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Losing my Patience with Grandma's Hat...Close to Sp'ing It..

Posted by desertgarden561 9/SZ11 -Las Vegas, N (My Page) on
Wed, Jun 11, 14 at 22:53

Grandma's/Grandmother's Hat was received as a band and has been in my yard for almost a year now. It has been the lousiest grower thus far. It is healthy, but only has two thin canes that are smaller than a diameter of a pencil with groups of 7 leaves spaced about every 4 inches. It has no fullness whatsoever and has been outgrown by bands planted in my garden as late as November. Is this growth habit typical? I am so close to sp'ing this rose. Even the EVS that was on life support last year is now competing with it in terms of growth.

Please advise.

Lynn


Follow-Up Postings:

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RE: Losing my Patience with Grandma's Hat...Close to Sp'ing It..

I think a few people have said she has climates she does not like.

I was just looking at mine today and enjoying how big she is, she is taller now that Lady Ann Kidwell who has been the real star of all the bands til this season.

If the shovel comes...I have money for postage :)


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RE: Losing my Patience with Grandma's Hat...Close to Sp'ing It..

I'm with Kippy -- if you sp her, don't donate her to the trash.

FWIW, we have more GH than I care to count -- ONE of the lot grew well, but flat refused to bloom for an entire year.

BUT honestly, I don't know anyone who has grown her in a desert setting. (I should give one to our friend in L.V.) Who knows? Maybe she doesn't like desert?

There's an ideal place for every rose.
I imagine that, likewise, there is a dreadful place for every rose.


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RE: Losing my Patience with Grandma's Hat...Close to Sp'ing It..

  • Posted by AquaEyes 7 New Brunswick, NJ (My Page) on
    Wed, Jun 11, 14 at 23:16

Until I read this post, I thought that, perhaps, my "Grandmother's Hat" was simply very immature when I received it last Spring. Most of last year's bands have produced at least one thick cane already, but GH still has the same two it had when it arrived. In any case, I don't think one year is enough time for me to shovel-prune anything.

These pics were taken May 30 this year. I wasn't expecting the Penstemon 'Dark Towers' which was planted just a month earlier to have already grown larger than it. Planted in the same bed just a few feet away, the China 'Napoleon' is growing like gangbusters.

 photo 10352984_10152141321467285_8639017015723436307_n.jpg

 photo 1508053_10152141323512285_3346804464221676743_n.jpg


:-)

~Christopher


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RE: Losing my Patience with Grandma's Hat...Close to Sp'ing It..

I am guessing there are different schools of thought. If a rose does not take off in comparison to others of the same time, area, given the same treatment, then maybe it was a weak plant to begin with or the climate, soil, etc. Does not provide what the plant requires to be happy and flourish.

Another school of thought is the belief in "late bloomers". That the rose is on its own schedule and will take off according to its own clock .

I have sworn off bands unless it is a rose I covet and that is the only way I can get it . I lack the patience and desire to coddle unless it is absolutely necessary.

I really wanted this rose but will not spend my time, money and energy on something with a high probability of being a dud in my climate when so many roses thrive.

If it does not get its act together by October...off to Camarillo it goes. It would serve me right as this rose was initially purchased for my sister-in-law and I kept it. I took a Julia Child to her instead.


Lynn


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RE: Losing my Patience with Grandma's Hat...Close to Sp'ing It..

One year?? Thats all a rose gets to prove its worth in your garden -- one year? If I had taken that approach to evaluating my 2000+ roses, most of my best plants would not have had a whisper of a chance.

At this very moment I have an 8 x 8 foot 'Konigen von Danemark' that is now 13 years old and by the end of its cycle, will have produced several hundred magnificent blooms. That plant took four years to start looking like it had any intention of surviving, let alone morphing into the specimen it is today.


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RE: Losing my Patience with Grandma's Hat...Close to Sp'ing It..

Yep, one year and an extra 5 months (October). I am not expecting much other than a performance that is closer to plants that have entered my garden and struggled, those that have only been here for a handful of months, and those arriving around the same time, in the same area receiving the same treatment.

I know that I lack some patience, that is why I have basically sworn off bands and will not waste time when there is a possibility that in 4 years or so we could relocate (move back to California). If a plant is showing signs that it is unhappy with what I can offer in my garden, I encourage travel and provide free transportation to a new home.

Lynn


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RE: Losing my Patience with Grandma's Hat...Close to Sp'ing It..

From the opening post: "Grandma's/Grandmother's Hat was received as a band and has been in my yard for almost a year now."

(emphasis mine)


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RE: Losing my Patience with Grandma's Hat...Close to Sp'ing It..

  • Posted by AquaEyes 7 New Brunswick, NJ (My Page) on
    Thu, Jun 12, 14 at 11:44

She may have meant that it's almost a year since it was planted in the ground, being babied in a pot before then.

I understand your reason for wanting things to move along in case you, yourself, have to "move along." If you need "instant satisfaction" then you'd be better off sticking to grafted plants, or own-root plants at least gallon-sized. Many of my bands grew very well, but a handful are lagging behind.

:-)

~Christopher


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RE: Losing my Patience with Grandma's Hat...Close to Sp'ing It..

Trospero and Christopher are right.

If I gave up roses after a year, I'd likely have no roses at all. In fact, because ALL of our roses have to be planted in squat pots in the ground (gophers) they likely take longer here than they do in most places. Our overall cool climate probably has an effect, as well.

I actually enjoy watching the little plants slowly evolve into something wonderful.

Gardening with perennial plants likely isn't a happy situation for impatient gardeners. Even an artichoke plant needs a year or two in the ground, before it matures and bears.


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RE: Losing my Patience with Grandma's Hat...Close to Sp'ing It..

Jerijen,

Gophers, I am glad that isn't an issue here, the soil and the heat six weeks from about July 1st onward keeps me on my toes.

A couple of weeks or so will mark the time since Grandmothers' Hat has been planted in my yard. So, just shy of a year in the ground.

I am a very analytical person, but realistically know that so much in gardening can move outside of pre-conceived parameters. Despite that, there's a "when to say when" based upon the standards we set in our gardening conditions. I've been growing roses here for over 14 years, at one point 150+ (primarily grafted), but must admit that this is the first year that I "in earnest" committed to the patience required for bands. Most have performed very well and nothing died last summer.

I re-designed my yard last year which included the addition of numerous bands and 1 gallon own root. G.H. is the ONLY one that really is not performing. Even Paul Neyron is growing like mad, as if it was was waiting for heat. I've considered digging up G.H. and repotting this Fall. The problem is, I would quickly place a rose in the large space allotted for G.H. If it should improve while in the pot, I will have no where to plant it on my suburban lot. It would be re-homed anyway.

O.T. ....Christopher, my husband and I are both California natives and all of our family resides there. It never made financial sense for us to sell our home and relocate to CA, but there could be an opportunity in the near future or we could just remain here. I am placing more roses in pots just in case (R.U's recent sale ) :)

This post was edited by desertgarden561 on Thu, Jun 12, 14 at 13:20


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RE: Losing my Patience with Grandma's Hat...Close to Sp'ing It..

Lynn, I think you know how wonderful my situation is for roses, and I planted GH in a particularly hot and unfriendly location because I had no other place at the time. For me this rose took off like gangbusters and grew like a weed. Unfortunately the blooms fried like nobody's business and I had to give it up, and planted Le Vesuve there instead, which worked out very well. I'm surprised you didn't have similar results although I'm sure soil and other considerations might explain it. This is what makes growing roses in a challenging climate so fascinating and yet also sometimes so frustrating.

Ingrid


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RE: Losing my Patience with Grandma's Hat...Close to Sp'ing It..

Ingrid,

I did the opposite. I planted G.H. In a location where it receives afternoon shade. It thrives for Jerijen and it doesn't get that hot at all there .... I believe. Go figure.....that's gardening!

Lynn


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RE: Losing my Patience with Grandma's Hat...Close to Sp'ing It..

I realize that roses may grow much quicker in a warm climate compared to my northern one but I never give a rose less than four years, sometimes up to seven years and patience has paid for me. My husband remarked today that von Scharnhorst, planted in 2005 and severely hurt by a fox digging for bone meal soon after planting, has finally taken off.


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RE: Losing my Patience with Grandma's Hat...Close to Sp'ing It..

I've had some roses take 2 to 3 ears to look like anything what will you put in it's place if you get rid of it.!


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RE: Losing my Patience with Grandma's Hat...Close to Sp'ing It..

I have a very nice sized, vigorous GH plant in a very large pot. I propagated it and planted a gallon sized one in the ground in a very sunny, hot location. It did not thrive. I am currently trying another gallon sized one in another tough location just to see what it'll do. I suspect that it is like many other roses and will do better if it is potted up until it is a nice sized 3 or 5 gallon plant before being planted in the ground. Some roses can take off when planted in the ground as almost a newly rooted cutting. It won't work for others. But nobody can tell you that you should want to work with it and find the best growing routine for that particular plant. You might try something different if you are drawn to that rose. I'd dig it up , pot it up, and grow it on. Pretty often a rose that is not thriving will respond to that and go on to be a good plant.


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RE: Losing my Patience with Grandma's Hat...Close to Sp'ing It..

FWIW, Grandmother's Hat is turning out to be a slow poke for me, too. I'm in hot and humid conditions.

I'm not trying to sway your opinion either way, just giving some neutral information.

I'm sure you'll make the right decision for you and your garden.


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RE: Losing my Patience with Grandma's Hat...Close to Sp'ing It..

I'm not looking for this rose to be mature at this point, not even close. It should however be showing signs that something is happening and it is actually heading down the path. Grandmother's hat is not "progressing" at a satisfactory pace. I have the same two whispy canes that existed when I received it, they are slightly longer and the leaves on the two canes are very sparse. That's it....it has been out done by everything I own including what was the saddest looking EVS bands ever.

I have looked for potential replacements if it doesn't shape up by Fall. Aunt Margy's rose is on the short list I have compiled thus far,

Lynn


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RE: Losing my Patience with Grandma's Hat...Close to Sp'ing It..

Lynn

I totally get how hard it is to wait....lol Stop laughing Jeri and Kim. :)

I planted the backyard in big 5g pots and lot that I got my instant gratification from them. I would not change that at all. Mom loves going out there and enjoying all of those big roses. The new bands are my roses. It is hard to wait on them to grow up, but I know that they are growing for the most part. Some do seem to really grow like mad and others not so much. It seems like those ones that are stalled are the ones I check on the most. Lady Hillingdon and Crepuscule. I think they might do better if I did not worry about them so much and trusted that eventually they grow because they have not died.


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RE: Losing my Patience with Grandma's Hat...Close to Sp'ing It..

Kippy-the-hippy,

I think it would be easier to make that kind of time investment and wait and wait for a bush to start showing significant growth if I knew that I would be residing here, in this state, after 4 years, but there is a good degree of uncertainty. The majority of my roses are grafted, which have been no fuss for me, pretty tried and true for my climate, especially when the temperature hits the 120's, but everything I have wanted is not available grafted.
Lynn


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RE: Losing my Patience with Grandma's Hat...Close to Sp'ing It..

Me? Laughing at you, Kippy? Would "I" do that to you? hehehe Nope, I'm not laughing. We've all waited for glacially slow plants to mature. I've shovel pruned my share, believe me. Speaking of which, want a 5 gal Aptos to add to your prickly wall, Kippy? Kim


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RE: Losing my Patience with Grandma's Hat...Close to Sp'ing It..

Kim,

I would LOVE an Aptos, it has been on my wish list. I went to a HS right by...Aptos, (They could never decide if it was Watsonville, La Selva Beach or Aptos, I think it all decided which route you where headed what town they called it)


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RE: Losing my Patience with Grandma's Hat...Close to Sp'ing It..

desertgarden561, maybe the rose is testing you to see if you're worthy of it?!

I know you're impatient, I know I am, I have to control the urge of prying and checking my plants every day :-)

In my experience, gardening is the art of learning patience. I've noticed that plants that I ignore, grow best.

And those that test my patience, surprise me, when I learn to let them be. And then I feel humbled and thankful for being patient.

It is a sort of a spiritual practice for me and learning the art of letting go....

So maybe you need to ignore it too....


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