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sarah_rc

And the winners are... Spirit of Freedom?

sarah_rc
16 years ago

Hello! I'm brand new posting to this website... I'm so glad to have found that I'm not the only one obsessed with old fashioned roses!!! This is great! I've thoroughly enjoyed reading the posts and since I've only been rose gardening for 2 years I've learned a lot. The reason I'm posting this is, well, I guess I wanted to stop lurking and say "Hi", and ALSO I wanted to -- Defend my rose! My first and favorite (although a young rose with an inexperienced rose gardener) is Spirit of Freedom! She is a newly debuted rose from David Austin and I see she's not even a contender on your lists! aahhh! ha ha, ha! Well, it seems she has a bad rap here on this site and I think you are all missing out! My first bush has been in the ground 2 years (this is her 3rd spring here) and she's huge. I keep chopping her back to the 5 ft fence and she just springs up all the more. If permitted she could easily be a 10 ft climber. Last year I put 2 more SOFs in beside her and they are growing faster than the first. She tends to shoot up 1 or 2 canes the first year and then the second year go crazy. Yes, okay, if the buds get too wet they ball, BUT but but - IMO this is a small sacrifice to be made when growing a delicious, delicately sweet scented rose with some 200 petals! AND let me clarify, it takes more than a couple showers to cause this!!! (I was inspired to post this after reading Molineaux's "love letter" to cl. cotilde soupert...a rose I must have now too...I just realized there was life outside David Austin's website! What heaven! There's more! My poor husband dosen't understand, I just put in 5 more bushes...) ANYWAY, maybe I'm too new at this, maybe I don't have enough other roses growing to compare my girls to, and maybe it's just my first love, but I think SOF is the sweetest, most beautiful rose out there. They're just starting to bloom and I shot some pictures...

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Comments (37)

  • dublinbay z6 (KS)
    16 years ago

    Sarah, what a lovely rose you have there. I know nothing about SOF, but if I need a larger bush, I will certainly give it a close second look.

    Those first blooms are so exciting, aren't they!

    By the way, welcome to the forum (and out of lurkdom).

    Happy rosing,

    Kate

  • ehann
    16 years ago

    Your pictures are gorgeous! Say, how is the rebloom on SOF? I have three Eglantynes that don't repeat enough for me. I love the clear pinks, though.

    Elaine

  • celeste/NH
    16 years ago

    Hi Sarah,
    Welcome to the Forum, and let me say you don't have to defend this rose to me! I am also smitten with her. I can't decide which of her virtues that I love most....the big, cabbage blooms stuffed with so many petals it seems
    impossible....the downy softness of those petals (like Puffs-plus kleenex!)....her disease resistance here in NH....her great winter-hardiness....the fact she smells lovely....her growing up the obelisk to look over me so I
    can gaze up at those glorious blooms....hmmmm. So much to
    love! Yeh, sometimes they ball but everybody has to have
    ONE flaw. And it happens so rarely I don't care.

    Count me in as another admirer!! I LOVE her too.

    Celeste

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  • twohuskies
    16 years ago

    I just bought one last week from Home Depot. Not exactly my preferred place to buy roses but for $10 I couldn't resist the petal packed stinky blooms! I hope she's as good for me as she is for you ladies. Good winter hardiness and long canes? Maybe I should move her to a larger spot?

    Celeste - how large does your SOF get?

  • Molineux
    16 years ago

    I've held off trying SPIRIT OF FREEDOM because David Austin doesn't rate the fragrance as strong. He describes it as pleasant, of old rose character with a hint of myrrh. I only want roses so sweetly fragrant that la parfume will literally knock you off your feet.

    CLOTILDE SOUPERT is one of those roses. Personally I think balling is small price to pay for the silky petal texture and perfect quartering. Even then it isn't an issue if you take the time to blow hard on the buds to initially "crack" the bloom open. I've had good success using this technique on both Clotilde Soupert and Souvenir de la Malmaison (the balling queen of the universe).

    BTW, PRETTY JESSICA is an older English Rose that I think you will like. It has the perfect, petal packed flowers that you are looking for but blessed with a positively intoxicating Damask fragrance. The color must be seen to be believed - lilac on the outer petals blushed rich cherry pink in the middle. Growth habit is short and slightly bushy so she would be a good choice for those tight spots where Spirit of Freedom is too big.

    Something to think about...

    Here is a link that might be useful: Pretty in Pink

  • sarah_rc
    Original Author
    16 years ago

    Oh my goodness, Pretty Jessica, I just squealed in delight and almost woke up my baby. Thank you so much for the recommendation; I'm adding her to the top of my list along with Clotilde. I have the perfect tub to plant her out in - a huge vintage black and white enamel kitchen pot. It will be magnificent. The blooms are like balls! And those thick upright stems!! Thank you!

  • celeste/NH
    16 years ago

    sarah...yup...that photo is my previous enabling of Pretty Jessica here on the forum, and yes....you gotta have her! Since you like the old-fashioned, fully-packed globular blooms you will have it all with PJ, not to mention she stays compact so she doesn't take up much space. I grow dozens of the Austins and Pretty Jessica is at the top of the list of my favorites. I got mine as a bareroot from Pickering last Spring and she bloomed non-stop all summer, and was my last rose to stop flowering (even after the killing frosts she was still setting buds). I am posting some more pics of her below to "seal the deal". You will
    love her!

    twohuskies, my Spirit of Freedom grows inside a 6 foot tall
    obelisk and was almost to the top in just one summer. This
    spring she didn't have much dieback. (I did wrap the obelisk but didn't take down the canes....too stiff & thorny) and was pleasantly surprised that the canes were still green after taking off the burlap. And this past winter was hell on my roses here. I had more winter damage than usual. I had never seen any mention of this rose being cold-hardy but its one of the hardier Austins for me. And as I said before, the blooms are SO incredibly silky and soft that I constantly touch & caress the layers of petals as I sniff their lovely fragrance. Still reminds me of Puffs Plus kleenex with lotion!

    Celeste

    PRETTY JESSICA, FOR SARAH....

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  • veilchen
    16 years ago

    Well well Celeste. Thanks to you I have added to my order list two roses for next year--Vic's Caprice and now Pretty Jessica. You have become more of an enabler to me than Patrick because you're in the north, like me. Thank you very much!

  • twohuskies
    16 years ago

    Uh oh 6 feet! Looks like I will for sure have to find a new spot for SOF.. And apparently something for it to climb on. Last winter was hard on my roses too so to hear it came through in good shape is very encouraging.

    Your Pretty Jessica is so, well um, pretty!! Mine will be blooming within the next week.

    BTW Celeste - when did you become evil enabler???? Your post on Vick's Caprice just about has me sold on that one. I don't have it yet, but it's on the my wish list. Good thing I already have Pretty Jessica.....

  • sarah_rc
    Original Author
    16 years ago

    Thank you Celeste, you certainly did seal the deal... your photos are to die for. Pretty Jessica is breathtaking and a must-have. I look forward to experiencing a "knock you off your feet" scented rose! Looks like she and Clotilde have to wait for next year though since temps are in the 80s already here in South Jersey. yuk!

  • celeste/NH
    16 years ago

    veilchen, I have led you to temptation but I'm not sorry. I am so sure you will love those two that I don't feel one bit guilty...LOL. When you fall in love with a rose it makes you want to share the joy! I hope yours will be as wonderful for you.
    twohuskies, Yes...you are going to have to give SOF lots of elbow room....she's a big gal, even in zone 4. Yes, I am becoming a bit of an evil enabler (grin). Some roses are just too good to keep a secret, and us cold-zoners have to stick together!
    sarah, glad I convinced you...I knew you'd want that one!

    Celeste

  • nberg7
    16 years ago

    This rose really interests me a lot. I like to check out the DA UK site now and then to see which roses they're using for cut flowers. Pretty Jessica "used" to be one of their mainstays in their fresh flower arrangements, but I don't think they're using it anymore- I might have to dig deeper.

    Can anyone comment on vase life for PJ in the meantime?

    Nancy

  • patricianat
    16 years ago

    It's a beauty.

  • devon_gardener
    16 years ago

    You know, I thought I was gaining self-control but nooooooooo!

    Buford has enabled me for Comte de Chambord

    Zeffyrose has enabled me for McCartney rose

    Molineux has enabled me for Pretty Jessica

    And now, these Spirit of Freedom pics from Sarah are making
    me want it real bad.

    All this in the middle of a California drought, when I want
    to just deal with the roses I have and maybe edit some.

  • anntn6b
    16 years ago

    Pickering says "Best grown as a climber".
    Does this fit with what y'all are seeing?

    Hi, Sarah, welcome to the fray.

  • karenforroses
    16 years ago

    What beautiful pictures of Spirit of Freedom! I just got one this past spring and she has put on excellent growth (I have her growing up and through an 8' pillar. I'm also falling in love with her - think she'll be a great rose!

  • ingrid_vc so. CA zone 9
    16 years ago

    Welcome Sarah,

    I was a "new" member just a few months ago and have learned lots and enjoyed myself even more. There are such nice people here, and everyone seems to have a great sense of humor, which I rate as equally important. I was thrilled to hear your enthusiasm for Spirit of Freedom since I ordered one from David Austin that is going on my house wall, with Cl. Pinkie on the next arch, and Celine Forestier and Ley's Perpetual further down the wall behind some junipers and lavender crape myrtle.

    Welcome again and hope to hear from you often.

    Warm regards,

    Ingrid

  • veilchen
    16 years ago

    My Spirit of Freedom isn't cane hardy enough to be a climber. It's in its 3rd year and is about 4 1/2' tall.

  • cupshaped_roses
    16 years ago

    I also simply love this rose!!! Only wish it had a stronger scent!

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  • devon_gardener
    16 years ago

    Niels, Wow! Gorgeous, Outrageous Pictures! I must have
    it!

  • bogie
    16 years ago

    I was at HD last night, and naturally had to see what they had for sale. They had a several SoF's and I walked out with one for 5 bucks and some change.

    It is my first David Austin, but I feel good about its chances here seeing that Celestial Rose grows this also.

    I think I will be getting my first pillar for this rose because most of my fence space is taken up at this point.

    It's all good!

  • nattaporn
    16 years ago

    I live in Thailand and I grew Spirit of Freedom for about half year. They is strong and doing well here and stem reach about 4-5 foot but still never blooming yet. I donÂt know why? Or maybe should I have to wait a little longer. Please give me any advice. Thank you.

  • dublinbay z6 (KS)
    16 years ago

    nattaporn,
    I have no idea what the growing conditions are like in Thailand, but maybe you could check two things:

    1. Are your roses getting at least 6-8 hours of sun a day? With less sun, many roses are reluctant to bloom.

    2. Are you using a high-nitrogen fertilizer on your roses? If you are, that would encourage leaf growth, but discourage bloom growth. Try to get a "balanced" fertilizer--such as 10-10-10 or 13-13-13. (A high-nitrogen fertlizer might say something like 19-6-8. The first number is the nitrogen number.)

    The only other thing I can think of is whether your roses need more water. Underwatering can discourage blooming, but you have to be careful--overwatering can drown your roses. Hopefully your soil drains well and quickly so you don't have to worry about the rose standing in water, which would be bad.

    Good luck,
    Kate

  • nattaporn
    16 years ago

    Hi Kate

    I just move my Spirit of Freedom for full sun area about a week. I will try to do my best with your advice and hope it will produce rose so soon. Thank you very much for your advice.

  • oldroser
    16 years ago

    Suspect that Spirit of Freedom will be a bush not a pillar in zone 4. There are practically no Austin roses that don't get some freeze back in zone 5 though our mild 06-07 winter left Heritage in excellent shape for the first time in ten years. Abraham Darby and Tamora froze to the ground. Mary Rose is very hardy and Fisherman's Friend did well but so far only Heritage has made a truly tall bush - and this year it's up over twelve feet.

  • cupshaped_roses
    16 years ago

    I think you are about that Oldroser. Austins can only be used as low climbers against walls in sheltered positions in zone 5. The reflected heat from walls in courtyards or urban areas creates a microclimate that makes it possible to push the hardiness of some roses.In my experience SOF will become 8 feet tall in a sheltered position. So will James Galway, Teasing Georgia and Fallstaff. Leander can even become 12 feet tall. These roses would only become bushes if not growing on wall in my area. SOF becomes 4-5 feet tall here. James Galway and Teasing Georgia have been the most hardy Austins I have grown so far. Heritage has been the most vigorous. Even if it freezes almost to the ground it will be 6-7 feet at the end of the season.
    The only Austin that can climb in zone 5 is Constance Spry. And this rose only blooms 3-4 weeks in the spring.

    One of my SOF growing against a wall (Bleached to almost white by the sun):

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    The flowers are Amazing! Some have more than 200 petals!!!

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  • onewheeler
    16 years ago

    That rose is my favorite of the 40 some roses I planted this summer, I adore her. I picked one of her late blooms tonight and inhaled her scent, she is delicious. I sure hope she overwinters well as I love this rose and want to keep it. I have it planted on the sheltered side of my house. It is one of the prettiest and strongest Austins I have grown. I do not spray my garden either and this one proved to be disease free so far.

    Valerie

  • jumbojimmy
    16 years ago

    A Beautiful rose. Hopefully it's available here in Australia soon.

    Cupshaped rose- your garden/courtyard looks very nice and intriguing.

  • cupshaped_roses
    16 years ago

    Thank you Jimmy! I try to make the most out of the 6 small areas in my garden. I hope you saw the thread about Gertrude Jekyll. I remember you asked about Comte De Chambord. I suggest you try both and see which one you like. SOF is not nearly as fragrant as GJ or CDC, but a rose this beautiful and with so many petals and easy to grow is rare. But I know you like very fragrant roses....

  • jumbojimmy
    16 years ago

    cupshaped roses - thanks for the info. I almost missed that post. I love the way you mass planted GJ in the second photo. It looks stunningly beautiful.

    Due to the severe drought in Australia and the fact that I'm renting at the moment - I'll have to reserve those two plants (GJ and CdC) at a later date. Hopefully it won't be too long that I have my own house.

    I can only get 3 more roses for next year. Comtes des Champagne being one of them because I've been kicking myself for not getting it earlier. The other 2 would have to be the new releases - hopefully one of them is Spirit of Freedom.

    Sharifas Asma...I'm really excited that I've bought her this year, she has this really nice, pleasant smell- much stronger than Heritage, Falstaff and A shropshire Lad.

    Just waiting for Cinderella fairytale and Jude the Obscure to bloom. :)

  • bogie
    16 years ago

    If it grows anywhere near as strongly as Night Owl did for me this year, SoF will do well on a pillar. If not, I can live with a bush form. I will let it go the first year and see how it does, then if a pillar is called for, I can add that later.

    Thanks to everyone for the additional information and especially for those beautiful pics!

  • cottageofpinkroses
    15 years ago

    My SOF from last year. Love all those petals.
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  • artemis_pa
    15 years ago

    I identified my "mystery rose" at Huntington Gardens: Spirit of Freedom. I spotted SOF amongst a bed of dozens of DA's...and just knew that was my rose. I've had this rose for 3 years. It is huge and very hardy and healthy. I have to chop it back several times during the summer. It always responds with more blooms. I find the scent strong in the morning, with an old rose mixed with Abe Darby scent. Nice. Usually in the evening it is a light old rose scent. Love this rose.

  • york_rose
    14 years ago

    Is Spirit of Freedom a rose with lax enough canes to be used as a climber (maybe a short one) on a 3' high fence (in zone 6), or if you tried to train it that way would it always be fighting to grow more upwards?

  • flowersaremusic z5 Eastern WA
    8 years ago

    It's been a few years since this thread started, but it is encouraging, nevertheless. My two Spirit of Freedom bushes are still in the trying to get established stage even after 2 and 3 years. A wonderful tonic recipe I whip up and a thick layer of compost has helped, but they seem to be telling me they're not happy - yet. I will continue trying to figure out what they want/need and hope for the best. I LOVE the form of this rose. A similar rose I am having better luck with is Cinderella Fairy Tale, a Kordes rose. I have 2 of those, as well, one of which over wintered like a champ, the other died to the ground, however, has made a valiant effort at returning to the fold. It wasn't the cold, as we had a mild winter, but the freeze, thaw, freeze, thaw, all winter long did the dirty deed. These two roses are so perfectly formed they take my breath away, and are worth every effort to grow. I doubt my SOF will ever reach the height of Sarah's in my zone 5 garden, but I love this rose at any height. Sarah, are your 3 bushes still climbing higher? I would love to see an updated photo, if possible.

  • muks29
    8 years ago

    I am in lahore. Very hot summers here.


    Love your sof. I have 3 sof grafted for the last 2 years. And not one flower. I have relocated all of them to different spots. I loved it so much that i will not give up on it. Later i got geoff hamilton and gentle germoine too. They are doing fine. Geoff comes close to sof beauty. Must try.