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What's the most overplanted tree where you live?

Posted by quirkyquercus (My Page) on
Tue, May 30, 06 at 13:03

It seems like every region has it's tree. The one the builders put in. The one that they have lining every street. The one that is just plain overplanted.

When I was in Florida, I thought Live Oak was seriously overplanted. And here in GA, willow oak is majorly overplanted. Which in it's youth looks like a live oak but deciduous narrow leaves. They're allright, but come on, they are not that interesting! YAWN! Borrring. There are many other street trees that can be used for some diversity. Just wait until that killer exotic pest comes along and then we're left with nada. Why doesn't this sink in? My town has planted willow oaks on every major street and nothing but willow oaks. And they planted some under powerlines. What is wrong with people?? they make me want to scream.

So tell me what your overplanted trees are. Ash trees in the midwest? Norway maple in new england?


Follow-Up Postings:

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RE: What's the most overplanted tree where you live?

Bradford Pear here in the Philly suburbs. You see them EVERYWHERE! And the 2nd most common is purple sand cherry. They are planted right next to the BPs.

Alexa


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RE: What's the most overplanted tree where you live?

  • Posted by bboy z8 WA USA (My Page) on
    Tue, May 30, 06 at 13:39

Take your pick.

Here is a link that might be useful: Overplanted in Seattle


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RE: What's the most overplanted tree where you live?

I think we just passed an over-do phase with honeylocusts, not sure what will come next, lindens & cherries seem to be frontrunners, however.


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RE: What's the most overplanted tree where you live?

  • Posted by basic z4A WI (My Page) on
    Tue, May 30, 06 at 14:32

While Green Ash, Honeylocust, and Amur Maple were way overplanted during the last 20-30 years, I'd have to say they've been replaced by Acer x freemanii, Betula nigra Heritage, and Syringa reticulata 'Ivory Silk'. In some neighborhoods it seems to be a monoculture of these hybrids. There's nothing wrong with any of them, just used way too often.


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RE: What's the most overplanted tree where you live?

1. Callery pears - self-destruct after about 10 years, and with all the different cultivars around, they're fruiting like crazy and we're seeing invasion by bird-spread volunteer seedlings.
2. Pin oak - near-monoculture plantings are now being decimated by overwhelming horny stem & branch galls and a double-whammy of bacterial leaf scorch.
3. Honeylocust - borers
4. the next wave of overplanted tree species here - Sweetgum; unfortunately, I don't know of any pest or pathogen that is waiting in the wings to attack these god-awful things.

Know what you mean about the willow oaks, qq - yeah, they're OK, but Man!, There are so many more interesting oaks available; geez, let's have some diversified plantings!!

I will give kudos to somebody in the public works department here - there are a number of bur, swamp white, and hybrid oaks planted here and there around town, in addition to some of the red horsechestnut selections and Corneliancherry dogwoods - a welcome departure from the ubiquitous list above and the purpleleaf plums, etc.


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RE: What's the most overplanted tree where you live?

Acer pseudoplatanus and Ulmus glabra in the past; now Acer platanoides.

The Ulmus glabra are all gone now (DED).

Resin


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RE: What's the most overplanted tree where you live?

First would be Bradford Pear,
Second: Purple sand cherries- these look good unless- it rains, or the japanese bettles have come out. So lets just say- bad most of the time in leaf.
Third: Weeping Cherry- I love the pink one I have. LOL!
Fourth: Crimson Barberry- ouch!


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RE: What's the most overplanted tree where you live?

bradford pear by a long shot!!


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RE: What's the most overplanted tree where you live?

Callery pears, each and every variety known to mankind
Crimson Maples


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RE: What's the most overplanted tree where you live?

There are a lot of overplanted things in my area, but I address myself to what is overplanted and I most dislike - Crimson King Norway Maple. The regular Norway Maple is overplanted as well, but it has good qualities and without it the city where I live wouldn't have much left. What does anyone see in these lugubrious looking Crimson Maples and purple plums?

What frustrates me even more than overplanting is the spacing (or lack of it) between species that grow quite large. What is really bad is when you find the occasional spectacular old specimen of Oak or whatever. You would get this fantastic vista of a widespreading crown except that 20 or 30 years ago some public entity planted a line of trees the last of which are now growing up into and impeding the view of the century (or centuries) old specimen that was there before. They couldn't have stopped planting 30 or 40 feet down, or used some low growing shrub around the magnificent old tree?


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RE: What's the most overplanted tree where you live?

Off the top of my head bradford pear, river birch, green ash, norway spruce, pin oak. In my subdivision there is an alarming # of crimson king norways. Also many weeping willows on small lots.


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RE: What's the most overplanted tree where you live?

Bradford pears. Absolutely! What is the fascination with these things???


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RE: What's the most overplanted tree where you live?

  • Posted by bboy z8 WA USA (My Page) on
    Tue, May 30, 06 at 22:09

It's mass consumerism, the same lack of selection and awareness that is prevalent in other arenas. I think many trees are grown by farms that used to be producing food or forage, likely switched to trees to get a higher return. The families (or nowadays, corporate employees) operating them aren't necessarily interested in trees much at all--certainly not enough to bother trying to plant and sell non-mainstream choices.

Last time I went to the Farwest nursery trades show in Portland (some years ago) it was booth after booth of purple Japanese maples and blue Colorado spruces. I get the impression the few growers that depart from the norm have garden center buyers who are trying to offer interesting selections eating out of their hands. One practice I have noticed is using specimens for scions for years and then digging them and selling them to garden centers. It seems to be "take our old stubbed off stock plants or take nothing, we don't care--somebody else will glady snap them up." Last example I saw here was some Phoenix maples that looked like hat racks, priced at hundreds of dollars each at a local garden center.

Public functionaries have to deal with politics and the abundance of people both in their departments and outside them that have bad ideas--including fear of the unfamiliar. In my town the parks department tried pastel hanging baskets on one street, as an alternative to the loudly colored flowers they usually use. There was a minor uproar.


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RE: What's the most overplanted tree where you live?

  • Posted by cacau z5/6 CO (My Page) on
    Tue, May 30, 06 at 23:41

In Denver I'd have to say it formerly was silver maple, from around 1900 to 1960. The bill for this mistake started coming due twenty years ago and is nowhere near its peak yet...great business for tree removal companies. The species is no longer allowed on public rights-of-way, but a few people still plant them on their lawns. Post-WWII there were tons of linden and honeylocust planted. Flowering crab has been way overdone. There are plenty of Colorado Blue Spruce of all ages, but somehow they don't seem ubiquitous. Over the last twenty years the main plague has been green and white ash and freeman maple cultivars.

Worst of all IMHO is the fascination people have with planting quaking aspen, short-lived weedy weak-wooded trees with many bug and disease problems, suckers galore, and root systems you don't want to pause next to for very long. They're much happier and healthier in the mountains where they belong, but no, everybody who owns a little property in the mountains (and a few don't but who simply poach) and needs a few extra bucks digs the blasted things up and sells them down here to people who can then pretend they're living in a picturesque mountain cabin instead of in a city of over two million. However, criticizing this tree around here is almost unpatriotic.


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RE: What's the most overplanted tree where you live?

From my observations here in Ontario -

1950's - silver maple
1970's - crimson king norway maple (WHY, WHY, WHY!!????)
2000 - Freeman maples, usually "Autumn Blaze"

You still see Norways getting planted, most are the regular green leaf variety although the alien-looking Crimson King still rears its ugly head.

Funny enough, I've got specimens of all of them on my lot!

A massive silver maple, a three-trunked Norway and a Freeman maple that is now a stump! A thunderstorm felled it.

I've also got a mature pin oak and a red pine as well as a black maple, so a real hodge-podge.

I'm going to cut down two mountain ashes at the front of my yard and I've just recently transplanted a native sugar maple. Someone will have a beautiful, mature tree in 50 years - hopefully I'll be around to see it1


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RE: What's the most overplanted tree where you live?

Bboy- your explanations are very sound and plausible. I would also add that the builders want the cheapest tree possible that will survive on their lousy fill dirt mixed with construction debris that can be planted improperly, covered with sod and still survive long enough for the final inspection and C.O. to be issued. My builder told me he paid $50 for the 2" or 2.5" live oaks because the city required X number of trees planted, that cheap #$*)@!.

Another overplanted tree in my area is CREPE MYRTLE!!!
Oh Lawdy! Crepe myrtle is the one tree everyone knows of. Fine for somebody's small garden. What bothers me about these is they are planted in roadway medians, parks and other locations where larger canopy trees would be more appropriate and beneficial. Then just when the tree is gaining some spread, along comes the lowest bidder to hack the top of them off! Good grief!
Not to mention there are reports of these escaping cultivation.

Don't get me started on Autumn blaze maples. Yes I have one but I didn't plant it. It has been explained to me many times but I don't understand why a silver maple hybrid is better than a red maple.


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RE: What's the most overplanted tree where you live?

ChrisinCanada, I'm not sure where you live, but here in Ottawa, it's the same with the Crimson King (or Queen?) Norway Maple. I dislike them, but my wish to be a reverse-guerilla-gardener (where you chop things down) comes into play with the green variety of Norway Maple, greatly overplanted here, and seeding themselves everywhere, including my eavestroughs. I don't see Bradford Pears here, although I noticed that Home Depot is selling them.

Here is a link that might be useful: darn norway maple


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RE: What's the most overplanted tree where you live?

What a depressing thread! It's like we are living in a lacklustre and mundane world and can do nothing about it. Regarding the public right-of-way there is something that can be done about it. Several years ago my town formed a Tree Committee. We meet monthly in the planning office of the DPW. We make decisions about plantings and removals in the median strips, parks, streetscapes. We have a mix of professionals and town residents on the committee. Since some of the funding comes from the state we frequently have a LA from the state and someone from the utility at the meetings. Sometimes progress is at a snail's pace but the work we have done is exceptional, no noxious trees planted.
Regarding new residential developments there is a different concern. My area is being transformed into a bedroom community for the Wilmington/Baltimore/DC commuter. McMansions are built and landscaped before the owner moves in. The landscaping is an afterthought. It seems incredible how Blue Atlas Cedar can so commonly be used as a foundation planting. Maroon-colored foliage is everywhere. I've noticed, once the air-conditioning comes on there is a disconnect between homeowner and landscape. they hire "Mow, Blow, & Go" crew to do the work.
Exceptional trees don't have to be rare. Our "Major's Oak" has a plaque around it and a split rail fence. It is a majestic specimen. We photographed and printed a Champion Tree list for our town. Promote exceptional plantings whether commercial or residential. Get involved in a community group and offer to landscape a highly visable area and take credit for it.
This thread will quickly dissappear into Cyberspace. It will take more than a gripe session here to do away with "cookie-cutter" design mentality.
Sam


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RE: What's the most overplanted tree where you live?

Mesquite and Acacia.


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RE: What's the most overplanted tree where you live?

  • Posted by john_w Z4a Minn, US (My Page) on
    Wed, May 31, 06 at 19:02

Familiarity breeds contempt

In the Twin Cities it's got to be the Green Ash (Patmore, Marshall's,etc),followed by crabapples, Heritage River Birch, Black Hills Spruce (the dark presence), Blue Spruce, Little Leaf Lindens, hybrid poplars and the Freeman Maples. Ash yellow worries (and EAB) seem to have no effect on planting decision.

That said, I'm noticing some communities are thumping the diversity drum, so I'm seeing off the beaten track trees like oaks (white, burr), sugar maples, Basswood, Kentucky Coffee trees, tamaracks, shantung maple, pines, hybrid elms and so on.

Personally, I appreciate most of the commonly planted trees and have intentionally planted a few of them on my property. Lindens smell heavenly. Honey Locust has a beautiful green light under its graceful banches. The Freemans have gorgeous autumn color. River Birch is striking in the winter landscape.

Here in Minnesota, Where Plants Suffer, I can tell you I'd LOVE to see a crape myrtle or a willow oak.


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RE: What's the most overplanted tree where you live?

From working in a retail nursery, I have learned most people don't care all that much or just don't know what their options are. Unfortunately, I would estimate only about 1 out of 25 customers will take the time to listen to you and learn about their options. The rest, usually because they lost a tree, want to be in and out as fast as they can with their new tree, a tree they know...Maple, Linden, Honeylocust, Crab, Japanese Lilac Tree. And when it is a replacement tree (disease, storm, etc) they usually want the fastest growing tree and don't care what the consequences are 25+ years down the road because "we won't be living in that house anyway."


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RE: What's the most overplanted tree where you live?

  • Posted by basic z4A WI (My Page) on
    Wed, May 31, 06 at 19:52

It takes an optimistic (or should I say enlightened) gardener to plant a Coffee Tree. You pull into the nursery in late April and May and all you see is a stick figure. I've talked to a few nursery managers/owners in this area who've given up on KCT for this reason. Your average consumer just can't get past what he sees in front of him. I've never worked at a nursery, but I've got to believe selling a tree in flower must be a piece of cake.


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RE: What's the most overplanted tree where you live?

Bradford Pear and all the accursed versions of Callery Pears... nasty, nasty things! Short-lived, ugly except when in flower (and the flowers stink), and invasive - what more could one ask for... AARRGGHH!!!!

Silver Maples were overplanted years ago both in my parents' area in New Jersey and down here in Maryland. Most of them are dead or dying now, falling apart in spectacular fashions. Here and there, some huge ones still lurk, but time will claim them.

Pin Oak is overplanted, but at least it's an oak. I'd rather have a variety of oaks, but it is better than the previous two trees listed by a long shot.

Sycamores tend to be overplanted as well, though I don't mind them. They are big and often messy trees, but their bark is pretty and they can live a long time (when the city doesn't top them and people don't plow cars into them?!) However, they get too big for small lots quite easily.

I'd love to see some GOOD maples planted, more varieties of oaks, and a host of other interesting trees, but these days the goofballs running things are lucky if they can keep a Bradford Pear or Sycamore alive after: sticking it in a hole that is too small, planting it too deep, burying its trunk flare in a "mulch volcano", not bothering to water it - ever, and then if the tree dares to survive and grow, coming along and topping it or performing some other horrid pruning job on it. Yeesh... plastic trees might be better for these people.

*sigh* I just wish I had the land to plant a wide variety of GOOD and LONG-LIVED trees.


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RE: What's the most overplanted tree where you live?

I'm seeing coffee trees, gingkos, swamp and burr oaks and all sorts of other interesting trees popping up in Chicago, I think the city really learned its lesson after the ALB (apparently the DED lesson had been forgotten!).


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RE: What's the most overplanted tree where you live?

Yes. I think it might be more instructive to focus on the rare instances where municipalities, in particular, have made wise choices. Even when the trees selected are not particularly inspired or rare, if chosen with an eye towards both long-term survivability and aesthetics, such choices can provide a true treasure for neighborhoods for generations. I remember a street beautification project where I grew up in the 1960's, which included an extensive planting of 'Red Sunset' maples. Today those trees are a defining characteristic of this community.


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RE: What's the most overplanted tree where you live?

I don't view all forms of overplanting with negativity myself, any kind of tree planting is better than none at all. You are right about trees (even overplanted ones) being the defining characteristic of a community. It is like that where I live with Norway Maple. It is a defining and greatly anticipated (by me anyway) time in spring when all the Norway Maples come into bloom in our valley. If one looks down from the hillsides all over the valley there is this fresh spring green canopy of flowers. Walk down the streets and you smell the pleasant fragrance. In hot summers the dense shade is greatly appreciated. In winter the mature boles are welcome remembrances of summers life. Having grown so many trees to maturity could hardly be considered failure. Yet it isn't a native species, and there are many natives that would make a welcome addition and provide a pleasing variety.

For some cities it might be an interesting idea to take a cue from what things were like when they were settled. Street names like Maple Elm Oak Linden even Mulberry were likely indications of what grew on the site natively. I know that Elm street in my district is along a bottomland - old Elms are mentioned in old deeds as property markers.

Most streets now don't even have any of the trees they were named after. Planting them with species appropriate to their names would make honest streets of them. It would give character to neighborhoods.


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RE: What's the most overplanted tree where you live?

Yep, I've seen plenty of that... perhaps the most sad are the "Chestnut" streets, since the chestnuts are almost all gone now...

There is an "Oak Street" up the road a mile or so that is lined with oaks of various types, so that's nice. It's one of those communities where the houses are set amid a forest of good-sized trees.

True that in most cases some trees are better than none, and the first thing is to get the people in charge to be able to get ANY trees to the point where they can have a long life; then, the individual species comes into play. Case in point: a local shopping center where almost every single tree in the parking lot was dead or dying - I doubt any of them were over 10 years of age. All were planted too deep, had the mulch volcanoes, etc. They were all removed and I guess they'll start over. What a waste - and I bet they learned nothing!


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RE: What's the most overplanted tree where you live?

"All were planted too deep, had the mulch volcanoes, etc. They were all removed and I guess they'll start over. What a waste - and I bet they learned nothing!"

Send them a copy of this post?? (I'm working on the assumption that people like that can read, which may be a bit optimistic, perhaps)

Resin


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RE: What's the most overplanted tree where you live?

  • Posted by gomero SW France, Z8 (My Page) on
    Thu, Jun 1, 06 at 17:23

This being Southern France you may guess that the most overplanted tree along the country roads is Platanus x acerifolia and orientalis. In the past the favorite overdone combination for street trees was Prunus ceasifera 'Pissardii' alternating with Acer negundo 'Variegatum' but is now out of fashion. For new plantings I see a lot of Sophora japonicas which seem to be drought tolerant.

Gomero


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RE: What's the most overplanted tree where you live?

I'd love to send them a copy of this post, but I sadly don't know who "they" are. I've also learned the hard way over the years that most people would prefer to remain ignorant than face the "horror" of having somebody who knows what they are talking about offer them help.

Case in point: in the center courtyard of my apartment complex there is a good number of trees that are around 30+ years of age (including one big oak tree that is much older - probably 80+ years and it was there long before the apartments). Among all these trees are several old picnic table and bench units. For reasons beyond my imagination, one of these tables is tightly chained to an old white pine. The chain is starting to dig into the bark and will girdle and kill the tree in a few years without any doubt if nothing is done.

I've brought this to the attention of apartment management 3 or 4 times already in the past few months. Nothing has been done - nobody cares. I've made it very clear that I know what I am talking about, and I've even tried to pitch removing the chain from the viewpoint of saving money (the cutting down of the soon to be dead tree and possible lawsuits if it lands on somebody). Again, nobody cares. My responses have ranged from outright lies: "We'll take care of it right away!" to hollow agreement: "Yep, that sounds true... so?" to insane: "We can't remove the chain because somebody would steal the table" (Ignoring the half a dozen other tables that aren't chained to anything, the fact that the chain could be loosened or tied to a post or something, and why would somebody steal a rusty old picnic table?!)

So, I've about given up. The tree will die. The idiots running the place will, at best, wonder why... at worst, they'll forget to cut it down and it'll land on something... and no replacement tree will be planted. Sadly, I am pretty sure I could direct the landscaping of the whole complex better in my free time than the idiots who get paid to run the place, but, as I said before, they would rather CHOSE ignorance than risk being informed by somebody who knows something!

Considering this state of affairs, I guess we should consider it amazing any tree survives in planted places these days.


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RE: What's the most overplanted tree where you live?

sounds like a call for a midnight chain cutting, is you ask me.


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RE: What's the most overplanted tree where you live?

Yeah, a pair of boltcutters, and shake a few bits of grass or old leaves to hide the cut in the chain for a few days until it rusts over and looks like it just rusted through

Resin


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RE: What's the most overplanted tree where you live?

Resin, that is so devious--I like it!


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RE: What's the most overplanted tree where you live?

In the past(roughly 1900-1960's), American and Siberian Elms(erroneously known locally as Chinese Elms). They were planted along the main roads of virtually every town in Western Missouri and Eastern Kansas, until DED. A few Siberians still hang on in some areas.

In the 1960's, 70's and 80's Pin Oak was planted everywhere to replace all the dead and dying Elms and in new housing subdivisions. Planted to the point of monoculture in many areas. No serious outbreak of galls or leaf fungus here yet.

In the 1990's until now it's Callery Pears and Red Maples. Planted all over in the most inappropriate places. The Pears have all the same well known negatives here. The Red Maples loathe our annual summer heat and drought and are often planted in parking lots where the heat and drought is enhanced and their leaves brown and curl until they look like ugly half dead mop heads. All the new sidewalks to replace the Red Maple root damaged sidewalks are quite prevelant and will no doubt need replacing again in the near future also.

On a positive note, the city of Lawrence, Kansas seems to have done an outstanding job of planting a nice variety of street trees. With several different Oaks being most notable, like Northern Red Oak, Bur Oak, Swamp White Oak, Shingle Oak, Chiquapin Oak, English Oak, Shumard Oak, etc. A few Ginkgo trees here and there too. Also, the median in Renner Boulevard in Western Lenexa, Kansas is planted with a nice variety of trees, like Eastern White Pine, Ginkgo Trees, Columnar English Oaks, Redbuds, River Birch, Northern Red Oak, White Ash, Honey Locust Trees, etc.


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RE: What's the most overplanted tree where you live?

An option to bolt cutters...if you got the cajones to do this...go to a pool store and get a jug of muriatic acid and pour a little on the chain slowly and it will melt away before your vary eyes and look like it was naturually rusted and corroded. Use a respirator and eye goggles and have a jug of water nearby to turn off the reaction.


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RE: What's the most overplanted tree where you live?

I guess it depends on how you define overplanted......Red Maples are fine trees, but there are a lot in my neighborhood. One corner lot has has 6 in a row. After struggling to pick the few species (out of dozens I would like) to fit in my limited space, it's a little depressing to think that someone is content to pick just one variety of one species and plant 6 of them.

On the other hand, what is with the weeping cherries? There are not so many around here, but I'm inclined to think of them as overplanted. One week of pretty blooms, then the rest of the year they look ridiculous, IMO.

There are lots of sycamores in the Lehigh Valley. If there's ever a sycamore disease ala DED or Chestnut blight, the look and feel of entire neighborhoods will completely change. But, I did drive by a street lined with old sycamores today, every bit as majestic as an elm lined avenue.

Alex


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RE: What's the most overplanted tree where you live?

A sycamore disease would be devastating - I already shudder to think what beech-bark disease will do to some of the local forests... Ugh!

What drives me nuts is that there plenty of people who know the importance of "the right tree in the right place" and avoiding invasives and monocultures, but these people are rarely in positions where they can make such decisions and the people in charge don't want their help!


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RE: What's the most overplanted tree where you live?

Callery pears are still being planted by the dozens in Maryland. Ugh.

The latest "in" tree among the landscapers seems to be the Zelkova. I see them planted around every new shopping center or business park.

And Silver & Norway maples must have been really popular in the past, because I see many dying specimens.


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RE: What's the most overplanted tree where you live?

Zelkova is another one that's really picking up steam here too and I have yet to see one that looks happy. Why pay all this money for a large tree NOW when it wont even look like a tree for another 20 years? Is there no one who opens a book?


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RE: What's the most overplanted tree where you live?

What is perhaps worse than the over-planted Callery Pears is mis-pruned Callery Pears. There's a row of them I go by every day that were topped some years ago. Some time in the past week, some genius decided to prune off most of the clumps of stems that grew from the topped tips?! The end result is a bizzare and ugly, topped tree with small clumps of leaves at the very end of the topped limbs that only grow straight up. As much as I hate Callery Pears, even I wouldn't subject them to that treatment! Yeesh... somebody needs their chainsaw taken away!

We have tons of Zelkovas, too. Many are planted along the medians and where I work. I guess they are better than no tree (and certainly better than some previous choices), but they are pretty dull and uninspired.

Most of the older silver maples are either dying off or have morphed into huge, run-down monsters where I live in Maryland.

The older neighborhoods are much better about trees from what I've seen. There's a large area with older, non-cookie-cutter homes that is in a forest of various tall, healthy oaks (with some other trees mixed in). Other older developments have good-sized trees of other varieties, too. No Callery Pears anywhere there, thankfully.


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RE: What's the most overplanted tree where you live?

Zelkovas are still relatively rare in my area. The handful of plantings I've seen were for the most part doing well. It isn't something I would plant on a massive scale but it could be a useful part of a larger mix.


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RE: What's the most overplanted tree where you live?

I haven't found Japanese zelkova to be particularly good in ice storms. I had one that was planted by my builder. I'm about 50% sure it's a columnar cultivar but maybe not. Either way it lost pretty much all it's branches in the ice storm we had in December. The wood may be strong but those tight crotch angles were a problem. On a good day, they look like a broom stick. There's also a dwarf cultivar called 'wireless' that could go under powerlines but we all know that space is reserved for large trees.


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RE: What's the most overplanted tree where you live?

I notice a bit of irony in your last sentence, but it does often seem that way doesn't it? I'm a little prejudiced in favor of Japanese Zelkova since I saw a magnificent specimen at Highland Park in Rochester NY planted in 1899. Though Rochester is one of the snowiest cities in the East this tree had not suffered any major damage in that time. Of course it's form was a bit different from the typical zelkova cultivar.


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RE: What's the most overplanted tree where you live?

I love trees more than you can imagine. I appreciate the Zelkovas but when they're turning out to be overplanted, especially in regions where they do poorly, I do get a tad emotional because that's such a waste. My favorite tree is probably American sycamore. But if it was overplanted in all the wrong places, I'd feel the same way about it as I do about willow oak.

I'll try to work on the sarcasm.


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RE: What's the most overplanted tree where you live?

Around here you see a lot of the Bradford Pears along with topped Norway Maples. They were put in in the 40's and 50's on lots that were simply too small. I have a huge one I would love to remove from my back yard along with the Crimson King that was stuck right in the center of my front yard.
At least plantings seem to be improving. Comercial plantings at least are moving to oaks, red maples and other native trees.


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RE: What's the most overplanted tree where you live?

  • Posted by lkz5ia z5 west iowa (My Page) on
    Wed, Jun 21, 06 at 23:14

Without doubt, green giant cedar and austree(hybrid willows) are being hyped in every catalog..........

Is this microphone on???? They aren't as good as they say.


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RE: What's the most overplanted tree where you live?

Quirkyquerkus. Don't curb ironic statements on my account, I think it is an effective literary device. I would take sarcasm to be more like a mean-spirited attack, which I certainly didn't get from your observation about large trees always being put under power lines.

The problems you site with zelkova are probably perfectly valid, from my point of view though with maybe a handful planted in a 50 or 100 mile radius (probably not much of an exaggeration), I'm wondering why it isn't more planted. I see that in a lot in posts though - people in one part of the country talking about the problems with different species, and others wondering where they are coming from, when the situation in their backyards is quite different. That is what broadens your perspective though, learning about the situation in a national context. Whenever I get a chance to travel it's always interesting to observe the horticulture practiced in an area and the species that are utilized - there are always some surprises. There is so much to see, and so little time to do it in. I get a heads up from these forums though.


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RE: What's the most overplanted tree where you live?

I have to rate zelkova fall color as a 9 out of 10. So I have to give the tree some merit. I don't believe it's immune to D.E.D. though. Not that it would stop me from planting it for that reason but when you have a municipal monoculture planting, you can see how that would be especially risky.


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RE: What's the most overplanted tree where you live?

Crepe Myrtle is highly planted throughout Dallas. I do really love the colors though... Oh well. Okay I'll begin with the oaks. Pin, Live, and Red Oaks are all way overplanted. Most of us here don't have the space for a 50 foot tall beautiful old tree. Magnolias are also over planted, still it's just the flavor of the south I guess, and weeping willows are overplanted for not doing well with our dry heat.


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RE: What's the most overplanted tree where you live?

  • Posted by hoovb z9 Southern CA (My Page) on
    Sat, Jun 24, 06 at 11:41

Currently it is Lophostemon confertus, aka Tristania confertus. I don't care how drought tolerant it is--yuck. Queen Palm is another. Ficus benjamina--although some few are beginning to see that agressive surface roots that buckle sidewalks may not be wise. The neighbor has planted one 3' from the foundation of his house. But he's moving, so it will be someone elses problem.

Cheap to grow is the key.


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RE: What's the most overplanted tree where you live?

Weeping cherry trees! I see them in just about every yard that has decent landscaping!


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RE: What's the most overplanted tree where you live?

There are way too many Linden trees in my town.They are one of the best shade trees I have seen but they are about the only tree one sees on some streets.It's kind of eerie in my opinion.And if some disease hits all those Lindens, it will look really bad around here.


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RE: What's the most overplanted tree where you live?

Omigosh, I forgot about Crape Myrtles! For some reason they're really popular as landscape trees in newer shopping centersin MD, especially in Anne Arundel County. Baltimore Countyseems to favor the Zelkovas. (In fact, I am looking out the window right now at some beautiful large zelkovas planted around this office building - the leaves look really pretty with the wind blowing through them.)

I don't have a problem with either crapes or zelkovas, but dislike monoculture.


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RE: What's the most overplanted tree where you live?

I suppose that I would be everyone's worst nightmare. I tried to do my research when I planted, but I seem to have picked just about every hated tree in this thread for my 2 acres.

15 white pines (border along road)
4 Greenvase Zelkovas (intermixed with border)
4 Greenspire Lindens (intermixed with border)
4 Concolor Firs (intermixed with border)
4 Norway Spruce (intermixed with border)

* About 315' of road frontage with townhomes across the street and trying to recreate a naturalized tree row (I know its not all native)

6 Pin Oaks
3 Red Sunset Maples (highly rated, but haven't impressed me yet, planted on side)
3 Sycamores (I love Sycamores, planted on other side of yard)
3 Cleveland Select Pears (may be short lived, but have been the best trees for the first 5 years and do welcome spring with the flowers)
1 Weeping White Pine
1 Forest Pansey Redbud
1 Yoshino Cherry
1 Dawn Redwood (back corner)
3 Douglas Fir (along back of property)
3 Norway Spruce (along back of property)

I planted most of these trees about 5 years ago as decent size trees to save me from my treeless lot when I built a home. It is finally starting to get nice, but I am hoping it will be even better in a few years.
3


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RE: What's the most overplanted tree where you live?

  • Posted by cacau z5/6 CO (My Page) on
    Wed, Jun 28, 06 at 23:41

No, no! We don't hate most of these trees, we just think they're overdone in particular locales, and not necessarily in yours. "Hated trees" is a separate subject, really, and there we'd be getting into ailanthus, bradford pears, aspen, siberian elm...


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RE: What's the most overplanted tree where you live?

Leyland cypress.

Surely to be the golden goose for tree services in about 20 more years.

I put a small topic article on my website's second advice page called "Does money grow on trees?...Almost!!". Number 29.

Just as Port Orford cedar brought money to tree services for a health reason, so will Leyland because of growth.


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RE: What's the most overplanted tree where you live?

  • Posted by bboy z8 WA USA (My Page) on
    Thu, Jun 29, 06 at 0:35

And health reasons, including cypress tip moth and cankers, as well as splitting under wet snow and toppling over on bound roots.


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RE: What's the most overplanted tree where you live?

There's a big difference between overplanted and hated. Any tree can be overplanted, leading to monoculture situations, which, in turn, are a real problem if/when a disease or pest strikes that particular type of tree or when all the trees of the same species and same planting time enter old age and start to decline at the same time.

Hated trees are those trees that just aren't good for much of anything. Maybe they are short-lived, have nasty-smelling flowers, are invasive, etc. Those are the ones we're better off without.


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RE: What's the most overplanted tree where you live?

Yates...
Some people feel very strongly about what's planted in people's yards. Personally I don't care as long as it's not an overgrown stand of bananas and K-mart assorted tropicals that lowers my property value. The problem I have is with municipal street plantings and commercial landscapes that they use the same trees over and over particularly when they aren't the right tree for the space.

The only bone to pick I have with your list is the cleveland select pear. I have zero tolerance for invasives but I blame the nurseries that sell them not necessarily the homeowners. In fact it wasn't until recently when I found them growing not just along the interstate but in the woods actually displacing native plants that I started harping on it.

And some people here are annoyed by the colored trees. I realize there is a need for color and texture in the landscape and what's readily available is usually the same old thing. It's extremely cumbersome to track down rare plants and after doing that for a while, the ordinary stuff that you can get right down the street looks more and more appealing. In my opinion, how and where you plant it is a more important thing to worry about. Ideally homeowners should go to the nursery and come home and research the plants on the internet and then go back and buy it. But we all know nobody does that. Most homeowners AND landscapers are oblivious to the problems with flowering pears and leyland cypress.
A neighbor of mine who used to own a landscaping business has a 10' cottonwood that appeared out of nowhere over the past month. It's in the woods behind his backyard maybe 30' away. I asked him if he knew what it was and told him why it would be in his best interests to cut it down. He didn't know and still hasn't done anything about it as it grows another foot each day he waits. The bottom line is my expectations for homeowners are very low but the ones that sell and grow the plants want cheap to grow, profitable and something that has name recognition like bradford pears, crepe myrtle and leyland cypress. Fast growing screen material sells like hot cakes. They also want it to transplant easily so they don't have returns.

Regarding your red sunset... I haven't been impressed with anything to come from the producer of that cultivar so that doesn't surprise me. They have a good repuation though and definitely supply the green industry with profitable plants that are easy to plant and survive the warranty period so that's why we see so much of their work. But I won't be using it in the future.


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RE: What's the most overplanted tree where you live?

here in indianapolis:
weeping cherry
bradford pear
red maple


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RE: What's the most overplanted tree where you live?

I'd say Crepe Myrtle and Dogwoods. Are they even trees ? I don't know, also alot of Eastern White Pines and Ugly Junipers.


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RE: What's the most overplanted tree where you live?

Interesting thread, and so true how the overplanting varies from region to region. When I lived in a suburb south of Denver, the builder of our subdivision put a token Ash in every front yard, most of which had to be replaced after a few years of late spring snowstorms. As Cacau mentioned, the homeowners almost always added at least one Aspen, which had numerous problems associated with them. The most overplanted tree that bothered me was the Colorado Blue Spruce, yes I said it, and I hope they don't make me leave the state! Those things will get huge eventually, but homeowners would put them in a side yard that is only 10'-15' wide, or put it a couple feet from their house. It is unfair to the tree, which will eventually be cut down because it is too big for the spot they planted it.

Well, I moved from the Front Range to near the Western Slope this year and the tree that is too big for the yard, but everyone has one here is the Willow, both the Globe and the Weeping varieties. With the gorgeous views around here, it amazes me that people would block it with a tree that big.

By the way, several posters mentioned the Little Leaf Linden, which I just planted in my new yard. I had never even heard of it until now, so I don't believe they are overused in this part of the country :) Just goes to show you.....


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RE: What's the most overplanted tree where you live?

  • Posted by picea 6A Cinci- Oh (My Page) on
    Fri, Sep 8, 06 at 15:56

There are a lot of globe blue spruces that they planted 5-10 years ago as a foundation plant that are getting much to big for the their location. Its a darf that is not staying small and they they are hard to keep pruned. David


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RE: What's the most overplanted tree where you live?

every breeder dreams of the next big commodity plant, just think Forsythia and PJM Rhododendron... Bradford and Leland were the next wave. Some folks will only buy what they know and these are all they know.

However, I have said many times to get people past their prejudices, there are no bad plants, just bad uses of them. If you find yourself hating a particular plant it may just be that you haven't seen it used well. Lelands burn really well when dried! ; )


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RE: What's the most overplanted tree where you live?

On the NC shore it's Pinus thunbergii by a long shot. They are one of very few trees that can take the summer drought, winter gales, and constant salt and still look good, but now it's a pest disaster waiting to happen. I'm trying Pitlolly, Bosnian, and strobiformis as alternatives.

Next on the list are non-native palms which never do very well, and look way out of place imho.


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RE: What's the most overplanted tree where you live?

What? No one else is plagued by boxelders? Consider yourselves blessed!

Tina McG


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RE: What's the most overplanted tree where you live?

Bradfords and Crepes, although Willow Oak is overplanted, and the City of Atlanta is prohibiting the use of Willow Oak until further notice to prevent a die out...Making the rounds now is Allee Elm (but the attributes are too good to say this is overplanted, it works so well).

Interestingly, Princeton Elm, a "DED resistant" Cultivar of U. americana, is making inroads here. I had several planted in a park, they look like a Zelkova at 3 inch caliper. Bugs ate the leaves really quick! Also, somewhat mature American Chestnuts were found in isolation in the Pine Mountain area (FDR State Park/Callaway Gardens) and are currently being tested to propigate with traits of Chinese Chestnut....Could these grand trees make a comeback?

If we could bring back the Chestnut in a form close to its native attributes, I will forever forgive the nursery industry for bringing us the Bradford.

http://www.thecitizen.com/node/7193


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RE: What's the most overplanted tree where you live?

Here (Manitoba, Canada) we seem to have loads of acer negundo (boxelder) and arborvitae (thuja occidentalis). Some elms too, but perhaps it's just that they self sow everywhere.

I actually love arborvitae, but when people plant them too close to the house they often doesn't make the best looking specimens, often growing up into the house eaves and ragged looking due to the drought conditions right against the house.

As for elms though, we have loads of mature trees, but based on what's offered at the local nursery, I don't think it's very widely planted anymore, due to the risk of Dutch Elm Disease (DED).

Glen


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RE: What's the most overplanted tree where you live?

Princeton elm DED resistant? I have heard different things about that. One source you might try is the Elm Research Institute (they are on the web) which claims to have a number of cultivars in development and ready for distribution. I got three, one killed by Japanese beetle defoliation when it was too small to recover. One of the two remaining trees I have (they are different cultivars) shows early promise of having a very tall soaring kind of shape.

If you believe the Elm Research Institute, the American elm is just about back.

--Spruce


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RE: What's the most overplanted tree where you live?

Bradford Pears, Crape Myrtles, Willow Oaks, Leyland Cypresses

I'd Like to see more evergreens such as cedars or long leaf pines, some more varied oak species or Pecan trees.


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RE: What's the most overplanted tree where you live?

A few things I'd like to see:

- A return of the American Chestnut (getting there, thanks to the ACF and other groups), and the American Elm.

- Some sort of way to propogate and spread more hickories. These are nice trees (though the nuts can be annoying, I admit), but they have taproots and tend not to transplant well, which is too bad. They are good-sized trees with nice, golden fall color that live a long time. Also, their rather upright shape makes them well-suited for smaller yards that may not have room for a huge, spreading tree.

- Proper use of conifers. If I had a dollar for every looming, massive, completely misplaced spruce tree, mishappen juniper, etc. It seems so hard to find conifers that have been well-maintained and properly placed.


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RE: What's the most overplanted tree where you live?

Over here in Ottawa it's the green ash (boring, boring, boring) the Norway maple and Crimson king (blah), and the honey locust (popular in parking lots and beside office buildings, way overplanted).

Interestingly I saw a few plane trees being planted this summer. You would normally never see them around. I will stay tuned to see if this becomes the new obsession ;)


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RE: What's the most overplanted tree where you live?

Linden trees are everywhere in downtown akron. Around here it was mostly woodlands with maples, some oakes, dogwoods a few natural pinds, lots and lots of wild black cherry trees that seem to be growing and dying at the same time..These are usually the trees to come down in storms. These were planted by nature.

but in people's yards I see those weepy things, I am guessing weeping cherries or weeping ornamental plum? alot!!

I see a few birches here and there, but not overplanted. But I did notice this year for the first time the city of akron and city of green planted a zillion japenese lilac trees mostly on public lands like highways and byways etc. they are pretty and have their flowers a long time. they are everywhere. NOt in people's yards yet.

I only noticed them because they were in flower and I never seen them before and had to look it up to find out what they were.

near me the overplanted tree is mostly by one neighbor who has five acres, he planted a bunch of those spruces, I think these are colorado spruces, so you have a forest of one kind of pine tree, except for a few white pines that have been there a long time. He was trying to decrease the amount of space he had to mow, I thought to myself there are many ways to get rid of lawn without using only one kind of plant.

I am in the process of reducing my yard size for mowing, but not with one kind of plant, thank you very much, gradually some areas will be all wildflowers, others will have some roses and trees and some ground covers. I will still have to mow but it will decrease the amount considerably when I am finally done, in the next few years. And it won't be mono plantings either.

RR


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RE: What's the most overplanted tree where you live?

sunny grower, in Chicago people who hate to mow just pave over every last square inch of their property, a bunch of CO spruces would be a welcome relief!


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RE: What's the most overplanted tree where you live?

Prunus cerasifera 'Atropurpurea' (all sunscalded and cankered)
Liquidambar styraciflua (all sidewalks lifted, pedestrians tossed)
Platanus acerifolia (anthracnose)


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RE: What's the most overplanted tree where you live?

cartobrien, that is terrible! I would rather have the pines too then pavement. In fact they really need to discourage paving since it causes flooding problems in many areas of the country.

What is funny everyone around here wants a nice green weed free lawn, so they spray the heck out of them. Basically it makes their yard look artificial. I guess my neighbors might just hate me as I don't use chemical on my yard so I have many different varieties of grasses, plaintain, dayflowers, dandilions, etc. and barly on my plants, and safer types of pesticides only specifically on vegies and occassionally on roses, but even then I try to use home made stuff first.

I put milk with garlic I blended in the blender on my white climbing rose because it had mildew, and it cleared it up for a while, but now some of it is back since our weather has been very wet, which is unusual for around here at this time of year.

I also watered my crape myrtles with garlic water and sprayed the leaves with the milk garlic thing and it cleared up the mildew. I figure this is their first year, and usually we don't get this much rain, but this year we had mroe than usual. Anyway hopfully as they mature they will get more resistant to mildew, my crape myrtles I mean, otherwise I can just try to improve the air circulation to them by pruning.

RR


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RE: What's the most overplanted tree where you live?

Interesting - I've heard that cinnamon can get rid of fungus, but I didn't know that garlic could.

Paving over everything ist the worst option - so many people want fake lawns and fake plants all covered in chemicals, topped off with lots of pavement. It is sad... then, they have to go far away to see anything that actually looks like nature!

I've always felt bad for the poor dandilion: they are durable perennials with pretty yellow flowers, interesting seed heads, and they are easy to grow. If they didn't spread on their own and were fussy plants, people would probably grow them!?


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RE: What's the most overplanted tree where you live?

Definately live oaks in Sugar Land, TX!


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RE: What's the most overplanted tree where you live?

Invasive, noxious Norway Maples, which are now plagued with some disease (leaves look like they have tar spots on them). We also have an over-abundance of poison sumacs. What a combo...


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RE: What's the most overplanted tree where you live?

Radgast:

Ah, I am not the only lover and defender of dandelions. Do you know that in colonial times lawns were supposed to be a collection of all kinds of low growing plants that could be mowed or more often grazed to keep from growing up too tall for comfort. It is only in modern times that people decided that lawns should be all one kind of uniform grass. Awful!! One of the points of the multiplicity of plants in colonial lawns was the fragrance produced by some kinds of plants, especially when walked on. The little flowers of all kinds were also prized.

--Spruce


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RE: What's the most overplanted tree where you live?

That's interesting to know, Spruce. It makes sense, too. People back then had other things to do than sit around making grass-only lawns... and they didn't have a need to use mountains of weed-killers to achieve those results. I bet that their lawns were a lot prettier and better for you, too.

Dandelions are welcome in any lawn of mine - same with clover and other nifty little wildflowers and plants.


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RE: What's the most overplanted tree where you live?

Out here in the Panhandle of Texas the only "tree" that can really do well enough to be overplanted is a mesquite tree.

However, I have regrets about the Siberian Elms. I suppose they self propogate. Any tree that can survive in our region is better than nothing, but the Siberian elm is a tree that gives elms a bad name. Around here they always look thin and shabby, with broken limbs.

On another idea raised above, about 4 years ago I planted a Princeton American Elm. It is thriving. It has not had any bug or disease problems whatsoever here yet. FWIW, my understanding is that while we have bugs and diseases here that can hurt American elms, we do not actually have the DED virus out here yet.


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RE: What's the most overplanted tree where you live?

There are number of hideous trees in Southeastern MA. The ones that rankle the worst are:

Norway Maples: Shallow root, zillions of offspring, worthless wood.

Blue Spruce: Yecch

Zelkova: Elms do great here and are hurricane proof, so why plant an alien tree?


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RE: What's the most overplanted tree where you live?

Would have to be Bradford Pears and Live Oak, however Live Oak is a very good choice, have never seen a live oak damaged in a storm. Bradford Pears are okay, I have had one for over 30 years now in my yard and still going strong. I have read everyones post on here and cannot understand why anyone would say that they hate certain trees, all trees are good! Just some are better adapted than others. It is not the trees fault for being planted in the wrong place and having to adapt to that particular area. Sometimes they do and sometimes they don't. We all have to remeber that all trees give us oxygen and help make a place more beautiful. Also seems that everyone is worried about diseases running rampant through the tree world. Trees do a great job of controllin diseases and other pest, some will fail, but the majority will live, trees have been around for thousands of years, so I would think they know how to handle certain pathogens. So with all that said, lets all be happy if you see anyone planting a tree of any kind, yeah it would be more nice to see a variety, but lets remeber any tree is better than no tree


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RE: What's the most overplanted tree where you live?

Well, first I'd beg to differ with the "any tree is better than no tree". I'd rather have no trees, than Bradford Pears, Tree of Heaven, White Mulberry, or many of the other incredibly aggressive invasive trees. While Bradford Pears are still early in showing their invasive habits, the others have been doing it long enough for people to know well their nature. Also, when you take a pathogen from one continent and introduce it to another continent, where it's never been seen before, you have a recipe for mass die off of ALL trees of a species, or even genus. Look at the American Chestnut, American Elm(and most other North American Elms), and now ALL native American Ash Trees. It looks like all of these are either nearly extinct in the wild, or are on their way to becoming extinct in the wild. So, trees haven't been around dealing with these pathogens for thousands of years and they don't do a great job of controlling them. There's no defense to these foreign pathogens, because there's been no evolutionary reason to have such a defense against a pathogen unknown to them. That's why such huge numbers of trees can fall victim to them and why these pathogens can be relatively minor in their native lands (where trees and other plants have had long term evolutionary exposure to them, and thus reason and time to develop defenses against them) while devastating foreign lands. Similarly this is why some alien trees are such incredibly aggressive invasives, while not being nearly as aggressive in their native lands. The plant community they've been recently introduced to, has no challenge, or competitive response to some alien tree's reproductive strategies, biochemicals, etc. At least this is true for some of them.

Also, the fear of a disease running rampant in a monoculture(which over planted trees can nearly be) is not without historical precedent. Again, look at American Elm. It was planted all over where I live, and was indeed a monoculture in some towns, and when Dutch Elm Disease came around, it whiped virtually all of them out. So, everyone was left with just about no trees in some of these towns, and on some streets that were once lined from end to end with them. Also, sometimes native diseases can reach epidemic porportions when encountered in a monoculture, partly because of the ease of moving from one tree to the next within a monoculture.(ie. there's no physical barriers and the close proximity allows for rapid movement).


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RE: What's the most overplanted tree where you live?

kman04, I do agree with you to an extent, however trees do have natural defense to ward off certain pathogens, as for elms, there are plenty of them growing wild here in the woods of Louisiana, so if you want some come down here and get them, apparently DED, never hit here. My family is from Minnesota and none of their elms trees were affected. As for the Ash trees, they all seem to be doing just fine here. Healthy as ever. As for foreign pathogens, how many forests have you seen destoryed because of a foreign pathogen? I have been all over this country and I have never seen a whole forest killed off from a pathogen. DED is and the chestnut blight are some of the only two pathogens that have hit the U.S. that has caused major damage, however it did not happen all over the U.S. And I agree with you that the trees you mentioned may not be the best in the world, but some people enjoy them and as far as I am concered any tree is good. If you don't like that particular tree dont plant it, plant something you do like as long as it is a tree that you do like.


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RE: What's the most overplanted tree where you live?

Do a google search for Emerald Ash Borer to see why Ash Trees are on my list of "going to be" extinct in the wild. Also, DED is quite widespread in Minnesota Extensive info on DED in MN I suspect your families Elms are probably resistent(Asian native) Siberian Elms. You are correct though that DED so far hasn't been prevelant in the extreme South and West of most North American Elms native ranges. That still doesn't do anyone living in the other 90% of their range any good. It has been reported sporadically in Louisiana since 1985 though.

The real problem with planting invasives, like the ones I mentioned, is that even if I don't like them and never plant them, I'm still having to deal with their aggressive seedlings/saplings(in case I miss them in their seedling stage). I've never planted any of these trees and yet the most common weed tree in my propery is the Asian White Mulberry and the nearest one I'm aware of is a bit more than 1/8 of a mile away. And many of them spread into the "wilds" where nobody is around to control them and thus by planting one you've unleashed it on everyone. Ask some on this forum how happy they are with their Common Buckthorn( Rhamnus cathartica), Tree of Heaven(Ailanthus altissima), Japanese Honeysuckle(Lonicera japonica), etc. problems. Then ask how many of them planted them in the first place. I bet that you would find virtually no-one had planted them. If it was as easy if, I don't like that tree then I won't plant it, then I would agree with you, but it's not.


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RE: What's the most overplanted tree where you live?

Kman04, If you were to read all of the university of Minnesota website on DED, you would have read that, yeah DED is in Minnesota and was destructive to many native elm trees, but not all the trees were destoryed and according to the website elms are resiliant species and will survive this attack that nature is putting upon them. I also called my family in Minnesota to find out what kind of elms they were and they are american elms, however he did loose one back in the 70's to DED, but the other 5 survived. As for the ash borer, once again, these are all natural things, 90% of the time healthy mature trees can lead off an attack by borers, however some do fall victim, survival of the fittest, weak shall perish and the strong will survive. I also contacted my local foresty department and asked them wheter or not DED is in Louisiana, there has never been any report of DED in Louisiana. Where did you get that information? As for the problem of planting invasive species, I totally agree, however I just want people to plant trees period. You have to remeber those invasisve species did not walk to that yard, someone planted them there, so dont hate the trees. They are doing what nature made them to do and that is to grow.


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RE: What's the most overplanted tree where you live?

DED didn't work like the Chestnut blight did, in other words it didn't appear in an area and kill all of the mature adult trees. It killed trees in somewhat sporadic groups, but it's still in these areas and still killing mature Elms. I can drive around my area and see dozens of dead and dying native Elms being killed by DED that weren't infected in the initial sweep through the area of DED back in the 1960's. So, just because the disease didn't immediately kill off all mature trees in a short period of time, doesn't mean it will stop or has stopped killing off native Elms. Nor does it assure the survival of any American Elms not yet infected. Here's a link to info about the initial confirmation of DED in Louisiana. Citation for Louisiana

Also, since no native American Elms have proven immune to DED, Im afraid if I got any from Louisiana, or Florida(where DED has not been documented) they will still be susceptible to dying from it here. It appears that the only limiting factor of DED has been the inability of either the pathogen or it's primary vector (the European Elm Bark Beetle) of surviving the local climate. So, it has no relationship to any strength or weakness of a particular American Elm tree.

Also, as far as every report I've read, NO native Ash species has shown any resistance to the Emerald Ash Borer. So far all reports show a 100% mortality rate of infected native Ash. It also appears that EAB attacks healthy trees equally as well as it does stressed trees. Of course all of this is still preliminary data, because of the recent introduction of this pest, but it's killed more than 20 million Ash trees so far in the relatively small area it is found and it sure sounds like nothing is likely to stop it from killing every native Ash that gets infected. Perhaps climate might limit EABs spread to a degree also.

I again have to disagree with the statement, "the weak shall perish and the strong will survive" as an inaccurate summary of what is going on. It's not a matter of being weak or strong, it's a matter of evolving with a pathogen or not. A species with no evolutionary reason to have a resistance to a particular pathogen (ie. they've never been exposed to it before) will often not have any natural defense against the foreign pathogen.

Also, while I appreciate your sentiment of wanting to encourage people to plant trees, I would still rather see no trees than aggressively invasive alien trees. The largely treeless Flint Hills are quite striking. Also, actually most of the invasive species I see around weren't planted by people. They were "planted" by their own seed dispersion. I don't personally blame(or hate) any tree or other plant for growing and behaving as it does naturally. It doesn't mean I have to be happy about having to deal with its aggressive invasive habits. Although, I do blame people for purposely spreading already proven invasive species. Quite frankly, I think it's quite disrespectful of the land and people in the area and very irresponsible. Of course I'm not talking about people who plant these in ignorance or who "inherited" pre-existing trees.

Lastly, perhaps I shouldnt of said completely extinct in the wild, since even with the American Chestnut they arent technically extinct in the wild, but for all practical purposes they are, since none reach maturity and few reproduce to any extent.


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RE: What's the most overplanted tree where you live?

Well, 'overplanted' is totally subjective-I have a small, suburban lot w/ lots of trees- alot of maples, magnolia, pin oak, white pine, & beech. When we moved in 2.5 years ago, we had some trees limbed up, some removed (dying cherries & a maple, Japanese hollies in front)-I'm almost happy with my yard now, but I still have a Norway maple in the back yard-I hate to take down a mature, healthy tree-but I think I could better utilize the space, It's a sunny spot, on the s/e side of the house.

My neighbors also hate a scrub oak in my front side yard, saying that it blocks light to their maple, but I like it & don't want to remove it...


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RE: What's the most overplanted tree where you live?

  • Posted by bboy z8 WA USA (My Page) on
    Fri, Dec 8, 06 at 23:45

We make use of our native trees. This is reason enough to protect them from foreign pests. Doesn't matter if the "dumbing down" of the continent (and the planet) by overly populous and polluting modern man could be called part of the natural course of events or not, it is in our own interest to conserve North American tree species (and other species).

Large scale development that creates extensive areas of degraded planting sites calling for quantities of the tough and sometimes aggressive trees like Norway maples and Calley pears is also degrading the total environment. Monocultural plantings of the same few kinds are a facet of an overall mono-culture, a garnish on a plateful of hot dogs and hamburgers.


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RE: What's the most overplanted tree where you live?

probably Acer platanoides as pineresin said,we call it Sycamore but I think that is a different tree in the US. A lot of whitebeam too in some areas but they are nice trees. Also a lot of limes,the kind that sucker a lot.


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RE: What's the most overplanted tree where you live?

Hi greenlarry - methinks you mean Acer pseudoplatanus :-)

Resin


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RE: What's the most overplanted tree where you live?

pine,indeed you're right;)


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RE: What's the most overplanted tree where you live?

I thought you were talking about Platanus x acerifolia (London Planetree) commonly called sycamore by folks that don't know which is which.


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RE: What's the most overplanted tree where you live?

Hey Ohio ppl! stop planting Bradford Pears, they're taking over! especially us down here on the Ohio river. Why not experiment a little? my loblolly and slash pines are doing great, not to mention my crepe myrtle, magnolia and camellia. Have some fun with your yard instead of the same old round white bradfords in spring.


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RE: What's the most overplanted tree where you live?

My $0.02 on an old thread...

Callery/Bradford pears here in Maryland. So many have been planted that they are now a dominant tree in highway medians (See I-95 and the BW Parkway/MD295 for examples) and on roadsides and I know they weren't planted there.

More than that, it pains me when you see parking lots, especially in strip malls, where 90% of the trees are dead because they were planted incorrectly and never given one drop of water...so that the retailer can spend more money and replant more trees, incorrectly, and not water them either so they too can die.


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RE: What's the most overplanted tree where you live?

Tree-churning is a business! Why plant healthy trees once and let them grow and live when you can make a lot more money replant unhealthy trees every few years? Sad...

And, yes, Bradford Pears and their cousins are now common weed trees all over Maryland.

As for most overplanted tree - it is still the Bradford Pear family of trees, sadly. Nobody learns.


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RE: What's the most overplanted tree where you live?

For this area it's Bradford/callery pears and crepe myrtles. Actually, I wouldn't find CMs so offensive, but so many businesses commit crepe murder, turning them into the most hideous looking things you've ever seen.
Another overdone, incredibly plain plant that's overused is those globular balls of male/berryless yaupons. You see them at gas stations, proving that they're bullet-proof, but I'd think home owners could be a little more adventurous!
Sherry


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RE: What's the most overplanted tree where you live?

Grief, this one's a golden oldie resurfacing!

100th post . . . there at least used to be a 100-post limit on threads, not sure if it still applies


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RE: What's the most overplanted tree where you live?

Bradford Pears. Technically, they not the most overplanted trees on campus -- that'd probably be the white pine or something -- but they're everywhere and they smell bad.


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RE: What's the most overplanted tree where you live??

Can't possibly overplant white pines! They're much too nice!

Resin


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RE: What's the most overplanted tree where you live?

150 post is the limit! Let's keep this thread going!

I'm gonna say one more...

Bradford pears are junk.


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RE: What's the most overplanted tree where you live?

I agree. I'm now a member of the BPHS. (Bradford Pear Hater's Society).. uh.. hehe, just kiddin', but it would be AWSOME if there were such a thing. :)


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RE: What's the most overplanted tree where you live?

Bradford/callery pears are over planted here.


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RE: What's the most overplanted tree where you live?

As well as Crepe myrtles that look very bad after being chopped off by people every year.


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RE: What's the most overplanted tree where you live?

Here in my part of Utah and even down two 2 hours south of me it is Blue Spruce.

Everyone plants them. They grow well. Grow fast. And, they are the state tree. I nearly planted one just for that reason, but my wife talked me out of it.


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RE: What's the most overplanted tree where you live?

Live oak is probably about the most overplanted oak in Texas. Not exactly a great shade tree for houses on small lots because they keep leaves all year long and there's no way to keep houses warm if planted in the wrong place.


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RE: What's the most overplanted tree where you live?

Just tore out my builder-planter BP...a great feeling! Should I watch it die, or chop it into pieces to put it out of its misery?...


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RE: What's the most overplanted tree where you live?

I actually think Pears (Bradford and other kinds) are quite beautiful when flowering, but they are definitely overplanted and look very ordinary for the rest of the year.

Around here, Bradford pears and Norway maples (both green and "Crimson King") are definitely overplanted. Again, I don't think that they are especially unattractive, just overused (though I shouldn't complain - I have 2 "Crimson Kings" in my yard.

For some reason, Honey locust is EXTREMELY common as a tree planted around parking lots and in small parks where most of the ground is covered with pavement or bricks, but not very common elsewhere. Maybe it's particularly good at growing in compacted and infertile soil.

White Pine (pinus strobus) and Red maple (Acer Rubrum) are very common both as plantings and as natural "volunteers". This doesn't bother me, because I like both of them.


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RE: What's the most overplanted tree where you live?

Eucalyptus sp.


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RE: What's the most overplanted tree where you live?

  • Posted by basic z4A WI (My Page) on
    Fri, May 23, 08 at 11:36

What I've noticed is a tendency by nurseries to grow/sell a limited amount of cultivars, with seedlings rarely offered. Nothing wrong with any of these, but I wonder if this won't someday come back to bite us someday. Here's a few that around here we've become dependent on: Acer freemanii 'Autumn Blaze', Amelanchier grandiflora 'Autumn Brilliance', Betula nigra 'Heritage', Ginkgo 'Autumn Gold', Gleditsia 'Sunburst', Syringa reticulata 'Ivory Silk', Tilia cordata 'Greenspire', etc. Its become so predictable. I've got a few cultivars, especially conifers and crabapples, but my first choice is always a seedling.


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RE: What's the most overplanted tree where you live?

Yes, I agree about seedling source trees in place of cultivars, especially for maples. I see parking lots lined with all one cultivar of red maple--all exactly the same, the exact same color in every tree. No, please, plant seedling origin red maples--really, more attractive.

--Spruce


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RE: What's the most overplanted tree where you live?

Around here, older suburb of Chicago, it's purple leaf sand cherry and (overgrown) yews. Taking a walk last summer for inspiration, I was stunned when I realized how widely (over)planted they are. Arborvitaes are always the choice for dense, fast-growing screening. I tried to convince my BF to plant a variety by her house, she agreed to, and then planted a row all the same anyway. :-(


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RE: What's the most overplanted tree where you live?

Hi PG,

I forgot to mention Arborvitae. Waaay overused IMO. Ditto for Colorado Blue Spruce.


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RE: What's the most overplanted tree where you live?

Starting to see a lot of Zelkovas here over the years...and red maples


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RE: What's the most overplanted tree where you live?

  • Posted by rdak z5MI (My Page) on
    Sun, May 25, 08 at 9:50

Hey, hey everyone, stop making fun of my Autumn Blaze!! LOL!

I'm kind of a square though, I like pretty much any tree as long as it is healthy.


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RE: What's the most overplanted tree where you live?

I didn't want to enter this thread for the very reason that it's become what it has..people listing trees they don't like. Amazingly to me, for example, are folks listing white pine as "way overplanted". Here in Wisconsin, vast, and I mean VAST stands of white pine were clearcut in the big timber days of yore. So, no matter how many of these get planted today, it will only be a fraction of what once existed here. How can this possibly be considered overuse?

Likewise, I see posters from the Rocky Mountain states lamenting the "overuse" of Picea pungens. Once again, this is surely only a slight return to former conditions, before logging, land clearing, subdivisions, ski slopes etc, etc.....

On the other hand, those who decry the continued planting of invasive species that have already caused problems...that I agree with.

Another tangental point: Nature often repeats itself. If, for example, conditions are suitable for a given species in a certain area, nature will often replicate this species to an incredible degree. Should we then say that nature has overplanted this tree type, because it has become common in this area? Of course not.

I could go on and on with this stuff! I'd better not;^)

+oM


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RE: What's the most overplanted tree where you live?

by far on my block it's silver maple and this year is the worst helicopter season ever.Last year I did not even have to pull up any seedlings cause last year was the lightest helicopter season I guess Mother Nature makes up the differnce


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RE: What's the most overplanted tree where you live?

Ailanthus is a pretty serious weed here, and it seems to like gullies like this.


ailanthus


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RE: What's the most overplanted tree where you live?

In the 60's to 80's - blue spruce
in the last 10-20 years - austrian pine

runner up: aspens


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RE: What's the most overplanted tree where you live?

Crabapples are all over my town- they line every street and boy do we have apple scab- by July most have dropped all their leaves...but they're pretty right now for about 2 weeks!


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RE: What's the most overplanted tree where you live?

I personally love crabapples. They might drop some fruit, but they are tough, adaptable and consistent performers here in Colorado. They also don't grow to be giants. I predict bur oak will be overplanted (here in CO) in the next 20 years, as its at the top of everyones list here. I see them going in all over town. They are nice trees, but can every home really have a giant shade tree down the road? I see them roadside planted every 10-20 feet ... but these will be giants someday!


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RE: What's the most overplanted tree where you live?

Crabapples - they look like hell about 2 weeks after bloom once the scab defoliates them.


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RE: What's the most overplanted tree where you live?

Well, mine look really nice now and they were in bloom 2 weeks ago. I guess its just a personal opinion. In colorado, not much else does as well as these crabapples ... I've got pears, japanese lilac trees, golden rain trees, cockspur hawthorns ... but the crabs are the best performers I have ... and tough enough to bloom, get snowed on, then keep on blooming.


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RE: What's the most overplanted tree where you live?

older:

juniper
siberian elm (somehow many of these have survived)

-blue spruce
-austrian pine
-aspen
- i'm not sure people in CO will ever tire of these three

newer:

russian olive (i think these have spread on their own)
canada cherry
norway maple
mountain ash
honeylocust

not to say that i dislike any of these trees (besides the elm & olive), just that they are planted in disproportionately high numbers


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RE: What's the most overplanted tree where you live?

"Crabapples - they look like hell about 2 weeks after bloom once the scab defoliates them" MD

"Well, mine look really nice now and they were in bloom 2 weeks ago. I guess its just a personal opinion" CO

It's climatic: apple scab is a far worse problem in humid climates like MD, than it is in drier air like CO gets.

Resin


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RE: What's the most overplanted tree where you live?

There are many crab varieties available with good resistance to scab. I'd not plant one without this attribute. I also consider persistent fruit a must as the fall/winter fruit display can be more significant than the brief, albeit spectacular spring flower display.

+oM


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RE: What's the most overplanted tree where you live?

Here it is Bradford Pear, New Improved Bradford Pear, and Cleveland Pear. This spring all the flowering trees bloomed in overabundance, and these, being planted in all our suburbs in developments in the last 10 years, stunk to high heaven. They are beautiful to look at, and to my horror, (AFTER I planted 8 of them), there's many down my road as well planted in lines along other's driveways making stink as well. I bought what was cheap at a local discount store-the pears, silver maples, and purple leaf plums. Now I know why-they are all rated bad on this site. I like my plum trees' color, though. Also picked up some River Birches on clearance (marked as willows) at Wallymart last year. So that's what is growing here, avoid in Spring unless you like stinky pears, which my friend describes as the smell of bee semen?! LOL What does anyone think of peach trees?


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RE: What's the most overplanted tree where you live?

Believe or not, here in the District of Columbia, in residential yards, I'd have to say cherry trees (any type -- really), and dogwoods. At least the city is doing a much better job now of trying to avoid monoculture with the street trees, and has a new rule about what can be planted along the power line side of the street.


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RE: What's the most overplanted tree where you live?

Here in Chicagoland, it seems to be Black Locust by far, followed by Norway Maples and Green Ash.


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RE: What's the most overplanted tree where you live?

The Lollipop Tree aka Bradford Pear in Central NC


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RE: What's the most overplanted tree where you live?

Here in northeast Tennessee, I can mention a couple... White pine and Bradford Pear. I personally would like to see more other types of pines planted, like the native Loblolly, or even Longleaf pines instead. Also, tons of Bradford pears... then there are alot of Willow Oaks (I have one too), but those are OK. One of our Super Walmarts (the one in Bristol, Virginia off of exit 7 I-81) has tons of them planted.


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RE: underplanted Live Oak

Live Oak will easily survive here, but not often seen here. I have two that have flourished over the years. I contacted the city and recommended that they look into planting hardy palms, Live oaks and Crepe Myrtle. They liked the ideas of Crepe Myrtle and Live oak, but bucked on the hardy palms idea. :O


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RE: What's the most overplanted tree where you live?

quercus - are Black Locust planted per se, or do they just sprout up in every roadside patch and abandoned lot in Chi-town like they do here?


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RE: What's the most overplanted tree where you live?

Though native to more southerly portions of Wisconsin, black locust is officially classified as invasive here in the N.E. part of the state. I used to like 'em, but now, I hate to see a grove coming up where, IMO, other trees would be more desirable.

+oM


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RE: What's the most overplanted tree where you live?

Black Locusts are actually planted by the city, by landscape contractors, and by homeowners.

The biggest "volunteer" problem we have here are ailanthus, the legacy of street and landscape plantings many decades ago. Ailanthus is one of the very few trees I can have absolutely nothing good to say about. But there they are, in every neglected vacant lot and foundation crack.


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RE: What's the most overplanted tree where you live?

Apparently no one from southern California on this message board. Where I am Eucalyptus, Chinese Elms, Jacaranda trees, amd various palms are most often planted. Chinese Elms make so many seeds they could take over a place easily. You even see seedlings growing out of cracks in the sidewalk. Eucs are extremely hardy and can grow 20 feet a year with no care or watering. They send out roots over 50 feet long, as do Chinese elms. I have a Chinese elm in the back yard and the roots went right under the slab foundation of the house and came out the other side in the front yard, as I discovered when I was planting a garden in the front. Neither tree seems to have any natural enemies around here, and can take continued abuse like topping them and cutting off all the branches and two years later they look like nothing ever happened. The trouble with a Euc is if you cut it down and don't remove the stump it will come right back, but this time as a clump of Eucs. And these can be big trees, in fact the tallest tree in the world is a blue gum in Australia, which is a type of Euc, that is 400 feet tall.


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RE: What's the most overplanted tree where you live?

"in fact the tallest tree in the world is a blue gum in Australia, which is a type of Euc, that is 400 feet tall"

Tall tales ;-)

Tallest Euc known is E. regnans, 97m tall. Tallest tree in the world is a Coast Redwood 115m tall.

Resin


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RE: What's the most overplanted tree where you live?

sugar maples and bradford pears; boston suburbs z.5


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RE: What's the most overplanted tree where you live?

I can't understand how so many people can dislike crepe myrtles. They plant them around businesses because they are tough and nice looking. I love them and as far as I'm concerned the more, the better. I do understand the monoculture problem with disease or insect pests, but you sound like tree haters to me. How can you not like sugar maples?


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RE: What's the most overplanted tree where you live?

helenh

Agree completely w/you on the sugar maple. How indeed could such a fine tree be overplanted.......in a state where it is native? Likewise with those lamenting too many white pines being planted, when in the past, very large stands of this tree existed, and were cut down to build many of our cities.

That's why I don't like this thread. It's gone astray.

+oM


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RE: What's the most overplanted tree where you live?

Dogwoods, purpleleaf plums, Oriental cherry, Leyland cypress, Arbs, crabs, fruit trees, and Callery pear. This goes along with the equally overplanted boxwoods, azaleas, and forsythia.

Some of those may not fit the definition of overplanted, but with as many problems as people have with them, they are.


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RE: What's the most overplanted tree where you live?

  • Posted by kimcoco Zone 5, Wisconsin (My Page) on
    Wed, Aug 6, 08 at 1:54

Maples. I don't know what variety. I like them, but they're everywhere. However, I should add that I wouldn't consider cutting them down. I do cherish the mature trees in our neighborhood, and when a huge Elm or Oak comes down, it's disappointing.

The city decides what street has maples, what street has elms, what street has oak trees, etc. The problem with this is if one is diseased, it's usually not long before the disease spreads to all the surrounding trees. So, not just one tree is lost, but several at a time.
Well, the imbeciles finally got smart and instead of planting an entire row of Elms, Maples, Oaks, etc., they now intersperse the varieties - less likely to spread disease and you won't be left with a street with NO trees.

Then of course my neighbor, who has an Elm on the city way, also planted two more on his property, but is too cheap to spend the $35 that it would cost to treat them every year for Dutch Elm disease.

Not only does he risk losing his own, but his neighbors risk losing theirs as well (neighborhood sore spot).


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RE: What's the most overplanted tree where you live?

In private landscaping, the purple leafed cherry is SO overdone (my house came w/a purple sandleaf cherry shrub and a purple leafed tree - both in a front island bed. I am patiently waiting the day they croak). Everyone has a few.


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RE: What's the most overplanted tree where you live?

Kimcoco

The city foresters just possibly might not be imbeciles! Diversity of a street tree planting program is a city-wide issue, not a single street or block issue. There ARE reasons to plant rows of the same tree type along a given street. They are: 1) Design. Aesthetics are heightened by repetition. Nature herself does this all the time. 2) Maintenance. It is more cost-effective to deal with a number of the same tree type when performing a wide array of maintenance practices.

I remember at a conference one time, I guy got up and posited his belief that every single tree should be a different species from the one planted before it. Now that person might have been an imbecile!

+oM


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RE: What's the most overplanted tree where you live?

This is a long-legged thread. I have a grove of twenty-foot-plus River Birches that I planted from 1.5-gallon pots into a damp spot the February before the first post. Here in NW Florida, Crape Myrtles probably have always been overplanted. But since Hurricane Ivan nearly defoliated our town, which was once considered urban forest, it's like people think twice before planting anything else. They're nice enough trees (I have several that I like, inherited from the PO of my house), and the tall, spreading, white-flowered type (Natchez?) has gorgeous bark and actually grows large enough to feel like a real tree when you walk under one. But they're all still shrubs, really, compared to the Long-leaves and Live Oaks we used to grow for the tall shipbuilders.


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RE: What's the most overplanted tree where you live?

In our nieghborhood here in Urbandale I would have to say its either the clump river birch or the crabapple. We do not have the birch but we do have a crabapple and I will admit I do like its twisty shape and the robins seem to like it.


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RE: What's the most overplanted tree where you live?

In the Milwaukee (including suberbs)...

Street Trees - Lindens, nice trees but they suffer from drought and defoliation from jap. bettles. I was just by Navy Pier Chicago and they too have a crap load of them. So many look like crap...must have been the drought.

Shrub - Purple Sand Cherry, need a nice protected site to get 15 years out of them. My subdivision is 12 years old and there are lot of them dieing.

Subdivsion trees - Autumn Blaze maple and River Birch. I have to say I still like these. The river birch needs a wet, acidic soil and when it gets that they are like gold with that crisp foilage and peely bark. Autumn Blaze is such a staple, but great form, drought tolerance and clay tolerance make it a great tree. I actually just ordered a 5 stem Autumn Blaze Maple, looks amazing. I just couldn't resist. Maples in our area always look fantastic. Even the Silver Maples still look good long has they had the space.

Pears trees...watch what you read on these. These are great trees for southeast wisconsin. My old subdivision had some bradfords, which are ok, but its the Autumn Blaze Pear that is amazing. They last about 30 years by the way and their foilage stays crip, glossy green all season...plus the white flowers and amazing fall color. Neighbor down the street has one and it is goregeous in the spring...better than any crabapple in my opinion. I just plant a 2" caliper in spring...fall color is just kicking in.


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RE: What's the most overplanted tree where you live?

Rstanny, I live near you and I absolutely agree. It is crape myrtle overkill around here, and like you said, nobody wants larger trees because they're afraid they will fall in a storm. I have been noticing quite a few Shumard oaks being planted lately though, as well as Live oaks. I really wish municipalities around here would replant the native Longleaf pines, they are beautiful trees.


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