However, I can elaborate a little more now that I know what you want to do. In Zone 8, you shouldn't need to do that much work underneath; for example you probably don't need compacted crushed gravel but rather just sand. You'd have to dig out your area, compact the dirt quite well, fill with sand until slightly higher than current concrete, then place pavers and compact. It will be difficult to ensure that your new pavers stay level with those on concrete over time; even a professional may not get it right. Good compacting and support of the edge are probably key. Good luck!

Depending on how much slope you have (lay a two-by-four off the edge of the patio and see how high it is by the time you get where you want the new patio edge to be), you could build a little footing wall of masonry brick around your proposed perimeter, fill inside it with sand, and lay your flagstone extending to on top of the masonry. The masonry may still need to be stabilized, especially if the ground falls off sharply, but if your edge pieces of flagstone are big, their weight will help.

You can give the impression of a more rounded patio, rather than actually making it rounded, by putting a circle of flowerbeds, edged with quite prominent boulders or a rockwall, around it. If you really don't like the concrete you can alter the surface of the patio only in this scenario; that won't be hard to do as it is getting the transition right between the concrete and dirt surface that is the challenge.

You can make your round patio, as I described in the last post, and edge the whole thing with a fairly heavy duty row of boulders or a rock wall of some sort.

I'd encourage you to go to a local landscape supply/quarry type place and talk to the people there about the job; take pictures with you if you can. Look at the materials they sell, and ask what kind of options they would suggest. Or look at landscape how-to books; there are zillions.

Posting pictures here might also help someone point you in the right direction.

I hated my patio, too. It took up too much space in my back yard. I have a shallow yard shaped like a lazy L. Imagine fully half the long part of the L in cement. And then imagine a lame two foot walk on the short side of the L right up against the house.

Initially, I thought I'd have to tear up the walk, and at lease cut a curve into the 90 degree angle of the patio. But, I am sort of lazy, and cheap, so I kept thinking until I came up with another solution.

I built 3 foot high planter boxes, that are two feet deep and placed them beginning the last 1/3 of the long side of the L and on top of the the entire two foot walk. I then added a curving garden bed that begins 1/3 into the long side of the L and then curves around the 90 degree angle, to the short side of the L.

The boxes get a lot of shade. In the boxes I planted white and green hosta, white azaleas, white impatients, and a green and white trailing vine, its a vinca -- I think -- to run down the boxes. The curving garden bed is rather large and bold. In it I planted an Althea standard, a Snowball Viburnum, lots of bulbs and day lillies, a Dogwood, and a Japanese Maple (with new shrubs and perennials to be added at a later date).

These simple changes completely changed the look of my yard and actually have turned my too large and too square cement patio into an asset. Stand in your yard, stare at your patio, and think outside the box, so to speak. You may find a solution that requires less work and expense than you originally thought.

I bought the wood for the planter boxes from the culled wood section at Orange Box home improvement store. I got 4 foot lenghts of 2 x 6 pressure treated pine for $2 each.

I hate the shortness of the slate-formed curve from my door to the path to the driveway--wanted to increase the size--yet couldn't due to the slope in the grass.

Have been looking all over for an answer and thought I'd at last try the "Gardening with Stone" forum which I thought had to do with rock gardening!

Anyway am going to try the masonry brick as foundation for the slate.

Again, gratzie

Rosie in Sugar Hill

My goal is to have my tiny little back garden mostly paved with a few in ground plants and the rest in raised pots. The idea is that the in ground plants will be more or less maintenance free (azaleas, heavily mulched, that sort of thing) and then not have to bend over in my (upcoming) old age. I have lots of plans for a rainwater barrel, gravity fed irrigation, a small falling water feature for the sound outside our bedroom, and many, many more or less tropical plants I'll have to move to the garage & artificial light to keep alive in the winter. (We don't get a lot, but we get several freezes and every year or so it can be a fairly hard freeze for 24 hours.)

My point, I'm so glad I had neither funds nor energy when we first moved here a year ago. My "design" has had to grow and mature to deal with the problems: very poor, heavily compacted soil -- underground wiring and pipes so spaced that I can only dig across the back fence out about 2 feet and nowhere else -- utility rules allow nothing permanent to be built over the lines (no concrete slab); location of the AC condenser; stark white plastic fence that cannot be changed. But limits can also be challenges and even open doors in our imaginations.

It'll be cooler weather in the fall before this gets done, but I'll post pictures.

David