I have 1/3 an acre but live across the from a pretty new neighborhood park with poor looking trees. They look like they were ran over before they were planted. I also have two great danes that are good at chewing on anything that they can find.

I anticipate that the seedlings that are on their way are between 12"-18". I feel like I ought to grow them a bit more before planting them so that they might be stronger for when they get attacked by my dogs. I have done a bunch of reading about air rooting and think I may buy some of the small rootmaker pots for the acorns that are coming and some of the roottrapper 5 gallon bags for the seedlings. I had thought about planting them in a protected gardening area till the trees grow a bit larger than moving them to the final location but figured that with the root maker bags it would help to develop good lateral roots that could help in the long run.

I am interested in playing with these trees for a few reasons. I am interested in Bonsai and would like to do that with a few of these trees and would also like to donate a few trees to the city park across the street. I don't imagine the city would be opposed to that. In that scenario the bigger and stronger the trees before planting at the park would be the best due to careless kids and what not.

I am thinking that these trees would be in the 5 gallon cloth bags for at least a year if not longer. From what I have read that would not be an issue for the roots but wonder about over wintering them. Will having the bags above ground in the winter damage the roots or are they hardy enough for our generally mild winters?

Tell me if my hopes are unreasonable or rational. Thanks for reading.

(couldn't figure how to add two links. Here is the address for the UofI Forest Seedlings site: http://seedlings.uidaho.com/Store/DrawProducts.aspx?Action=GetDetails& ProductID=57&ParentID=&PageID=46&CategoryID=1

You'll need one gallon pots and "Aquashield paint" from Sears in a color other than black & you'll paint the inside of the pots. Aquashield paint completely-stops roots from circling. So instead of buying larger bags or pots from rootmaker, you can simply go this route as a friend of mine in the business already does. #8482 Aquashield paint is what I have bookmarked for Sears.com but the link no-longer works. It's marine paint for boats, that's what the stuff is.

Good luck in your adventure.

Dax

I use short wire border fencing that I buy by the roll and cut to fit newly planted things. At one point I had 200+ plants with these little cages around them as you can see in the background of these two pics.

All you need is a visual deterrent that triggers the dogs to go around rather than over and these have worked extremely well for me. Over the years I have tried every method there is with puppies, adults, and fosters.

It is wise to observe the dogs and see where their natural paths are- it's best to avoid trying to change their patterns if you can help it. I keep the entire perimeter along the fence clear as well- all ornamentals are planted at least two feet away. The dogs will run the perimeter whether you plan for it or not, so you may as well work with them on that.

If your dogs are unattended for long periods of time out there, easily bored, and prone to digging or eating plants I would use the short metal fence stakes and chicken wire- I have done that on a few choice plants and it takes maybe ten minutes to set up and protects even the most delicate plant from our big-footed friends.

You can do it- you can have a nice garden with dogs but you have to anticipate what your problems are going to be and figure a work-a-round before the dogs find a way to thwart you. If they get there first and establish bad habits it is a hundred times more difficult.

gardener
Any idea why I would need to paint the inside of the pots? Everything I have read says that its the design of the pot that will encourage the roots to not circle but rather branch out.

I am interested in the ability to grow more and finer roots with the rootmaker pots/bags.

1 == make pot determination

2 == determine what potting MEDIA goes in the pots .. its very important

3 == where to put the pots.. because trees dont appreciate black pots in direct sun

4 == how to water them ... trees do not like soggy roots .. and this is tied in with the media .. the pots are kept very dry.. compared to other plants ...

5 == what to do with them in late fall.. for winter storage ..

master those variables.. and you are all set ...

the dogs are the least of your problems..

ken

i do NOT claim to be an expert ...

25 feet sounds good.. for the next 15 years ... lol ... but not enough for the next century of potential life ...

how old are you .. and will you care about it all in say .. 25 to 50 years????

with 85 feet.. more space the better.. if you want independent free standing specimens ...

ken

I was a little worried about what my neighbors would think about my big tree plans but they all seem to be very happy about them. Its a pretty new development and most of them don't have much in the way or trees.

Dax

avoiding the cost of pots.. media.. water.. and winter worries ...

EXPERIMENT MAN ...

ken

"You'll need one gallon pots and "Aquashield paint" from Sears in a color other than black & you'll paint the inside of the pots. Aquashield paint completely-stops roots from circling. So instead of buying larger bags or pots from rootmaker, you can simply go this route as a friend of mine in the business already does. #8482 Aquashield paint is what I have bookmarked for Sears.com but the link no-longer works. It's marine paint for boats, that's what the stuff is."

Okay, this has been bugging me since I read your post. Why other than black? Does the black not work?

Just curious.

Richard.

It is still raining today and will continue into Saturday. I want to have something figured out by Sunday or Monday though. I did go to a few nurserys today though looking for net baskets without any luck. I may have to check out a grow shop to find them locally. It would be fun if I still drove a marked cruiser.

WHO HAS BEEN FEEDING IT???

crimminey ... in mother earth.. in any decent soil ... trees do NOT need anything.. NOTHING ...

that said.. a LITTLE OF This or that should not hurt ... but do keep in mind.. they are not children.. who need to be fed.. bathed.. clothed.. educated ...

now.. pots .. with media.. designed for heavy drainage.. which trees prefer ... MIGHT need some water sol fert ... depending on how long they will be potted ...

but since trees prefer to be on the dry side ... you really should not need to water so often that you run all the nutrients out the bottom .. especially young small trees ..

and if you dont run the water out the bottom.. like you might water a perennial or annual ... then the pot should NOT need.. all that much ...

again.. a little of this or that is OK .. but dont start think along the kid line.. and think you need to hyper-fertilize a tree ...

and i would NOT use a potting media .. that already has fert contained in the bag ... its just another thing you need to MANAGE .... and part of managing it all.. means NOT to go into it with some preconceived notion that they are children ...

good luck

ken

Black paint can't been seen when painted inside of a black pot so pick another color. And when it's time to re-paint (I think the paint lasts 5+ years before the pots need re-painting)

Sanc,

My friend is an expert propagator who's used this method of going from Rootmaker cells to ordinary pots for years, beyond-years. The roots produced are simply astounding.
From a seed (Pinus densiflora he likes to mess around with) started right now this time of the year and finishing up at Fall of this year, he has a full-one-gallon plant and a 12-18" seedling with a 1/4"-1/2" caliper. It's simply astounding.

I'll try to find some pics.

Dax

I'm having a little trouble finding pots though. With the warm weather we are getting antsy to work outside but a lot of the nursery around here haven't gotten in a lot of their stock.

Ken, Frank uses their ingredients to the exact proportions, listed. And Frank is the guy I'm talking about folks aka starterdude.

Dax

Dax

Sanct, Ken's spacing comments are correct...if you must have each individual tree able to form a fully expanded crown. Around here, there's these things called forests, and in these forests you will find trees at just about every spacing interval there is. Just saying....trees of same or similar species and ages, when started together, generally accomodate each other. It all just depends on what effect you're after.

+oM

I have some oaks really coming along. 1 meter of growth on (3) of my Bur oaks this year. They'll have to be dug however, because they're between my sidewalk and garage. I'll do that next-spring.

Dax

Here are the pics I promised. I didn't read through all the comments again to see if I ever explained what I had done so I'll just do a quick shake down. I bought seedlings from the Idaho extension acorns from a website called acorno.com. I planted the seedlings in 1 gallon rootmaker pots, 3 gallon rootmaker bags, and some in my garden boxes. I planted the acorns in the little 2.5"x 2.5" rootmaker pots and a few in my raised beds. I planted bur, n. red oak, and a couple pin oak acorns. The seedlings were all bur oak.

I build a little potting bench from scrap wood I had lying around and put all of my pots on top of that on the east side of my house. They get good sun until about 1300 hours then shade. The ones I planted in the garden boxes get full sun and there isn't great drainage so the box soil is basically always wet. (Its my first year with those so I have some work to do this fall/spring getting the drainage issues figured out.)

We have had the hottest summer on record and have been in the mid 90's basically since the beginning of June. I have tried to water the potted plants every afternoon when I get home from work and have only missed a few days. As you can see, the small potted acorns have all died. I think that the pots were just too small to store moisture during the day heat and dried out before I could get to watering them after work. The 1 and 3 gallon potted oaks look great other than a bit of leaf scorch.

The oaks planted in the raised beds seem to be doing just as well. They have some scorch but the little guys are green and have good leaves. I haven't gotten any real growth out of any of them. I'm not sure if its the heat, lack of water/ too much water, or anything else.

I am not sure where to go from here. This was totally just an experiment but I need to decide what to do with them before winter. I have a spot in the back south west corner of my yard that is just dirt. I haven't gotten around to doing flowers there yet and have considered planting my oaks in tidy rows there to have them mature a bit and bare root them when they get 4-5 feet tall. I still haven't decided on that though.

Leave anything you have in the ground where they are and transplant them to their permanent location, next (early) spring while they are dormant. When the ground is workable, plant em.

The ones in the pots/bags/ you should sink in the ground, leaving them in the pots, and next spring, plant em.

Good job. I know if you could have kept the media moist on the 18 cell rootmaker flats, you'd of had excellent starter plants that could have been moved up to larger pots/bags. They are actually 3.25 x 3.25 x 4" not 2.5. Those are the correct size to work with oaks.

Looks like you had fun and had success.

Dax