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Spray Cecile Brunner?
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Posted by
Kippy-the-Hippy 10 Sunset 24 (
My Page) on
Thu, May 15, 14 at 11:38
| Does anyone have any experience with how shade tolerant Spray Cecile Brunner is or how much it would slow growth to be in the shade? |
Follow-Up Postings:
RE: Spray Cecile Brunner?
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Kippy,
I have one planted at the edge of some trees where it gets some afternoon sun, but not six hours worth, for sure. It's healthy and is growing. I can't say much more than that. Sometimes if I'm not sure about placement because of sun issues I'll put the rose in its pot and leave it where I want to plant it for a month or two to see how it does. Just a thought. Gean |
RE: Spray Cecile Brunner?
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| Thanks Gean. I was thinking of ordering a band so it will be a bit before I could plant it but am looking for some fairly fast growing shade tolerant roses for loosing the wonderful neighbors |
RE: Spray Cecile Brunner?
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| All the permutations of Cecile are quite shade tolerant, Kippy. You can successfully treat and grow them like you do Iceberg. That shouldn't be surprising as they are basically the same breeding as Iceberg, Sally Holmes and the more successful "hybrid musks". All are based upon something strongly multiflora crossed with other types, but retaining a great deal of the multiflora character. Kim |
RE: Spray Cecile Brunner?
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One of mine is in considerable shade and does fine. It's a tough rose.
Melissa |
RE: Spray Cecile Brunner?
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| Kim What are all the Cecile Brunner types? I might have to go pick up some Sally Holmes to fill in between the climbers. Otto has them in 1 and 5 has Can I saw how annoying it is to be looking and buying plants just to loose those neighbors.... |
RE: Spray Cecile Brunner?
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| Bush, Spray, Climbing, White, Pink Gate, etc. All the mutations and close seedlings of Cecile Brunner. For the most part, as far as their cultural requirements, they're interchangable. Kim |
RE: Spray Cecile Brunner?
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| I never liked "Spray Cecile Brunner" -- if you didn't prune off the spent panicles, it ended up looking like someone drove by and tossed a bunch of mangled wire coathangers into the bush! |
RE: Spray Cecile Brunner?
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| I have to do that with all the climbers which flower in sprays or clusters anyway here, for the same reason. No biggie. Kim |
RE: Spray Cecile Brunner?
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| Trospero. Considering the neighbors that might be a plus :) I am about ready to write to the property owner asking for a freeway sound wall The other neighbors offer of fortuniana cuttings sound really good too. :) |
RE: Spray Cecile Brunner?
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| Kippy, if you can find Cl. Cecile Brunner, preferably the non repeating one, it grows like oatmeal on a two year old, or fleas on kittens. RAMPANT is probably the operative word. Most of the commercial ones are going to be budded on Huey which give them a huge push right out of the can. Create a real wall there using her and any Fortuniana pieces you can get. Just get ready to have to wade into it with a flame thrower periodically so you can eliminate the rat's and squirrel nests which are guaranteed to be built in that barbed fortress! Kim |
RE: Spray Cecile Brunner?
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| Oh another plus!!! Rats and squirrels. :) I have one 1g cl Cecile on the street fence. Did not realize she would throw those 10 foot canes in the shade too. One a 1g do you think it is on Huey? Can you tell I have some hostility today about spending 3 days dealing with a ridiculous false claim made by the neighbors? |
RE: Spray Cecile Brunner?
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| Where did you get your one gallon Cl. Cecile? You should be able to easily tell by looking at the base of that plant whether it's budded or own root. If you can't see a bud union, there isn't one. Yes, in less then full sun, you should expect to see explosive growth like that, actually faster. The rose WANTS more light. It will easily deal with less, but it prefers more, so it more quickly throws itself out into greater light ASAP. That's what multiflora seedlings do when they germinate in the understory. They're very tolerant of the reduced light and actually make good use of the increased moisture the shade provides, but they quickly produce roots and then almost as quickly throw themselves up, into and through the canopy out into the sun. Banksiaes do it; Giganteas, Musks (real ones, too, not just "hybrid musks" which are multiflora hybrids), any of the real climbers are well suited for those conditions because they are the conditions under which they evolved. Most of the flowers appear out in the sun where bees can find them, pollinate them, seeds form and either fall off through the canopy to the moister, mulch laiden ground to germinate, or are eaten and dropped by birds, rodents, etc. Only those most able to germinate in lower light, tolerate filtered sun until they explode into the greater light will make it, "selecting" for that ability over time. I don't blame you for wanting to smother them in prickly growth. Good luck! Kim |
RE: Spray Cecile Brunner?
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| Thanks for the info Kim. I got my Cl Cecile from Otto's as a 1g. I was thinking about it today and I think I had noted it did not appear to be budded. It had been pushing up new basals from all around the base and they are not Doc H. I think I will see if I can find a 1g at one of the other local nurseries and put on the fence. I also think I will make a new row in front of the fence row where I can put roses that bloom more regularly all summer. And maybe stick with the less thorny but extra tall roses on that fence line. Our chainlink fence is a couple of feet from their wooden fence and I planted the roses a foot or so in front of the fence. I could put in a yellow Lady Banks and the Cl Cecile and have quite a nice wall right there. Any of the H. Musks that you would suggest? Off to search the Gigantea's and Musks. |
RE: Spray Cecile Brunner?
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| That pretty much depends upon what you can find, Kippy. You know how large Banksiae and Cl. Cecile will get pretty quickly. I know you want to smother those folks, but you also have to take into account how quickly those are going to eat the space and how much effort you want to put in to maintaining the area. If you have the room, planting Sally Holmes and pruning her as a free standing shrub gives the impression of an enormous white Hydrangea on steroids. Jacqueline Humery can give the same effect, only with porcelain pink buds and more double flowers. I know you already have a pile of them, but Icebergs could also be spectacular there in front of the two climbers and they flower MUCH more continuously than just about anything else. They recycle faster than any other roses, start earlier and flower later than any others, too. Mix it up with both Brilliant Pink and White to tie the Banksiae and Cecile in and you should have the effect you're looking for. And, best part, they're EASY to find in the sizes and price range you will likely enjoy best. Kim |
RE: Spray Cecile Brunner?
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| Late to the conversation. My Cecile spray only received about an hour of sun, some reflected light and a whole lotta shade. She topped out at 10 feet in a few years. (Grafted.) Bloomed just fine. Even in PDX, this crowd of relatives handles shade. My Perle d'Or (own root) gets sliced down to 4.5 to 5 feet each spring. Otherwise it would also reach 10 feet in the shade. Near continuous bloom. Here in Portland, Ballerina can climb to 10 feet in the shade, as can Penelope. Bloom fine. They grow rather quickly, too. Sending more neighbor sympathy. Carol |
RE: Spray Cecile Brunner?
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| This is an extremely helpful thread. I just want to follow along. Sounds like you are angry, Kippy :( but it also sounds like you will create a wall of great beauty. A silver lining, if you will. |
RE: Spray Cecile Brunner?
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| Met with the county today......they are just doing their job just frustrated we have to do this again for no cause I realized I have a mystery rose that is probably multifloria back ground and is very vigorous for a band and needs a home. Think I found it. Going to see about several Sally Holmes for a front hedge row and I think make a second row of some more pillared roses And going to tell the owner of the property that their fence is rotten and we would support a variance to allow for a taller privacy fence. Thanks |
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