OK, thanks.

I'm off to get new plugs.

The engine does run fine after it gets started and blows out the excess fuel. And it seems to start if you try a restart while its still warm.

Plugs. Is the NGK BMR4A the correct plug? Is there a 'newer tech' better choice?

I originally changed these plugs because one plug contact had become loose inside the plug wire socket, and the screw-on connector had worn off partially.

I have a set of new spark plug wire sockets, but I never installed them because everything was running fine.

Do these sockets simply screw on the coil wire ends?

I think I'll get new spark plugs and instal the wire sockets now.

Thanks.

New spark plugs, new spark plug wire ends, and a dose of fuel tank fuel injector cleaner.

Same old problem.

I'm going to run more of the tank of gas through the engine by starting it with my air hose procedure.

Then I'm going to check each coil and see if they are up to specs, then If this isn't it I'm going to tear out the injectors and clean and inspect, as soon as I find out where they are on the engine.

Thanks.

I doubt if this is your problem, but good to know anyway. There are two different plugs for the 445. I discovered that when I bought a set and they were different than the ones that were in there. John Deere parts man finally found it somewhere, but it wasn't in the normal lookup. Mine is a 94 model so it might have been an early thing.

Changed plugs, changed plug wire ends, tore apart air cleaner, carb/fuel manifold thing, soaked in carb cleaner, cleaned everything and replaced everything, --- it started once, then a week later didn't start.

So, I'm stuck. Is there an ignitor module? It seems there is one on the 425???

I don't have the manuals, and it seems like the thing is flooding out, but I'm not sure.

Is there an after market denso fuel injector part number that I could try?

Does anyone have an after market source for the tubes on the fuel manifold / carb thing?

Thanks.

Changed plugs, changed plug wire ends, tore apart air cleaner, carb/fuel manifold thing, soaked in carb cleaner, cleaned everything and replaced everything, --- it started once, then a week later didn't start.

So, I'm stuck. Is there an ignitor module? It seems there is one on the 425???

I don't have the manuals, and it seems like the thing is flooding out, but I'm not sure.

Is there an after market denso fuel injector part number that I could try?

Does anyone have an after market source for the tubes on the fuel manifold / carb thing?

Thanks.

Here's a thought and maybe engine_tech can comment. I had a coolant temp sensor go bad on my truck and it was always reading -10F so the engine computer was commanding a max rich fuel mixture all the time. I don't know if the 445 EFI operates the same way but it does have a coolant temp sensor so it might be something to check out.

I've got a 445JD and like it a lot. I do know that on a vehicle the coolant sensor will cause an extremely rich condition and vehicles have O2 sensors to help the computor know that. Does the yellow light in the dash that goes out after the fuel pumps shuts off work correctly? Something about short and long blinks of the light mean the computor sensed something wrong.

The only really important sensor on a 445 is the air pressure (vacuum) sensor. It's the box mounted under the air cleaner base with the small tube going to it. It's basically a throttle position sensor, and tells the EFI how much fuel is needed. Make sure the hose is not cracked somewhere.

The air temp and water temp sensors just tweak the mixture very slightly. If any sensor is bad, the light on the dash will flash a code.

I think your fuel pressure may be high, causing a rich condition. There is a fuel pressure regulator that can give trouble sometimes. I doubt your problem is electronic.

You really need to get the JD manual to test this tractor properly, as "thowing parts" at it will can be very expensive. It needs to be properly diagnosed.

OK, I decided to unplug the air pressure sensor and try it, and it started right up. However, I couldn't seem to advance the throttle without stalling out. Is this 'normal' for having the sensor unplugged or out?

And however two, I didn't try to start the thing first before unplugging the sensor. So it could be a coinkydink.

And there are no codes being flashed, aside from when the air pressure sensor is unplugged.

Thanks.

engine tech, will the MIL flash a trouble code IF the fuel pressure regulator sticks in the CLOSED position?? If not....the pressure regulator may be sticking closed (high fuel pressure) and flooding the engine on a cold start attempt, but then shaking loose (from engine vibration) to operate normally (until the next time it sits for a while). Another possibility is that if the induction system uses a single injector (throttle body fashion) instead of an injector for each cylinder (port injection), the injector may be leaking gasoline into the induction manifold while the engine is off (during storage) and that LEAKED FUEL is what is slugging the spark plugs and wetting them. If this is the case, it's not just that the plugs are wet that it will not fire up........it's because with that much "leaked fuel" present, the mixture is far too rich to combust (it would be all fuel and no air). If this tractor has the fuel tank higher than the engine, a leaking injector can continue to drip fuel even when the fuel pump is not running. These pumps are not made to prevent fuel from flowing in the normal direction by gravity or by siphon action. Even if the tank is lower than the engine, there is probably enough fuel in the fuel hose(s) to flood the engine if the injector fails to seal off completely.

Any one know if this problem was solved. I have the identical problem with my JD445. New plugs solved it for a week then it returned. No if I blow out the plugs it will start.

Only stone75 knows the outcome and he is not talking! (mad at us maybe?) :^)

Mownie's last post is likely the problem. SOunds like a leak down problem to me. Maybe try this. Pull the plugs before doing anything else. On a dead cold engine spin the engine over a couple rounds and see if it blows a lot of gas out the plug holes. (Keep the spark plugs away) If it does then you know it's a leak down problem. Also dry out the combustion chamber with an air hose. Put the plugs in and try to start it. I bet it would start. No way it would flood that fast and yet run good otherwise when started.

I have EFI on dixie chopper 28 horse only thing I can think be problem old gas. Old gas wet plug but want Ignite. If clean out cylinder after trying crank compression build some heat in combusting chambler and crank on next try if cleanout had carb. cleaner in prosses it crank run because added cleaner freshen gas so start run one cycle. There dead gas and there dead hell gas.

Thanks for the input. I will try first start with plugs out to see if excess fuel is present. I have discovered that once the tractor starts, it sounds ok but with the loader on it, if I put the loader into some dirt and try to lift the arm, the machine abruptly stops. It will restart ok but as soon as a load is put on the hydraulics, it stalls again.
Prevoiusly, I removed the fuel tank, drain it and replaced the fuel so I don't think bad fuel is the issue.
The injector, there is one, is an expensive part so I am hesitant to just replace it unless I am fairly sure that is the issue.

I would try timing light on each plug wire you may have dead cylinder by that mean one plug not firing wire or coil. Thatload with bucket would kill engine if only one firing. Skip in 2 cylinder hard ear to pickup by sound. Before cranking take plug wires off plugs wires back on loose so remove one at time if engine goes dead thats good one. Induction timing light best tool to check firing system.

Excuse the run on sentences in the interest of trying to be brief, some of this will only make sense to someone with experience troubleshooting EFI, this information is based on experience & goes beyond the factory manual. The correct fuel pressure is critical at all times, during the start cycle, running light & heavy load, and when key to OFF; causes of hard starting or stalling under load can be found by using this valuable tool. Only a fuel pressure gauge will allow this to be monitored; to check move key to RUN & pump will cycle briefly, should get close to 25 psi, key to START & pressure should not change too much but could fluctuate slightly, once running pressure should be stable around 25 psi & rise 1-2 psi at high idle vs. low idle, snap throttle to low idle & pressure should briefly drop to just below 25 psi but quickly recover to 25, shut key OFF & pressure will drop a few psi but some residual pressure should hold for several minutes. If pressure is low or falls to zero when key OFF check fuel pressure regulator for presence of fuel where vacuum hose attaches (hose should be dry or fuel pressure diaphragm may be torn, can be checked with a vacuum pump), fuel in this small vacuum hose can bleed off the residual pressure quickly and provide a path for fuel to puddle in the intake manifold which will immediately be dumped into the cylinders on the next start; if vacuum hose is ok then check fuel hose in fuel tank between pump outlet & tank fitting for even a small tear or pinhole which can commonly appears with age, checking this requires fender deck removal so might as well change it while you are there. You can get lucky & guess w/ EFI but the same symptoms can be caused by different failed parts which can quickly turn into an expensive situation. Measure any fittings for fuel or vacuum hoses & buy the correct hose at any automotive parts store; I would change both fuel pressure & air pressure (aka vacuum sensor) hoses.

Thank you socal. Glad to hear about the potential for fuel to migrate via vacuum hose from fuel pressure regulator. Prior to your disclosure, I thought only a leaky injector could be responsible. Good tip.

I have 28hp EFI that don't have that vacuum hose on fuel pressure regulator so all don't have it. my pressure regulator easy to see out open inlet outlet and hose goes back to tank return line from regulator to tank. Thanks socal

Thanks socal. The fuel pressure reg is the cheapest at 140, followed by the injector and pressure sensor at 330 and 350, so I like the idea of relacing a hose. Will take me a few days to get to that. The fender and seat are already off. It does seem to start and run ok if it has been running recently. Though yesterday it started quite rough and for a few moments an error code was flashing on the instrument panel. two long flashes, two short flashes. Haven't checked with dealer yet on what that may mean. I appreciate all the advice here and I will post the solution when I find it.

I have not heard any conclusions to this thread, but I had the same problem and was finally able to identify the culprit. I pulled the valve cover off and found that the valves were not moving - broken camshaft gear. I subsequently found that JD used a composite gear on these tractors in the mid-late 90s, and have gone back to steel. Parts are under $250, which includes all gaskets and other parts recommended for replacement while that far into the engine. The new all-steel camshaft is $150 by itself. Apparently this is such a common problem that all of these parts were IN STOCK! There is no recall on this item, and since my tractor has just over 1000 hrs, no price breaks. Good luck to all who might still be out there.

I had the same problem. John Deere gives the gap at .030. Change it to .025 and it should start fine. I found a plug gapping guide for the Kawasaki engines and saw the 22 hp EFI were gapped at .025. This was a free fix, if you don't price in the hours of aggravation. One last thing. Should you go to John Deere and purchase new plugs, they are gapped at .030. Don't believe they are gapped correctly, no matter what the parts man says. Also make sure they give you the correct plug. I rebuild my engine last year, put in the plugs they said I needed and hand turned the engine over before I started it. Good thing, the plugs were too long. I promptly removed them and returned them and gave the parts man a few angry words about their mistake.

I too had a broken timing gear replaced it with the all steele now I have no fire at either plug I have battery voltage at both coils can someone help

***"I have battery voltage at both coils"***
This engine has a magneto ignition system. There should not be 12 volts connected to the coils.
The white wire on each coil is the "kill wire" to ground the coil when you want to stop it from making spark, thus killing the engine.
If you really do have 12 volts at each coil, something has been rewired incorrectly, and the coils may have been damaged.

Well, I thought this problem had solved itself. The thing started well most of last year and until this week. I thought it had a stuck ring or valve, or a little bit of varnish from the modern gasoline.

Anyway, I installed two champion CJ8 s, gapped to .025. And it started
right off. Changing from NGK BMR4As

Lot's of good comments on this thread. It's a little over my head. I'm assuming that if the composite camshaft gear breaks, it's definitely not going to run, correct? And further regarding this thing, is this gear failure always a fairly benign thing? That is nothing else gets bent or damaged when this thing goes? I had the case cover off to repair the inner gasket to prevent water from leaking into the crankcase, actually I don't think it ever went into the crankcase, but it eventually would not hold water even to mow the yard once. I then, wasn't aware of this issue with the composite gear and I'm not totally sure if it has the composite or not. I seem to remember looking at a brown fiber gear-looking thing. But I'm not sure.

Thanks for all the comments, and I think it's just the spark plugs causing this problem. Although I'm not sure why long cranking worked to get it to start. Anyway...Cheers!

Stone75 Have you ever replaced the "time delay" module? This is a common problem for what you are describing. Its about $20 bucks from your dealer. This module keeps your engine running for a split second longer after you turn off the tractor. Burns up leftover fuel in carb. It also causes hours of troubleshooting intermittant spark issues...

There is no carburetor on the engine owned by the OP.
Read the second sentence in the very first thread posted on May 23, 2008.
***"This is a John Deere 445 with fuel injection."***

The Deere exploded view shows it still has a time delay module.

My JD445 seems to have a similar problem, but, I have not [yet] experienced a starting problem or wet plugs. My JD445 starts right up every time. Sometimes with a single backfire and stall then it starts right up again. However, it is running progressively more rough these last few weeks of 0 to 15f degree snow throwing days. Yesterday, at 1/3 to 1/2 throttle it starts running so rough with a coouple puffs of black exhaust and with little power I had to shut it off for fear of causing [more] damage.
my first suspicion is water/ice in gas [92 octaine, advertized to be free of ethanol] to which I routinely add Sta-Bil Marine stabilizer. Gas was purchased less than 2 months ago and stored in typical 5 Gal plastic, gas container.

No codes, fuel pump seems to run normally as it always has.

Does draining and refilling the fuel seem like I'm on the right track?

I hesitate to add alcohol or 'Dry Gas' because I don't know if this will harm the engine.

What is the easiest/best way to get the gas out of this JD445 at -9F in my garage?

Since it does seem to idle for now, can I just run it until empty?

I too would not add dry gas or any other alcohol. Water will be at the bottom of your fuel can , so drain it out and verify that is the problem. Unless for some reason you feel water got in the tractor tank originally. As these have the pump in the tank, remove the cap and cycle the key. If you here a gurgle along with the buzz of the pump, pull the sender and look for a break in the connecting hose to the pump.
I have to say that the description sounds like a miss fire / unspent fuel condition with the rough running and black smoke- but it's hard to say w/o being there.

I had problems with wet plugs after my 445 sat for more than 2 days. I figured it was the injector leaking. I cut the red wire coming out of the fuel pump and spliced in a toggle switch. This allows me to shut off the pump before the ignition. This way there is no pressure in the fuel line during storage. I put the switch on the back wall of the fender plastic box. If I will not be using the machine for a few days I kill the motor using the switch. Dave

By trial and error, rather than any sort of diagnostic test by several John Deere Techs, a new Left side [as I sit on the seat looking forward] head appears to have solved my problem of rough running, wet plug, black smoke, power loss. Only the Left plug/cylinder was ever a problem. Right plug always looked just as it should. I do not let it idle any longer than necessary to back it into the garage; otherwise, running at near full speed for everything. The old head did not appear damaged or cracked in any way. A new head gasket on the original head was tried but did not help. I suspect, more than anything else, this engine does not like to idle. Due to the number of occurrences I've read about other people having similar problems, I suspect the engine design or quality control is marginal, working on some machines, failing on others. I thought I could not go wrong with a John Deere, but, my experience on this 445 has shown me I was wrong, broken hearted.