If this beast has been submerged (I read the original) you DO NOT want to begin by turning the engine over by hand (long bar) or with starter. If you attempt either way you run the risk of bending a piston rod (connecting rod), crankshaft journal, or both. You need to begin by removing the spray nozzles (injectors) first so that any water remaining in any cylinders can be expelled from the cylinder when you rotate the engine. Even after the nozzles have been removed there is no guarantee that you will be able to get the engine to turn, the pistons may be rusted and/or galvanically corroded to the cylinder walls (aluminum alloy pistons in a cast iron cylinder in the presence of water for a long time...no, no, no,). If the engine refuses to turn after removing the spray nozzles DO NOT try to force the engine to rotate or you will bend rods and/or crankshaft. You can try filling the cylinders will your favorite "rust bust" agent via the nozzle hole and let it sit for a week or so (some folks say fill them with diesel fuel or kerosene). You should not expect any miracles here. If the machine had been rescued and restoration/salvage commenced as soon as possible after it went swimming, the better would have been the chances for recovery. It gets darker still......if the machine was running at high RPM when it submerged.....it may have suffered bent rods/bent crankshaft and/or shattered pistons from the hydrostatic lock-up that occurred when the cylinders inhaled liquid water. I fear that anything short of a complete tear down and overhaul will be inadequate. If tear down is done, each connecting rod and the crankshaft need to be checked for alignment (straight & true). The engine block and cylinder head should be checked for cracks and warping (thermal shock of heated portions of engine being dunked in cold water suddenly). Good luck.

...told ya i didnt know anything about deisel engines....wat are spray nozzles(injectors)?

So what were you doing that it went swimming? Inquiring minds need to know.

i wasnt doing anything.....its my friends tractor but mine for free if i make it work. they were plowing snow on 7 inches of ice when they stopped to get tire chains. 5 minutes later they came back to see the back end going under. it was at idle. kinda reminds me of the titanic...it shouldnt have sunk on 7-8 inches of ice

Spray nozzles are the devices that inject the diesel fuel into the combustion chamber at the right time under extremely high pressure (anywhere from 1,800 PSI to nearly 33,000 PSI on some of today's diesels) so the engine will run. These spray nozzles (or injectors on some engines ) are what make the diesel engine principal work (in conjunction with about 500 PSI compression pressures) I can appreciate your not knowing anything about diesels, as you willingly admit. Trust me on this: It is going to take a lot of expert attention to ever hope of recovering this engine to running condition, and mucho denero. The fuel pump and the spray nozzles might be ruined as well as other parts of the engine that can't be salvaged simply by hitting them with a piece of fine sandpaper and some spray paint. The camshaft is likely rusted beyond salvage. The cylinder head and valve train also likely unusable. And you ask what a nozzle or injector is. You will need to enlist a helper to work with you that knows something about this engine in particular or at least older diesel engines in general. That's just the facts you have to accept. This ain't the flight of the Phoenix or something where they bring the dead back to life. And a tractor that has been completely submerged in a pond and allowed to lie there for a long time before pulling it out, and then not having an immediate professional going over, well, that's just not the same as acquiring an old tractor after it sat in a barn for 10 years.

mownie-ill be truthfull with you, i know this about 99% a lost cause, but...i need a cut and this may be my chance to a good one of i get really darn lucky. i know im asking for a miracle but ill try anything once. i have a failry high understanding of gasoline engines and can either by trial and error or knowledge fix almost anything gas, so im hoping even tho almost entirely different i can use some of this knowledge for this diesel. my mom was definetly right about 7 years ago when she called me a stuborn kid, now im a stuborn teen :) (a.k.a-the joy of parents everywhere)

"Nothing ventured, nothing gained".

Some of the guys are "Pessimistic", some are "Realistic", some are "Optimistic". But none, know the answer for sure! If you don't give it a shot, you won't either.

Yep, yer correct, stubborn teen. But, go for it, ya have nothing to lose except a lot of time and money! (well, probably not much money)

I'd e-bay this puppy, with the message 'recent thorough cleaning'.

tmajor is right about "none know the answer for sure". I'll add this to my little tirade. At your age, it is quite OK to be "ignorant" (and I mean this as "not yet aware or informed") of details. Not a problem, we have all been where you are right now. I worked with an experienced mechanic in my late teen years who was fond of saying "We don't care if you come here ignorant, ignorance is curable by administering a good dose of education, it works every time. Stupidity, on the other hand is most always terminal." I still grin when I play his words back in my head. I'm not as pessimistic about "whether this machine is salvable" as it might seem in reading my previous posts. What I'm trying to emphasize is: This will be a MAJOR undertaking (no pun intended). A project of this magnitude could easily require years of painstaking work (and some money). A big project like this must be divided up into different phases and also EACH member of the power train (engine-transmission-differential) and the other systems (electrical-fuel-hydraulic) will all need to be gone through systematically in order to determine IF they can be returned to operable condition before you put a bunch of money into any of them. Before you start taking parts off this machine you need to equip yourself with a shop manual or service manual and read the heck out of it to learn the components and their relationship to each other. And as I always stress about tear-downs of unfamiliar stuff, USE A DIGITAL CAMERA AND TAKE PLENTY OF PHOTOS. These photos should be taken from different viewpoints before and after each component is removed. You can build a photo file that is more helpful than some photos (or line drawings) in service manuals. Tag the individual items or sub-assemblies as to which position (like "left front" or "cylinder # 1 nozzle", or "front of head" and so forth) it came from where there are multiples of the same part (such as injectors, for example) Use see through "zip-lock" plastic bags to keep parts in (you can write on the bag with permanent markers and they will hold the nuts-bolts-pieces associated with those parts together). The spray nozzles you asked about: They will be the parts that are attached to the cylinder head with 2 (usually) bolts or nuts. They will each have a steel fuel line that runs back to the injection pump. They will also have a rubber or plastic (sometimes metal) "excess fuel return line or manifold" attached to them. You should remove the intake and exhaust manifolds before you begin the process of inspection. When you start removing the spray nozzles, remove the steel "Fuel injection line" from the nozzle first. DO NOT be tempted to "bend the line" out of your way to make clearance for extracting the nozzle assembly, follow the line back toward the injection pump and loosen or remove any holding fixtures or hardware, and loosen the line nut where the line attaches to the pump. The line needs to be loose enough for you to move it out of your way without bending it. Remove the excess fuel return lines from the nozzles. Remove any other objects or components (brackets, hangers, etc.) that may keep the nozzle from coming straight out of it's bore. Remove the nuts or bolts that hold the nozzles in place. Using a suitable prying tool under each mounting flange (area around where the mounting fasteners were removed) gently and evenly, pry the nozzle out of it's bore. There should be a copper sealing washer on the nozzle where the barrel rests on the cylinder head, be sure to retrieve and save this washer. Be extremely careful not to drop or otherwise damage the nozzle end that was inside the engine. The nozzle assembly could easily represent a couple hundred dollars or more (if it COULD be replaced. Pack the nozzles in individual bags and wrap with newspaper or other "cushiony" material and store the nozzles in a sturdy box where they will be safe. Once the nozzles are out of the engine, try blowing compressed air into the hole where you took out the nozzles (to see it any water is still there, a long thin tubed air blower works best). After you determine there is no water in the cylinders, pour the cylinders full of "rust bust" (or diesel fuel or kerosene mixed with a bit of auto trans fluid as preferred by some folks). You may observe some the fluid run out of an intake or exhaust port, this only means that the intake or exhaust valve is open on that cylinder. Let the liquid rust bust sit for a few days. You should drain the engine oil pan and replace the engine oil filter (at least take the oil filter off and empty it at this time). Fill the new filter (or the old one) with fresh oil. Fill the oil pan (crankcase) with fresh oil. This oil and filter will be discarded later in this restoration process but for now you want to make sure the oil pump has clean oil to deliver IF THE ENGINE WILL TURN. You should remove the valve cover and squirt or brush clean motor oil over the entire valve train, valve springs and push rods (or the cam gear, camshaft etc. if this be OVERHEAD CAM, but I doubt that it is). Leave the valve cover off so you and a helper can watch for any valves that might be stuck if/when you get the engine to rotate. You should also drain the hydraulic oil and transmission/differential oil to get rid of any standing water. Realistically speaking, you could drain the water out of each system by loosening the drain plug and letting just the water drain (the water will be on the bottom with the oil floating above it) out into a catch pan. When oil/fluid begins to come out, re-tighten the drain plug and add enough of the correct oil/fluid to the cavity/reservoir to bring the level up to correct. It is possible that ALL of the fluid escaped from it's respective system during the time the tractor remained submerged in the pond. If you ever reach the point of placing this machine back into service you will at that time replace all fluids in all systems. After the rust bust has sat for a few days, use a long breaker bar and socket to try turning the engine. OR ALTERNATIVELY, if this tractor has a gear box transmission and clutch, you can jack up ONE REAR WHEEL ONLY (make sure the front axle is not engaged if this is 4X4), and place the transmission into the highest SPEED gear position possible (this would be like 3rd or 4th and high range). Stand beside the rear wheel that is off the ground and place both hands on it. Now, rotate the wheel in one direction til there is no slack. Now SLAM the wheel in the opposite direction. Watch the engine fan or pulleys for rotation (to see if engine moves). If engine moves, make sure that the direction of rotation is what is normal for this engine (usually it is clockwise as seen from standing in front of engine while looking at the engine). Once you are sure of the correct direction of rotation, roll the engine a few revolutions (if it turns at all). Watch for any valves that don't move up and down as the engine turns. Expect to see the rust bust fluid run out the exhaust ports. If you get this engine to the point of turning freely (remember, you WILL NOT be able to detect compression at this time as the spray nozzles are removed), you will at that time be ready to advance to evaluating and cleaning the fuel system. Do all the above and report back at a later date with a fresh thread. Good luck yetty.

I would think, as you get into this project, it will "take a course". Either everything you touch will be junk or it will be pretty good.

tmajor

I once had a boss that always wanted things down in half the time it would normally take. I had learned early to double my estimates for installing computer systems. When he called me a pessimist, I said "A pessimist is merely an experienced optimist."

yetty

Don't do anything halfway. Always be proud to show anyone anything you have done. Don't be tempted to cut corners because no one will ever see it. Good luck and keep us posted.

Ted

IMO depends on how long it's been under water? Engine will die when it suck in the water and blocked off the air supply and will slowing fill vented cavities. fuel system is closed Probably be the only thing water hasn't filled up. naturally it will take a complete disassemble and clean up. Diesels are alot harder IMO. Not the clean up but the fuel system recovery. Plus, most of use don't have a clue about diesels other than add fuel, change oil and filters. I would want to have some expierence with diesels to take on a project like that, not to mention all the other areas. I would completely disassemble before I would buy a part to build it back up.

I know this doesn't mean anything in the scheme of this post, but my grandfather had an old International Harvester pickup that accidently ran down the hill and ended up in a pond. He pulled it out the next day with the ol' Super C tractor and drained the water out, changed the fluids, and ended up driving the ol' pickup for 8 more years. The only thing that really got harmed was the radion never worked after that, but everything else was fine.

I'd go for it and try to recover the tractor. I'll bet it can be done OK!