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Soil Test Back - P & K very high and Ph 8.0
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Posted by
lam13 7 (
My Page) on
Thu, May 3, 12 at 13:43
| I started my raised bed vegetable gardens almost 2 weeks ago with a bulk "garden mix" I purchased from a local organic nursery. It was made up of zoo and horse manure, used hops from a local brewery and screened topsoil. After a few days, everything started to turn yellow & wilt, so I sent off a soil test. Here are the results:
P - 121 lb/acre Very High
K - 1560 lb/acre Excessively High
Mg - 616 lb/acre Neutral
Ca - 4674 lb/acre Neutral
My pH is 8.0
The recommendation is to add N, either by blood meal, fish meal or cottonseed meal. What is the best way to do this? The whole garden is already planted, so do I use a liquid fertilizer or work in a solid around the existing plants? I also need to decrease the pH, but the report did not state how to do that. Is my garden this year going to be salvageable at all? |
Follow-Up Postings:
RE: Soil Test Back - P & K very high and Ph 8.0
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- Posted by RpR_ 3-4 (My Page) on
Thu, May 3, 12 at 14:13
| Use some liquid nitrogen fertilizer for a quick fix and obviously is has zero P. I use Liquid Iron often when I need a quick shot of Nitrogen. |
RE: Soil Test Back - P & K very high and Ph 8.0
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| When the leaves turned yellow, was it yellow with the green veins? If so, that could be iron chlorosis which is common with a high pH. I have alkaline soil and hardwater so it is not uncommon for me to deal with that and we generally use Ironite for that. My understanding is that it is hard to change the pH quickly (and would likely also stress the plants more). I would probably use a liquid to help the plants initially and scratch in one of the meals mentioned. Good luck. |
RE: Soil Test Back - P & K very high and Ph 8.0
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| Although the pH could result in some yellowing, it's not going to result in wilting. One guess is not enough water. Another guess would be too much water. Another guess would be a root disease, which of course compromises root function and the plants can't take up enough water. You could also potentially have a salt issue but I would expect you to see some burning very soon, if not already, if salts are a part of the problem. In any case, I would guess that the nutrient status is probably the least of your problems at this point. |
RE: Soil Test Back - P & K very high and Ph 8.0
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| The pH may be high from the horse manure, if they used lime in the horse barns to decrease odors. It's fairly common to see that and it wreaks havoc for the user. You can add powdered elemental sulfer but it is not terribly fast. You might be able to find soluble fertilizer for acid loving plants (MirAcid from the Miracle Gro people is one product). But as stated above it should be high N and low to no P and K with your test results, and I don't know if they sell that formulation. |
RE: Soil Test Back - P & K very high and Ph 8.0
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| My mode of operation is to mix and incorporate any amendments with my good top soil. This does tend to moderate any weird results. Perhaps some people are trying to avoid weeds by not using the existing soil? |
RE: Soil Test Back - P & K very high and Ph 8.0
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| If the plants began yellowing "after a few days," I would wonder if the composting process was complete. It should have smelled earthy. |
RE: Soil Test Back - P & K very high and Ph 8.0
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| I believe the first few days I overwatered. We have also had unusually high temps since I planted (88-90), so that could have contributed to the wilting as well. They are looking much better today (not wilting) as we have finally gotten a nice soaking rain. The leaves started yellowing at the bottom of the plants with new growth initially staying a darker color. I didn't notice the veins being darker than the leaves. The tomato leaves developed a yellow blotch on some leaves. I think the culprit was unfinished compost. It smelled strong once I got home, but the smell dissipated within a day or two. Should have done the soil test first, but trusted the company I purchased it from. Live and learn. :/ Thanks for the suggestions! This is a great forum and I'm learning a lot (unfortunately the hard way haha). |
RE: Soil Test Back - P & K very high and Ph 8.0
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Animal manures do tend to be alkaline, however by themselves they should not raise a soils pH into the 8.0 range, by themselves. If that "garden mix" smelled of anything other then good rich earth it was not ready for planting and could well have caused numerous nutrient deficiencies. This is one one of the reasons why soils for gardens should be prepared about 6 months before you will be planting.
Depending on how the yellowing, the chlorosis, occured it could be Nitrogen, Magnesium, Zinc, Iron, Sulfur, Copper, Manganese, or Molybdenum although yours does not sound like any of those. |
RE: Soil Test Back - P & K very high and Ph 8.0
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| In case no one has mentioned it in this thread, soluble iron supplement with acid is also a way to temporarily decrease pH. Comes as a liquid concentrate. If the high pH is causing iron deficiency, this can help with both. |
RE: Soil Test Back - P & K very high and Ph 8.0
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| tox, is the iron supplement called Ironite? |
RE: Soil Test Back - P & K very high and Ph 8.0
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| No, Ironite is a granular product and I'm not sure but I don't think it acidifies. The stuff I'm talking about is a concentrated liquid that you dilute. Link below to one such product. I've used it on azaleas and other acid loving plants. |
Here is a link that might be useful: Green Light Liquid Iron and Soil Acidifier
RE: Soil Test Back - P & K very high and Ph 8.0
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| You can also use the cottonseed meal to provide both a source of N as well as being a natural soil acidifier. |
RE: Soil Test Back - P & K very high and Ph 8.0
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| I spoke with the Master Gardner helpline and she suggested sulfur to acidify the soil. I think it will take awhile to see results from that though. She also recommended cottonseed meal. I called the company I purchased the soil from today. They were very apologetic and are checking their sources of manure to see if they have changed anything (i.e. putting lime out in the stalls). He offered to purchase and come to my house to apply blood meal or fish emulsion, which they believe will help for now. Anyone have any objections/opinions to blood meal in this situation? If I'm understanding what I've read, blood meal would be good for both iron and nitrogen deficiency. |
RE: Soil Test Back - P & K very high and Ph 8.0
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- Posted by RpR_ 3-4 (My Page) on
Fri, May 4, 12 at 17:07
| There is also a liquid Ironite. |
RE: Soil Test Back - P & K very high and Ph 8.0
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| That sounds pretty upright of them to offer to come out and do something to fix it. I'm happy we were able to give you some info so you could make an informed phone call. The blood meal or fish emulsion will certainly help with N problems but will not have any effect on pH. It remains to be seen whether that will come down over time or not. If you've planted already, it's not possible to till in sulfer this season, but you could top dress with it along with the N supplement. |
RE: Soil Test Back - P & K very high and Ph 8.0
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| toxcrusadr: That is exactly on point!!!!! You all gave me valuable information to have an informed discussion with this company. I have been impressed with their response as well. I really appreciate the viewpoints & look forward to continuing to learn from these forums as I go. I will keep you posted as to the result! Fingers crossed for a garden that produces at least a little this year! :) |
RE: Soil Test Back - P & K very high and Ph 8.0
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| The guy I purchased the soil from came out yesterday and worked in some alfalfa meal around the plants in my bed. (He originally said blood meal, but this may wok out better in that I believe the smell would have drawn my dogs to dig in the soil.) I read up on the alfalfa meal and it seems the nitrogen/nitrates won't be available to the plants until 1-4 months. Some suggested above a liquid iron supplement that would be immediately available to the plants. My question is would it be safe to use them both? |
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