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| For the 2nd year in a row, my flower garden flopped. I am constantly running around giving this one water and that one water. I do this everyday. I am officially tired. So the plants in the ground have started to dry up. I just can't keep up.
Last year, I tried lasagne garden, but apparently had too much grass and everything was dying so I had to remove some of the grass. It was not a good year. What can I do to the soil to finally enjoy a nice garden. Oh, one more thing, one of my garden is close to a pine tree. Does that make any difference? |
Follow-Up Postings:
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- Posted by GardenerBlog none (My Page) on Tue, Jun 14, 11 at 9:47
| Hi Msirie, There is no different if your garden is close to a pine tree. Plants dry up can have many reasons, such as: You need to check to know the exact cause. Good luck. |
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| There is no different if your garden is close to a pine tree. What if the garden and pine are close enough together for root intrusion from the pine to be a problem? Can the roots of the pine out-compete other plants for water, nutrients and rooting space? What if the O.P. is installing plants that require full sun but are constantly shaded by the pine? Can stress of one type (even if it does not directly affect a plant's ability to take up water) make plants more susceptible to other problems such as disease and pest infestation that could manifest as in drought-like symptoms? I know that I don't have enough information to come to a conclusion but are you sure that you know for certain that the pine can not possibly be a factor? |
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- Posted by gardengal48 PNW zone 8 (My Page) on Tue, Jun 14, 11 at 11:28
| The pine could certainly be a factor. But I agree we do not have enough information to determine exactly what may be wrong in this garden. Plants will need water.......this is just an indisputable fact of plant life :-) And the amount of water can vary widely depending on a whole host of factors - the weather, the type of plant(s), when they were planted, the influence of the pine tree, light conditions, the soil type, any mulch covering, etc. I may be making an assumption here, but "constantly running around giving this one water and that one water" doesn't sound like a very efficient method :-) Have you tried a soaker hose/drip irrigation or even using an overhead sprinkler to thoroughly water the area when you do water? Water must penetrate the soil down through the root zone thoroughly to be sufficiently drawn up and absorbed by the plant roots. A watering can or a light sprinkling with the hose is not gonna cut it! |
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| Back when I did actually do a garden, I planted several rows of corn parallel to a row of very mature pines. The corn nearest the trees maybe hit 3 feet and the further away the rows were, the taller the corn was. It was almost a perfect slope when you looked along the rows. Never did get anything worth eating on any of the plants. I suck at gardening. Lloyd |
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| I agree with what has already been said. Plants are always going to need water and watering by hand is the least efficient way to do it. There needs to be some form of drip irrigation installed and run by a timer. It can be done fairly cheaply and it can be done by the average homeowner in one weekend. Then you can enjoy your garden without running around watering. |
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- Posted by TheMasterGardener1 none (My Page) on Tue, Jun 14, 11 at 23:23
| Yes either a drip irrigation system or a filtered garden hose like I use. Take all the chlorine out of the water and your plants will love it. If you know underwatering is the problem and you think the pine tree is a problem then dig down and see if there is pine tree roots reaching in your garden. |
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| Thank you guys are all your suggestions. I am definately learning, just not fast enough. There is no different if your garden is close to a pine tree. Plants will need water Water must penetrate the soil down through the root Either a drip irrigation system or a filtered garden hose Soil is lack of humus and does not hold water well |
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| Hard to know the cause of your problem as others have noted above. I'll just add that I grow flowers that are adapted to the types of conditions that already exist in the areas where I grow them and most get no supplemental watering after the first week or two after transplanting. Some die but many do not. It's hard to go wrong with some compost and mulch for most flowers. I'm not familiar with the conditions in your area but I also note for whatever it is worth that Bee Balm is almost impossible to kill where I do my growing. |
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| I am in Georgia. And yes, I do have some Bee Balm and even those are struggling. I might replant them somewhere else in the fall. Do you mix the compost and the mulch into the soil? Or do you just spread it on top of the existing soil? |
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| I don't till in my compost, I just top of the soil with compost, then mulch on top of that. "I am constantly running around giving this one water and that one water". Do you have clay soil? (When I see GA, I think "clay"). If so, clay should hold water pretty well for a while, unless it's not really watered well in the first place... Or could you be overwatering now? That will kill off a plant faster than lack of water. Keep in mind too, that some plants will just wilt in very hot weather. If you ignore it, the plant might look fine by evening when temps start falling. My hydrangeas do that all the time but I don't give them water every time they wilt. Karen |
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| Get a soil test. Contact your county extension office and go from there. That's really the best thing to do when you're having problems. Everything else is guesswork. That soil under your pine tree might well be quite dry and acidic and not the best for growing flowers and herbs. Some blueberry bushes might thrive there though, but it would likely need some water if it's dry and the pine tree is drinking up all the rainwater. |
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| The Universtity of Georgia Cooperative extension Service office nearest you will be able to help with a good, reliable soil test for your soils pH and nutrient levels and these simple soil tests can help you learn about your soil so you know what you need to do to make it a good, healthy soil that will grow strong and healthy plants. 1) Soil test for organic matter. From that soil sample put enough of the rest to make a 4 inch level in a clear 1 quart jar, with a tight fitting lid. Fill that jar with water and replace the lid, tightly. Shake the jar vigorously and then let it stand for 24 hours. Your soil will settle out according to soil particle size and weight. For example, a good loam will have about 1-3/4 inch (about 45%) of sand on the bottom. about 1 inch (about 25%) of silt next, about 1 inch (25%) of clay above that, and about 1/4 inch (about 5%) of organic matter on the top. 2) Drainage. Dig a hole 1 foot square and 1 foot deep and fill that with water. After that water drains away refill the hole with more water and time how long it takes that to drain away. Anything less than 2 hours and your soil drains� too quickly and needs more organic matter to slow that drainage down. Anything over 6 hours and the soil drains too slowly and needs lots of organic matter to speed it up. 3) Tilth. Take a handful of your slightly damp soil and squeeze it tightly. When the pressure is released the soil should hold together in that clump, but when poked with a finger that clump should fall apart. 4) Smell. What does your soil smell like? A pleasant, rich earthy odor? Putrid, offensive, repugnant odor? The more organic matter in your soil the more active the soil bacteria will be and the nicer your soil will smell. 5) Life. How many earthworms per shovel full were there? 5 or more indicates a pretty healthy soil. Fewer than 5, according to the Natural Resources Conservation Service, indicates a soil that is not healthy. A soil lacking sufficient amounts of organic matter can make keeping enough water in the soil difficult. The water may not penetrate deep enough in clay soils or may move through sandy soils too fast. A good, healthy soil should not need daily watering, even in Arizona in July. |
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| Do you have clay soil? Yes Get a soil test. ... soil under your pine tree might well be quite dry and acidic and not the best for growing flowers and herbs. Some blueberry bushes might thrive there |
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| Drip irrigation lowers water use. Drip is a very slow form of irrigation which allows water to seep into the soil rather than running off. As a result root systems grow deeper where soil remains damp longer. |
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| For blueberries, I would just mulch well with pine needles and keep them well watered. It's best that they not have a lot of competition for root space; don't plant them too close to the pine tree. You could put some potted plants in between the blueberry bushes. Watering them will drip more water down for the blueberries. Mulch the plants in the pots too and install drip irrigation. In my zone this would be about the worst time to move plants around. But with that said, if the plants are doing horribly where they are, moving might save them. Do some google searching about preventing/curing transplant shock to help with the transition. |
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- Posted by gardengal48 PNW zone 8 (My Page) on Fri, Jun 17, 11 at 9:13
| It is a persistent gardening myth that pine trees make soil acidic - they don't. Most pines (and other conifers) prefer acidic soil so that's where they grow naturally. Soils are acidic or alkaline based on their mineral elements and the amount of rainfall they receive, NOT due to what's growing on them. Besides, the vast majority of plants prefer to grow in acidic soils anyway.......pH is NOT the problem. It is often difficult to garden in close proximity to pines or other large conifers. Large trees produce a lot of roots and these roots out-compete smaller plants for both soil nutrients and available soil moisture. And if the trees have been in place for many years, often the soil immediately surrounding them is relatively depleted in nutrients anyway. There is also often a shade factor to consider as well. The bottom line is your plants are struggling because they are not getting what they need in terms of adequate moisture and nutrients. Deep periodic watering and a good organic mulch should help. Unless they are annuals or planted in containers, daily watering is usually not necessary. Even in my area of recurring summer drought, a weekly watering of any established planting beds is all that is required. Less frequent but deeper watering will encourage plants to develop deeper root systems and therefore be less thirsty. A good mulch layer around the plants will conserve soil moisture and prevent evaporation and if the mulch is something nutrient-rich - like compost - it will continue to provide nutrients to the soil and the growing plants. |
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| Wow, Gardengal, I am impressed with your knowledge of plants. I am still trying to decide what to do. Here is my thought. Yes, the pines have been there for a long time. The shortest one is probably taller than a 3 or 4 story building. There is no shade issue as the lower branches have all disappeared. It would seem like the competition for moisture is great. I think the easiest thing to do would be not to fight the pine. (after all they were there first, plus they're bigger than me and the existing plants) The pines seem to be winning anyway. As time permits, I will slowly move some of my favorites to their new home. Some of these plants, I've only planted this spring so the shock shouldn't be too bad. Please correct me if I am wrong. I'll probably leave the common ones such as the Black eye Susans and some others in place. How's that for a plan? |
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- Posted by gardengal48 PNW zone 8 (My Page) on Fri, Jun 17, 11 at 11:30
| Since I have no idea what you are growing, I can't tell you what to move or what to leave in place. Some plants are quite tolerant of root competition/drier soils, others much less so. If you do move plants, make sure the new planting area is well-prepared before you move them. It makes everything a lot easier :-) If the plants are living and growing but just not thriving the way you think they should, you have some time to work with. Transplanting in midsummer is not ideal but it can be done......later in the season would be better. Research the plants you have and see what conditions they need. To reduce watering issues, group those that require frequent watering together and those that need less separately. And do mulch.....it will help a lot. I am impressed with your knowledge of plants Thanks, but it is nothing out of the ordinary......I've been gardening for a very long time and as a horticulturist, it IS what I do for a living. Me knowing about plants is like a doctor knowing about anatomy - it is a professional requirement :-) |
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| You might try raised beds. That helps alot of soil and drainage issues. :) |
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- Posted by joepyeweed 5b IL (My Page) on Mon, Jun 20, 11 at 11:16
| The easiest thing to do would be to select plants that are known to grow well in Georgia Clay under pine trees, then you don't have to do as much work. Selecting a plant that grows well in the conditions that you have is much easier than trying to amend soil to create a condition for a particular type of plant. |
Here is a link that might be useful: Native plants in the Georgia Peidmont
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