Pereire does not seem to be extremely fragrant to my nose. I wonder if it is the tea rose parentage in SDLM. I am so glad I am growing this plant and may grow its other sports too.


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RE: Do I need Souvenir de la Malmaison?

Out of the three roses, which has a stronger fragrance? a) SDLM; b) felicite palametier or c) madame Hardy. And which would you choose?


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RE: Do I need Souvenir de la Malmaison?

Jumbojimmy, I assume you mean Felicite Parmentier...

Of those three I would get SDLM.


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RE: Do I need Souvenir de la Malmaison?

For fragrance, out of these three, Felicite Parmentier will beat others hands down. However it doesn't repeat, so if you need repeat SDLM, if you want unbeatable fragrance FR.
Olga


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RE: Do I need Souvenir de la Malmaison?

I've got Felicite Parmentier. Lives through the winter fine. It struck me that it looked a lot like SDLM. Wonderful fragrance. It has a tendency to tumble to the ground, getting herself messy, which I don't like. The flowers are like pretty babies, smaller than some others. But there are a lot of them. She gets about five feet.
There is a lot of similarity in the flowers, which is odd, since Felicite Parmentier is supposed to be an alba, while SDLM is a cross between a Bourbon and a tea.
One of history's mysteries, since the parentage of FP is unknown.
Of course, it's hard to tell from a photo. If you had those two side by side, you might think they were way different.
Felicite definitely is an easy care substitute for me, but I know nothing about blackspot and rain and balling would be welcome. Our problem here is hot wind blasting the roses. FP blooms before the hot wind comes.

Here is a link that might be useful: Felicite Parmentier


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RE: Do I need Souvenir de la Malmaison?

SDLM has long been the very favorite flower in my "fantasy" rose garden. But now the beds are prepared, and 5 "bands" are due to arrive next week.

Something about this rose that really moves me...quite excited to start the adventure of growing her.

Bill


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RE: Do I need Souvenir de la Malmaison?

This morning when I was walking through the garden, I noticed that one of my SDlM plants was blooming quite a bit, in a pot, (fortuniana rootstock) 2 years old this week; I quit counting blooms when I got to 48, so I would say about 60 pounds on this one, although the ones on their own roots are about half that amount. (I have two on fortuniana, two on their own roots; something about the fortuniana rootstock or the pots made them do better than the others).


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RE: Do I need Souvenir de la Malmaison?

I'm glad to hear good things about Mystic Beauty. I have one coming from RU next week :)

Barbara


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RE: Do I need Souvenir de la Malmaison?

Some people say they can see no difference between SdlM and Mystic Beauty, so Gene's observations are interesting. I never planted SdlM because we have one of the worst climates for balling. I have MB, and her flowers are good when some other roses have problems. It will occasionally ball or get wet brown spots, but no worse than the average for all roses, not something I'd consider a fault. Of course, since I'm not growing SdlM, I can't say MB is better, or even different. On casual observation, it looks the same as SdlMs I've seen.


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RE: Do I need Souvenir de la Malmaison?

Between SdlM and Felicite Parmentier I would definately choose SdlM. The flowers are bigger and you get them all season long. Okay the fragrance isn't as glorious as Felicite's Alba parfume but it is still strong and nicely complex (think cantaloupe with a spicy kick).

Image of Souvenir de la Malmaison by Archduke at Hortiplex


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RE: Do I need Souvenir de la Malmaison?

Pat Henry told me Mystic Beauty was a much better plant than SDLM. I have SDLM but she's growing v-e-r-y s-l-o-w-l-y so I'm looking for good things out of MB.

Barbara


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RE: Do I need Souvenir de la Malmaison?

I really liked Rouge SDLM but it took sick with a case of Downy Mildew from an imported rose and since it was still under 3 years of age, it could not recover, but the two years I had it, I was quite pleased. KPV was planted in a bed with unruly hybrid teas with fortuniana grafts and could not overcome their vigor for taking over and they did.


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RE: Do I need Souvenir de la Malmaison?

Patrick (and anyone else)

I am torn between SDLM and Jacques Cartier. I have space for only one more (townhouse, small garden), and I may just leave the rose in a container for a year (until I can move one of my small floribundas to another spot).

So between SDLM and Jacques Cartier / Marchesa Boccella, which one pumps out more blooms, and which has more fragrance? (How do the fragrances compare?). Which is more disease resistant? (I get some bs on my roses, but I'm usually good at cutting it off before it spreads)

-Basil


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RE: Do I need Souvenir de la Malmaison?

  • Posted by soff belgium (My Page) on
    Mon, May 14, 07 at 5:26

I already have souvenir de la malmaison, three times in fact,
the first came in place of devoniensis, the second was specially bought for itself, the bush form, but it is finally the climbing form, and the third is a cutting, that is already on a arbor and full of roses, after only a year!
My question: does is stop balling!!!?

Basil, marchessa bocella doesnt ball!! can't compare the fragrnce, my marchessa is wonderful but my malmaison is quite rotten!


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RE: Do I need Souvenir de la Malmaison?

I started to post about Mystic Beauty and thankfully Gene did. I just purchased one and it smells heavenly. I bought it on fragrance alone. Not as pink as SDLM but supposed to be healthier. SDLM seems to be zone picky and hardly ever blooms for me past spring.

Carla


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RE: Do I need Souvenir de la Malmaison?

I am not Patrick but I grow roses, and have had both Jacques Cartier and SDLM. I think in your climate, Jacques Cartier is a better rose for you and fragrance is much better than SdlM. However, JC does not like my southern heat so we shovel-pruned it, but in other gardens it is wonderful and I hated to get rid of it for the fragrance alone. It is probably the most fragrant rose I have ever had.


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RE: Do I need Souvenir de la Malmaison?

Nova,

If I had to choose between the two then Souvenir de la Malmaison wins hands down. Marchesa Boccella is a very pretty and worthwhile rose but it lacks of the WOW factor that SdlM has in spades.

Flower: MB's blooms are a about 2.5-3 inches wide with a knotted button eye in the center. The outer petals form a scalloped edge. Bud color is deep rich pink that progressively lightens to an uniform light cool pink. SdlM flowers are bigger and the quartering is more "tight". The form is absolutely perfect on each and every flower. The outer petals form a circular disc with the inner petals pulled into segments, culminating into a pinpoint center. Only a few OGRs can match SdlM for consistency and perfection of form. Color is a pale icy pink that verges on white. The image included in my last post is very accurate in terms of form, color and petal texture.

Fragrance: very different. MB has a strong Damask scent; i.e. "classic" rose fragrance. Unfortunately, it is very much a one note fragrance. SdlM, on the other hand, has ravishing blooms blessed with a gloriously complex fragrance. Now to be honest, some folks can't smell it. I can and to me it is pure whiff of heaven.

Growth Habit: Both are short to medium in height but MB is more rigidly upright. I prefer the slightly wider habit of SdlM.

Disease Resistance: Good for both. I found SdlM to be slightly more resistant but to be honest I didn't keep MB around long enough to do a fair comparison.

Repeat: Good for both. SdlM is slightly faster to repeat.

Vigor: MB is better. An own root specimen is likely to mature the second year. SdlM makes you wait a year or two longer because she blooms at the detriment of putting on shrub growth.


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RE: Do I need Souvenir de la Malmaison?

Patrick

Thank you for that run down. You've sold me on SdlM, it will be my next rose purchase! By the way, Chamblees agreed with you (although they have JC/MB in stock, but are out of SdlM), I guess that indicates it is one fine rose!

I may put it off buying SdlM for a year (space issues, not sure I want to run a "container ghetto"), but I will decide that in the next few days (I'm going back and forth). But thanks nonetheless, I read your postings avidly, esp since you live in same climate zone

Your posting on Molineux sold me on that rose, I bought and planted 3 from Chamblees (hoping they grow into a brilliant blooming hedge). My Jude the Obscure is 3 years old (my 1st rose) and is about to put on a show, he has 25+ blooms on him. I'll have to take some pictures as he unfolds

-Basil


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RE: Do I need Souvenir de la Malmaison?

Carla, Mystic Beauty repeats like a modern bush rose for me, but SDLM should do that too-- unless, as you say, there is some magical threshhold of latitude. My MB has been slow to develop, but is showing good vigor this spring, after being one of the last to bud out after the freeze. It is also more cane-hardy than the tenderer moderns like Elina. I'm really glad to have it.


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RE: Do I need Souvenir de la Malmaison?

molineux, how is your SdM holding up in terms of blackspot this year so far? I'd like to know, I'm surprised with my own roses, my Queen Elizabeth has yet to loose one leaf.


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RE: Do I need Souvenir de la Malmaison?

My SdlM got sprayed with Mancozeb about two weeks ago. That is the ONLY spraying it has received this season. I looked at it yesterday. There are two yellow black spotted leaves on the lowest cane to the ground. Otherwise green and lush. Sure wish my other roses looked that good. I've been lazy with the spraying and unfortunately most my roses are showing the neglect.

But not Souvenir de la Malmaison.


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RE: Do I need Souvenir de la Malmaison?

I have to say I am falling in love with this rose. A couple of weeks ago I posted a thread saying I had very mixed feelings about it. I went outside and cut off all the brown dingle balls hanging off of her and muttered that as soon as I found a "better" rose she was getting replaced.

Wouldn't you know I went out the next day and she had the most exquisite bloom that I cut and brought inside. No thrips either. She's been doing great since, but does need to be deadheaded to look tidy. I haven't sprayed for a month because of all the wind we've been having, and the foliage is still beautiful.

I think I scared her enough to straighten up. I'm glad, because she is budded on fortuniana, excellent quality, was mail order, and therefore wasn't a cheap rose.

Sandy


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